Why doesn't God intervene? A question to the religious among you..

G'day ATS,

This topic has been simmering away in my mind for some time. It really has bothered me. It was initially brought to my attention by this tragic story.

Baby scalded in pipe burst dies

A 10-month-old baby badly burnt when scalding water poured into her cot has died in Bristol Children's Hospital.

Rhianna Hardie suffered 85% burns in the accident at her home in Taunton, in November. She died late on Tuesday.

I actually cried when I heard this story. I literally broke down. At the time my nephew was the same age as this poor baby, so it really hit home.

More recently....

Baby killed by falling lamppost in west London named

A baby boy killed by a falling lamppost in a west London street has been identified as Tommy Hollis, who would have been one year old on Friday.

Police found him outside Chiswick Town Hall on Tuesday. He was taken to hospital by air ambulance but died.

I mean seriously, what the heck. How can there possibly be a God when you see stories like this? The first one, can you imagine the pain and suffering that this baby went through? The agony of the parents.

If there was a God, and he was all powerful like most religions profess him to be.

How could God allow suffering like this to occur?

Why did he let a lamp post fall on a little baby?

Don't tell me about human self determination, about man's will, that is total BS. The usual answer goes "God doesn't cause famines, Mankind causes famines". Yes, and a man put up the lamp post and installed the boiler. However if I were God (and I really loved the World), I'd want to stop poor little babies suffering and dying in freak accidents.

The crux of the matter is this, if there is a God, he let that baby scald to death, rather than intervene.

He let that lamp post fall, just at the split second the child was passing.

No God who does that is worthy of being God.

Yes there are examples of "miracles"....

Newborn baby is catapulted from car at 70mph in motorway horror... and SURVIVES

A six-week-old baby boy has survived being catapulted from a car travelling at 70mph.

Jonathan Samuel was flung out of his father's car after a tyre blew, causing it to spin six times before smashing into the central reservation of the M6 near Wigan.

AND...



However in my eyes this doesn't excuse God for NOT PREVENTING young Rhianna Hardie's suffering, her family's pain and her tragic death.

I am struggling deeply with this, I cannot beleive that there is a God when I see these examples.

Any thoughts ATS?

DISCLAIMER: Please don't let this be interpreted as an anti-religion thread. It's a serious, well intentioned question.

All the best ATS, Kiwi

[edit on 13-6-2010 by kiwifoot]

because that would be against the "free will" he gave mankind.

Not everything is God's Fault, Get your crap right.

-Don't make my waste my post again, but then again It would be a waste of my powers to NOT tell you to get your things right before posting.

[edit on 13-6-2010 by TheUltimateEnd]

what really is "god" is beyond form- if that energy (or non-energy) even brushed up against the world of form it (the world of form) would implode or explode.
simple religio-physics, really......


edit to add "(the world of form)"

[edit on 13-6-2010 by IandEye]

Originally posted by Hellas
because that would be against the "free will" he gave mankind.

Yep.

I was waiting for that mate.

Seriously, if you love someone, are a all powerful God, would allow a young baby to suffer %85 burns and scald to death?

I'm sorry, it doesn't wash.

In fact, that's almost obscene on the face of it.

Originally posted by TheUltimateEnd
Not everything is God's Fault, Get your crap right.

-Don't make my waste my post again, but then again It would be a waste of my powers to NOT tell you to get your things right before posting.

[edit on 13-6-2010 by TheUltimateEnd]

Sir, take a second to READ before MOUTHING OFF. (IF you can)

I never said these accidents were God's fault.

I said he didn't use his all powerful abilities to stop a baby from dying a bloody painful death.

You're angry because it's true...you know it ...





[edit on 13-6-2010 by kiwifoot]

Because God doesn't see it as necessary to deal with the issues of 8 billion humans. Not only is it unnecessary, I don't think God is able to deal with everyone. If a farmer owns a plantation and plants a lot of crops, he hopes most of the crops reap their fruits, but some of them are bound to fail, and the farmer can't spend too much time worrying about each individual crop. I think God is the same way.

Originally posted by Hellas
because that would be against the "free will" he gave mankind.

Does the earth he supposedly made have freewill?

I'd imagine not as freewill is only ever referred to in relation to people.

In which case, why does God not intervene and sort the seabed out in the Gulf of Mexico that now appears to be damaged?

Save the water he supposedly created.

Save the creatures he supposedly created.

Just curious.

CX.

Originally posted by kiwifoot

Originally posted by Hellas
because that would be against the "free will" he gave mankind.

Yep.

I was waiting for that mate.

Seriously, if you love someone, are a all powerful God, would allow a young baby to suffer %85 burns and scald to death?

I'm sorry, it doesn't wash.

In fact, that's almost obscene on the face of it.

I can't explain to you or anybody why God does this and that. But even if he would save this Child, you would say why did he save this Child and not my sick and dying Father, Mother etc.. Why is he unfair? Everybody is equal in God's eyes..

you know why?

because God is not a human being, God doesnt care about humans, God may not even care about the universe, because it may be part of a much bigger system

thats the reality, and GOD is just a word for something we cant understand ...

people need to understand that these ancient books have perceptions, it is not a bunch of FACTs ... but people want to believe too much

and I find amazing that the crazy ones are the ones that want to believe in UFOs, but most religious people believe that an ANCIENT PERSPECTIVE to something they didnt understand is considered as FACT ...

ignorance is a blessing for the elitist

reply to post by kiwifoot


I have heard that sometimes God sees a soul that is so beautiful, he calls it home early, before it can be corrupted by this world.

Also, perhaps it was not God acting to cause these tragedies but Satan causing them in order to try your faith. God permits the devil to try people's faith because, those who still hold to the faith in the face of tragedy have their faith strengthened in the end.

God allows the devil to use children for these tragedies because their innocence ensures that they will receive their reward in heaven for the suffering they were forced to endure here on Earth.

Stephen Crane (1871-1900)
from War Is Kind (1899)


A man said to the universe:
"Sir I exist!"
"However," replied the universe,
"The fact has not created in me
A sense of obligation."



............................

There is no God with all powerful abilities. And if there is indeed such a being, it is not in his interest to save the baby, because he didn't. There is only the here and now, everything happens in a logical, chronological order. There is nothing that can intervene, if psychics don't allow it to intervene. Get your perception of God straight, but also all the other millions of sheeple.

Everything happens, because it is supposed to happen. If it was not supposed to happen, then it would simply not have happened the way it did. The matrix has you, it is all around you, and it is perfect.

Originally posted by Hellas

I can't explain to you or anybody why God does this and that. But even if he would save this Child, you would say why did he save this Child and not my sick and dying Father, Mother etc.. Why is he unfair? Everybody is equal in God's eyes..

No friend I wouldn't.

Death is a part of life.

Dying is natural.

Children dying is a part of life.

But a baby dying in such a manner, sorry. If he has the ability to intervene (and he must since the church and other religions acknowledge miracles) then in this case he MUST. He let this child die an agonising death. There is just know way around it..

Originally posted by FortAnthem
reply to post by kiwifoot

 

I have heard that sometimes God sees a soul that is so beautiful, he calls it home early, before it can be corrupted by this world.

Also, perhaps it was not God acting to cause these tragedies but Satan causing them in order to try your faith. God permits the devil to try people's faith because, those who still hold to the faith in the face of tragedy have their faith strengthened in the end.

God allows the devil to use children for these tragedies because their innocence ensures that they will receive their reward in heaven for the suffering they were forced to endure here on Earth.

Thank you for that reply, quite beautiful. But my main gripe still holds true, surely God shouldn't have allowed this poor baby to go in such a horrific manner. Especially if it was the work of the devil!!

maybe the God or gods is regarding the happenings on earth as an experiment.

just like a petri dish, and therefore do not intervent.

Originally posted by Hellas
because that would be against the "free will" he gave mankind.

What does that have to do with free will? These are random accidents, not choices someone makes.

Originally posted by Phlynx

Originally posted by Hellas
because that would be against the "free will" he gave mankind.

What does that have to do with free will? These are random accidents, not choices someone makes.

So he should intervene because someone drank to much and drove against a tree? Because that was his choice. Or what kind of accident do you mean?

I have heard GOD called all these negative things.

Does GOD love us?
Yes!!!
Where is that baby now??
In heaven with God.

Who is GOD?

Apostle - Hebrews 3:1
Author and Perfecter of our Faith - Hebrews 12:2
Beginning - Revelation 21:6
Bishop of Souls - 1 Peter 2:25
Branch - Zechariah 3:8
Bread of Life - John 6:35,48
Bridegroom - Matthew 9:15
Carpenter - Mark 6:3
Chief Shepherd - 1 Peter 5:4
The Christ - Matthew 1:16
Comforter - Jeremiah 8:18
Consolation of Israel - Luke 2:25
Cornerstone - Ephesians 2:20
Dayspring - Luke 1:78
Day Star - 2 Peter 1:19
Deliverer - Romans 11:26
Desire of Nations - Haggai 2:7
Emmanuel - Matthew 1:23
End - Revelation 21:6
Everlasting Father - Isaiah 9:6
Faithful and True Witness - Revelation 3:14
First Fruits - 1 Corinthians 15:23
Foundation - Isaiah 28:16
Fountain - Zechariah 13:1
Friend of Sinners - Matthew 11:19
Gate for the Sheep - John 10:7
Gift of God - 2 Corinthians 9:15
God - John 1:1
Glory of God - Isaiah 60:1
Good Shepherd - John 10:11
Governor - Matthew 2:6
Great Shepherd - Hebrews 13:20
Guide - Psalm 48:14
Head of the Church - Colossians 1:18
High Priest - Hebrews 3:1
Holy One of Israel - Isaiah 41:14
Horn of Salvation - Luke 1:69
I Am - Exodus 3:14
Jehovah - Psalm 83:18
Jesus - Matthew 1:21
King of Israel - Matthew 27:42
King of Kings - 1 Timothy 6:15; Revelation 19:16
Lamb of God - John 1:29
Last Adam - 1 Corinthians 15:45
Life - John 11:25
Light of the World - John 8:12; John 9:5
Lion of the Tribe of Judah - Revelation 5:5
Lord of Lords - 1 Timothy 6:15; Revelation 19:16
Master - Matthew 23:8
Mediator - 1 Timothy 2:5
Messiah - John 1:41
Mighty God - Isaiah 9:6
Morning Star - Revelation 22:16
Nazarene - Matthew 2:23
Omega - Revelation 1:8
Passover Lamb - 1 Corinthians 5:7
Physician - Matthew 9:12
Potentate - 1 Timothy 6:15
Priest - Hebrews 4:15
Prince of Peace - Isaiah 9:6
Prophet - Acts 3:22
Propitiation - I John 2:2
Purifier - Malachi 3:3
Rabbi - John 1:49
Ransom - 1 Timothy 2:6
Redeemer - Isaiah 41:14
Refiner - Malachi 3:2
Refuge - Isaiah 25:4
Resurrection - John 11:25
Righteousness - Jeremiah 23:6
Rock - Deuteronomy 32:4
Root of David - Revelation 22:16
Rose of Sharon - Song of Solomon 2:1
Ruler of God's Creation - Revelation 3:14
Sacrifice - Ephesians 5:2
Savior - 2 Samuel 22:47; Luke 1:47
Second Adam - 1 Corinthians 15:47
Seed of Abraham - Galatians 3:16
Seed of David - 2 Timothy 2:8
Seed of the Woman - Genesis 3:15
Servant - Isaiah 42:1
Shepherd - 1 Peter 2:25
Shiloh - Genesis 49:10
Son of David - Matthew 15:22
Son of God - Luke 1:35
Son of Man - Matthew 18:11
Son of Mary - Mark 6:3
Son of the Most High - Luke 1:32
Stone - Isaiah 28:16
Sun of Righteousness - Malachi 4:2
Teacher - Matthew 26:18
Truth - John 14:6
Way - John 14:6
Wonderful Counselor - Isaiah 9:6
Word - John 1:1
Vine - John 15:1

Originally posted by Hellas
because that would be against the "free will" he gave mankind.

Free will?

Would that be the free will that says: love and obey me, meaning; do exactly as my earthly representatives say (and interpret writings) from a selection of old texts, edited and collated by many different people, each with their own agenda over a period of hundreds of years.

Or

Spend an eternity in pain, misery, burning, torture and tormented in a place called hell.

You choose.

Yes... free will.

Here is one for you... A guy walks into a bank and says:

"Good morning, would you mind ever so kindly placing the contents of your cash safe into this bag? If you do not I will place the contents of these shotgun cartridges at a variety of locations inside your body. It will be painful and you will probably die."

That is also free will.

Humans have been in existence for millions of years. We have had the option (though the very generous 'choice' outlined above) of being saved from an eternity in pain, misery, burning, torture and tormented in a place called hell, for 2000 years. What about all the BILLIONS of humans that lived in the past?

It is time for people to spend some time thinking. Escape from the cage of your mind. Any religion that resorts to open threats for membership should set alarm bells off in everyone.

[edit on 13-6-2010 by Pentothal]