Why Did God Create Satan?

Originally posted by etherical waterwave
Love stands above free will, love encompasses free will.
Free will lacks in what love can do. Free will is subordinate to love. Free will is typically human. I just said some things.

Love comes from god, freewill denotes choice. If we didn't have evil we would have no choice. If we had no evil everyone would have to love and worship God. We would be Gods mindless worshiping robots. He had to let Satan exist or we would have no freewill.

Make sense?


edit: spelling

Originally posted by Sectumsempra
reply to post by ownbestenemy

 

G-d works in mysterious ways. G-d even mentions he is a jealous G-d.

No, the Bible mentions that He is a jealous God. Which I find the Bible to be hearsay and second hand accounts and not the true word of God. If we were to believe it then God is a murderous, hateful, spiteful, and jealous being that loves His creation....something just doesn't add up.

reply to post by ownbestenemy


Where does it mention Satan is jealous of G-d in the Hebrew Bible? I'm not a Christian so I don't believe in the Christian concept of Satan.

Here are some links I would like to share with you on the Jewish view on Angels and Satan.
Satan (Chabad articles)
Angel (chabad article)

reply to post by Sectumsempra


I was saying that God was jealous. Which is evident and can be logically concluded by the commandment to not worship false idols or other gods.

reply to post by ownbestenemy


Well there you go! Do good and follow G-d.
Satan is just an Angel and nothing else.

Originally posted by ownbestenemy
This pondering upon this subject came to me after reading Thomas Paine's The Age of Reason. Obviously the book is a refutation upon Christianity and comes from a Deist point of view; as Thomas Paine self proclaimed.

He questioned why God, if we are to believe Him to be loving of His creation would create a being that would knowingly turn against Him. Why would He allow Satan to seduce Eve in the Garden of Eden? Why would He create a being that would have infinitely increasing powers that would allow him to: escape Hell and have the same powers of omnipotences upon the very people God has professed His love towards?

Greetings,

I've been mulling over this for the past few years and with unusual deliberateness, the last few days.

Why Satan? In human terms, loneliness came to mind first, even curiosity. Then I saw only black stillness an eternal and deafening quiet. There was no stirring of thought, just infinite nothingness. No form. Then the passive awareness which existed in nothingness turned inward upon itself. Sentience examining sentience. It was this act of self-awareness which brought about Satan. This distillation of awareness; focus, brought form to the void.

In mystic traditions, Satan is also a prominent figure, though often called Kal or the Negative Power.

The Negative Power has dominion over this world (as well as the astral and causal worlds), he has been subcontracted by God to create these worlds, though he cannot create or destroy souls.

The laws which govern this world, both physical and karmic, were created by the Negative Power, but all accordiing to the will of God.

The Negative Power is also called the Lord of Justice, and in some respects is similar to the Christian God.

Justice and punishment is meted out by the Negative Power, but love, mercy, and compassion are the attributes of the highest Lord of Lords.

Our connection to the Negative Power is our mind, which is his tool and creation, whereas our connection to God is our soul, which is God's creation.

To answer why God created Satan or the Negative Power would require a very indepth discourse on mystic cosmology, suffice to say that he plays a necessary role in the training of the soul on its path to God realization.

Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy. -Isaiah 54.16

Abaddon and Apollyon both mean "destroyer."


Explains his demise:

Thou hast defiled thy santuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee. -Ezekiel 28.18

Originally posted by Soke33
Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy. -Isaiah 54.16

Abaddon and Apollyon both mean "destroyer."


Explains his demise:

Thou hast defiled thy santuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee. -Ezekiel 28.18

[...] I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee [...] Just any fire? Or could this be a special type of cathartic fire?


Interesting verse.


Regards

Originally posted by ownbestenemy
No, the Bible mentions that He is a jealous God. Which I find the Bible to be hearsay and second hand accounts and not the true word of God. If we were to believe it then God is a murderous, hateful, spiteful, and jealous being that loves His creation....something just doesn't add up.

Maybe GOD was just jealous over Mrs. GOD...the "Sabbath Queen," also known as the Shekinah...or the Holy Spirit, the voice of the Earth Goddess, Sophia, Wisdom, whatever you want to call your GOD Mother...if you call GOD Father, that is.

They'd been separated ever since the 2nd chapter of Genesis...certainly a man would have some questions, spending all that time apart - from Genesis to the end of Revelation.

That's a long time!

Check out Numbers 5:12-31 and chapters 18-19 of Revelation...keeping in mind that the cup of wrath given to Babylon the Great is the same cup that the priest would give to a woman accused of cheating on her husband, per the passage in Numbers 5.

It says that she was "judged." This does not indicate a verdict, but just that a verdict was given.
How can we know what it was? Guilty or not guilty?

Immediately after the judgment of Babylon...then we read of the Lamb's wife - not bride but wife:

Revelation 19:7-8
Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honor to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

They must have already been married...had some issues...and this is the renewing of their vows...not their first rodeo, as they say.

Was she faithful or not?
Was he justified in his jealousy, or not?

Even GOD can get better at being GOD. Jealousy in a GOD is not becoming.


Just a thought or two...

reply to post by Abovo


If you read Ezekiel 28.1-19, it explains the throwing down of Satan in great detail. God created and appointed him as the cherub that covereth, and he walked to and fro in the “midst of the stones of fire”; the altar of God, and was actually the keeper of the judgment fire. (14) The iniquity found in him (15) was that he stopped loving God; his heart was lifted up because of his brightness, and it corrupted the wisdom in him (17). That is how he became the father of lies.

I believe the fire brought forth is Truth, Which is God's Word (Wisdom); That by Which He will Judge in righteousness and Truth.

…For He cometh, for He cometh to judge the earth:
He shall judge the world with righteousness,
And the people with His truth. -Psalms 96.13


(For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous GOD.) -Deuteronomy 4.24

This is further supported by a statement made by Jeremiah in his complaint after prophesying the People being delivered into the hands of the king of Babylon (type of Satan) for worshipping false gods (Jeremiah 19-20 explains). His complaint was that God had him in derision, but he couldn't deny the Truth, while others prophesied lies.

For since I spake, I cried out, I cried violence and spoil; because the word of the LORD was made a reproach unto me, and a derision, daily.
Then I said, "I will not make mention of Him, nor speak any more in His name."
But His Word was in mine heart as a burning fire shut up in my bones, and I was weary with forebearing, and I could not stay. -Jeremiah 20.8-9

It is better to be purified by the fire (Truth) of God's Word than to be consumed by His judgment fire.

Also, one may reference the exchange between Satan and Christ in the wilderness (Luke 4.1-14). Christ uses the written Word to rebuke that devil.

reply to post by ownbestenemy


You should ask God. We are not God and any answer we give you will only be speculation. Only God can answer your question because only God knows the answer to your question.

reply to post by ownbestenemy


Would it be out of jealousy or for our own protection? Only God holds the keys of life and death. All other gods lack in support.

reply to post by etherical waterwave


That is the understanding from the Bible, which I find to be hearsay. That God is a jealous god and wants you to only have faith in Him. Its understandable because that is the only way that the story would work.

But were the Greeks any less moral for believing in multiple gods? Are they all in hell because to explain the world around them they formed gods and stories that fit the unknown? Is that not the same thing later religions did and do?

I believe in God. But just not the God presented within the Hebrew and Christian books. Those were written by men. They purport to be the "word of God" but I just don't see it that way.

reply to post by ownbestenemy

Why would He create a being that would have infinitely increasing powers that would allow him to: escape Hell and have the same powers of omnipotences upon the very people God has professed His love towards?

Satan's powers are finite. He is God's "whipping boy", he does what God says and cannot operate outside God allowing him to act on anything. God continually is one step ahead of him and turns his evil into good every time. He hasn't 'escaped hell", he isn't even there yet. The Bible says he is accusing the brethren day and night before God. and isn't cast from heaven until the midway point of the 70th week of Daniel. (Tribulation) Satan is not omnipresent, he can only be in one place in the universe at one time.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by ownbestenemy

 

Why would He create a being that would have infinitely increasing powers that would allow him to: escape Hell and have the same powers of omnipotences upon the very people God has professed His love towards?

Satan's powers are finite. He is God's "whipping boy", he does what God says and cannot operate outside God allowing him to act on anything. God continually is one step ahead of him and turns his evil into good every time. He hasn't 'escaped hell", he isn't even there yet. The Bible says he is accusing the brethren day and night before God. and isn't cast from heaven until the midway point of the 70th week of Daniel. (Tribulation) Satan is not omnipresent, he can only be in one place in the universe at one time.

Satan does what Man says as man is God. There is no game of 'dog chase cat' in regard to the relationship of mankind to Satan. There are only forces which exist in the mind. It is the interplay of shadow and illusion which cause the hardship of mankind. God is Man and you hurt God every time you hurt each other. Love God and Love your Brother. No exceptions. All doom is self-inflicted.

reply to post by Menagerie


Lol, no. God is Creator, man is created. The fact that there is a moral authority for mankind shows that the authority is higher than man. Man cannot appeal to mankind for a moral authority. That is a self-refuting logical fallacy.

I've come to the opinion that man is not his body. We are spirit enthroned within a bio-vehicle. The vehicle is designed according to desire. The spirit thirsts for annihilation in God, eventually the body will be no more. So the story goes

Satan's powers are finite. He is God's "whipping boy", he does what God says and cannot operate outside God allowing him to act on anything. God continually is one step ahead of him and turns his evil into good every time. He hasn't 'escaped hell", he isn't even there yet. The Bible says he is accusing the brethren day and night before God. and isn't cast from heaven until the midway point of the 70th week of Daniel. (Tribulation) Satan is not omnipresent, he can only be in one place in the universe at one time.

If his powers are finite then why does the current church teach otherwise. They teach that Satan ever present and is the adversary of God. If this is true, then he is not finite but infinite just as God is.

But you did not answer the question. If God is a loving god and a benevolent Being, why create a being that would serve as your eternal demise and advisory? It contradicts itself yet people don't want to see it.