Arizona Governor Signs Controversial Immigration Enforcement Bill

Arizona sued the feds for the cost of maintaining illegals in their prisons. The feds kicked it out and said it was Arizona's problem. Now, Arizona is trying to do something about its problem. kudos to them

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


"I'm not advocating rounding up people based on profiling. You get that, right?"
I do, BH.

Being from CA, I USED to see fields and houses raided by the old INS because chances were that there would be illegal workers there, Haven't seen that in years, however, not since mid-1980's, about the time the American worker started to be hung out to dry.

And back then, people on expired visas were actually dealt with.

And back then, there were still "American" corporations. But, hey, as the economy went global, with corporations having gone multi-national, a porous border helped bring down/keep a lid on American wages, so corporations could reap even greater profits.

A porous border also helped transfer peoples out of countries in which the American military was waging war.

And as Asian/Middle Eastern countries grew in wealth, or as in the case of Hong Kong a need to get wealth out before the Commies took over, America became up for sale.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that it took years to get to this point, so there is no quick fix. I just don't see the Arizona bill as providing a solution to the mess we're in. Very few politicians have the cojones to do what needs to be done to drag this country into a 21st century economy and culture, rather than regress.

Arizona LEOs should not be turned into La Migra. If the task is too much for Federal forces, how can it be possible for state forces?

Maybe I'm too pessimistic/cynical, but I can see the law applied as I said in my previous post or where the "help" of citizens would be deemed necessary, with scare tactics of jail for "misprision of felony" brought against anyone who is aware of an illegal alien, even if that illegal alien is grandma from Ireland.

On a lighter side, I can remember two times when I was personally involved in profiling in the War on Drugs years ago. If it weren't for two sleepy kids popping their heads through the curtain of our camper shell at 1 am, at border crossings, I don't think we would have been waved off with a smile and "Have a nice trip!"

Originally posted by desert
Very few politicians have the cojones to do what needs to be done to drag this country into a 21st century economy and culture, rather than regress.

Interesting.

What are you saying needs to be done?

Are you for open borders and globalization?

reply to post by Jessicamsa


Hi, Jessicamsa. No, porous borders are not good. Instead of sending our money and human resources to nation build in other countries, we should have been increasing our border security decades ago, to match the effects of NAFTA..

Instead, we allowed more people to enter and jobs go out, not enforcing employer sanctions on hiring illegal aliens, just dealing with it by winking at business.

Of course, the average citizen who has ever employed an illegal alien to help build a fence or roof is just as guilty.

Also, there is no need now to automatically grant citizenship to babies born here. But that would be "unconstitutional" (that needs to change IMO).

To help with jobs, we need a major program NOW nationwide to rethink and redo our energy sources and consumption. Our military realizes it, but we cannot wait for military spinoffs, and we must broaden our greening up beyond the military directly into civilian greening up.

Globalization is a given now, and we have to adjust with new ideas (like above jobs for one).

I have to end here for now, but I found myself agreeing with ideas of Thomas Friedman.

As a follow up to my prior post, to try to be more thorough and clear, I offer this: what needs to be done now is offer a way to become legal aliens for those here illegally already. I am not saying it needs to be citizenship necessarily, although that would be the ideal. This is where I meant that politicians needed to have the cojones. They need to stop pandering to those who want to merely deport everyone here illegally!

One, mass deportation is impossible. 12,000,000! Forget it. The horse has been out of the barn too long. Two, there are now too many families whose parents are illegal but have at least one child a US citizen. Because this nation never adjusted their border security/immigration services proportionally to what was happening outside the border, this mess was created. You cannot in good conscious break up families over the fact that parents are illegal aliens.

I grew up in a time when friends and family were "allowed" into this country after "doing the paperwork". What has transpired over the course of almost three decades, allowing (without paperwork), even encouraging, turning a blind eye to who enters our country has only profited corporations and politicians who profit from them, and ANYONE ELSE, who thought cheap labor is a good idea. Cheap labor only cheapened the economy, for some--the American worker, with disasterous results we see today!

I will not get into the massive drug trade which started with increased American involvement in Central America and Colombia in the 1980's!!

Please go to here, Failure Is Not an Option, and read the recent article by Thomas Friedman. While I have not always agreed with Mr. Friedman on EVERYTHING (who does...hey, it's America! Land of the free to think and disagree, and home of the brave enough to do it), I do agree with his views and research on globalization and energy usage and what it means for Americans.

China is having a good week in America. Yes it is. I’d even suggest that there is some high-fiving going on in Beijing. I mean, wouldn’t you if you saw America’s Democratic and Republican leaders conspiring to ensure that America cedes the next great global industry — E.T., energy technology — to China?

We can choose now to be scared of illegal aliens and of other countries who are ahead in green energy, and act irrationally, or we can accomplish great things by acting rationally and wisely. It's easy to pander to corportions in Washington who really threaten our security (both economic and technological, which helps us to avoid war/conflicts over resources).

[edit on 28-4-2010 by desert]

Originally posted by Jessicamsa
Are you for open borders and globalization?

Oh, regarding globalization. Here is another article, which points out the reality of world trade these days.

China, India etal are gigantic markets for corporations. Even an American corporation needs to produce there to sell there, much as Toyota, for ex, built in Tennessee, a state with lower wages than Detroit BTW, to sell here.

But...sadly...America has abused science so much the last 30 years, and encouraged students to major in areas other than science (business, law, or other areas where the money is, or graduating ministers instead) that they are reaping the results.

When Xie Lina, a 26-year-old Applied Materials engineer here [China], was asked recently whether China would play a big role in clean energy in the future, she was surprised by the question.

“Most of the graduate students in China are chasing this area,” she said. “Of course, China will lead everything.”

When Ronald Reagan removed the solar panels from the White House, it set our nation back on the course of being dependent on others for our energy. Again, we have reaped what we have sown.

All the dead bodies of our soldiers sown into the ground, from wars as a result of our energy dependence, cannot help us reap what we now need, to become an energy technolological powerhouse for the world, let alone ourselves.

What do Americans have the desire for? Moving ahead in the world or staying behind to fight each other?

We can have the best border security and enforce immigration policy, but unless we have a vision for this country that stretches beyond our borders and fully and fairly includes us in the global economy, we will become a backward nation where no one wants to go, and more sadly, from where citizens want to leave.