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Marine vet's 20-foot flagpole has homeowners association filing suit over a display of patriotism t

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posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:34 PM
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Originally posted by Sinnthia

Originally posted by Annee
(2) any reasonable restriction pertaining to the time, place, or manner of displaying the flag of the United States necessary to protect a substantial interest of the condominium association, cooperative association, or residential real estate management association.


Just because apparently someone is having a hard time seeing this part. Maybe it is understanding this part but lets toss a little benefit of the doubt out there. I hate to watch someone drown like this (again
)


YEP - - this is from the Flag Act he keeps referring to. Its right there in black and white.

There are several other cases like this through out the US - - and as far as I can tell - - in those cases as well - - the HOA is protected by the Flag Act Limitations.




posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
What part of this law do you not comprehend?


HEY! (snap snap!) Talking to you. I really want to know what the face of our military is like today. Is it nothing but spoiled children? I would like to think that relatively few fit that profile. Are you going to help or hurt that?

Talking to you. You condescend and insult people all while spewing ignorance all over everything around you.

What part of this.


SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.
This Act may be cited as the ``Freedom to Display the American Flag Act of 2005''.
SEC. 2. DEFINITIONS.
For purposes of this Act--
(1) the term ``flag of the United States'' has the meaning given the term ``flag, standard, colors, or ensign'' under section 3 of title 4, United States Code;
(2) the terms ``condominium association'' and ``cooperative association'' have the meanings given such terms under section 604 of Public Law 96399 (15 U.S.C. 3603);
(3) the term ``residential real estate management association'' has the meaning given such term under section 528 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 (26 U.S.C. 528); and
(4) the term ``member''--
(A) as used with respect to a condominium association, means an owner of a condominium unit (as defined under section 604 of Public Law 96399 (15 U.S.C. 3603)) within such association;
(B) as used with respect to a cooperative association, means a cooperative unit owner (as defined under section 604 of Public Law 96399 (15 U.S.C. 3603)) within such association; and
(C) as used with respect to a residential real estate management association, means an owner of a residential property within a subdivision, development, or similar area subject to any policy or restriction adopted by such association.
SEC. 3. RIGHT TO DISPLAY THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES.
A condominium association, cooperative association, or residential real estate management association may not adopt or enforce any policy, or enter into any agreement, that would restrict or prevent a member of the association from displaying the flag of the United States on residential property within the association with respect to which such member has a separate ownership interest or a right to exclusive possession or use.
SEC. 4. LIMITATIONS. H. R. 42--2
Nothing in this Act shall be considered to permit any display or use that is inconsistent with--
(1) any provision of chapter 1 of title 4, United States Code, or any rule or custom pertaining to the proper display or use of the flag of the United States (as established pursuant to such chapter or any otherwise applicable provision of law);
or (2) any reasonable restriction pertaining to the time, place, or manner of displaying the flag of the United States necessary to protect a substantial interest of the condominium association, cooperative association, or residential real estate management association.



Don't YOU understand???



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:37 PM
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Originally posted by Annee
YEP - - this is from the Flag Act he keeps referring to. Its right there in black and white.

There are several other cases like this through out the US - - and as far as I can tell - - in those cases as well - - the HOA is protected by the Flag Act Limitations.


Personally, I would think the part that specifically explains that listed under something called "limitations" makes it kind of obvious that that exact stipulation is given as a limitation. I dunno, maybe I am crazy.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by Sinnthia

Originally posted by Annee
YEP - - this is from the Flag Act he keeps referring to. Its right there in black and white.

There are several other cases like this through out the US - - and as far as I can tell - - in those cases as well - - the HOA is protected by the Flag Act Limitations.


Personally, I would think the part that specifically explains that listed under something called "limitations" makes it kind of obvious that that exact stipulation is given as a limitation. I dunno, maybe I am crazy.


OK - I get to use laughing emoticons now


Ya Think?



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:44 PM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by Dilligaf28
 


How so?, the posters on here don't seem to want to acknowledge logic. Much less common sense. For someone to actually believe that a HOA bylaw supersedes signed and passed piece of congressional legislation is completely absurd!



Dude... read the exception provisions... the other poster has made it quite clear that he is not challenging the relative supremacy of congress, rather that the 20 ft flag pole may likely fall under those provisions which state that, although the Act protects the right to fly a flag, it does not protect the right to do so when it is contrary to any of the listed exceptions...



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:46 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

OK - I get to use laughing emoticons now


Ya Think?


Well, I would think. I am going to go ahead and see if our lovely host can change that for me though. He seems pretty set in what he thinks is going on here so maybe, just maybe, EVERYONE else reading and commenting is crazy and he is right. I feel bad since I have already seen him fail at this before and I know it makes him lash out in anger. Maybe, just maybe he can convince me I am wrong this time.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:50 PM
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This subject is being discussed in other forums on several other similar cases.

The general consensus: Know the Rules before you buy. A signed contract is a signed contract.

One person said they had the right to a 20 foot pole because the main office had one out front.

HOAs are independent (unless its a development group). I have heard of HOA's making exceptions - - - but by law they are not required to do so according to the Flag Act.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:51 PM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by Dilligaf28
 


The flag act, is you actually google it, will in fact reference you to the US code. My argument still stands that they are in indirect correlation with each other.


www.law.cornell.edu...

As far as I can tell the relevant provision of the USC does little else other than codify certain definitions about the US flag?



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 12:55 PM
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Originally posted by lee anoma
As a good neighbor I'd reduce the pole.
It really isn't a big deal.

I guess the homeowners association will be a bit more discerning next time.

I'm just waiting for a Conservative politician to take up his cause to ensure reelection.

It's going to happen.

- Lee


I know. When you think about it, a 20ft flagpole in your neighborhood is probably quite a garish sight...
edit on 10-1-2011 by duality90 because: poor spelling



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 01:18 PM
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Originally posted by duality90
I know. When you think about it, a 20ft flagpole in your neighborhood is probably quite a garish sight...


I can't remember where I was - camping maybe. But it was right next to a tall metal flag pole. And yeah - - that chain clanked all night long. You'd probably get used to it - - but why should you have to?

Also - my neighbor has at least at 20 foot lighted flag pole. I really enjoy looking at it - - especially when I want to know which way the wind is blowing.

But we live on 2 acres in a rural county. Its not right next door in a crammed together housing development.



edit on 10-1-2011 by Annee because: quotes



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 05:54 PM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by captaintyinknots
 


Just had to laugh.....catching...my breathe....


Fact? oh goodness~


Laughing at the fact that you still have nothing to counter me with? laughing at yourself i take it?



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 05:57 PM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by Annee
 


I believe reading comprehension isn't your strongest suit? I did not make the comment :



WIth regard to your comments I will let your own avatar pic reply for me... "BULL"


that was posted by : marinesniper0351

You comments just made you look like a fool. Trying to blame someone for someone else's comments? Care to acknowledge that your were wrong? A yes or no will suffice!


I see that you have abandoned trying to back your claims up and have now resigned yourself to trolling your own thread.

Classic.



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 05:58 PM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


In the first pages of this thread I did happily address the issues. But when someone makes an ignorant comment, and wrongly make accusations, I'm gonna call them on it. We are suppose to deny ignorance aren't we? And that comment was ignorant. Not to mention, the facts were right in front of the young ladies face.


So when are you going to call your self out on your ignorance? You have been proven wrong over and over by your own source...



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 06:00 PM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by Sinnthia
 


Facts are facts indeed, but reviewing this threads many pages, I have come to the conclusion that everyone's interpretation of " facts " are debatable ate best. Some believe that the law supersedes bylaws, some vice versa. The only way to have conclusive evidence which is the most " superior ", would be if this goes to court. At which time a judge would rule of the legality or lack there of.


Or you could just look at the code and realize that it is specifically written into it that the bylaws are legal....



posted on Jan, 10 2011 @ 06:00 PM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by Sinnthia
 



To ensure that the right of an individual to display the flag of the United States on residential property not be abridged.


What part of this law do you not comprehend?


Still ignoring the whole act, i see. makes sense, as it kills your whole thread...



posted on Jan, 15 2011 @ 08:27 AM
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Originally posted by captaintyinknots

Originally posted by sbctinfantry

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
I am not a fan of homeowners associations, but he chose to live in one, and therefore to follow the rules of it.


Some rights are granted by god, not homeowner's assosciations. So sayeth our founders.


States rights my friend. If the state agrees that HOA's are okay, the fed cant do anything about it. There is no constitutional guideline against it.


Federal law in this item is the only avenue authourized to either modify or amend laws pertaining to the Flag so this is a Federal item, the 10th can't do jack squat for you in this case as the flag is Federal. Hence why at every tier of Government the US Flag is always flown highest and proudest.
edit on 15-1-2011 by TheImmaculateD1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 15 2011 @ 08:44 AM
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Originally posted by sonofliberty1776
reply to post by Dilligaf28
 

Fine, then how do the supersede Constitutionally guaranteed rights then? The Constitution is still the supreme law of the land, no matter how much you liberals hate and deride it.


Don't even go there, liberals allow you to keep your freedoms while the GOP and Baggers want your freedoms stripped if you aren't in lock step with them but this is for another time and not here.

I'd expect much more common sense from someone claiming to be sympathetic to the cause of The Sons Of Liberty!



posted on Jan, 15 2011 @ 08:45 AM
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The HOA cannot usurp a Federal mandate and that is that This would fall under the heading legally speaking Federal court and not state court. 10th don't mean jack squat here.

What gives these HOA's the rights to spit on the Constitution, the flag and nation? This is yet again another attempt to dismantle everything that this nation holds true and holds dear.

I care not for the rules of any HOA as no one has the authourity to tell you that you cannot display the Flag if you wanted to.

Size of the flag and the pole is irrelevant, to undo, just take the pole out and repack the hole with dirt and place some grass seeds over it and within a few months it will look like nothing was ever there.

Ecologically speaking I am most positive that it does not interfere with any known bird migratory routes, most definitely does not interfere with the routes of any commercial or military aircraft so with that in mind even that is shot down and deemed baseless.

Rights guaranteed to us in The Constitution are granted to us by the doc and not by God. The only God given rights we have is the right to life and the pursuit of happiness. Beyond that the doc gives us these rights.



posted on Jan, 15 2011 @ 08:47 AM
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Complete text of the Flag Act of 2005 :

H.R.42

One Hundred Ninth Congress

of the

United States of America

AT THE SECOND SESSION

Begun and held at the City of Washington on Tuesday,

the third day of January, two thousand and six

An Act

To ensure that the right of an individual to display the flag of the United States on residential property not be abridged.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

This Act may be cited as the `Freedom to Display the American Flag Act of 2005'.

SEC. 2. DEFINITIONS.

For purposes of this Act--

(1) the term `flag of the United States' has the meaning given the term `flag, standard, colors, or ensign' under section 3 of title 4, United States Code;

(2) the terms `condominium association' and `cooperative association' have the meanings given such terms under section 604 of Public Law 96-399 (15 U.S.C. 3603);

(3) the term `residential real estate management association' has the meaning given such term under section 528 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 (26 U.S.C. 528); and

(4) the term `member'--

(A) as used with respect to a condominium association, means an owner of a condominium unit (as defined under section 604 of Public Law 96-399 (15 U.S.C. 3603)) within such association;

(B) as used with respect to a cooperative association, means a cooperative unit owner (as defined under section 604 of Public Law 96-399 (15 U.S.C. 3603)) within such association; and

(C) as used with respect to a residential real estate management association, means an owner of a residential property within a subdivision, development, or similar area subject to any policy or restriction adopted by such association.

SEC. 3. RIGHT TO DISPLAY THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES.

A condominium association, cooperative association, or residential real estate management association may not adopt or enforce any policy, or enter into any agreement, that would restrict or prevent a member of the association from displaying the flag of the United States on residential property within the association with respect to which such member has a separate ownership interest or a right to exclusive possession or use.

SEC. 4. LIMITATIONS.

Nothing in this Act shall be considered to permit any display or use that is inconsistent with--

(1) any provision of chapter 1 of title 4, United States Code, or any rule or custom pertaining to the proper display or use of the flag of the United States (as established pursuant to such chapter or any otherwise applicable provision of law); or

(2) any reasonable restriction pertaining to the time, place, or manner of displaying the flag of the United States necessary to protect a substantial interest of the condominium association, cooperative association, or residential real estate management association.

Speaker of the House of Representatives.

Vice President of the United States and

President of the Senate.



posted on Jan, 15 2011 @ 11:06 AM
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reply to post by TheImmaculateD1
 


What part of this do you not understand?

SEC. 4. LIMITATIONS.

Nothing in this Act shall be considered to permit any display or use that is inconsistent with--

(1) any provision of chapter 1 of title 4, United States Code, or any rule or custom pertaining to the proper display or use of the flag of the United States (as established pursuant to such chapter or any otherwise applicable provision of law); or

(2) any reasonable restriction pertaining to the time, place, or manner of displaying the flag of the United States necessary to protect a substantial interest of the condominium association, cooperative association, or residential real estate management association.




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