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Originally posted by MY2Commoncentsworth
reply to post by soficrow
Originally posted by soficrow
NoHierarchy again:
"free markets- they're all good and well but ONLY if we dismantle hierarchies/centralization within MARKETS at the exact same time we dismantle them in governments. If we shut off government but allow massive, centralized, top-down, hierarchical markets/businesses to exist... you're still going to have tyranny, except there won't even be the ILLUSION of Democracy, a public vote, or fair representation... "
Centralization in the Capitalist Free Market has already been dismantled by Anti-Trust Legislation which would have never been possible if the Centralized Constitutional Federal Government would have been dismantled.
I mean no disrespect but you Progressives are laughable. You must really think that us common folk are stupid or something. You want to dismantle the Capitalist Free Market, along with the Federal Government......... Let the Market correct itself. It's when politicians start tinkering with the market that problems soon develop.
Have sensible regulations that protect us from the likes of criminals who have gotten us into the mess we are in today. But don't try to tinker with the Market, and don't try to dismantle it. And don't try to abolish the Federal Government either. As loathsome as The Fed can be at times, it is necessary in order for the country to prosper. It is also Constitutional.
Originally posted by soficrow
Net Neutrality would prevent corporate gate-keepers and government from controlling the Net.
But the net cant be controlled by Corporations. One can only control the content coming from ones own Server.
Originally posted by NoHierarchy
Power and wealth corrupt, plain and simple.
Governments and markets are inherently corrupting, plain and simple. Dismantle them both or dismantle neither.
If we don't have checks and balances we have autocracy.
We don't have it terrible... but there is also massive room for improvement. Capitalism is just as much a failure as Communism.
Originally posted by Chevalerous
While we're at it about Internet freedom, just ask Google about Fascist China, if their Internet for 1.3 billions is freer than ever!
It's for an example only imaginations & lies that the Media mogul Silvio Berlusconi and other elite Corporations & the corporatocracy are now actually lobbying to censor forums, Blogs and digital news-papers to control what should/could be written on the net in Italy and in several other countries around the EU.
This is exactly what the Supporters of Net Neutrality are trying to prevent!
They are seriously discussing this on the highest political levels right now both in the EU and the US - Have you totally missed this?
You must have misunderstood what exactly Net Neutrality is about?
(especially those who are delusional enough to think that the Commies are behind Net Neutrality! -
Originally posted by Skyfloating
Originally posted by soficrow
One particular experience stands out for me - around 7:00am of December 4, 2003, I was reading articles about "fibromuscular dysplasia" on the US national medical database, "Pubmed," which listed over 1.5 million articles on the subject. Suddenly, everything disappeared and a window came up saying, "This topic has been closed." ...I spent about 5 hours that day madly dashing from one database to the next, as they ALL closed on the topic. ...Pubmed re-opened the topic after about 3 months and a HUGE outcry - but the 1.5 million articles were censored down to about 16! In the intervening 7 years, the total is now 307.
Thats a very interesting account, to say the least.
Originally posted by Maslo
It can be controlled by ISPs. Net neutrality would outlaw this. The ISP would be able to control only speed and amount of data, but not its content.
Originally posted by Skyfloating
Originally posted by Maslo
It can be controlled by ISPs. Net neutrality would outlaw this. The ISP would be able to control only speed and amount of data, but not its content.
Precisely.
And it is my Belief that a Service-Provider should be able to determine what services it provides and what services it does not provide.
...the Departments of Commerce and Agriculture "have almost completed the process of distributing $7 billion in funding from the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009 (ARRA),"
Big cable has beef with FCC, says broadband deployment is timely
And it is my Belief that a Service-Provider should be able to determine what services it provides and what services it does not provide.
Originally posted by MY2Commoncentsworth
reply to post by NoHierarchy
We don't have it terrible... but there is also massive room for improvement. Capitalism is just as much a failure as Communism.
Bulls***! Things are terrible. The only room for real improvement is what I have described above. Capitalism has not failed. It is Communism that has failed all over the world......why do you think they all had to resort to Capitalist Markets?
...bizarre and childish anti-commie tirade. Using words like equality/neutrality/oppression absolutely DOES NOT make you a communist.
Originally posted by soficrow
Because really, there's not much difference -at all- between the two in practice.
Capitalism and Communism: Two Sides of the Same Coin?
Originally posted by MY2Commoncentsworth
reply to post by soficrow
Originally posted by soficrow
Because really, there's not much difference -at all- between the two in practice.
Capitalism and Communism: Two Sides of the Same Coin?
What is it about Corporations that you hate so much? If you are afraid that they are going to make a profit, why don't you just buy stock like a normal person does? Why do you want to dismantle the Corporate Structure that has made this country great?
If you really believe there is little difference between Capitalism and Communism you are either overwhelmingly ignorant or you are just trying to spread Communist Propaganda. Which is it?
[edit on 7-9-2010 by MY2Commoncentsworth]
Originally posted by NoHierarchy
Wake up- it's time to move beyond the systems that fail us instead of trying to hammer out and polish a defective machine.
Originally posted by Skyfloating
Originally posted by Chevalerous
It's for an example only imaginations & lies that the Media mogul Silvio Berlusconi and other elite Corporations & the corporatocracy are now actually lobbying to censor forums, Blogs and digital news-papers to control what should/could be written on the net in Italy and in several other countries around the EU.
Yeah, like they're actually succeeding
Look at Wikileaks.
I love it how people keep complaining of having "no freedom of speech" while writing about EXACTLY the things they supposedly have no freedom of speech about.
This is exactly what the Supporters of Net Neutrality are trying to prevent!
No.
And No.
They are:
1. Creating an Artifical Problem ("The Corporate Fascistoids have taken over the Internet!!!!!")
2. Offering the Solution ("More Regulations! More control!")
They are:
1. Creating an Artifical Problem ("The Corporate Fascistoids have taken over the Internet!!!!!")
2. Offering the Solution ("More Regulations! More control!")
Corporatocracy, in social theories that focus on conflicts and opposing interests within society, denotes a system of government that serves the interest of, and may de facto be run by, corporations and involves ties between government and business. where corporations, conglomerates, and/or government entities with private components, control the direction and governance of a country, including carrying out economic planning notwithstanding the 'free market' label.
Originally posted by MY2Commoncentsworth
reply to post by NoHierarchy
Originally posted by NoHierarchy
Wake up- it's time to move beyond the systems that fail us instead of trying to hammer out and polish a defective machine.
Ya but what would you replace it with? Care to share that with us? And how will net neutrality be protected under your new system?
The Kochs are longtime libertarians who believe in drastically lower personal and corporate taxes, minimal social services for the needy, and much less oversight of industry—especially environmental regulation. These views dovetail with the brothers’ corporate interests. In a study released this spring, the University of Massachusetts at Amherst’s Political Economy Research Institute named Koch Industries one of the top ten air polluters in the United States. And Greenpeace issued a report identifying the company as a “kingpin of climate science denial.” The report showed that, from 2005 to 2008, the Kochs vastly outdid ExxonMobil in giving money to organizations fighting legislation related to climate change, underwriting a huge network of foundations, think tanks, and political front groups. Indeed, the brothers have funded opposition campaigns against so many Obama Administration policies—from health-care reform to the economic-stimulus program—that, in political circles, their ideological network is known as the Kochtopus.