Provide reasoned argument refuting OP, OP ignores it and then gets many flags.

Don't you just hate it when you make a great argument against an OP and then the OP just ignores it and continues posting without addressing any of the points you made? Isn't it even worse when the further points of the OP are things you already addressed?

And then the post gets a bunch of flags because people read the OP, like it, and don't care about any further arguments.

Perhaps it is only you who feels it is a great argument. However, I do know what your talking about, though you can't rule out the first point.


--airspoon.

reply to post by madnessinmysoul


My experience is that a lot of people do not read any of the reply posts at all.
It's really annoying to answer or defend the same stuff over and over again.

But what can you do about it ?

reply to post by madnessinmysoul


Maybe your just looking at it from one side. Say you are in a thread and disagree with what has been posted and state your opinion. Obviously the like minded people are going to agree with each other and disregard what you have stated because there on the same side of the fence. Maybe what you have stated punched holes in there thread and simply ignored you for that reason. Who knows? But in the end you shouldn't let it get to you people tend not to critically think around here as of lately.

reply to post by airspoon


I've considered it, but it's still only a common courtesy to reply to someone's post if they're on point and addressing all the issues and they disagree.

If I'm wrong, people should be able to show me that I am.

I think in a long thread there is only one way to get anyone to read your reply and notice your point and that is to get in very early (first page) and then hope at least two people give you a star, from then on it become almost self fulfilling, people will only read the starred posts on the first page and then add stars to them making it even more likely people will read them. At that point if the OP still ignores it they look kind of silly and other people on the thread will start asking the same question.

A lot of the long debates on here are more or less defined on the first page with the first few posts setting out the agenda for the rest of the thread, after that if you make a point that hasn't been thought of it seems to be ignored.

reply to post by madnessinmysoul


Try not to let it bother you as much. If you do say something significant, whoever was meant to read it to gain something from it will read it. Keep replying with your best intentions, and your words will reach those meant to hear. Don't be discouraged!

I don't really understand the whole star / flag thing anyway, there something that people collect and give to each other that have no discernible use, kind of like Pokemon

Originally posted by airspoon
Perhaps it is only you who feels it is a great argument. However, I do know what your talking about, though you can't rule out the first point.


--airspoon.

This very well may be the case.

Having interacting with you in the past...you seem to think very highly of yourself and your "arguments".

reply to post by OutKast Searcher

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher

Originally posted by airspoon
Perhaps it is only you who feels it is a great argument. However, I do know what your talking about, though you can't rule out the first point.


--airspoon.

This very well may be the case.

Having interacting with you in the past...you seem to think very highly of yourself and your "arguments".

I'm not saying they may be absolutely certain, but a good example was a person posted a thread that was based on a youtube video that was also provided.

I went through a bit more than the first two minutes of the video pointing out the basic factual errors, not issues of ideology or argument, in it. Blatant misrepresentation of the Constitution, basic failings at understanding the US budget and simple mathematics failures.

Instead of them being addressed, those refutations were all ignored in favor of calling me out on entirely separate issues that weren't presented in the video or my post.

I do not expect my posts to be seen as the greatest of ideas, but I at least expect my ideas to be treated with the basic respect of being addressed.
What's more insulting is that I was given responses that entirely ignored that I had made a previous post, not that people still disagreed with me.

If you feel like you've made a good enough argument to disagree with me, you are free to do so. Just at least acknowledge that I have made a point that disagrees with yours.

Searcher, you are one of the few people on here that I disagree with that I actually have a level of respect for on an intellectual level. I'm not saying the other people I disagree with are stupid, they just act in intellectually dishonest and deceiving ways regardless of their intelligence levels.

We may disagree, but at least we disagree through actual argumentation, not both of us simply asserting that we're right and the other is wrong.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul

Instead of them being addressed, those refutations were all ignored in favor of calling me out on entirely separate issues that weren't presented in the video or my post.

I do not expect my posts to be seen as the greatest of ideas, but I at least expect my ideas to be treated with the basic respect of being addressed.
What's more insulting is that I was given responses that entirely ignored that I had made a previous post, not that people still disagreed with me.

Just try to take it in stride. Although the person you are engaged in debate with might not acknowledge your points of validity, perhaps there are "side-liners" that will.

In most regards, if a person is being hard-headed, stubborn, in denial, or disregarding your words, sometimes you just have to be the better person and let it be. You can get upset or scream your lungs out to be heard, but you're the only one feeling the negativity.

Keep your head up and try not to let the opposition get to you too much. May Peace be unto you.

reply to post by OutKast Searcher

Having interacting with you in the past...you seem to think very highly of yourself and your "arguments".

Without going too far off topic, I've never above admitting that I'm wrong and I certainly am not above changing my opinion or theory based on the information or logic provided by others. In fact, I have done so right here on ATS. However, in order for me to do that, the logic has to be sound, as does the information provided. More often than not, it's the logic that people seem to have a hard time, when failing to win over my opinion. I can't tell you how many times people have made arguments against mine without using sound logic behind their arguments or without understanding the logic behind my argument. Their information may be right, but the logic used to piece it together isn't.

For instance and using a pure hypothetical, I may say that the sky was red over NYC on the moring of August 10th, 2009. Someone may say, "well the sky is almost always either blue, black or any portion in between so chances are that the sky wasn't red in August of that year, therefore your assessment is wrong". While the information may be correct, the logic isn't and therefore I'm unlikely to buy your explanation. However, if you say, "the sky is often red due to dust or sand particles kicked up in the sky by the winds of a pressure front and there was no pressure front anywhere in the vicintiy of North America on August 10, 2009... Here is my source, then I'm more inclined to take what you say, weigh it against whatever information I'm basing my assessment from and then modify it accordingly. That logic is sound, therefore I'm far more likely to run with it.

So in effect, I'm more than happy to modify, change or otherwise retract my theories or assessments, provided that both the information and logic is sound and accurate, as well as more plausible than whatever information that I may have. If you weren't able to change my mind or get me to accept your theory, then it is probably because I didn't agree with your logic, your information was unproven, you didn't understand my logic or I simply overlooked your post. Either way you have it, you weren't able to convince me that you are right and I'm wrong, like some other members have. I'm always willing to change to my world-view or adjust my theories accordingly, as I'm only interested in the truth, regardless of how that truth rubs against my own personal biases or world-view. It's called objectiveness.

Furthermore, I generally don't post on something unless I'm sure about that which I'm posting or unless I have thoroughly researched the subject at hand. I would never just post as if I knew what I'm talking about, when I really don't. In fact, that is a pet-peeve of mine. Because of this, it generally takes a pretty good argument and sound logic to tie it together in order for me to cede my own. I also hardly ever make an absolute conclusion without absolute proof and since little in this universe provides absolute proof, my convictions are few. Some people don't need absolute and sound proof before coming to conclusion and being convinced of that conclusion. Many people who either lack objectivety, come to conclusions without sound proof or both, think that others believe and/or learn in the same way and so can't fathom why or how some people don't believe the same the things, even when looking at the same body of evidence.

Anyway, I can assure you that if you make a good enough argument by providing proven facts and using sound logic to tie it all together, I'm more than willing to change my line of thinking, as I have done often through-out my life. In fact, it's the benefit of being objective. If I didn;t do that with you, it's not because I'm unwilling to or because I think too highly of myself, rather it's because I didn't buy your argument, or one of us didn't understand the other's logic. With that said, I learn from people all the time and I have often found that the best lessons are taught by the least likely people in the least likely places. There is a lesson to be learned with almost everyone and that notion has not escaped me.


--airspoon

Some people would rather just get out what they need to get out,
share what they need to share,
and get on with it.

Not everyone is interested in a heated/and-or long winded debate about everything, all the time.

I do know what your talking about,
from both sides.
Sometimes being the OP ~and not really caring to have a personal discussion with anyone, and not bothering to address opinions and get into long discussions sometimes.
and also having been the responder who the OP doesn't bother to address.

Who cares.

Well, you do apparently..
but I don't know why.....

You said what you needed to say,
and chances are it was seen,
and by more than just the one you intended it for...
So you made your feelings known, and people saw what you wanted them to..
So what if your ego isn't fed with a response?
it should keep you humble, not make you feel like your thoughts MUST BE ADDRESSED!


Get over yerself mate.