All Roads Lead to Rome

Originally posted by cosmicpixie
Question Proto :

I am only on page 6 at the moment.....I wanted to know if you have any sources to support your belief that Islam was a religion deliberately concocted by the same strategists who you say engineered Christianity. Is there any actual evidence ?

If both the Old Testament and New Testament are fabrications of Rome as I contend, then the Quran would have to be as well, since it takes elements of both, and takes them one step further.

If just the New Testament is fabrications of Rome, especially the whole origins of the Christ Cult, then the Quran would have to be as well to, since it features Christ as a prophet of God.

Since the Muslims actually lived in the region Rome contends Christ was from, and the region of the Hebrew mystery God(s) they would have had to have known both were false doctrines.

One thing is for certain, and I am not a theologian, and that is the Muslims did not accept Christ as a son of God but as a holy prophet for a reason. They rejected the notions of the Trinity for a reason. They have enmity towards the Hebrew based on how they have honored and followed the God for a reason.

The Hebrew too, obviously rejected Christ for a reason, and sees him as a blasphemer, and in their later works the Talmud and Torah, even have a special level of their Hell, just for Jesus and Mary.

So since none of the three parties can agree on the ‘complete’ story, but only ‘pieces’ of the story, and all three of the parties supposedly had access to the region throughout that time period, it is logical to conclude that these fundamental splits could only be because each, was given, the doctrine by Rome, with the fundamental differences, being meant to cause them to all disagree on the ‘complete’ story, for the sole purpose of divide and conquer warfare.

In the three, the Hebrew, Christian, and Islamic faiths, we once again see the Trinity, Trilogy concept, which is Rome’s invention, the Apollo Tripod, at play, using prophecy, meant to be self fulfilling, by causing a fundamental argument in the rudimentary beliefs of each sect, that would drive the prophecy to completion.

When you remove the spirituality aspects from it, and the notions of God, people do want to and are inclined to believe in, and approach the situation of these three religions that dominate the world, solely as logic based puzzle, that would be the logical conclusion in my humble opinion.

No one of them could be right, because they were all given and taught something purposefully wrong, so there would be no way, any of them could ever agree on it, based on the rules of blind faith, written into each one, based on a Deity that does not speak for itself, and a closed series of prophets that are alleged to have spoken for him, in each divisive incident, that sets the three branches apart.

That could only be Rome’s doing, because Rome is the one most benefitting from it, and Rome stands still to this day to gain the most from it.
That’s my reasoning and methodology.

Thanks.

Originally posted by undo
there we have it, ladies and gentlemen. a lesson for those who seek to ask the really hard questions is, he's allowed to use any method necessary to prove his point, including pointing to prophecy as the vehicle of rome to depopulate the earth in the guise of sacred fulfillment. but when you ask why the vehicle is constructed in a way that perhaps disproves his theory he wants you to be censored out of existence.

Ok I'm 20 pages late but there is something that may validate both his stance AND yours...you have probably heard about a technique called PESHER...? It was a way of giving double meanings to some of the stories and information in the bible. For the masses the meaning would be literal - so in the case of something terrible ascending from the absyss this would be taken to mean a demonic being emerging from hell perhaps. For those who has ears to hear and eyes to see though the meanings of alot of allegories within the bible went alot deeper but only initiates into the deeper mysteries would have a chance of grasping those deeper meanings. So on the one hand you have a control system feeding people lieralisms as fact (things like the virgin birth, turning water into wine, feeding 5,000 on one loaf of bread, resurrection from the dead etc) but on the other level there was some sort of deeper code, often tied into Astrology/Astronomy and mystery teachings. So the bible may have been constructed as a kind of coded manual so that initiates around the world would maybe understand the secret plan/agenda while others would view things from a purely literal perspective. The NWO plan gets set in motion while the manual containing its blueprint also serves as a code for initiates around the world........?

I'd have to agree with you that information contained within far older texts and traditions from around the world has not really been factored into this overall theory presented by the OP . Nearly every culture has testimony about beings who came from the stars in flying boats/ships/vehicles dispensing knowledge and having wars with each other sometime or other...there may well have been a far OLDER inspiration for the mission Rome decided to undertake that began with these visitors. In other words, the Roman NWO mission may be a case of picking up the mantle these other bunch left behind - their secret gods who they have been working for over the past couple of millenia as maybe they believe they are on some promise once it all comes together. There is alot to speculate over but it would be ignorant to dismiss this ancient and worldwide testimony (and the modern phenomena of UFOs and abductions etc )when trying to figure out what the hell is going down on planet Earth and that seems to be what the OP has done. I think there is another layer above what he has been writing about as I'm sure others do also.

Hope I haven't gone too off topic here....

reply to post by harryhaller

Curious that immediately after his death, the Apollo missions were started. Citing him directly as the inspiration. He was skeptical of manned lunar missions, and correctly failed to see any benefit to the USA at that time. Sputnik was a gimmick, and the space race was a series of press releases that belied the facts behind each nation's true resources.

It is rather curious isn't it, that we would have named, the biggest technological achievement to date of the human race for Apollo isn't it?

So once again, in the very recent past, we see the Patrician Elites paying homage to the Patron God of Troy, by naming this huge achievement that carries man off the planet for the first time in honor of Apollo.

Strong circumstantial evidence that certainly gives more food for thought to the Trojan connection to the mystery religion, and the Trojan founding of Rome, and Rome's continued control and conquest of the world.

Is it, could it really just be coincidence? It's one heck of a coincidence if it is!

reply to post by cosmicpixie


No disrespect to anyone, but the presence of pictures crudely rendered in the ancient past, being used to suggest that an alien presence manipualted the DNA pool in the ancient past, does not mean these things factor in today.

Like Johnny Apple Seed, they may have had an impact, but if they had the power, and influence people claim, there would be a presence that could really be substantiated.

Personally, and I am not alone, the Reptilian conspiracy, which is really just an extension of the fear of the serpent manifest into ancient and more modern works as being something poorly substantiated and with no real evidence to support it simply is a fantasy that has no shred of real proof to substantiate it.

Real being a dead reptillian, real being a working stargate that takes us to reptiallians, real being a piece of working reptillian technology.

So to the same people who imagine the mystery gods can't be from Troy, even though Rome's roots are from there, and all these other regions were conquered by Rome, and this alien technology or presence did not protect these people or regions from basically being conquered with swords and stones...

And that someone would have certainly have leaked out these mystery gods from Troy, then your same logic would suggest someone would have had to leak out the Reptillians with conclusive evidence.

So once again, if Rome is using religious and historical fabrications to control the world, how do we know the leaders and priestly class of these cultures did not fabricate THEIR OWN texts and teachings, to control and place fear in their populations with depictions of half beast, half human creatures, they ascribed great power to, greater than humans, aligned with the ruling elite class and protecting them to impose their rule.

Without real evidence, which there really is none, but a lot of interpretations and theories, as I have pointed out so many times before this is not actionable intelligence, and does nothing to confront the actual Roman conspiracy or the premise of the thread.

In my humble opinion the place to prove these fantastical theories is out in the real world, doing real investigatory work, that uncovers real evidence in the physical form that can actually display a real presence through it.

So yes, it's all off topic, and still being instigated by someone who is intent on derailing an important thread, and a real in your face conspiracy, to basically have one huge brain fart.

The real evidence of these things, really isn't there, but simply based on a lot of people supporting one anothers speculations.

The real evidence for Rome still trying to conquer the world, is there.

If I really thought the Reptillian conspiracy had any relevance to this Roman conspiracy I would have worked it into the thread.

If I thought the Reptillian conspiracy was prominent in it, I would have worked it into the title, and as I have said, I researched those things and found them not to have bearing, and they are excluded for a reason, and I have displayed that reason, as well as the evidentiary standards that would have to get me to consider them.

Evidentiary standards Undo nor anyone else has ever met.

So yes, it really is off topic, even more so, when the poster in question has created her own little stargate in the form of another thread, to channel people here to this thread to derail it.

I sure would appreciate people sticking to the topic of this thread.

Rome using Religion, Banking, Law and Military might to establish a one world government, and REAL evidence for that, or against that, and the Reptillian theory, does not provide anything that proves Rome isn't doing that nor has anyone provided any real evidence of a Reptilian presence.

If as I contend Rome is using Religious Fabrication to Control the World to our detriment through fear based fantasy, what exactly does introducing another unsubstantiated fear based fantasy do to help?

I would prefer it if people kept this thread on topic, and productive, and take these things to the Gray Area, where they belong.

Thanks.



[edit on 1/5/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


I never specifically mentioned Reptilians or Serpents, though there are serpent-based cults the world over tracing back thousands of years - whole books have been written on the subject. Cultures separated by thousands of miles recanted tales of wise people from the stars who looked like humans , THE SHINING ONES as they were often called, emerging from a devasted world to impart their knowledge . There are reams of descriptions of wars, weaponry and crafts in numerous Indian texts as well as Chaldean and Chines works and of course the Sumerian tablets and whole host of other works. So either they were all making up pretty much the same story or there was something to what they all talked about.

If the off world beings were once around then took off for whatever reason (or at least it looked like they took off) there would not be much left to testift to their presence accept the recollections written down by different cutures around the world and in respect of that testimony it is abundant as Undo's threads and countelss other researchers have revealed . I never mentioned debatable ancient artwork either......
Wayne Herschel's amazing star map discoveries also give food for thought in relation to the topic I brought up as does Christopher Dunn and Joseph P Farrell's research into the Great Pyramid Enigma.

I won't ramble on about it, it's just that you have this whole theory wrapped up in your thread and in your head and other people like myself think there may be more to it - it is supposed to be a discussion after all where others posthulate their own theories or bring up ideas that may relate to your own But you are entitled to discount the same story told by different cultures around the world if you want to

reply to post by cosmicpixie

But you are entitled to discount the same story told by different cultures around the world if you want to

I think where we might be getting hung up can be described easily. Let's say there were a race of beings that came and visited the earth long ago and imparted knowledge or simply wanted to take over. There is evidence, as you say, from countless ancient civilizations of this event.

It didn't stop Rome from conquering and consolidating and expanding. They went about their business and were successful in their endeavors. No reptilians stopped them. Today we can see the system in place that they wanted to set up.

Now we can speculate and say that Rome took the secrets and used them for their conquest and that is why they were so successful. Or we can say that the Roman Empire was actually those beings and they drove us all the way to the present. Either way we still have a very real system in place that degrades and dehumanizes and drives us back to itself at every turn.

Whether it is an other worldly force or simply brilliant human calculations, we are still in the same boat. Considering it to be other worldly will not bring about a solution as we have no idea how to combat it. Considering it be an evil human plan can be dealt with.

So after going through that we have to come to a conclusion as to whether it is indeed human or alien. Unless someone can figure out what it is that counter acts reptilian or alien powers, we have to stay on the human side. At least in my opinion.

reply to post by harryhaller


Yeah, but J Edgar Hoover and Johnson are established as having bigger roles.

Why Dallas? And was GH Bush involved?

As far as your whole claim on NASA, maybe you should take it up on another thread.

Why was Kennedy killed? That is still a big question, and I am surprised there are not more threads on the subject. We definitely know he was killed in Dallas,

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Do you also think that the Romans wrote the Gathas of Zarathrustra as well?

While Jews chose not to recognize the connection between the two religions, it is obvious, and the existence of the Mithra cult, and the similarities between Christ and Mithra are considerable.

Apollo is a Greek god, and Greek culture is celebrated because of the huge amount of contribution to science that they made.

For that matter, we celebrate Roman culture for their great accomplishments as well.

Accomplishments that were mainly tied to the Republican style of government that made them great in the first place.

reply to post by harryhaller

Curious that immediately after his death, the Apollo missions were started. Citing him directly as the inspiration. He was skeptical of manned lunar missions, and correctly failed to see any benefit to the USA at that time. Sputnik was a gimmick, and the space race was a series of press releases that belied the facts behind each nation's true resources.

I went back and read this reply after seeing Poet's post. I immediately considered that JFK was some kind of ritualistic sacrifice to the Apollo Roman deity or something. It's worth keeping in the back of my mind for now.

reply to post by jackflap


This is very appropriate...
I googled the words...

What did the Greeks sacrifice to Apollo?
And this is the first "answer" that I ran across. You have to look for the answer in between the ads, because it is quite cogent.

reply to post by cosmicpixie


Once again, a small group of likeminded people trying to establish an alternative fear based reality are missing the point of the thread.

The point of the thread is we are being ruled through a fear based reality, based mostly on fantasy and fiction, by utilizing stories of unseen forces that can not be proven.

In other word’s God will not be appearing on the six o’clock news and neither will any Reptilian overlords.

So yes, substituting one fear based reality, for another fear based reality, is simply a person wanting to be ruled through their own fears, which are always imagined.

They cease being imagined when they are proved with hard evidence.

There is hard evidence Rome is manipulating a fear based religion as one part of how it governs the world.

Undo simply wants to add more fear based elements to it, that can’t be proven.

They couldn’t be proven 40 pages ago, they can’t be proven now.

So like Rome she is attempting to use peer pressure, where other people who have adopted this alternative fear based reality based on shared acceptance of fantasy that has no evidence to substantiate it, want to try to use peer pressure to validate it, to validate their alternative fear based reality.

The thread is about empowering us all by realizing if we don’t establish real evidentiary standards for the things that people are trying to make us fear, that we are going to be manipulated through acceptance of those things on faith, meant to govern us with fear.

It really is simple, and the thread is about proving how Rome has created a fear based system based on a fantasy it concocted and wove into law.

Why anyone would want to add more fantasy based elements based on imagination and wild interpretation, with out one shred of real evidence is not only questionable but self defeating.

No one is being censored, these notions that lack any evidence, that meet real court of law standards, are being rejected by a much larger group of peers.

So what we simply have, is a poster who created their own alternative fear based reality, fearing that others won’t fear it as she does, using her small peer network that helps her validate it and believe it, try to influence a much larger peer network that rejects it, and sees it for what it is, nothing factually established.

You won’t meet the factual evidentiary requirements through peer pressure, when that group of peers is that small and lacks evidence that meets practical standards.

This is why it’s all off topic, and she is being placed on ignore by people, because she is basically just doing what Rome does, in pushing non-substantiated fears, through peer pressure manipulation.

It’s sad she can’t respect that, hopefully she is not like the one ATS member who wanted to kill himself and his wife and children because he could “hear” Nibirru coming and didn’t want him and them to be eaten by reptilians.

Rome and the Laws, Banking System, Militaries, Treaties and Bullas that govern it all, are real and in black and white for people to read.

Once again, I would appreciate people stay on topic, and realize the Reptilian theory was rejected by the OP and the vast majority of the people involved in this thread, which is why she has tried to create a platform through her small peer network to highjack the thread.

People deny ignorance, stop propagating it, your arguments become effective, when you have an effective argument, and when people see they aren’t credible and reject them, learn to respect that.

The thread isn’t about can we invent something to fear even more than Rome has invented for us, the thread is about when are we going to stop allowing others to rule us through fear.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


An "alternative fear based reality" seems to be your purpose in writing this thread.

I have no fear of the Catholic Church. The religious fanatics of the radical right serve as more of a threat to my liberty than the Catholic Church, which is pretty much toothless these days as far as I am concerned.

I don't know why you choose to vilify the U.S. federal government, when over all throughout our nations history we have been an agent for good.

Our real threat is those that want to convert our republic into an empire, and most of those people hail from the region of our nation that you claim to be the only people protecting us from the the evil Roman Catholic Church. The very region of our nation which works hardest to eliminate our liberties.

Sadly, you have everything backwards, and putting me on ignore does you no good, by the way.

I don't think this is actually off topic - - - more like a tiny side note in the larger picture. But feel free to classify it off topic.

Have you heard of he Golden Circle and the involvement of the James brothers?

Its a fascinating little bit of history I find interesting. People are not always what they seem.

Well I'm not part of any little clique, I just happen to think there is more to it after 18 years of my own study and that this other piece of the jigsaw which you discount as mere fantasy to be part of a bigger picture. I've read Undo's threads and Skyfloating's amazing research amongst others here on ATS and their conclusions just happen to dovetail with some of my own after my own independent study over the years.

But as someone else said, even if there was some older inspiration for Rome's mission and even if aliens were involved the fact is that it is this mission and what it means for the world that is the main point for contemplation.

Still, you really ought to reign in your impulse to insult people's views that don't mesh with your own - there is a MASSIVE body of very scholarly research into what Ancient texts have all talked about and you just sit there declaring it all a load of twaddle !

And for the second time I did not mention Reptilians !!!!

[edit on 1/5/10 by cosmicpixie]

Poet1b: you said the magic word. Literally.

Sacrifice. By whom? To what? Why?

Gods have always demanded sacrifice, an in this story we have many gods. We have serpents too ... in this story though the serpent is defeated.

What is the difference between a killing of convenience, and a sacrifice? Both include personal gain ... (?) Ships demand sacrifice too. The champagne used to be a young boy, unless workers had died in construction. Since maritime law is part of this topic, i think its relevant.

If JFK had been killed, by a hired assasin at a place of his choosing, would it be the same as if part of a "masonic" rite? (i use the word masonic carefully, but these boys [the hidden rulers] DO belief in hocus pocus and more importantly, ritual)?

Total aside to PT: your thread is missing IMHO a most important aspect:
The power behind Rome. I'm cooking up some ideas, watch this space ;-) but they only seem to have a certain deck of cards so to speak. They do not share our rules, but do have their own. I mentioned pearl harbour earlier, same MO being used decades later with Iran. We know that JFK & Di were "sacrifices" because both died violently at "masonic" sites. Now the ritual is the thing. The ritual makes it stronger.

Thoughts?

www.templeapollo.com...

It was said that he was born on the seventh day on the seventh month, hence the number seven and the day is sacred to Him.

He is a god of sunlight,

Sunday anyone? Proof IMHO that Rome is Apollo orientated!

reply to post by cosmicpixie


It's not an impulse, it's called doing more extensive research, that did not draw the same conclusion. I have repeadetly stated, I have researched those things, and found them irrelevant.

No one has provided anything that makes them relevant.

The fact that people don't even want to argue this on her own thread she created to argue this speaks volumes.

It's trying to highjack a thread by addressing one narrow window of a huge picture, that the huge picture is not contingent upon again and again and again, to derail a thread, to make it about a discussion of another fear based alternative reality.

You posted on Undos thread at 4:48 AM this morning your time, and followed Undo's stargate to this thread at 7:00 AM where you have focused on Undo's theories, and that narrow aspect of the thread.

And Undo is one of your friends, I am also one of your friends, but it's a chicken and egg thing, so yes, undo is trying to drum up support to derail the thread along her line of contention, by creating another borrowing off the name of this thread and playing off of it, having made an Original Opening Post aimed solely at trying to add another dimension to my theory, by naming this theory and thread and me, and linking to it, and mistrepresenting all three in the process.

I investigate conspiracies, and that of course is a conspiracy, and if someone can't piece a conspiracy together that simple? Well, they might want to avoid the bigger ones!

Just saying, I really would appreciate the attempts to derail the thread to cease.

I respect you and we have always been friends, but there is no denying Undo wants to derail this thread and use it as a platform to promote her reptilian conspiracies instead.

Originally posted by harryhaller
www.templeapollo.com...

It was said that he was born on the seventh day on the seventh month, hence the number seven and the day is sacred to Him.

He is a god of sunlight,

Sunday anyone? Proof IMHO that Rome is Apollo orientated!

And the Lord said, let there be light!

Great work Harry!

When you investigate the Trojan aspect, Aeneas being the Trojan that founded Rome, and start looking at the fact it dates in reality to the same time period and possibly before Egypt and Ur, and the Gods of Troy, you start seeing a lot of connections that begin to really establish the Mystery Religion of Rome.

reply to post by Josephus23

Who is responsible for our system of contract law in the United States.... Rome.

I was going through a lot of information after your post about the sacrifices to Apollo. I came across the fact that the Romans believed that their laws were handed down from their Gods and that they were in fact divine. It is scary because our law is Roman in origin isn't it? We may have come across a really cool connection right there.

reply to post by jackflap


Yes in fact the connection that I laid out in the very first part of my opening post.

Once investigated by open minded people, honestly, it sheds a whole new light, and dimension, and actually is the missing piece of the puzzle.

Keep in mind the whole system is based on the Divine Right of Kings.

Kings have always tried to establish their divine right to rule.

Kings have always decided what history is going to be taught and handed down and depicted.

So Kings having works to commemorate them linking to Divine and cellestial things not of this world, does not in fact mean, that they were linked to Divine and Celestial things, just that their power over their people was dependent on convincing those they ruled over, that they were divine of divine origins.

So in esence when you take something like the Key Of Solomon, that is the family crest pointing to different stars, that does not prove space travel, or alien influence, but simply that they were aware of where they were in relation to other stars.

That they commissioned artists to depict them as being divine and celestial for the sake of establishing their power, does not in fact mean that they were divine or of celestial origins.

Just that they wanted to manipulate that appearance to use fear to rule over the masses.

I can lay a strong case, that is exactly what Rome has done, with it's own legends of Romulus and Remus being born of immaculate conception, by the God of War Mars, and a virgin mother, who then were nursed by a wolf, one of the three sacred animals to Apollo and then raised by a Shepard, with Apollo being the carer of Flocks and Herds!

This really is the mystery religion, and all the other symbols from other peoples and regions Rome conquered was just about working that imagery into their own, for their own glory and posterity.

The evidence of all this is very compelling, when you stop trying to make the square peg fit in the round hole, and start realizing there is a round peg out there that does fit into it, it's called Troy, and their chief patron God Apollo.



[edit on 1/5/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]