So, What happens to you if/when religion is proven false?

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

I'm an atheist so nothing would happen to me, however i believe that your entire post is a logical fallacy. No matter what evidence is presented there will always be those who have faith. Consider Evolution, it is beyond a doubt that Evolution occurs, the evidence is overwhelming and yet we still see people saying "god gone and dunnit".

Theres no way you will stop some people believing in the magic man, all that can be hoped for is that these people don't let their religion get in the way of human development.

Doesn't the impartiality of your statement hinge upon which definition of "we " is used?
If "we" is defined from the viewpoint of an American atheist, the depiction of those that disagree with the theory evolution as possessing a regional accent possibly may not be considered culturally biased, as those people are the most vocal in their disagreement.
If "we" is defined from the the viewpoint of an atheist, wouldn't consideration of the numbers of all the religious that deny the theory of evolution dictate that the phrase be " Allah did it" to lack any cultural bias?
Am I to logically assume that my regionally accented assertion "that there ain't no God" is of less value than your own?

Great post OP. I think this is a VERY legit topic that every person should ponder because change is inevitable and this could happen soon.

First, one should realize what organized religion is at it's foundation. It is a belief system based on the written words of those who lived a LONG time ago. These words are used to best describe the time that these ancients lived in. What happened then, does NOT serve us best now. We are failing because so many people are not trying to adapt to what is best for us NOW. If we don't adjust according to the time we live in, we have only ourselves to blame; not religion, not science, NOT God.

Secondly, the truth of the OP's topic could come in a number of ways. One situation, that I believe highly probable, are the discoveries in Quantum Mechanics. Science is searching VERY hard as we speak to explain (not theorize) the creation of everything...and it WILL happen soon. How will this impact your belief system when you find out that our entire Universe is ONE living entity and that you & I & everyone are all connected? If that doesn't change your way of thinking, nothing will. Take it a step further, and science also tells us that there are an infinite number of Universe's that coexist in a harmonious dance in order for physical life to happen. This implies that there is a tremendous amount of planning and creation happening on an infinite scale. Can we even think that big? Really? It would say to me that a supremely intelligent force (God) is in control of everything...and that we need to reconsider what the intelligent foce is. Remember...everything is energy. (I do NOT mean to imply that we don't have free will - that's another discussion)

If anyone is interested at all in the "First" paragraph, check out the two books by Eckhart Tolle called "the Power of Now" and "A New Earth". They are both life changing, if you are open to it.

Peace to all.

ZenTao

Curiously some of you seem to know little or nothing about religion and yet go on and on, so lets start with basic precepts. Religion is not an attempt to explain how the universe works, while most religions have creation metaphors, not all, not even most, religions insist on a literal dogmatic interpretation of their texts. Religion is a means to acquire values without the necessity of suffering ones own ignorance and learning values by experience. Great part of the human experience has to do with learning through the effect that our decisions have on our self esteem. Most of the things you have learned about yourself or will learn about yourself, have been experienced and learned by countlesss individuals before you. Religion can provide the way to benefit from the experience of previous generations.

Intellectualism seems to be prospering here of late, but the intellect is often an impediment to the learning of values. Through the intellect anything can be explained, unfortunately through the intellect anything can be justified. So we see in our society how the decay of values is causing a rise of the selfish and ambitious, people without integrity that would sell their mothers for a bigger piece of the pie.

Personally I could care less what values you people represent, but I would urge you to accquire a coherent set, and not just hide your personal ignorance behind clever intellectual responses. You'll enjoy life more and help to make the world a better place.

Scientifically speaking it has been proven wrong even the ego has been proven wrong. People take their truths for # feeds like super market tabloids and our corrupted media. If they really had a cornerstone of their belief system in science I am sure their life would change if they heard about these findings.

Originally posted by Ufokrazy
Religion is the only thing that is keeping a lot of people from committing Sins. So, the consequences is going to be the opposite if it doesn't exist.....

[edit on 4-9-2010 by Ufokrazy]

[edit on 4-9-2010 by Ufokrazy]

Come now..."the only thing...from committing sins" ??? Most open minded people would say that Religion does more harm than good. It puts blinders on sheople and demands their allegiance out of fear. It creates a thought process that makes it OK to judge AND condemn people...Hypocrisy as it's hightest.

Yes, for some people, I suppose it gives them something to hold on to. But, it still clouds their minds. Showing up on Sunday does not make you a good, religous person. It's about how you live every minute of every day. Religion also keeps you from looking for answers where they truly come from....within. God is IN you and they don't want you to know that. Then you would have no need for them and no reason to put money in their baskets. Have faith in YOU. I believe in you because we are all the same and we are all ONE. Open your mind to other possibilities. Life is MUCH, much more than what you can see and what you've been told. The truth is IN you. Not in a book or the beliefs of someone else.

Peace.

I would ask the reverse question. What would you do if you were faced with evidence that there is a God behind the smoke and mirrors?

And why would he bother to notice you?

reply to post by ntech


why does everyone make the assumption any "god" has a gender. Maybe because the bible and other religious texts were written by men.

reply to post by ZenTao


yeah, that argument is extremely flawed. It assumes that without religion, we all act like savages, when in fact it is WITH religion that we lose our minds. The Crusades, King Philips War, and of course the war in the middle east (among countless others. sorry im not good with history, just look up religious based wars on google or something) have all been started by fundamentalist idiots who try to convert and exterminate anyone who does not share their beliefs. If everyone was an atheist, society would still function properly and its ignorant to think otherwise.

[edit on 4-9-2010 by falige]

reply to post by SaturnFX


Not sorry to say, you have no idea what you're doing. You want to play games with your soul then that is entirely your business. It's called Free Will. You're quite free to live, believe and rant what you will. You don't have to believe the laws of gravity apply to you, either...until you happen to step off a 10 story building. Surprise! They DO apply, even to you. So, you will be just as surprised when you enter into eternity and, lo and behold, God's law does apply to you, afterall. Lemme put it this way... by following Christ I have lost nothing, even if I am wrong. But if I'm right, YOU'VE lost everything...forever. Do you gamble much? Never bet against the house, the odds are always against you. I'm quite used to folks who don't want to discuss these matters rationally, so I'm posting this and moving on. I PRAY you change your mind and heart. "Every knee will bow, and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord."

reply to post by falige


I'd like to think so, but even an atheist might demean someone for something other than religion, such as the way they speak.
Same amount of friction, just no gods involved.


Edit: cause I type like I speak.

[edit on 4-9-2010 by 23refugee]

Uh,

well sorry to break it to you but religion is false. It consists of various institutions that have different rules and guidelines for the followers and even preachers.

Organized religion has proven to be judgmental, hypocritical, corrupt, flawed, and disgusting. Hell, even Thomas Jefferson agreed that Christianity is perverted.

Does that mean there's no Universal creator? Of course not, but I promise you it's not a Christian, Jewish, Muslim, etc creator. It's purely science....however, chances of some kind of intelligent creator of all existing are quite slim.

Any and all evidence will be surpressed, the time machine if it uses green technology will be stolen and shelfed. The time traveler will be assissinated and his character will also be discredited by the church. Then the story will leak to a tabloid and all the information with it becomes also discredited because of this action. The world will not change and nothing will happen. IMO

Brothers and Sisters,

You can never prove religion false. Religion is ones perception of the world he/she lives in. We ALL are the center of OUR universe peering out through the eyes we have and interpreting it the best we can. Each and everyone of us will do this differently. No two atheists are the same, no two Christians the same, no two Muslims the same, etc.

All we see of this world is but one part that our tiny little minds can perceive. We would do more if we took the time to share and understand our perceptions without judgement over who's is right or wrong.

Just a thought, with love,

Your Brother

Religion is a belief. A belief in a God is just that, a belief.
Some people believe, others don't.
You will never convince a religious believer that his/her belief is wrong, he/she will just never believe that. They are convinced that their belief is the actual truth, which it, in reality, may or may not be.
But you will never shake that belief.
A non-believer could however be convinced that there is a God by seeing, or believing to see, proof of that God's existence.
You can make a non-believer turn into a believer, but you seldom can achieve the reverse.
A non-believer will start to believe in a God usually after some traumatic event that has affected him/her very deeply.

Born again Christians actually revere Jesus Christ more than the God. After all Christianity is the belief in Jesus Christ.

To paraphrase William Shakespeare - To believe or not to believe that is the question.

Originally posted by ntech
I would ask the reverse question.

I would ask you to start your own thread.

Originally posted by marieisme64
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

Not sorry to say, you have no idea what you're doing. You want to play games with your soul then that is entirely your business. It's called Free Will. You're quite free to live, believe and rant what you will.

Oh, I have an idea what I am doing...I am asking a philosophical question on ATS to encourage discussion about what the core values are away from any particular religion...I dont think asking questions = playing games with your soul...matter of fact, if the soul is at stake, I would venture to say asking questions is perhaps the best thing you can do to ensure the most clear picture possible to choose from.

I'm quite used to folks who don't want to discuss these matters rationally, so I'm posting this and moving on.

Seems you have learned to do exactly as you stated...no rational discussion, just rant and leave.

reply to post by SaturnFX


A very good question. I dont think its contrary to believe in God (Higher power, diety, etc) but not subscribe to an organized Religion.

Faith - A belief in things unseen.

One can look into the Bible, Quran, Torah, etc and see a "version" that a particular group wants people to subscribe to. By doing this, I think religion fails to live up to what its designed for.

Religions throughout the world preach peace, except to those who dont subscribe to that particular religion.

We are all Gods children - And yet religions take on the aspect of spoiled children vying to get the most attention from the parental unit, and doing so in such a manner that it puts down the other "children" to make itself look better.

Organized Religions are full of contradicitons, willfully pointing out these contradictions in others belief system, while ignoring its own.

In my personal opinion (I was raised Catholic btw) religion, I think, has been more of a hinderance than a help. Throughout history we can see what happens when religion is used as a source for change. In every single scenario, we see that when one religion makes strides to become better, there is always another group attached that is setback, or hindered, from advancing for whatever reason.

I suppose the statements that say - If we were alive 2k years ago, and ancient aliens decended through the atmosphere and made contact with us, we would accept them as Gods. This example is found throughout humankinds journey. During WWII the United States established airfields on remote islands in the Pacific Ocean. The occupants of these islands did not have contact with a modernized world. So when our planes were stationed there, they were used to airdrop food to the natives in addition to be used for the war.

When we left, the natives were confused as to why their skygods, who cared for them by giving them food fromheaven, left. There are photos of them building airplanes out of brush and burning them to get the "Gods" to return.

If religion is suppose to be designed to bring people closer to God, I find it intresting that these exact same groups pick and choose what message they want to give by picking and choosing what "prophets, apostles, seers, what have you" to use.

The greatest social changes throughout history have never been based on religion. Setting religion aside all you are left with are a group of people who decided enough was enough, and made a stand. Religion then comes in and claims the change as their own.

In the end, we all have the exact same fate - Death.

What happens from there is unknown. I think the unknown portion is how religion is able to interweave itself into our process.

Kind of makes you think:

We spend all of this time and energy in convincing people to have Faith in something they cant see, touch or understand until it happens to them, while at the very same time saying that if you arent this religion, or that religion, then you dont get to go.

One could almost apply the Ferme Paradox to religion as well. If god exists, then where is he/she? Why have they not come to this planet, smack our heads together and then placed in the corner to think about what we did wrong.

Religion - Right idea in theory, wrong application in practice.

One of my favorite scenes from the West Wing that kind of sums some of this stuff up, from the hypocrisy of religion, to how its used piece meal to push an agenda:

Youtube Link - West Wing

Going to war over Religion is like fighting over who has the better imaginary friend.

[edit on 4-9-2010 by Xcathdra] - Spelling, Dyslexia, etc



[edit on 4-9-2010 by Xcathdra]

reply to post by SaturnFX


I'll give you a star and flag for an insightful question. But no, I wouldn't be affected, because regardless of any dogma being correct. I almost am within contact with my soul always so I don't need validation fro anyone/or thing.

On the flip to your question. You go to the past to discover that a vast majority of the scriptures were correct(to some correlating degree). Inveresly would your life be affected if you "knew" 100% that there was now a heaven and a hell?

Originally posted by agentofchaos
On the flip to your question. You go to the past to discover that a vast majority of the scriptures were correct(to some correlating degree). Inveresly would your life be affected if you "knew" 100% that there was now a heaven and a hell?

Thanks for the actual answer...and since you did somewhat answer the question, I will answer your question.

No, I do not think I would change at all...see, I could choose to do exactly as the bible states for me to do, but that would be a forced action that is not in my heart to do for any reason, disgusted at the Godhead for demanding clones..I would eventually realize that the more "proper christian" I became, the more I resented the rules set down that destroyed personal paths, promising all sorts of horrible things should I attempt to explore the universe and all its mysteries...that in itself would have me fall far short of the requirements needed to enter heaven, which would make me fall back to simply living my life how I seen fit and the deity can either accept me as a individual creation, or choose eternal torment for an eternity...either way, it would allow for me to live at least a few years or decades as a individual.

Interesting thread. But the truth to all these post is the simple answer..... You can not prove something negative. The religious people will always look for ways to say they are correct.


See the link for more information...

skepticwiki.org...'t_Prove_a_Negative%22