A challenege for everyone!

Hey guys,
When I was a young kid I always used to joke to myself that no one else was real, and everyone is in the world is just a product of imagination.

And now the older and more in-tune get with myself and everything around me, the more I realize how disturbing this thought actually is. I've had some crazy coincidences, happenings in the past year of my life and it sort of begs the question who is in charge of it all? God? Perhaps it's me? It may even be my dog, eh?

You take a schizophrenic person, put them in an unstable environment, and suddenly faces start appearing on the walls. No one else can see them, but does that make them any less real to the schizophrenic person? Of course not. So as connected and unified as our conscious is...there is certainly a hint of disconnection from human to human as well.

So I issue a challenge to you guys. Can you prove to me that you are real? A conscious, thinking, free-willed person like I believe I am. Or are you just an extension of my personality and imagination and work like a computer program. I input data into you, you process a function a predetermined response, and output it to me?

Just because we say the sky is blue does not mean that we see the same color. So I challenge you ATS, how can you prove your existence?

Hey, since you're just a figment of my imagination, why are YOU asking ME such difficult questions? Huh???

I had your idea before ... @ lol, so maybe, my brain used my idea to create a user to post the idea here, so I could see it and be "what the $¨(&#%4"

I thought about what you just said, and I think it makes sense, but in MY perspective, you could be just AI too, just creation of my brain, so, no matter what you say, you would always have an answer ...

there is no way to prove you are real

we probably live in a virtual reality, and we are real, into this reality, but not outside of it

What you have described is a common thought that most people have at young ages, especially in childhood and among sheltered(spoiled) people. As people mature, they usually accept this as "wishful" thinking, and realize that they are not, as they once believed, the center of the universe, and that things do not happen simply because they are there. In adults, however, this has come to be known as Cotard's Syndrome. Since adults have, of coarse, reached mental maturity and should have realized the facts of life by this point, this continued delusion is a serious medical problem. Going unchecked, cases tend to end with said individual commiting heinous crimes against another individual (i.e. rape, murder, torture), because they have come to believe that the world exists simply for their pleasure and enjoyment. You, sir, need to seek psychiatric help immediately, before you turn into one of these individuals.

reply to post by Eldix


LOL, you are crazy my friend

we are just entertaining the idea that its possible that you are just an AI in my perspective

so, whats the problem in that? its not like I am going to start killing people over it or doing bad things

people that do that, were born with mental diseases or were manipulated into that, by these religion freaks we see everyday

[edit on 14/8/10 by Faiol]

reply to post by Eldix


This question of existence is probably as old as intellect and self-awareness. If it's a form of insanity to occasionally wonder about ones place in the cosmos and if experience and perspective are universal or if they belong only to us then I proudly count myself insane in the company of Socrates, Plato, and Descartes, among others.

*edited to clean up derailed train of thought*

[edit on 8/14/10 by Hefficide]

reply to post by Nostradumbass

faces on the wall ? noway, thats my imaginery friend.

reply to post by Nostradumbass


Well, what I often wonder is, are we each in our own reality? You and I may have merged realities for one moment, but then, I will go off in a whole complete other direction in the multiverse than you.

I notice weird coincidences in my life, for example, current events and the political climate change based on my moods and what I am thinking. Even the posts on ATS reflect what I am thinking. Lately, I have been a lot more conservative and so have the posts here, even to the point of praising Hitler, which is messed up.

Earlier in the year, when I was the opposite, there were a lot of posts about light and 4th density and love.

The radio often plays songs in coincidental ways. People relate to me in weird ways as well. It is all quite trippy.

Basically, it is kind of like I have a theme for a period of time and everything falls into that theme somehow.

I think it is possible we are all real, but multi-dimensional beings and basically that allows each of us to be the ones in charge of our realities and be the only real ones from our perspective, but don't quote me on that.

dp?

[edit on 14-8-2010 by darkbake]

reply to post by Eldix


It could be an autism spectrum disorder, actually. The thing you mentioned seems to be when someone thinks they don't exist, or are dead.

reply to post by darkbake


yeah, I already thought about that too, but my problem is that, a system that allows us to live together in different places, but sharing information between different realities, thats kind of too complicated

I would say it would be impossible to do ... I just cant find a solution, that could make we all share

if you were to design a virtual system to support something like virtual life, you wouldnt do in that way, so its hard to imagine that we would live in a system like that

but I dont know, if somebody have a better idea of how would this system work, please share, I dont have an idea on how to make it work

*L* I pondered this question many times.

My personal beliefs lean close towards the holographic universe theory.

our bodies and our physical environment aren't real, only our 'soul' is (but our soul isn't located inside the hologram, only projected here)
I also consider that, inside our personal holographic environment, we ARE the center of our universe, because this experience envolves around us, not around others.
Are you real inside my universe or are you merely a projection of me, creating my holographic reality? hm.... I'm not sure but I hope all of our souls are real (and not ONE, because that would be boring) and we share this experience together.
but again, I'm not sure and I certainly can't prove it.

nice topic though
keeps one thinking outside the box

reply to post by GypsK


yeah, it may be right

but, maybe we dont really exist outside of this system, maybe there is no soul, and we are just virtual and thats our life and thats it ...

if you imagine in close future we will be able to do our own worlds ... thats a very good possibility too then

reply to post by Nostradumbass


Quit it you're freaking me out!

This is truly deep thinking, I don't remember a time, even in childhood, that I ever considered myself as being the center of the universe or earth or people. I had imaginary friends, that to this day I can describe to a hair, even that could come into play if you are considering what is real in your life and not, but I just can't wrap my head around the concept of, as an adult, everything and everyone around me is not real. Or that I am not real. My back hurts, that tells me I am here, and need to take a pill.

Here is just one thought i wrote on my "Your Spiritual Revolution" thread series part II:

Are you real?
A human body with an average weight of 70 kg contains 10 octillion atoms.
This huge number reads like this:10,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 !

If you would lay all this atoms in a straight line without a gap, it would be ca. 73 lightyears long!
But how much mass is that? 70 kilos, yeah, but this has more to do with gravitational forces than the amount of atoms inside you...
No, it is less than 1% matter! If you imagine one hydrogen atom as big as a cathedral, the amount of matter (one proton, one neutron and one electron) in it would only be as big as the head of a needle!
The rest is empty space!
This means your whole body with you full weight and everything else is more than 99% empty space, ...nothing!
No, it´s not nothing, but there are very low energy fields who hold the electrons in their orbit. When this electrons change their orbit to a lower one, they release protons, ...light. Also there are the so called free radicals, but all this stuff is not as interesting for us now, so we let this by side.
I appreciate to read about the mechanisms inside atoms, but it it could fill books and that´s not the purpose of this thread. So, meditate about it...
You are 99% "empty" space!
Are you real? * * * * * * * * * * *

Oh and have a look on the only one quote i have in my sig!
It´s from Krishnamurti. Everybody who is interested in this should see or read him. Have a google search there are some old vids on the net. he explains it very well and easy to understand.

I could explain more about it but i also work on a thread on this very theme... Will be ready next few days... Have a look!

reply to post by GypsK


What a beautiful response. Now THAT I can wrap my head around. My soul is someplace projecting me into this life.

I saw a child pass away once while at the hospital with my neice who was teetering on the edge of life herself, as you might imagine everyone was in deep grief and reaching out to God to save these innocent children, and as that child passed away we saw a cloud of light, in the shape of a child, raise up and then turn into a small cloud that disappeared into the ceiling. My thoughts on that were instantly that I had just witnessed a soul leaving it's body, and it left me thinking that we are all just souls that move from host to host, with the soul maturing as it passes from one to another.

reply to post by Nostradumbass

No one can ultimately prove they are real, at least not in a philosophical way. So in effect the question is meaningless.
We each feel that we exist, is that not enough?
Perhaps if we can free ourselves from the illusions we hold about ourselves and others we would see that we are all the same anyway.

reply to post by Nostradumbass


Hmmmm.... thought that way myself when I was a kid, that all the world was just my illusion.
Theese days ofcourse I´ve matured and now know that it´s wrong thinking...
It´s all an illusion, me myself included, so the `I´ I was so sure about was not real either!!!!

But don´t ask me who has this illusion - no clue whatsoever

Well I don´t have any profound answer to your question, there are so many questions - a wise man once told me to love the questions themselves for what they were, and not always be looking for answers...
So a many thanks for your question

[edit on 14-8-2010 by laffoe]

Originally posted by Faiol
reply to post by GypsK

 

but, maybe we dont really exist outside of this system, maybe there is no soul, and we are just virtual and thats our life and thats it ...

yes, maybe
but then I think of the moment I saw my father die...
one second he was lying there, with 'life' in his body, even when he was unconscious there was still life in him, there was soul, the thing that makes him 'him'. The next moment there wasn't. When you watch this proces it's something you can feel: life/no life, a world of difference.
so where did this "life" go to?
I had to many experiences to belief that our soul doesn't die with the physical illusion... but then again, these experiences might be yet another illusion.

reply to post by space cadet


That sounds like an experience to cherish, even if it where sad circomstances. Seeing what you describe is a beautiful picture,
if that doesn't convince a person that there is more beyond this life then I don't know what will.

but considering the topic and the question of the OP, it still doesn't proof that it was real or illusion. I don't think it can be proven as long as we are 'here'.
I hope that after I die here, I can look back at my life and laugh with the questions I asked... maybe I say something like: 'god, I was such a chicken' lol