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My Visit to the Mason Cemetery

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posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 11:57 AM
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Originally posted by AfterthoughtWho chooses the headstone? When my grandfather died, my grandmother chose it (he's buried in Bushnell). Does the Mason choose it, the wife/family, or does the Lodge?

It wouldn't be the lodge. It would have to be either the family or the deceased himself.


Can any degree be buried in a Masonic cemetary? Heaven forbid (or Satan's hell, if that's what you choose to believe), a first degree Mason dies in a car accident. Would he have the honor of being buried here?
If he so desired, or if those were the wishes of his family, he probably could. I somehow doubt that an Entered Apprentice who'd only been a Mason for a month or two would be so attached to Masonry by then that he'd make such a dying request, though.

Is the ground consecrated?
That would depend on the cemetery. Are commercial cemeteries consecrated? Or only churchyards? Masonry not being a religion, it would depend on who owned the cemetery, I'd guess. (More interesting, perhaps, would be asking if a Mason could be buried in a consecrated Catholic cemetery...)


I enjoyed seeing all the symbols. The only thing I noticed missing is the Eye of Horus!
It's not a particularly important symbol in Masonry, compared to all the other symbols...




posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 12:00 PM
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Originally posted by Afterthought


I only have a few questions that maybe the Masons can answer.
Who chooses the headstone? When my grandfather died, my grandmother chose it (he's buried in Bushnell). Does the Mason choose it, the wife/family, or does the Lodge?


Either the deceased or the deceased's spouse/family. Lodges do choose headstones, and most Masons do not have Masonic imagery on their gravestones. It's simply a personal choice.


Can any degree be buried in a Masonic cemetary?
Heaven forbid (or Satan's hell, if that's what you choose to believe), a first degree Mason dies in a car accident. Would he have the honor of being buried here?


Most cemetaries do not have Masonic sections, so most Masons are buried along with non-Masons. One must be a Third Degree Master Mason to be buried with Masonic honors. Entered Apprentices and Fellow Crafts (First and Second Degrees) are not full members of the fraternity, and thus are not buried with Masonic honors. Also, Master Masons must be in good standing with some Lodge to buried with Masonic honors.


Is the ground consecrated?


No.



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 12:09 PM
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["The Double Headed Eagle of Lagash" is the oldest Royal Crest in the World... No emblematic device of today can boast of such antiquity. Its origin has been traced to the ancient city of Lagash. It was in use a thousand years before the Exodus from Egypt and more than two thousand years before the building of "King Solomon's Temple."/ex]


"The city of Lagash is in Sumer in Southern Babylonia, between the Euphrates and the Tigris and near the modern Shatra in Iraq, Lagash had a calendar of twelve lunar months, a system of weights and measures, a banking and accounting system and was a center of art, literature, military and political power, five thousand years before Christ".


Double Headed

ATS


..... Janus was the patron of concrete and abstract beginnings of the world[5](such as the religion and the gods themselves), the human life,[6] new historical ages, and economical enterprises.......


Janus

[edit on 16-6-2010 by Logarock]



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 12:31 PM
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Thanks to those Masons who answered my questions regarding the specifics of the Masonic burials.

To the person who posted more info regarding the double headed eagle, I appreciate you posting the info/origins regarding the ancient symbol.
I believe that way back eagles were still considered raptors. Probably even more so.

A raptor is any meat eating bird.
www.thefreedictionary.com...
An eagle is a raptor, but not all raptors are eagles.

Keep in mind that many things, especially terms/ideas still alive from distant ancestries, carry double meanings.



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 12:43 PM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light
One must be a Third Degree Master Mason to be buried with Masonic honors. Entered Apprentices and Fellow Crafts (First and Second Degrees) are not full members of the fraternity, and thus are not buried with Masonic honors.


we had this discussion at our school of instruction. Think of the apron and the speech that goes with it. It is given to an entered apprentice. He is told at that moment, that he will have this apron placed on his body at death. wouldn't he have the same burial as a full master mason? Never had it happen that I have heard about, but it would be good to know how to handle it, should it ever arise.



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 02:30 PM
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Originally posted by network dude


we had this discussion at our school of instruction. Think of the apron and the speech that goes with it. It is given to an entered apprentice. He is told at that moment, that he will have this apron placed on his body at death. wouldn't he have the same burial as a full master mason? Never had it happen that I have heard about, but it would be good to know how to handle it, should it ever arise.


According to this chart, 25 Grand Lodges in the US allow Masonic burial for EAs and FCs, while the other 26 restict Masonic burial to Master Masons.

[edit on 16-6-2010 by Masonic Light]



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 05:04 PM
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reply to post by JoshNorton
 





If he so desired, or if those were the wishes of his family, he probably could. I somehow doubt that an Entered Apprentice who'd only been a Mason for a month or two would be so attached to Masonry by then that he'd make such a dying request, though.


We buried an Entered Apprentice this summer. His mother requested it, because she said Masonry was the best thing that had ever happened in her young man's life. It is too bad that we got too him a little too late, but she appreciated all the attention the brothers had given him in his last month or so. He was having a lot of anguish, but he was a great kid, and he was working very hard on catechisms and making friends and coming to every meal, but a late night phone call from an ex put him in a funk one night and he ended his own life.

Yes, EA's can receive the rights and the burial.



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 05:06 PM
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reply to post by network dude
 


That is exactly correct. Once they take the first obligation the are a "brother." When they receive the apron they are told to wear it with pride and honor (as an EA). When they stand in the NE corner they stand by all outward appearances an upright "Man and Mason."

An EA is still a Mason.



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 05:30 PM
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Originally posted by Afterthought
Thanks to those Masons who answered my questions regarding the specifics of the Masonic burials.

To the person who posted more info regarding the double headed eagle, I appreciate you posting the info/origins regarding the ancient symbol.
I believe that way back eagles were still considered raptors. Probably even more so.

A raptor is any meat eating bird.
www.thefreedictionary.com...
An eagle is a raptor, but not all raptors are eagles.

Keep in mind that many things, especially terms/ideas still alive from distant ancestries, carry double meanings.


Not saying that all of the above is true. Just that it is The ANCIENT and Accepted Scottish Rite.



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 06:21 PM
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reply to post by Afterthought
 

I would say that the family chose the headstone or maybe the deceased left his/her wishes in a will. The Lodge has that authority. The only thing they can do is attend, and if requested, do Masonic funeral rites, which is a public ceremony and a way to pay final respects.

Like I've said before, its not the Eye of Horus. Its a symbol of whatever God you believe in. Our symbols don't always have the eye in it. It can appear in the top of the compasses or within the Square & Compasses.

[edit on 16-6-2010 by KSigMason]



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 07:21 PM
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".women are unclean and in the law it states "

Huh?!?
Women is a blessing. Every one must acknowledge that his LIFE is due to a WOMEN ! If one's mother is unclean that do not apply to everyones mothers.



posted on Jun, 16 2010 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by KSigMason
reply to post by frozenspark
 

Lies perpetrated by a French king. The same French king who tried to join the Order, but was denied. The same king who orchestrated the deaths of 2 Popes so he could put in his own little puppet to disband the Templars because he couldn't pay back his debt and didn't like that the group didn't report to a king.

Pull your head from fanatically sites and actually read a history book.



King Philip the Fair was denied membership because he is related to Jesus through one of his brothers. Once King Philip found out about the satanic and lucifarian things the Templars were doing he acted as the King of France, claim to the throne of Jerusalem, and relative of Jesus to have them put to death for crimes against Christ and Nature.

Now the Masons have installed the current Pope and now officially apologized for King Philip's actions.

Well as a cousin of King Philip I hereby resign that sentence. My grandfather was 33 degree Mason and Satanist and would say the Satanic Bible called to him. I know how evil they are. I am also descended from King Fulk of Jerusalem and Jean Bourbon, the Man in the Iron Mask. My other grandmother Elizabeth Jessie Libera was a member of the Priory of Sion and told me the Eastern Star was the most evil people she ever met. This is after she made it to the top of her local one.

Elijah Shalis



[edit on 16-6-2010 by eshalis]



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 12:16 AM
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reply to post by eshalis
 

Now where do you get that Phillip is related to Jesus? Its a historical fact that Phillip made up charges, established a pawn in the Seat of Christ, and then attacked them. He owed them so much and could not repay them so he did what he could do to zero out his debt.

The Masons are not the Masters of the Pontiff. Catholics can still be excommunicated for joining the Freemasons. Again, there is no definitive proof that the Templars established the Freemasons or vice versa.

Those are some bold claims. Its too bad you can't prove them.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 06:42 AM
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reply to post by KSigMason
 


Why are you arguing with a guy who thinks he is related to the Kings of France and therefore somehow related to Jesus? I think no matter how much sense or logic you use you are only going to be on the losing end of that debate. Jusy saying.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 07:07 AM
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reply to post by eshalis
 


lets see if we can help you prove some of your story. how about you let us know what lodge your grandfather was in. And give us his name. We will check to see if he existed and verify that part of the story. Then we can find out about the Lucifer worship and such.

None of that should be an issue since you already gave us your name and your grandmothers.

I'll wait right here.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 07:18 AM
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Originally posted by getreadyalready


Yes, EA's can receive the rights and the burial.


See my above post. 25 US Grand Lodges allow EA's and FC's to receive Masonic burial. The other 26 do not.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 09:36 AM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by getreadyalready


Yes, EA's can receive the rights and the burial.


See my above post. 25 US Grand Lodges allow EA's and FC's to receive Masonic burial. The other 26 do not.


I saw your post, thank you for that, however I would assert that the 26 who do not allow it are breaking their own traditions. It is possible that those states have a little bit different degree work, or different lectures, but as far as all the EA lectures I have heard, you are presented your apron and you become a brother and you stand in the NE corner as the youngest Mason. Therefore, you should have all the same rights of burial....in my opinion.

Now, as an EA you are restricted from much of the learning and you can't attend a Master meeting, and in my lodge you only get a cheap cotton apron. You have to return all 3 catechisms before you receive your White Leather Apron, but I think that is more of a cost efficiency thing than a tradition. We don't want to spend the money on a leather apron until you have proven your commitment. Still, you are a "brother" and you should be honored as one if you die before you get the chance to complete your learning.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 09:44 AM
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reply to post by KSigMason
 


It appears in those different locations for specific reasons. Most Masons don't realize it, but where the eye appears carries a significance. For example, most square and compasses have the G in the middle, but a Past Masters symbol would have the Sun in the middle.

www.freemasons-freemasonry.com...

www.hbmasons.com...

There is so much symbolism in Masonry that even the most seasoned Mason often overlooks the subtle differences. Many times it just looks like someone has taken artistic license to fancy something up a little, but that is not the case. Even the angle of opening of the compasses has meaning.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 09:52 AM
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reply to post by eshalis
 


No way the Masons are installing Popes. I know there is some give and take when interpretting history, but the Catholic Church as often times forbid its members from becoming Masons. There has been a lot of back and forth between the two organizations. My lodge has Catholic members, but they will readily attest that some of their church members frown upon it.

Masons do not pic one God over another. We only demand that a person believes in "one ever-living God." We don't care what name you put on that God, and we have our own unique ways of referring to the God that avoids any disagreement between competing religions within the Lodge. We also readily acknowledge and display the Quran, the Epic of Gilgamesh, and the Rig Veda in the Shrine Temples (a subset of Masons).

There is often disagreement and politics in a Masonic Lodge and that is why there are so many lodges. When one group strongly disagrees with the leadership they organize and start their own lodge. Each Lodge still believes in all the basic precepts and shares all the same traditions and knowledge, but they may have a little difference here and there about the daily operations or business side of how the lodge is run. It sounds like your family members were disgruntled with someone or something in the lodge, and that happens sometimes. Especially once you make 33rd degree, but 33rd degree is an honorary degree that can only be bestowed by your peers for your years of service, so I don't believe that a 33rd degree Mason would criticize the organization.

I know a lot of 33rd degree Masons, and they may get mad at someone, and they may not even come to lodge, but they only speak of the fraternity with Love and Reverance. They never criticize the fraternity as a whole.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 10:58 AM
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reply to post by Masonic Light
 


thanks for that info ML. It's interesting that NC is on the no side of that. I guess this has been brought up at the Grand Lodge.

I agree that once you are initiated and given the apron, that to not be given the right to a masonic funeral would be much like going back on your word. I would think this needs to be discussed a bit more at the Grand Lodge level.




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