Merkel says German multicultural society has failed

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posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 09:17 PM
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It's about damn time someone in charge is coming to this conclusion. Multiculturalisim is poison and destructive to the host nation. I for one am filled with hope that Germany may once again be for Germans. Are you paying attention England?




posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 09:36 PM
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Originally posted by loam
reply to post by centurion1211
 



Originally posted by centurion1211
Multi-culturalism IS a failure in the U.S. as well.

Multi-ethnicity is a good thing. helping build a country with new blood.


I think you have expressed this in a way I can mostly agree with.


They really are two different things, aren't they?


Thanks.

I wish more people truly understood the difference.

People from all over the world helped build this nation into a super power - because they all wanted to be Americans - PERIOD. They didn't want to be dutch-americans, of french-americans, or any other kind of "hyphenated americans". They wanted to assimilate and learn the language and customs here. they wanted to be a part of being an American.

Now, we have all these groups that want to retain their language and customs, that love to put "I love wherever they came from" on their bumper stickers.

Sadly, these people and their supporters (mostly liberals) here will be the death of the U.S.



+13 more 
posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 09:38 PM
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Originally posted by centurion1211
Multi-culturalism IS a failure in the U.S. as well.

Multi-ethnicity is a good thing. helping build a country with new blood.

Multi-culturalism tears a country apart when immigrants won't assimilate.





Not only the lack of a desire to assimilate but requiring the new host country to follow and obey their old countries laws.



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 09:50 PM
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Originally posted by The Revenant
What is happening to us in Europe? Have we forgotten the lessons of the past? Millions of us died, from all corners of the globe, so that the lessons learnt from the collapse of fascism could be indellibly printed upon our minds for all time.


Reducing it to fascism is blinkered. It's about culture and economics.

All cultures will feel threatened by a large body of immigrant foreigners. It's not fascism, it's natural. Germany has 2.5 million Turkish immigrants alone. That's about 3% of the population, and doubtless they are concentrated geographically. That's going to cause friction, particularly in an economic down-turn.

In the current down-turn, you can expect to see anti-immigrant opinion grow because of the shortage of profitable work. Mass economic immigration leads to a lowering of salaries in semi-skilled professions. It's simple supply and demand. Immigration is bad for poor people.



We cannot allow the Jewish question to become the Islamic question - let alone the Islamic Solution.


Are you referring to the Nazi Final Jewish Solution? There is a law that states that comparing anything to Nazism immediately reduces your argument to the absurd...



Islam should be welcome wherever and whenever. It should be allowed to co-exist and cohabit in any given free and democratic society. Anything less is unjust, and fascist.


Why? I think most people would agree that in Islamic cultures, women have a very different role and status to women in the West. They are less free to make choices under Islamic cultures. I don't consider that progress.



I'm sure that Angela Merkel is just voicing the opinion that many normal Germans / Europeans / non-Muslim western citizens are thinking. But to do so reveals a shadow - a shadow that we thought had died in a bunker long ago. Can this debate be completed without the shadow coalescing into something more? Or are we condemned to reliving the lives of our ancestors, relearning their lessons - at the cost of blood, progress and humanity?


Are you getting Jungian? This 'shadow' of which you speak did not die in any bunker. It's not fascism, it's just tribe / nation self-interest. You'll see it in the school-yard. Right or wrong, it's a cultural survival mechanism. To equate it with fascism is, as I said, blinkered. Equate it rather with the reality of living in an world imperfect by nature and the nature of humans.

It's a big subject. Immigration of non-westerners into western countries does seem to be coming to a head. Personally I think there has been too much of it. It appears to have been encouraged by Western governments who wish to improve business efficiency / reduce wages. It is fundamentally an economic phenomena, and always has been.



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:06 PM
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Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by centurion1211
Multi-culturalism IS a failure in the U.S. as well.

Multi-ethnicity is a good thing. helping build a country with new blood.

Multi-culturalism tears a country apart when immigrants won't assimilate.





Not only the lack of a desire to assimilate but requiring the new host country to follow and obey their old countries laws.


Assimilate huh? Kinda reminds me of the Borg in Star Trek.
No seriously, there is nothing
wrong with people keeping their cultural heritage, why is that so difficult for some people to
understand? There is nothing wrong with having a little pride in ones family tree, it is part of
what made this Country great. I think that arrogance is a thing that appears once people forget
where they came from, seeing that The United States of America was built by the poor, outcast
and undesireables of other countries we are in no position to be knocking legal immigrants.



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:11 PM
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reply to post by The Revenant
 


I think that perhaps it is not a question of Islam.. But where the Islamic people are coming from. A german born person who was born to islam or converted is probably not a concern.. But a large group of islamic people from other countries perhaps will create turmoil. It is a clash of the cultures, they should do their best to assimilate without forgetting their heritage. And it can be done, most Americans come from a very huge variation of Ancestry and we do fairly well in the multicultural department.



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:20 PM
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Originally posted by Miraj
reply to post by The Revenant
 


I think that perhaps it is not a question of Islam.. But where the Islamic people are coming from. A german born person who was born to islam or converted is probably not a concern.. But a large group of islamic people from other countries perhaps will create turmoil. It is a clash of the cultures, they should do their best to assimilate without forgetting their heritage. And it can be done, most Americans come from a very huge variation of Ancestry and we do fairly well in the multicultural department.


Exactly the same stuff happened in the USA. I've seen old-photos for job vacancies in the USA saying 'Irish need not apply.' And that was written by ex-settlers of mostly Irish descent! They didn't want the next wave. Watch Gangs of New York.

There's nothing new here.



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:20 PM
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Originally posted by Mr. D
seeing that The United States of America was built by the poor, outcast
and undesireables of other countries we are in no position to be knocking legal immigrants.



That's exactly why I can say what I have. The US has seen both sides of this issue and we are seeing more and more of the negative aspects compared to previous waves of various immigrant nationalities/cultures which freely chose to be acclimated and or assimilated as an "American" speaking of which, the national language is "English" Not Spanish, Cantonese, Laotian or Farsey. etc etc etc.

Simply because an immigrant adopts the host countries culture doesn't mean they need to lose their heritage or traditions. Nor does it mean they can force upon others their former country's laws and traditions simply because they refuse and or are too lazy to adapt.
edit on 16-10-2010 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:33 PM
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Originally posted by Mr. D

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by centurion1211
Multi-culturalism IS a failure in the U.S. as well.

Multi-ethnicity is a good thing. helping build a country with new blood.

Multi-culturalism tears a country apart when immigrants won't assimilate.


No seriously, there is nothing
wrong with people keeping their cultural heritage, why is that so difficult for some people to
understand?


Nothing wrong with that, of course.

But multi-culturalism means they NEVER give up ANY of their cultural heritage to try and bcome part of their new home.

What's difficult to understand is if they love it so much, why are they not still there?

Anyway, glad the Germans have finally figured it out. Hope the rest of the civilized world is not far behind.
edit on 10/16/2010 by centurion1211 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:40 PM
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The comments in the article remind me of what is said about Hispanic immigrants in the USA. I think the problem has less to do with religion specifically and more to do with the current era of immigrants refusing to change their ways to accommodate their new countries and instead expecting everything to be changed to accommodate their needs. And to me that all just fits in with the entitlement generation and "me first" attitude that seems to have sneaked in uniformly into every member of every classification you can think of.

Where I live a lot of the Hispanic immigrants are starting to make learning English a priority because they see it as a key to moving up socially and economically. We have so much demand for English teachers now that there is a huge waiting list of students for the few teachers available. And we are seeing once you break down this language barrier things start falling into place. Somehow all countries must get the message across that all immigrants must at least try to learn the language of their host country. Verbal communication is the first step toward breaking down other cultural barriers. I see this also as a child of an immigrant for whom English is not the first language. It is also basic common sense.

I forgot to add we have a good number of Muslims but so far they have not posed any significant assimilation problems. Most had some level of education in their native countries and had somehow obtained proficiency in English prior to becoming US citizens. Their religion remains a personal matter that poses challenges only in limited spheres.
edit on 16-10-2010 by SheeplFlavoredAgain because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:43 PM
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Originally posted by SLAYER69

Not only the lack of a desire to assimilate but requiring the new host country to follow and obey their old countries laws.

Well said is an understatement. Star to you.


If legal immigrants think so much of their country they left, why'd they leave? It can't be because of persecution if they want their host countries, like you said, to obey the laws of where they came from.

I'm about so tired of politcal correctness, I think I'll go thr....Blaaaaaaah!
edit on 16/10/10 by Intelearthling because: bold correction



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:46 PM
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Originally posted by SheeplFlavoredAgain
The comments in the article remind me of what is said about Hispanic immigrants in the USA. I think the problem has less to do with religion specifically and more to do with the current era of immigrants refusing to change their ways to accommodate their new countries and instead expecting everything to be changed to accommodate their needs. And to me that all just fits in with the entitlement generation and "me first" attitude that seems to have sneaked in uniformly into every member of every classification you can think of.

Where I live a lot of the Hispanic immigrants are starting to make learning English a priority because they see it as a key to moving up socially and economically. We have so much demand for English teachers now that there is a huge waiting list of students for the few teachers available. And we are seeing once you break down this language barrier things start falling into place. Somehow all countries must get the message across that all immigrants must at least try to learn the language of their host country. Verbal communication is the first step toward breaking down other cultural barriers. I see this also as a child of an immigrant for whom English is not the first language. It is also basic common sense.


I agree completely....Assimilating into the culture of the country someone emigrates to is extremely important. It is not only the respectful thing to do but the right thing to do.



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:51 PM
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Originally posted by Intelearthling

I'm about so tired of politcal correctness, I think I'll go thr....Blaaaaaaah!


So many people are tired of it and it is great because it shows.

Times are tight and people don't have time for that crap anymore.


*Check this out - One in ten Germans would a new leader to come in and clean up the country with a hard hand:


One in ten Germans would like to see a Führer in power; they see dictatorship as the best option for the country, a survey has revealed.

According to a social study conducted by the Friedrich Ebert Stiftung, the longing for a strong hand is still common among Germans.

rt.com...



And the Hitler exhibit just opened in Berlin..

Times they are a'changing.



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 10:59 PM
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Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by Mr. D
seeing that The United States of America was built by the poor, outcast
and undesireables of other countries we are in no position to be knocking legal immigrants.



That's exactly why I can say what I have. The US has seen both sides of this issue and we are seeing more and more of the negative aspects compared to previous waves of various immigrant nationalities/cultures which freely chose to be acclimated and or assimilated as an "American" speaking of which, the national language is "English" Not Spanish, Cantonese, Laotian or Farsey. etc etc etc.

Simply because an immigrant adopts the host countries culture doesn't mean they need to lose their heritage or traditions. Nor does it mean they can force upon others their former country's laws and traditions simply because they refuse and or are too lazy to adapt.
edit on 16-10-2010 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)


lazy is a harsh word and is relative. There are plenty of people who want to work and always have.
A big problem in the U.S. today is that there are too many people who try to take a "cut" of peoples
wages and salaries for doing nothing. Take a look at the temporary job placement services......
They will give you a job, as long as they get their cut. That my friend is not an option. Those who
do those things are in for a huge wake up call. This country is being ruined by those who have and
do those things and it pains me to see Americans and Legal immigrants having to be subjected
to that.


This is just a drop in the bucket and empty peanut shells compared to what is really going
on my friend, why do you think their is such a backlash and controversy going on?

race.change.org...



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 11:01 PM
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reply to post by Intelearthling
 


Yes, it never made sense to me that some Muslim immigrants in Europe want Sharia implemented or have among them radical clerics. That sort of behavior does seem rather suspicious and warrants further attention and debate. I personally know of no Muslims who want our laws changed to resemble what they worked so hard and sacrificed so much to escape. Quite the contrary. They seem to enjoy our culture and only very unobtrusively reject anything that conflicts too strongly with their religion, like revealing clothes or anything that violates dietary restrictions. So I was quite surprised to read the Ft. Hood shooter might have become radicalized through talks with a cleric in he met in a mosque that is not far from where I lived. That sort of radical thinking seems more the exception than the norm for our region. Definitely not representative of Muslim sentiment and behavior as our community knows it.



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 11:07 PM
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reply to post by Exuberant1
 


So 10% say they would like some sort of Führer eh?
Well did everybody think that just because the NAZIs lost the war that some who still had admiration for them would completely vanish?


10% does seem rather high of a % though...



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 11:09 PM
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reply to post by Exuberant1
 


Ah man that's just sick. Really? That is what some of them want over there as the solution to thier problems?Now THAT is lazy. Too stupid to learn from history and unwilling to come up with a better solution...something innovative and positive. So wish for some fascist nut job to save the day.


If they are that fed up then go ahead and revoke the citizenships of anyone not willing or able to meet their standards and deport them. But not another frikkin Hitler. Hell hey probably have the DNA of the original on ice somewhere that they can clone.
idiots
edit on 16-10-2010 by SheeplFlavoredAgain because: To fix my wording because I realized you don't "elect" a fascist dictator. Doh!



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 11:20 PM
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She's right. Not right in her morality, but right in the fact that it hasn't worked...

It hasn't worked anywhere, EVER...

It hasn't worked in the west, it hasn't worked in the east, or the middle east.

Integration is a hard pill to force on an unwilling patient.

It isn't the right frame of mind, and can be quite dangerous allowed to escalate.

As much as we may not want to accept it, Racism seems to an almost untouchable and natural part of the human psychi.

It has to be taught, persuaded, and FORCED (in some instances) out of the mindset....

All the way back to the Anglo vs. the Neanderthal..

What its been Its been since men...and its very strange...


hmmm.....



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 11:32 PM
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Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by Exuberant1
 


10% does seem rather high of a % though...



That's what I was thinking.

This is just the 10 percent who are brave enough to admit it.

What was the voter percentage that elected Hitler and what percent of the population did they make up?

Ah, it was about 36 percent. That was 13.5 million votes which was about 17 percent of the population (according to the 1939 census). But the German population in the early 1930s was around 62 million so that makes it about 22 percent.


It is safe to say that Germany has its balls back. I think.


edit on 16-10-2010 by Exuberant1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 16 2010 @ 11:36 PM
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reply to post by OneEleven
 


Well I think pretty much any group of people can get along regardless of race, religion, or national origin if they agree to unite to promote common interests that ensure everyone has a safe pleasant community. My block is like that. We are a diverse bunch but we band together to help each other keep our property values secure. We look out for all the kids. We dig each other out of snow drifts. We all share an ideal of what our neighborhood should be like and we each sacrifice a little individuality to achieve a pleasing shared existence that expresses this ideal.

The problem with multiculturalism is that it's taken to extremes and promotes the idea that nobody has to agree to a common good because there is No such thing and we are all somehow supposed to coexist in our individual bubbles, separate but equal.





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