God's Fingerprint On Creation Found!

Originally posted by Triple_helixxx

Originally posted by starwarsisreal

Originally posted by inforeal
Who is God?

HU IS GOD

God is the creator of all things dude but you can't see him except via Near death experience

wow you're an idiot

See the above quote for evidence of said pissing match.

Edit to add: dscussions on religion are for the ignorant. discussions on the monad are worthwhile.

Carry on.

[edit on 16-5-2010 by bigfatfurrytexan]

Just to add two interesting quotes which some may note down in their memory, God has finger prints all over creation, in the ancient times people saw the earth as a created because of how nature and patterns worked, they become very skilled in reading the stars, looking at nature as being made for a purpose and not just random evolution. Maybe our senses have been blunted to the point we don't see the stars and wonder like we used to because of light pollution and how nature has been distanced and replaced with human products and that seperates the senses of being spiritual in nature and seeing earth as a purpose not just a random accident and worthlessess.


Romans 1:19

20For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
Text

Romans 9:19-21 (New International Version)

19One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?" 20But who are you, O man, to talk back to God? "Shall what is formed say to him who formed it, 'Why did you make me like this?' "[a] 21Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for noble purposes and some for common use?

Text

That isn't a valid point. You are using an intelligently created set of characters to use as an example for something random. I'm sure after so long you would come up with some random words by bashing the keyboard. With chaos comes order.

You're being chased into a corner... Your second sentence make a valid point although you drew a different conclusion based on your own perception.


If our Universe is an intelligently created set of characters now described as a "tri-nary" - 1,4,7 / 2,5,8 forming stereoscopic spatial dimensions... Nothing WE ARE is chaos. A control has been set in place. A cycling of energy. The prime mover or vehicle driving said cause and effect is a torus... Tori on myriad scale in fact.

To give you some examples:


Water down a drain
Galaxies
Hurricanes
Tornadoes
Snail shells
Blood traveling through our blood stream
Cellular structure
Heart muscle
Ear drum
Null point of Earth's magnetic field
DNA
etc., etc...


Pick one. Not only is there a character set... The character set draws energy in patterns. The pattern is us. You don't get around this debate.

[edit on 16-5-2010 by Americanist]

thank you kindly for this sweet & chewy & most polemic of subjects to debate and ellucidate .
I'm curious how a person relates the Pythagorean solids and the Fibonacci sequence to an idea of a personified 'god'..if anything this video PROVES that the concept of 'ALL THAT IS' is inclusive of natural laws that apply to matter in this world as it is perceived to be. This entire syllogism once again plays into the dilectic perpetuated by the elites who worship BAEL, Marduk-RA/ Mithros/Osirus and/or Lucifer. Anyone else who thinks the significance of mathematics and our life-form is evidence of a personified god is just laughed-at behind the scenes by the ruthless baELITES who run all the churches and perpetuate this idea of creative design, evolution and creation et al...
Our species is a genetic creation by non-humans who feed on us as a material and also as an astral food source...your personified god is no more than a grotesque-blue-tinted freak that exists to manipulate people into putting faith outside thier own selves.. So I suggest that persons wanting to put a Christian spin on everything should reailze the entire RA-legion is a clever deception to make people give up hope and to make Marduk/Lucifer look good..this video only truly proves that universal laws are consistent; beyond this I must admit that my oppinions are also completely subjective.
thanks for the most enjoyable post..kudos.~*

[edit on 16-5-2010 by shay_james]

[edit on 16-5-2010 by shay_james]

reply to post by Gorman91

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by TheMythLives

 

This would be true, except for one thing. Nature is NOT limited by these numbers. nature simply accepts them. There is no energy gain, or benefit from the form based on those numbers. It simply is.

The problem is, physics is not a set amount of numbers. Physics is the law of the world put into place by another system. Physics talks about how the laws of nature and how the laws of everything interact with each other and how they create harmony together. And you are exactly right Nature is not limited by these numbers, but rather Nature is limited by the laws of the world, which is physics. And physics, also, simply exists and "is".

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


people need to wake up and connect the simple idea of singularity.

everything was created, but think about what god is a little longer.

Originally posted by dalan.

That someone is hallucinating when they have a NDE, is simply an assumption, with no scientific backing whatsoever.

Actually there is scientific backing to the claim that NDEs are hallucinations. Youtube has a video by Michael Shermer (Out Of Body Experience) worth watching. John Stossel's "The Power Of Belief", also on Youtube, addresses some of the science behind NDEs.

Originally posted by Phlynx

Originally posted by dragonsmusic

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by dragonsmusic

An organized structure is not proof of an intelligent source behind it?

The solar system, for example, is an organized structure. It does not imply or rely on a creator or designer for its structure or organization.

The solar system is not an organized structure? lmao

silly domesticated primate, it is! A massive one, it's just too big for you to understand it.

Did you not read a word he said? Space is organized due to gravity.

Ah, gravity! Yes, that explains everything! Thanks so much !

As much as I like these threads, I cant help but point out that it is GOD who proves science. Not the other way around. It is HIS laws, statues and precepts that create order. Evolution like to say anything is possible in time. HMMMM, Let me grab all raw materials for a house, nails, windows, doors, hinges, everything.. Give me eternity to blow it up over and over. How long would it take me to blow it up and have a complete functional house? It would never happen. Then how in Gods name can evolutionist claim all that we are and precieve as mere chance? Even selective evolution screams intellegence. Who decides who selects? PLEASE PEOPLE use your brain GOD GAVE you.

reply to post by The time lord


Another version that actually seems to target a certain belief structure and does it ever hit home with accuracy, never read this version before.

Romans Chapter 1 19-23 & 25 Amplified bible

19For that which is known about God is evident to them and made plain in their inner consciousness, because God [Himself] has shown it to them.
20For ever since the creation of the world His invisible nature and attributes, that is, His eternal power and divinity, have been made intelligible and clearly discernible in and through the things that have been made (His handiworks). So [men] are without excuse [altogether without any defense or justification]
21Because when they knew and recognized Him as God, they did not honor and glorify Him as God or give Him thanks. But instead they became futile and godless in their thinking [with vain imaginings, foolish reasoning, and stupid speculations] and their senseless minds were darkened. 22Claiming to be wise, they became fools [professing to be smart, they made simpletons of themselves].
23And by them the glory and majesty and excellence of the immortal God were exchanged for and represented by images, resembling mortal man and birds and beasts and reptiles.....
25Because they exchanged the truth of God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


Why is God so hard to find? You'd think an all-powerful being would be kinda obvious. If the only fingerprint God left was eloquent mathematics he's quite the ninja-deity

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by dragonsmusic
That's silly, and even more so with those stars on it. I forget how many people here are silly , but this post just reminded me.
It's not a presence of a god that is indicative when one encounters mathematical constants. It has nothing to do with religion for me, but it screams intelligence! It screams Prime Mover!
Compare ATS itself to advanced mathematical formula.
Did ATS happen on it's own? Did it come into being without Simon? Would it exist without him, Skeptic, Springer and the mods?

It's a highly advanced combination of 1's and 0's. That's all. So that must mean it's just how things are, it's just there.
There's no such thing as Simon, Skeptic, ATS or the internet, no such thing as the MODS. I don't know the exact history of how the internet came about so that means that the internet, also, is just there. No prime mover behind it.

Poor argument. Comparing something known to have been created to something that has the illusion of having been created is preposterous. If the pinpointing of orderly mathematic constants in nature "screams intelligence and a prime mover" I'd suspect you're either lack the intelligence you believe you see, or that confirmation bias is driving your need for you to associate the laws of physics with an "intelligent prime mover". All this talk of "fingerprints" and the notions of mathematical formulas as being evidence of an "intelligent prime mover" is actually another dull and egotistical exercise of humans anthropomorphising the universe.

I'm comparing two things which both required some form of intelligence in order to come into existence. I am baffled that you missed that part. The only thing poor about my argument is that it was lost on you. And that's really nothing to do with me. If you do not see intelligence being involved in the creation of the solar system then it is not I who lacks an eye for spotting intelligence.

Originally posted by dragonsmusic

Originally posted by Phlynx

Originally posted by dragonsmusic

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by dragonsmusic

An organized structure is not proof of an intelligent source behind it?

The solar system, for example, is an organized structure. It does not imply or rely on a creator or designer for its structure or organization.

The solar system is not an organized structure? lmao

silly domesticated primate, it is! A massive one, it's just too big for you to understand it.

Did you not read a word he said? Space is organized due to gravity.

Ah, gravity! Yes, that explains everything! Thanks so much !

I'm still waiting on you to present the evidence that the order of the solar system is due to the "intelligent prime mover" you keep referring to. Come on, give yourself at least some excuse for your smug responses.

Originally posted by Phlynx

Originally posted by dragonsmusic

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by dragonsmusic

An organized structure is not proof of an intelligent source behind it?

The solar system, for example, is an organized structure. It does not imply or rely on a creator or designer for its structure or organization.

The solar system is not an organized structure? lmao

silly domesticated primate, it is! A massive one, it's just too big for you to understand it.

Did you not read a word he said? Space is organized due to gravity.

A) Sorry, but gravity does not exist in modern physics.

B) I hate when people make topics like this. SCIENCE AND RELIGION DO NOT MIX EVER. Please do not try to explain religion with science, and please do not try to explain science with religion. (I.E. FIBONACCI SEQUENCE)

C) Even if there was such thing as God, he would be divine. There are myriads of men who claim to know the will of God. But the truth is no human could understand him if he does exist.


[edit on 16-5-2010 by fordrew]

reply to post by TheMythLives


Myth

For all respect I have for you (we've talked before and I have you in high regard) I disagree.

Physics is simply a form of rationally and logically trying to explain what we dont understand and have no clue about.

The difference between our physics and religion is that physics are mutable. When something proves itself not to be logic or rational according to the laws of physics we create again other "laws" to explain the event and transform or simply abandon the previous "law" - as opposed to religion where its kinda easier to explain everything - rain - god, sun - god, lightening - god, blue sky - god and so on.

Physics dont explain the pattern of the fibonacci sequence, the sequence reveals intelligent design and tries to find a pattern where physics simply cant grasp yet. Design is not physics.

The question is... why do the physics we know do seem to end up obeying the design? Shouldnt the design depend on physics? But here we see physics obeying the design.

Physics changed a lot over the last hmmm 2 thousand years... yet the design remained unchanged, you can trace the sequence back to the birth of earth.

Originally posted by dragonsmusic

I'm comparing two things which both required some form of intelligence in order to come into existence. I am baffled that you missed that part. The only thing poor about my argument is that it was lost on you. And that's really nothing to do with me. If you do not see intelligence being involved in the creation of the solar system then it is not I who lacks an eye for spotting intelligence.

Sorry, but you have provided no evidence that natural processes are a result of intelligence, only smug claims that it does because it looks that way to you.

Explain to us how the organization of the solar system is due to intelligence. If you can manage that, explain why other solar systems exhibit different organizations than our own.

I would not say that this proves that God exists, but it is kinda wierd that everything in this universe is unique, except for math. It's not just Finonacci Sequences, but also pi and various other numbers that we see again and again.

It very much seems as if someone had created a specific system or code on which to build upon this dimension or world.

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by dragonsmusic
The solar system does not imply intelligent design? lmao

silly domesticated primate, it does! It's just too big for you to understand it.

Edit because I was being emotional and did not express what I meant to say the first time.

Support your point with evidence.

"It does!", combined with condescending petulance, proves nothing.

The evidence I would like to provide you with is a telescope. I will buy one for you and then you can observe the gigantic astrolabe-like universe that surrounds you. As far as petulance goes, what could be more petulant than demanding that I show evidence for a prime mover when you live on a world that just so happens to provide you with a star to keep you alive, water, food, and air to breathe? Not to mention you are surrounded by massive heavenly bodies all of which follow courses, the precision of which, is baffling.

Originally posted by FraternitasSaturni
the sequence reveals intelligent design

Actually, it doesn't. In fact, natural processes follows all kinds of algorithms and sequences, none of which imply "intelligent design", and none of them reveal any designer.

Can anybody prove exactly how nature's adherence to mathematical formula reveals or indicates any type of "intelligent design"?

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


I don't believe that qualifies as being enigmatic or ninja-esque. You can always blame the perceiver and the tools, or methods, of observation.

Think about it. Science makes claims about dark matter. Yet, what do we really know about dark matter? Something about it taking up more space in the universe than all other known elements and particles. Yet, we can't examine it. So, we're saying it exists, but can't even really see it. Scientists claim it is because we don't yet have the tools to examine it properly.

Yet we have formed theories about its nature and people take these theories seriously. As if they've already been proven. Why? Because its under the name of science? It practically poses the same credibility as faith.

Let me also add that if science DID find out that a "God/Gods" exist, it would probably call "God" something else. Even though the fundamentals of the two would parallel one another, science would try to de-mystify it simply out of arrogance.