Obama defends ground zero mosque plans

reply to post by silent thunder


While I agree with you that this should be a non issue. It does have value as a discussion. Most of the dissent has to do with ignorance and hate. Just because a topic is not as heavy as, economic collapse or the terrible wars that are raging, doesnt mean it is without value as a topic of discussion.

The hate for Muslims in this country is quite high compared to other religions. And how a society interacts with different cultures is a reflection upon itself. Maybe after reading this thread someone will see the other side of the argument for allowing the construction of this mosque.

Getting people to realize that we are all the same. Humans just trying to do whats best for our families, based on the environment in which we were raised. We all may have different views on certain things but a time is coming where we must all learn to accept one another as equals.

If this change can happen, many of the terrible topics you mentioned will waste away. Love for all with help to end war. Love for your neighbor will help to close the gap between rich and poor.

While on the surface some of these issues may seem trivial, they do have value.

Gay marriage should be a non issue as you state. But some people view it as a big deal, based on ignorance and hate. This mind set must go. So discussing these issues has value in the sense that it may open someone up to accepting someone or something they never accepted before.


Love thy fellow human or find a new planet.


Damn me, derailing my own thread.

reply to post by Romantic_Rebel



Don't you think it's at least a little provoking to build that mosque exactly at that location. If these idiots whom decided they want to build it there had any sympathy for the victims and their families of 9/11, they would never ever request a building permit for that location. They would choose another location instead.

Now, they needlessly hurt these people and it wouldn't surprise me if they are doing it on purpose.

reply to post by Mdv2


Well this was brought up earlier in the thread. The Mosque is being used to provoke people.

Originally posted by Mdv2
reply to post by Romantic_Rebel

 

Don't you think it's at least a little provoking to build that mosque exactly at that location. If these idiots whom decided they want to build it there had any sympathy for the victims and their families of 9/11, they would never ever request a building permit for that location. They would choose another location instead.

Now, they needlessly hurt these people and it wouldn't surprise me if they are doing it on purpose.

Why would it be provoking? These people didnt do anything wrong. Not to mention this location is 2 blocks from ground zero. I'm not sure why they should feel bad about their religion or not build it there. They arent terrorists?

Some people that they are connected with, only via having the same religion did something awful and so they should feel guilty and choose a new location for a Mosque.

Originally posted by iamcamouflage

Originally posted by Mdv2
reply to post by Romantic_Rebel

 

Don't you think it's at least a little provoking to build that mosque exactly at that location. If these idiots whom decided they want to build it there had any sympathy for the victims and their families of 9/11, they would never ever request a building permit for that location. They would choose another location instead.

Now, they needlessly hurt these people and it wouldn't surprise me if they are doing it on purpose.

Why would it be provoking? These people didnt do anything wrong. Not to mention this location is 2 blocks from ground zero. I'm not sure why they should feel bad about their religion or not build it there. They arent terrorists?

Some people that they are connected with, only via having the same religion did something awful and so they should feel guilty and choose a new location for a Mosque.

Especially if they would really be interested in distancing themselves from terrorists, they should have chosen a different location. Building a mosque in the very vicinity of Ground Zero, isn't that the ultimate victory for Islam - at least for those who consider 911 to be a good thing?

As soon as the displeasure about their idea became clear, these people should have shown remorse and common sense and they should have said immediately: 'we're sorry, we'll build it somewhere else; we have no intentions to deliberately hurt the families of those who have died in the horrible attacks of 911.

Millions of mulims across the world will be laughing at American stupidity. When Saudi Arabia requested Putin for approval of a Mosque's construction in Moscow, he said: 'You can build it, if we can build a Russian orthodox church in your country'. Obviously, they were denied a building permit as other religions get zero chance to enjoy the freedoms that the millions of muslims enjoy in our Western world.

But hey, we, Westerners, got to be always tolerant and accept everything without a question.

How do you people function with your head so far up your ass?

Do you have the slightest understanding of the delicate nature of this situation? To allow unimaginable pain by those who lost friends and family in the attacks in the name of peace is beyond criminal.

[edit on 14-8-2010 by sliceNodice]

Has everyone lost their minds? There is no reason worth a damn why a mosque would be built here other than to thumb their nose at how stupid Americans are. It's a disgrace and a slap in the face to all that died and laid down their lives at this hallowed spot.

If Muslims really cared about us and our relations they would build it somewhere else. This will send Muslim/Christian relations back hundreds of years. I for one am absolutely outraged by this news. The fact that Obama endorses it makes his credibility go to ZERO. He is a ******* moron and should be thrown out of office. He is not capable of leading this country any more. I can't recognize the country i grew up in anymore. The world is laughing at how stupid we are.

I hope every New Yorker that loves this country will stand by to mock every single Muslim that goes in and out of that piece of **** building whose foundation was laid simply to mock the United States. Shame on anyone that is ok with degrading the innocent victims, firefighters, and police that were murdered by radical Islam.

[edit on 8/14/2010 by Mr Poopra]

Out of nothing other than respect to all the families and friends of those that lost their lives that day, I don't think it's appropriate to build a mosque there. I have no qualms with Islam, but that's not the point, and every American should understand that.

It's unnecessary provocation, and quite honestly, disrespectful to everyone irrevocably damaged by the attacks.

Originally posted by silent thunder
Instead spend your energy arguing endlessly about a building project on some land where something happened a decade ago.

[edit on 8/14/10 by silent thunder]

I can't even fathom how ignorant, insensitive, and offensive that statement was.

Islam including radical islam and fringe followings, are violent in nature and have a profound & inherent dislike for western civilization. Sugarcoat it all you wish only because of being naive' about what is really after your ass. The worst part is, that there is about 2 million of them willing to do whatever under the brainwashed direction of those connected to powerful industry leaders, politicians and the secretive world of exclusive clubs for the elite.



Instead of trying to defend everyone else's right to do things like burn the US flag or shoot a cop dead let's try to focus on things that very possiblly could cause a major conflight on US soil. Like securing our borders, funny how we defend others' willingness to invade, shoot to kill towards their percieved "invaders" or threats deemed so. Yet we can't even keep burger flippers and construction workers coming over from Mexico. Just imagine what goes on at the Canadian border!

Wake up folks. Wake up.

"i'll give you a jihad you won't believe"


sorry, i just like that line.

Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel
I agree with you OP. Many people just have a distaste for Islam. Because they have know clue to what the Islam is about.

It would seem that you have little clue on how to spell NO.

I think people are not as stupid as you make out when it comes to Islam. People know when there is something wrong.

Most people do not know how a car works. Does that mean they can not form opinions about cars?

Islam in general is Anti Western. This would be fine as they are entitled to their beliefs however they are moving to the West and still spouting this rhetoric. Islam and its founder are naturally savage. You need to learn about Muhammad, his six year old wife, his instruction that all none believers should be met with Death. Its in the Qur'an or just Google it.

Islam is anti women and we are second class citizens so for that reason alone Islam can go """"" itself!

reply to post by mikelee


WOW. that map of the Islamic threat in the States is Alarming. Serious trouble is on the cards. Once the Us has been "captured" we are all doomed!

Im ok with churchs being built anywhere.

But where is the money coming from? This is my beef.

The government is giving money to some guy, to go out and get funding for this. Why

Separte church and state!

Originally posted by Intelearthling

You can't compare Timothy McVeigh to terrorists. McVeighs' beef was with the FBI and their "jack-booted" siezure of the Branch Davidian compound in Waco, Texas under the authority of Janet Reno during the totalitarian rule of the Clinton administration.

While I don't condone his actions, they were politically motivated. Islamic actions are purely theologically motivated.

LOL
It isnt terrorism if its political?
I am sure IRA, ETA, RAF, Weathermen and AUC will be happy to hear that.
In fact:
Al queda and Hezbollah have political goals too.
Congratulations: With that definition you just wiped terroism of the face of the earth once and for all!

Thanks man, really made me laugh!

ya dude, ask bill airs lol, however you spell it.

call the white house and ask for the weathermen.

can japanese people build a shinto temple at the uss arizona monument on pearl harbor ?? even if its done by people who don't regret the attack on pearl harbor??

Because that would be just as wrong as building a mosque at ground zero .

Originally posted by lambs to lions
reply to post by Adevoc Satanae

 

I have to admit, you make some valid points. I'm not one that gets offended by much of anything. I agree that it is their right, and obviously if someone has a problem with it then its basically tough. However, I feel like it is counter productive.

Maybe it is but is that not the point of free expression right there? You are free to feel it is counterproductive. Maybe it will be. The problem is, they have the right to find out and we have no right to deny them that. All we can do express how we feel about it.

There is a million places they could have chose for that mosque.

Apparently not. There are so many of these threads now I am not sure which one but ~Lucidity did a nice job laying out the list of mosques being protested all over the country. Staten Island is not far enough from ground zero and neither is Tennessee? Seems they are running out of "a million other places" to me.

Yes, Islam has a massive following, but they are largely misunderstood in this country. I would go as far to say that a large part of our population despise them. Is it largely due to ignorance? Yes. Still, ground zero is a monument to the thousands that were murdered by an extremist group of members of Islam.

So you think that a population of people who are angry and afraid out of ignorance should stay that way? You think that would be better than trying to actually build some kind of understanding? I am not sure I can get on board with that line of thinking when it comes to really any topic.

Whether that is fair to all muslims doesn't matter. This country is very tolerant, and understanding.

Did you just put those two sentences together? Who is talking about being fair to ALL Muslims anyway? I am not for being FAIR to all anything. The Amish that rape their daughters, Mormons that rape their nieces, Catholics that rape alter boys, etc. I am all for being fair to Mormons, Amish, Catholics, whatever but not ALL of them. Criminals are criminals and I am pretty sure that since rape is still outlawed, murder most likely is too. I have to check. Maybe murder is against the law in parts of the state but not NYC anymore? There are bad apples in every bunch.

As Americans, shouldn't they also represent those values. And I don't think that this is as innocent as a right to religious freedom. I think there is something of a celebration of a victory at work here.

Maybe you are right. Let's consider that. What would they be celebrating the victory of?

Originally posted by Mdv2
reply to post by Romantic_Rebel

 

Don't you think it's at least a little provoking to build that mosque exactly at that location.

How so?

If these idiots whom decided they want to build it there had any sympathy for the victims and their families of 9/11, they would never ever request a building permit for that location.

Why not? What does one have to do with the other?

They would choose another location instead.

Now, they needlessly hurt these people and it wouldn't surprise me if they are doing it on purpose.

How are they hurting people, EXACTLY?

Originally posted by Mdv2
Especially if they would really be interested in distancing themselves from terrorists, they should have chosen a different location. Building a mosque in the very vicinity of Ground Zero, isn't that the ultimate victory for Islam - at least for those who consider 911 to be a good thing?

Who are the people that consider 911 a good thing and what do they have to do with this mosque?

Define "vicinity."