Has 9/11 truth had its day ?

Originally posted by The Surgeon


• The movement is more organized with groups specializing in particular areas: research, activism, video production. Research group examples include Architects & Engineers for Truth, Pilots for Truth, etc.

A&E lead by Box Boy Gage is nothing but a marginally successful snake oil salesman. Gage has not contributed one single scientific paper regarding the collapses that he blames on the US Government. He travels the world on the dimes of the feeble minded followers of his pathetic cause.

Pilots For 911 Truth lead by Rob "11G's" Balsamo. Anytime he attempts to gather cash he releases "Press Releases" in the hopes that no one checks his work. You apparently missed his melt down here several months ago when he pretended to be a NASA Scientist and got caught.

• 9/11 research is becoming more focused as individuals find their niche. Some specialize in following the money, the hijackers, air activity on 9/11, passenger analysis, WTC 7, collapse/demolition of the towers...

Nothing has changed since the original influx of lies from the truth movement during their peak of 2006. They, as the OP states are doing nothing but regurgitating the same, tired garbage.

• 9/11 researchers are getting better. They have more experience, knowledge, tools and data than before.

More experience in selling snake oil. The tools and data they collect is ignored or molded into something it is not.

• Serious researchers are digging deeper and wider than before, and almost always finding more "little smoking guns", evidence of conspiracy and of course -- more unanswered questions and things that don't make sense.

Awww cute little guns... how cute... are they BB Guns? Squirt Guns?

• More information, data, analysis, photos, videos -- all contribute to the global "body of knowledge" concerning 9/11.

All the truth movement contributes to, is an ocean of lies!

• FOIA is paying off. Thousands of documents, photos and videos are being pried out of the hands of the government. I have personally read thousands of pages of FOIA documents and have found small smoking guns, WTFs, corroborating data/evidence and sometimes info that actually supports part of the official story.

More BB Guns... how quaint. What are you doing with all these little guns? Talking about them in a Conspiracy Theory forum, or will you go to the media with your stockpile of guns?

• 9/11 researchers continue to fight amongst themselves with pet theories, name calling, rivalries -- as will be found with any group of individuals sharing a similar interest.

Agreed

• There is more consensus than before since many theories have become established as fact. It is the general consensus that WTC 1, 2, 6 and 7 were destroyed by controlled demolitions. Thermite, and specifically nano-thermite played a role in WTC 1 & 2.

Really? Many? Care to list these "facts" that point to an inside job?

• More people are politically aware than a few years ago and recognize that 9/11 "changed everything" and that 9/11 affects their lives today.

Most people knew on 9/11 that the world changed forever.

Sorry, not a single poster so far has shown the OP wrong.

"They, as the OP states are doing nothing but regurgitating the same, tired garbage."

As compared to regurgitating the same tired garbage insults to protect and run interference for criminal scum? How long did it take you to come up with that ultra-original "Boxboy" comment and all the other infantile brainstorms you treated us to in your last post? Keep 'em coming; your target audience is anxiously awaiting to drool over more juvenile asinine comments.

Originally posted by ipsedixit

I think if Bush, Cheney and others were hauled into court now on war crimes charges, 9/11 would loom large as an issue on the docket

This is a notion that I find interesting.

Let's imagine a trial was brought now, and there was a groundswell of opinion that ensured 9/11 Truth had a driving role in the procedure. Perhaps Richard Gage and Rob Balsamo are brought onto the prosecution team. Several weeks are set aside for them to have at Cheney and Bush and whoevere else they feel like.

What are they actually going to say? How are they going to make anything stick? I doubt they can prove anything concrete about explosives, let alone link anyone powerful to their alleged placing in the towers.

By definition Gage would have to submit a hypothesis as part of his accusation. So would he settle on thermite, or would the huge, pulverising explosions get a run out? We've already seen him contradict himself, but because Truthers can sit back and say "well, we don't know what happened, but we don know the OS is nonsense" you've never had to produce a counter theory.

A trial would mean a series of proven, non-contradictory statements about what happened. Is the TM's evidence up to it?

Originally posted by Joey Canoli

Originally posted by cLOUDDEAD

Like NIST admitting freefall speed of Building 7, "proving" what Truthers were saying all along. lol

They never said it didn't.

What has this done to get you a new investigation again?

Nothing, right?

Like I said, this is a smoking gun to you, and yet, nothing comes of it, proving you wrong.

This has zero effect on you though.

Very sad.

I have to butt in and say that you're idea of being "proven wrong" is completely absurd. Since when does the intended goal (investigation) effect the veracity of the claim (elements involved outside of terrorists)?

reply to post by SmokeandShadow


I think he means that if the general opinion agreed with the person he's replying to - ie if there was a wide acceptance that there was a "smoking gun" - then an investigation would be inevitable.

Since there hasn't been an investigation and it remains unlikely that there will be, we can surmise that most people don't think that there is a de facto "smoking gun". I'd tend to agree.

It has been proven that 9\11 was a inside job, but there are more important roles to take care of out there at the moment.

reply to post by Archirvion


It's been pretty much proven that 9/11 wasn't an inside job.

But you're right about there being more important things out there. Or roles. Or whatever.

Originally posted by Archirvion
It has been proven that 9\11 was a inside job, but there are more important roles to take care of out there at the moment.

We all saw with our own eyes the 9/11 was an outside job. Jets don't have room to fly inside so it had to be done outside in the open. I don't know why this still confuses people.

Originally posted by SphinxMontreal
"They, as the OP states are doing nothing but regurgitating the same, tired garbage."

As compared to regurgitating the same tired garbage insults to protect and run interference for criminal scum? How long did it take you to come up with that ultra-original "Boxboy" comment and all the other infantile brainstorms you treated us to in your last post? Keep 'em coming; your target audience is anxiously awaiting to drool over more juvenile asinine comments.

Thank you for the colorful critique. Now, will you be supplying any new evidence to the "inside job", or will you like all others just parrot that slogan over and over?

reply to post by TrickoftheShade

If things were to pan out that way, it is unlikely that anyone in the truth movement would be on the stand at all, with the possible exception of Sybel Edmunds.

I guess you didn't know, but trials are conducted with witnesses who have evidence to offer not with speculators who have well thought out hypotheses and conjectures to offer, no matter how convincing they may be.

Anyone notice how the 9/11 forum has become something of a dumpster lately?

Originally posted by ipsedixit
Anyone notice how the 9/11 forum has become something of a dumpster lately?

Yes, hence the reason why the OP is spot on! Nothing new...just the same old same old.

reply to post by Six Sigma

I'm referring to the same old jibes and stupidity. A lot of the "same old same old" is due to the fact that new people come into the discussion and have to be brought up to speed.

But on the subject of a trial, nobody who has been involved in conjecture and speculation on either side of this case is going to be on the witness stand. Nobody from NIST or any academic institution with a digital simulation. None of that would be involved in a trial.

A trial presupposes a drastic change in the political climate in the US. In a climate favorable to an honest judicial process that could guarantee safety for witnesses, people on the inside would come forward to testify against the perps.

A real criminal investigation would develop real witnesses. Even the official 9/11 comissioners suspected they were being lied to by military witnesses and wanted to charge them with perjury.

A trial presupposes a completely different climate. Richard Gage and others could relax and watch the proceedings.

Originally posted by ipsedixit
reply to post by Six Sigma

 

But on the subject of a trial, nobody who has been involved in conjecture and speculation on either side of this case is going to be on the witness stand. Nobody from NIST or any academic institution with a digital simulation. None of that would be involved in a trial.

That would be an amusing trial to watch, a trial without any witnessses at all

reply to post by ipsedixit


The jibes and stupidity are because the 911 Truth movement is a movement based on stupidity.

"Just Asking Questions" was the parroted line of 2006 when the truthers peaked. The questions were answered, and ignored. NIST reports were released and either inappropriately ridiculed or ignored. Not a single engineering document was submitted for proper peer review by the truth movement. I am not including of course the pathetic nano thermite paper that was submitted to a vanity journal.

Besides a few marches, meetings, or speeches, 911 Truth is an internet entity. Turn off your computer and 911 Truth disappears. 911 Truth will be around for decades like other unprovable CT's... Moon Landing, JFK, etc.

I come here in the hopes that newbies that may wander in here are taught the truth. Charlatans like Gage travel the world attempting to re-write history while accusing the government of mass murder. The feeble minded will always be there to pay his way.



[edit on 5-7-2010 by Six Sigma]

Originally posted by Six Sigma

Most people knew on 9/11 that the world changed forever.

Sorry, not a single poster so far has shown the OP wrong.

If placing a star on a members post is an indication of support for ones stated position ( which I believe is the intended purpose ) then it is PAINFULLY obvious, the majority do not agree with your opinion or that of Alfie1 or Joey Canoli.
Sorry, I don't understand your irrational persistence in the face of such overwhelming rational opposition. You constantly have your collective asses handed to you ............. and yet , you guys prattle on.
Amazing ! Seriously, what is your motivation for such a lost cause ?
This is not a baited question. I am not going to respond . I really would like to know. Thanks

Originally posted by dazbog

Originally posted by Six Sigma

Most people knew on 9/11 that the world changed forever.

Sorry, not a single poster so far has shown the OP wrong.

If placing a star on a members post is an indication of support for ones stated position ( which I believe is the intended purpose ) then it is PAINFULLY obvious, the majority do not agree with your opinion or that of Alfie1 or Joey Canoli.
Sorry, I don't understand your irrational persistence in the face of such overwhelming rational opposition. You constantly have your collective asses handed to you ............. and yet , you guys prattle on.
Amazing ! Seriously, what is your motivation for such a lost cause ?
This is not a baited question. I am not going to respond . I really would like to know. Thanks

Users on a pro-conspiracy theories board promoting a conspiracy theory, what a surprise.

Could you care to demonstrate where say, Six Sigma, Alfie1 or Joey Canoli (or myself for that matter), have had their asses handed to them? Unless we're dealing with some extravagantly outlandish claims (see the Viola Saylor thread below, I'm still not sure what the point of that thread is), 95% of the truther arguments have been heard before and can readily be countered. Simply because there's been nothing new coming from the 9/11 Truthers since someone was flipping through a chemistry 101 book and found a description of 'thermite'

[edit on 5-7-2010 by roboe]

Originally posted by ipsedixit
If things were to pan out that way, it is unlikely that anyone in the truth movement would be on the stand at all, with the possible exception of Sybel Edmunds.

Who is Sybel Edmunds?

Anyway, that's my point. Even with a huge groundswell of support behind you, you lot would still find a way to screw it up. Because IT'S ALL MADE UP.

I guess you didn't know, but trials are conducted with witnesses who have evidence to offer not with speculators who have well thought out hypotheses and conjectures to offer, no matter how convincing they may be.

I'm fully aware of how trials operate. And again, although you've misunderstood me, you make my point for me. Neither Gage nor Balsamo has a well-thought out hypothesis. They wouldn't be able to form any kind of prosecution because they don't have a concrete accusation.

What do you think a prosecutor does? They postulate a version of events that implicates the accused and forms an incriminating hypothesis of what occured.

To make such an accusation Gage et al would need a cogent theory, and since half their ideas debunk the other half, and there's no evidence of Cheney or Bush or the Joooos being involved, they wouldn't - as you admit - be much use.

Anyone notice how the 9/11 forum has become something of a dumpster lately?

Yeah, there are quite a lot of thickos on it.

Originally posted by ipsedixit In a climate favorable to an honest judicial process that could guarantee safety for witnesses, people on the inside would come forward to testify against the perps.

That's just complete supposition. There's no evidence that there are any frightened "people on the inside". Even Sibel Edmonds isn't a whistleblower in the sense that the 9/11 TM would love her to be.

And it's not like a real insider couldn't come forward. Go to another country, get on the internet. The US's reach isn't immediately global - you can't even take control of a couple of sand blown countries, and that's with your entire army engaged. And anyone publishing serious insider knowledge about any plot would quickly become unkillable anyway.

Of course, all this presupposes that the world isn't some Hollywood spy movie fantasy.

Originally posted by jprophet420

Originally posted by Alfie1
After nearly 9 years there seems to be nothing but feeble re-gurgitated material and fewer and fewer posters are supporting it. Is it time for truthers to move on to more productive pastures ?

After 9 years no theory regarding 911 has been proven true.

As far as less posters supporting it, show where you got that information please.

It is true that I don't have precise statistics about support for 9/11 truth. It is my impression, obviously supported by others, that the support has slowed up on here and elsewhere.

If that is so, perhaps it has a lot to do with nothing new being presented and obvious grasping at straws.

If there was truth in many "truther" theories there are a multitude of things which could and should be proved. If AA 77 didn't hit the Pentagon then it and its passengers went elsewhere. The remains of that aircraft and its passengers must be somewhere. If a missile hit the Pentagon then people launched it and there must be a missile short on an inventory. If explosives were used at the WTC then explosives must have been transported there and installed by people expert in there use. Again, there must be a huge deficit on someones explosives inventory. If UA 93 did not crash at Shanksville then that aircraft and the remains of its passengers and crew must be out there somewhere.

Fact is there is not a shred of proof to suggest any of the above. What do we actually get time after time : 2.3 trillion dollars missing, Marvin Bush head of security at WTC, all sniffer dogs pulled out, red cross worker hearing countdown on radio, morphed phonecalls from doomed planes , hi-jackers still alive, Silverstein "pulling" WTC 7, nukes, holograms, dancing Israelis etc etc etc. I am sure some truthers must groan as much as I do when this stuff is re-hashed.

The time must surely come when, if you are of that bent, it is best to move on to the next conspiracy. Do any of you truthers care who blew up the "Maine" in Havana harbour ?

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
reply to post by SmokeandShadow

 

I think he means that if the general opinion agreed with the person he's replying to - ie if there was a wide acceptance that there was a "smoking gun" - then an investigation would be inevitable.

Since there hasn't been an investigation and it remains unlikely that there will be, we can surmise that most people don't think that there is a de facto "smoking gun". I'd tend to agree.

Exactly.

It goes to prove just how shallow truthers are.

These "smoking guns" are only "smoking guns" to them. No one else thinks so.

This has no effect on them, other than to somehow prove to them that this is proof that the whole world is "in on it".

IOW, paranoid delusions.