It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

'I have to keep her indoors now'

page: 1
1
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on May, 4 2010 @ 12:17 PM
link   
I came across this and i cant help but finding it disturbing.
Here is a quote
The Muslim husband of the first woman in Italy to be fined for wearing a burka has vowed to never let her outside again, because he doesn't want other men looking at her.

Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk...
Heres the link
www.dailymail.co.uk...

The question that i have here is this,
If you were in the position of the man or woman, what would you do?

[edit on 4-5-2010 by jazz10]




posted on May, 4 2010 @ 12:23 PM
link   
The problem with this whole thing is one word: intolerance. Intolerance of another culture's customs and ways, intolerance of a whole people, and in a much broader sense, intolerance of the color of someone's skin. I've said it before and I'll say it again: nothing, and I mean NOTHING will be accomplished in this world unless people start pulling their heads out of their arses and stop being concerned about the level of melatonin in someone's skin, or the way that they worship their own deity, or how they go about their daily life. Instead of promoting this intense hatred of everything Middle Eastern, why not promote understanding and respect for another fellow HUMAN BEING. We're all the same color on the inside, and I'm getting quite fed up of the MSM, the gub'ment, and citizens blaming everything bad that goes on in the world on the big bad Middle Eastern Boogeyman. That boogeyman doesn't exist, and until people start waking up to that fact, well, you know what I'm going to say.

That's all I really have to say on this topic, because it just irritates me to no end.

MSM
gub'ment
intolerant people.


Peace be with you.

-truthseeker



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 12:29 PM
link   
Personally I find it rather archaic that he won't "let" her be outside again so that other men can't look at her. This isn't the 1600's where men can order women around whenever they want. But keeping women covered is part of their religion, so in that way I can kinda understand where he's coming from. Doesn't mean I agree with him, but I can kinda understand it.

As for what I'd do if I were her, it's irrelevant because I'm not her. My mindset is different than hers is because I wouldn't ever allow a man to tell me what to do to begin with. So what I would do in this situation and what she'll do are likely completely different things. I'd tell him to stuff it and go outside anyway. I'd bet good money she won't do that and as irritating as I find his comment it's not my business to tell her she should.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 12:31 PM
link   
reply to post by truthseeker1984
 


What's this got to do with that?

This is about someone being so posessive of their spouse that they will not allow them in public??

I'd love to know what SHE thinks, but i don't suppose SHE would be allowed to hold any press conferences, especially now that she can't wear her burka.

IMHO from the govt and msm, it's part of our conditioning. Nobody shall be unidentifiable through our cctv system. Even you poor little moslem women. We will identify who you are, where you have been, and where you are going. It's lack of privacy meets personal privacy.

And unless you want to be tracked 24/7 whever you leave your house, you may find this notion disturbing.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 12:33 PM
link   
If the world does what i suggest and make us all 1 gender than this will not be a problem.

Roll on a few hundred years.

On topic its there life they choose to do what they want.

I am not interested in females, so i do not really care about this situation.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 12:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by harryhaller
reply to post by truthseeker1984
 


What's this got to do with that?

This is about someone being so posessive of their spouse that they will not allow them in public??

I'd love to know what SHE thinks, but i don't suppose SHE would be allowed to hold any press conferences, especially now that she can't wear her burka.

IMHO from the govt and msm, it's part of our conditioning. Nobody shall be unidentifiable through our cctv system. Even you poor little moslem women. We will identify who you are, where you have been, and where you are going. It's lack of privacy meets personal privacy.

And unless you want to be tracked 24/7 whever you leave your house, you may find this notion disturbing.



It has EVERYTHING to do with it my friend.

www.telegraph.co.uk...

This I believe is the exact article that spawned the one in question now.

Look, I don't agree with their culture, and I don't have to. But I respect them as humans, and respect their ways even if I don't agree with them. Wearing a Burka is part of their culture, so therefore should be respected. If the husband feels so strongly about it, so be it. Yes, it's unfortunate, but it isn't my place, or any government's place to tell someone what they can and cannot wear in public, especially when it comes to subjects of religion. This burka ban would be similar to telling a nun she could not wear her habit, or telling a priest that he could not wear his collar. Do you see where I am going with this? Intolerance toward someone else's religion has now forced this person (who so strongly believes in it) to seclude his wife from the prying eyes of other men. I don't think it's right, but if that's what he needs to do to stay true to his culture, then so be it.

It's all about understanding, and so far, all I have seen is anti-Middle East hate.

It's disgusting, and I'm sick of it.



Peace be with you.

-truthseeker



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 12:51 PM
link   
reply to post by truthseeker1984
 


When you travel to a middle eastern country you are REQUIRED to follow their customs. It is the law. Dress codes are very strict for both men and women. Isn't that being just as intolerant of other people's cultures and beliefs? Would you cry foul if you went to a middle eastern country and couldn't wear your shorts and T-shirt? Would you be as disgusted by their intolerance for your way of life?
Going to any foreign country is a choice. If someone doesn't agree with the laws and values of a particular country then that person shouldn't decide to live there.

Italy didn't say that this woman couldn't follow her beliefs. Muslim women are only required to cover their heads, not their whole bodies.

The real issue to me is why this man is being allowed to treat his wife in such a reprehensible manner in a country that affords equal rights to both men and women.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 12:53 PM
link   
TruthSeeker,

Your quote...."Look, I don't agree with their culture, and I don't have to. But I respect them as humans, and respect their ways even if I don't agree with them."

This is exactly the point. Only thing is, it is they that do not respect OUR cultures and expect us to become acolytes of their culture. Respect goes both ways. With the Muslim world there is no give and take, It's their way or the sword!
Zindo

[edit on 5/4/2010 by ZindoDoone]



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 12:56 PM
link   

Originally posted by Cobra5000
reply to post by truthseeker1984
 


When you travel to a middle eastern country you are REQUIRED to follow their customs. It is the law. Dress codes are very strict for both men and women. Isn't that being just as intolerant of other people's cultures and beliefs? Would you cry foul if you went to a middle eastern country and couldn't wear your shorts and T-shirt? Would you be as disgusted by their intolerance for your way of life?
Going to any foreign country is a choice. If someone doesn't agree with the laws and values of a particular country then that person shouldn't decide to live there.

Italy didn't say that this woman couldn't follow her beliefs. Muslim women are only required to cover their heads, not their whole bodies.

The real issue to me is why this man is being allowed to treat his wife in such a reprehensible manner in a country that affords equal rights to both men and women.


That was my point. It isn't just associated with other countries' intolerance: it's ALL OVER. The point I was trying to make is that intolerance is what is killing this world. I don't care if you are a Muslim, Christian, Jew, Druid, whatever. Respect other's cultures and be respectful of each other as a human being. That's all I was trying to say. But it does bug me that it seems that as if it is the Whole World vs. The Middle East. It screams of something much bigger than just an article of clothing, and to have an entire country or countries (whether Middle Eastern or otherwise) making a big deal out of such is just plain idiocy at the most basic of levels.



Peace be with you.

-truthseeker



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:01 PM
link   

Originally posted by ZindoDoone
TruthSeeker,

Your quote...."Look, I don't agree with their culture, and I don't have to. But I respect them as humans, and respect their ways even if I don't agree with them."

This is exactly the point. Only thing is, it is they that do not respect OUR cultures and expect us to become acolytes of their culture. Respect goes both ways. With the Muslim world there is no give and take, It's their way or the sword!
Zindo

[edit on 5/4/2010 by ZindoDoone]


You're right, but maybe by extending a hand of friendship or even one of co-existence, maybe something productive might come from it. And the blanket term that all Middle Eastern cultures are the same in their dealings is not true at all. It would be like me saying that all Americans are fat, lazy, and stupid, or all British Citizens have bad teeth, or all Germans are Nazis. I could go on, but you get the point. There are always people (in control or otherwise) that will negatively reflect on an entire culture or country (look at good 'ole Gee Dubya for that one). And I'd like to see one shred of evidence that tourists going into these countries are arrested or fined for wearing something that isn't suitable to their culture (if there is one, then I will stand corrected).


Peace be with you.

-truthseeker



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:07 PM
link   
This is a tricky one.

I view orthodox Muslims just the same as I view orthodox Christians and Jews and while they have every blessing in my book to practice their religion in peace when they begin imposing their views on the political process and mainstream society I begin to see nothing but trouble (such as the problem we have here in America with Evangelicals).

Orthodox religions in that regard really do much to hamper their assimilation and one could fairly argue that once their behavior reaches that point it does in some manner deliver a blow to the respective societies they choose to reside therein.

Europe, while more tolerant than most, really does not have a taste for anything orthodox, regardless of religious persuasion.
I have never seen a European country however deny Jewish citizens the right to cover their heads or their bodies, nor fundamental Christians....

It does seem they are delivering a small blow, under the "veil" (no pun intended..hehe) of women's rights by denying the right to wear the Burkka...
I personally yes do find them ridiculous and distasteful but again the arguement that many have regarding Westerners' dress in Middle Eastern countries resonates with me nonetheless.

I certainly cover myself up, whether visiting the Vatican or a Buddhist temple or the Middle East....though I may be hot I do respect the culture I am entering.

Personally I find myself always in the position where I am pro-tolerance and pro-assimilation, as strange as that may sound.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:08 PM
link   
reply to post by truthseeker1984
 


A few thousand years of past actions by the Muslim world shows that this will NOT work. They only talk or negotiate to gain time to undermine their infidel enemies, of which is anyone who isn't Muslim!
Zindo

[edit on 5/4/2010 by ZindoDoone]



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:35 PM
link   

Originally posted by jazz10
The Muslim husband of the first woman in Italy to be fined for wearing a burka has vowed to never let her outside again, because he doesn't want other men looking at her.


This is not about respect for religion.
This is not about tolerance of culture.

This is about an insecure brute who feels the need to control a woman he believes he owns.

Let's not lose sight of the core of the problem here.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:42 PM
link   
reply to post by truthseeker1984
 


Well you can be tired if you want to but the "boogeyman" will still be Middle Eastern as long as they keep blowing things up and arriving where they are a guest and attempting to change everything to suit them.

Nobody in any western culture is ever going to be comfortable with and probably will not allow anyone, male or female, to walk around in anything like a Burqua with their face hidden from view..so might as well get used to it.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer
This is about an insecure brute who feels the need to control a woman he believes he owns.



Are you sure of what you say is true there?

How does she feel?

Have you even asked how she feels about this. Why do we all assume that people want what we want?



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:50 PM
link   
So... the husband admits that he knew about the law and that it is not against his religion to comply, but will ban the woman from outdoors because he "cannot have other men looking at her". This story is not reflective of religious tolerance or lack thereof, but more to the point of borderline spousal abuse. I wonder if this woman agrees with him?

It appears she would have some support, perhaps, should she choose to do otherwise...

From the link...


Muslim groups in Italy today insisted that Italian laws must be respected. Imam Izzedin Elzir, president of the Islamic Community and Organisations Union in Italy, said: 'We are for the freedom of women and against veils of any kind and Italian laws must be respected.

'We as an organisation have always said that we are against face veils or coverings in Italy because the law of recognition has to be observed.'



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:53 PM
link   

Originally posted by andy1033

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer
This is about an insecure brute who feels the need to control a woman he believes he owns.



Are you sure of what you say is true there?

How does she feel?

Have you even asked how she feels about this. Why do we all assume that people want what we want?


True, I haven't heard from the woman.
I have, however, heard from the man.
I feel certain what I have said about him is truthful.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:54 PM
link   
reply to post by truthseeker1984
 


I have to disagree with you.

I think it is tolerance that is destroying the world, as you put it.

The more you bend over backwards to be tolerant of others (this goes for cultural, as in this context, and like a crying baby whose parents won;t hush them in an expesive restaurant), the closer you are to being flat on your back.

I think we need more people in the world to have spines and stick to their convictions and less accomodation of those that would impose themselves on others, i.e. like the baby in the restaurant example above.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 01:58 PM
link   
reply to post by traditionaldrummer
 


You do not know that for sure, plenty of muslims must surely be passive, and alot may be humble too. We just get a picture of them from the news.

Not all males are teh same as other males, and same for females. I do not care for this stuff as i do not have interest in females, but not every female will dislike it.

But they should have the right to choose, and maybe italy is not the country for them if they want to wear this stuff, but its upto them.



posted on May, 4 2010 @ 02:02 PM
link   
Muslims do not have a monopoly on subjugating women. If you don't have any Muslims in your town you may think that the women are all kept inside. This is not true. I just saw one in Walmart.



new topics

top topics



 
1
<<   2 >>

log in

join