No citizen rights for NY terror suspect

No citizen rights for NY terror suspect

www.presstv.ir

The arrested suspect in the recently failed New York bombing has been stripped of his US citizenship and charged with terrorism-related offences.

Faisal Shahzad was arrested on Monday as he prepared to board a Dubai-bound plane at John F. Kennedy International Airport.

The Pakistan-born former US citizen was questioned by the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) without initially being read his legal rights to remain silent or have a lawyer present before questioning.

(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
blogs.ajc .com
www.gazettetimes.com

Related AboveTopSecret.com Discussion Threads:
Revealed: NYC car bomb suspect worked at same firm as ‘Catch Me If You Can’ con artist

That's a shame and not matter what his accused crime is, he should be afforded the rights that everyone else is entitled to. Have we completely forgotten about the Constitution? I mean, I know that Constitution doesn't matter much anymore but are we completely throwing it away?

I think it is important to note, that no matter how much evidence is against this guy, he is still presumed innocent until proven guilty and he should be afforded due process. Let's not stoop to the level of our "supposed" enemies by not affording basic rights to others, much less an American citizen. Just my 2 cents.

--airspoon


www.presstv.ir
(visit the link for the full news article)

Edited for grammar.

[edit on 5-5-2010 by airspoon]

reply to post by airspoon


You even come here posting stuff defending this guy... i don't believe it... he purchased the car... his prints are on the car... the reciepts are at the car sales place of business (or now they are at the Police headquarters) and then he was found trying to get out of America....

What more proof do you need?

I think in this case it's not an innocent until proven guilty verdict!!

Surprisingly there are numerous people who feel that he should not have any rights. This is wrong, people need to understand that due process not only helps the defendant but also everyone else too and the law of the land.

If he is stripped of all rights and is not tried in court, then he may very well be wrongly accused for the crime. Whether you truly believe he is guilty or not is irrelevant, we must never stray away from due process and there must never be a precedance for not conforming to that standard.... ever!
If you disagree then perhaps North Korea would be a more suitable place for you to live in.

Originally posted by TruthxIsxInxThexMist
You even come here posting stuff defending this guy... i don't believe it... he purchased the car... his prints are on the car... the reciepts are at the car sales place of business (or now they are at the Police headquarters) and then he was found trying to get out of America....

What more proof do you need?

I think in this case it's not an innocent until proven guilty verdict!!

If you truly believe that then why are you against due process?
If you are correct then he will be found guilty and dealt accordingly with!

So what's the issue then?

I don't know if this is true but it is in line with American law. Individuals who decide to take up arms and fight for a foreign army are no longer citizens. We have been more than forgiving of Islamic Jihad always thinking the moderate muslims would speak up. They have not because they support violent jihad as proscribed by their role model Mohammed and in glory of their god Allah.

Again, I haven't seen any other articles reporting the same thing but I would expect that muslims living in America are being increasingly made uncomfortable. Were I a muslim, I would be packing my bags and getting out of the country.

We will be putting them in camps with the illegal aliens very soon. Especially if Greece is any indicator of our New World Order to come.

I think some people are letting emotion get the better of them.

You've got to think of this as just a normal criminal case and regardless of the apparent evidence against him, he has not been convicted of any crime and certainly shouldn't have his citizenship revoked ( unless there's another reason for that ).

If his citizenship has been revoked purely because of his apparent involvement in this crime then that could prejudice the jury and makes me wonder whether he'll have any chance of a fair trial.

I'm not American, so I don't know whether this procedure is normal or not over there.

Originally posted by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


You even come here posting stuff defending this guy...

How do you get that this thread is about anybody defending him?

Did you read the article? The suspect is AN AMERICAN CITIZEN!

He is entitled to the same rules as any other American. He needs to be read his rights, etc.....be allowed an attorney, the whole 9 yards, just like anybody else, who is a CITIZEN!

He might very well be guilty of everything you said. He is still entitled to due process, just the same as any other suspected criminal.

If you don't think so, that makes you less of a citizen, than the suspect!

[edit on 5-5-2010 by Blanca Rose]

Of course he should have all the legal rights than anyone else!!!

- How USA can even consider anything else - or is the country ready to waterboard this guy, and throw him to secret prisons and places like Guantanamo to rest of his life without fair trial?

I think those who support such thing have only something to hide here.

If this really is true - USA sucks very deeply!

Originally posted by ModernAcademia

If you truly believe that then why are you against due process?
If you are correct then he will be found guilty and dealt accordingly with!

So what's the issue then?

Fair enough!

I guess some people need to be made an example of.... maybe others may think twice before committing such an act! If i did some act of terror like this i don't think i'd be expecting any help.... i would know what i was doing as he did so i'd be guilty the whole way. The thing about having a trial is it means you dont get sentenced until the verdict is given.

Plus i guess i'm just peeeed off seeing terrorists in the news headlines!!

Maybe i shouldn't bother reading the latest news threads or reading the latest news online... but it's hard to avoid.



[edit on 5-5-2010 by TruthxIsxInxThexMist]

I believe the main point here is being missed-

If we didn't read him the Miranda rights, and no one is treating him like an American citizen then he could ideally appeal whatever verdict, or get let off in the future even (if he got the proper support) because he was denied these rights! This makes no sense! We have people fighting for rights for 'ILLEGAL immigrants' yet this man doesn't receive the proper treatment? Im not for or against the man myself, I am simply saying it doesn't sit right with me mainly because I can foresee a future problem arise because of it.

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


Would you feel any differently if this suspect was home grown?

If in fact this fellow did what he is alleged to have done, he still deserves the rights afforded to any other citizen.

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


“He that would make his own liberty secure, must guard even his enemy from opposition; for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach himself.” --Thomas Paine

I'm not defending the alleged suspect at all, rather, I am defending the Constitution, something that doesn't happen enough these days. If we set this precedent, then it may be you who becomes stripped of your rights, for something you may not have done.

Also, we don't know that this guy admitted to anything. Until I see it, I'm not going to believe it. Remember, our government has lied to us on numerous occasions so there is absolutely nothing to say that they are not lying about this. We have no idea under what conditions he may have confessed either, which could make his confession meaningless, IMO. Not that a confession means that we can strips rights away from someone before a conviction anyway.

The point here, is that it becomes a slippery slope when you pick and choose who can have rights. It may be you one day.

Just my 2 cents.

--airspoon

First it's the suspected terrorist. Then it's the suspected child molestors. Then it's the suspected murderers and then before you know you'll be send to guantanamo for jay walking.

reply to post by mike_trivisonno

Individuals who decide to take up arms and fight for a foreign army are no longer citizens. We have been more than forgiving of Islamic Jihad always thinking the moderate muslims would speak up.

What foreign army would that be? He didn't run off and join a foreign army from the evidence that we have thus far. He is however suspected of committing a crime. Just because there are a bunch of people committing or conspiring to commit the same types of crimes, does not mean that they have joined a foreign army. If we made that argument, then we could easily make that argument for drug users, shop-lifters and child molesters. Where would it stop? Anyone suspected of a "popular" crime is not part of a foreign army and doesn't deserve rights? Come on, that's ridiculous.

--airspoon

Edited for grammar.

[edit on 5-5-2010 by airspoon]

[edit on 5-5-2010 by TruthxIsxInxThexMist]

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist



You know, and another thing.....with all the commotion about illegal aliens in this country, and people demanding their ousting, one thing can be said about this suspect. He actually took the time to become a citizen.

Who really know? Possibly he went through all of it to blend in well with everybody else.

I'm tending to think he got dissillusioned when he lost his job, and his home went into forclosure.

The American dream slipped his grasp, like it has done so for other citizens of this country.

It very well could have been a natural citizen, who might have done this as well.

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


First off, your last sentence does not make any sense. However, I never once said that he is a "great guy". Until he is convicted by a jury of his peers who have looked at the available evidence, then he is considered innocent, regardless of your own personal feelings. These checks and balances were put there for a purpose. If we remove them for one, they will be gone for others, possibly you. While I could care less about this turkey, I do care about the Constitution and since I am a retired soldier, I swore to uphold the Constitution and that's what I will do until the day that I die.

--airspoon

reply to post by Blanca Rose


I didn't say anything about him being of Pakistani origin did i?

I'm pretty sure i didn't...

And you are right... all i'm saying is too many people get away with less sentences then they should have got... murderer's, rapists... whatever... if if it is 100% that a person has done something then thery should suffer for it... as i said most know what they are doing before commiting the act!

Are there any other sources for this?

I checked out the other two links in your post. The "gazette times" link says nothing of the sort, and the "ajc" blog is just an opinion piece criticizing McCain's desire to withhold rights from this suspect.

The only source claiming citizenship has actually been stripped is a press outlet that is owned and operated by the government of Iran.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's an outright lie, I'm just hoping that there would be another source for something as big as this.

If his citizenship is stripped after he is found guilty of taking up arms against the United States that would be a whole other situation. If his citzenship was stripped before a trial (as presstv claims) that's a tremendous issue for anyone who believes in freedom and I find it very hard to believe that the only people aware of it are Iran's hand selected preapproved mouthpieces.