reply to post by muzzleflash
Oh really? So the Persian Empire never existed? They never attacked, or owned huge parts of the globe?
You call others ignorant in relevance of History, yet you are completely ignorant to any History that isn't told in the US. Your own mind is already
made up by years of propaganda, and just because you "google stuff" you think you actually have learned the truth.
It actually saddens me that you can have such an illusion about the world. Just because you only about the good parts (which, to them, are bad) of
Western History, doesn't mean that they were all saints, poor and ignorant since the beginning of times.
They have had empires while Europe was in rubble, and we have had empires while they were in rubble. It's one of the basic notions of History, and yet
you don't restrain yourself from thinking too high of yourself and "yelling"
"learn some facts".
Fact: Not every Muslim hates the West, nor the US. Period. There are people who actually agree with that life style and politics, thus countries like
Iran having a youth that tends to be pro-West/US. But, the ones that do hate, hate the country, as a whole, not the US military.
Fact: Those Muslims that aim hate towards the US aren't victims, okay? They are rich, powerful man with their own interests. They don't give a crap
about what their people are suffering, but they do use their peoples pain in heart to justify and carry on with their goals. You failing to understand
this, thinking that everyone either is a victim/saint or a murderer, is a logical fallacy.
The suicide bombers, the kids that attack troops, the soldiers that still resist, are just pawns in a much bigger game. The US isn't innocent, and the
war doesn't have a reason to exist, but that doesn't mean that the US is the bogeyman and that Europe/Western civilization is the cancer of the world
(bare in mind that I'm not a US citizen, nor american).
Fact: What you, and many others, are actually feeling is a notion of guilty because we live better than most parts of the world. We have food, water,
shelter, luxuries, computers, tv and internet. All that with time and money to spare on mundane habits and commercial seductions. So you are filled
with this hate for Western Civilization, because since your birth you have seen a Europe and America with wealth, with peace in their territories and
with problems that could be solved. You saw growth and economies flourish from a form of good life.
And so you feel guilty, because you have what millions don't and will never have. And since the History that is taught in the classroom is the History
of the winner, and not the looser (especially in the US), you think that through all out the History, Europe and later the US, have been crushing the
world with colonies and what not.
A reality check, is that you can't look at History (REAL History) within your life time, you can't even look at it from the books in your country, and
from opinions that are born with the same circumstances than yours.
You have to learn YOUR History, the correct one, and THEIRS.
You don't restrain from saying "THIS IS WHY THEY HATE US! Because we attack their cities and their people". I ask you... Do you know the extent of the
Persian Empire? Do you know how many wars, and for how many time, such empires lived and fought? I say the Persian Empire, because it's a obvious
comparison to Iran's current situation in the world.
But lets pick another example...China, that you mentioned. China now is growing stronger, but was week for many, many years. Yet, everyone that looks
at China as poor, underdeveloped, and well...stupid...fail to realize that you are actually talking about the country that once built a freaking wall
around the whole empire. A structure that still lives today, and should remind people like you that the world is a balance of powers that never stops
to find a perfect balance within humanity. Look at the Chinese wall, and then imagine that the Chinese empire was even bigger than the area of the
wall, in their prime time.
Concluding, we have Asia with huge empires, ages ago. We have the Middle East with huge empires, ages ago. We have Europe with huge empires, ages ago.
Now, we have America with a huge empire, and like every other civilization before you
, America does their share of mistakes, even
...so, where does that feeling of guilty comes from? Why are people so anxious to judge, criticize and put down their own home, when it's just a proof
of the Human way of evolving, with up's and down's and twist's?
That part, is settled and refuted. In order for you logic to make sense, you would need to ignore all past History of the world, and not only
remembering the past 500 years (which, you did).
And not only the past, but also the future. What about Africa? Do you have any doubts that in 500, 1000 years, they will possibly be an empire, or at
least a super-power? Sure, they have just stepped out of dark times. But given time, any nation/continent can build enough momentum to go into power.
There is nothing morally wrong about it.
But, let's leave philosophy and question more actual stuff.
You put videos of US soldiers in confrontation, with common activities during a war, and you label it "They care about THIS! They hate us because of
May I ask you, where did you made such a logical step, from ignoring all US realities, and just going to the conclusion that they hate your soldiers,
and your military power?
Because, to me, they don't hate the US military. They hate the US (again, the ones that do. Not all of them hate the US).
They hate people like YOU.
YOU voted in an election that selected the people who made these wars happen. YOUR vote led to actions being taken that produced this results.
YOU contribute DAILY for the system that makes such wars happen. YOU demand a life style that is also kept with this kind of things. YOU and ALL
OTHERS with a guilt complex over this whole issue, project their self-guilt into soldiers.
And I'm not saying that your intentions are bad, or wrong. I'm not even saying that I don't agree with your overall message. I do agree with it, I do
know for a fact that this wars are a bucket full of crap.
the people that you are showing here in public, and pointing fingers at, judging them and putting them responsible for all the bad things
the US does... I'm sorry, but it's idiotic and utterly wrong. For the bad, and for the worst, they are YOUR soldiers, YOUR friends, YOUR sons, YOUR
fathers and mothers.
If you want to point in a direction, where people could understand why there is so much rage towards the US from the Middle East, show videos of your
elections, of President Bush (father and son), of President Clinton. Show videos of Obama claiming that he was going to carry on with the war in
Afghanistan, although removing troops from Iraq. Show them videos of average americans and their opinions and knowledge about the people that you so
Show the real picture, and not the idiotic and ignorant notion that the military are actually the commanders of the US, and the ones responsible for
making such decisions. The military branch is a tool of YOUR system, a system in which you belong. They are not your governors.
The whole Kuran thingy, is just another drop in a glass of water that is already full on their side. Western actions have not been right, crimes were
committed, people are suffering.
But the way you try to portray that, making the military as a Jesus of all US sins, is wrong.
edit on 14/9/10 by Tifozi because: Added last paragraphs.