Australian archaeologists uncover 40,000-year-old site

Originally posted by constantwonder
So after doing some more looking around i have found that there seems to not only be an active archaeological conspiracy in Egypt, Peru, and Mexico, we can now add New zealand, Australia, and Tasmania.

I know that this is not new news but when you look at the dates of several disputed sites you find a pattern of dates coinciding with what may or may not be cover ups.

LOL constantwander don't tell me you are falling for the archeological cover up nonsense? Not you too!!!!

Archaeologists have said that Indigenous people have been here for up to 60 000 years, no cover up!!! Quite the opposite.
This is great news, I will read up on it more, so thankyou for posting it, but this is not astounding new information from the archaeological record regarding how long they have been here, just supportive evidence backing this incredibly rich cultures' long long long stay here.

[edit on 11-3-2010 by zazzafrazz]

LOL Zazz. Yeah me too I guess. I'm not saying it's a cover up in the sense that their trying to make it look non exsistant. I think the cover up comes into play with things like anomalous artifacts in strata predating modern man.

I also think that some dates have been thrown out to fit modern theory.

Case in point Virginia McIntyre and Hueyatlaco Mexico

They dug four strata to excavate the artifacts. Virginia Steen-McIntyre later wrote and published a paper concerning the dating of the artifacts found. It reported four sophisticated, independent tests: uranium-thorium dating, fission track dating, tephra hydration dating and the studying of mineral weathering to determine the date of the artifacts. Their 1981 paper (Quaternary Research (1981) v. 16, pp. 1-17) suggested that these tests, among others, validated a date of 250kya for the Hueyatlaco artifacts. Later analyses conducted by biostratigraphic researcher, Sam VanLandingham, were concordant with the radiometric analyses conducted earlier.

The professional report, categorizing the findings at Hueyatlaco, was delayed for years. When it was finally published in 1981 it met widespread criticism. Steen-McIntyre argues that her findings were rejected not on their failings or merits, but because her critics engaged in circular reasoning

This woman was a credible geologist who's career was destroyed over her findings at Hueyatlaco. The U.S. Geological Survey confirmed her dating.

According to U.S. Geological Survey researchers, the beds from where these artifacts were recovered all underlay the Hueyatlaco Ash. The Hueyatlaco Ash was dated by: the U.S.G.S. to ca. 250kya via the fission track method; Ray Donelick (University of Idaho at the time) to ca. 250kya via the fission track method; Ken Farley (Caltech) to ca. 430kya via (U-Th)/He and Sam VanLandingham to ca. 80kya-430kya via biostratigraphy.

www.archaeologyfieldwork.com...

Some of it just doesn't add up Zazz. However if you have counter evidence please lay it on me. I would be more than glad to go over whatever you can find I'm not so close minded that I think i can't be wrong

Originally posted by SaturnFX
oh boy, the jesus freaks aren't going to like this news... how can you have a 40k year old site in a 6k year old universe

Saturn, is that the best you can do? You know very well that the "Jesus Freaks" (aka Christians) do not believe the world is only 6000 years old. That calculation was done by some guy many centuries ago, and a few people have glommed onto it, but they're in a weird little minority. No Christian I know seriously thinks the world is only 6000 years old. That's absurd.

Then, again, there's a lot to be said about the way we date sedimentary layers, right, because we're making extraordinary discoveries every day that seem to be pushing the origin of Man not only farther back in time, but farther away from Africa!

Within just the last 2 years, we've seen discoveries in China that place the so-called Cro Magnon Man in eastern Asia some 750,000 years ago.

Ooops.

How is that possible, unless this iteration of mankind that we call Cro Magnon (as from France of about 40,000 years ago) actually originated in the far east about three-quarters of a million years earlier?

It takes a great big DUMP on the "out of Africa" theory.

Now, as we move our investigations farther East and into Southeast Asia, we start finding underwater structures off the coast of Japan that may date back tens of thousands of years.

Then we move down through Indonesia to Australia, where we find this ancient vault of human habitation where it shouldn't be (according to our modern theories of mankind's origins and migrations).

I mean, tell sweet sister Matilda that, by crikey, Mankind may very well have come out of Australia! And why not?

It actually makes more sense.

Look at the various indigenous species of Australia... They are freaky, from a naturalist's point of view, like a population isolated and left to its own devices of evolution for millions of years. Okay? Are you with me, mate? Australia is like a whole continent of Island Evolution, separated from the rest of the world by continuous tectonic upheavals.

So there's a concentration of species, there's inbreeding, evolution takes a queer turn on itself on a massive scale, and very peculiar animals are the result, right? ("peculiar" relative to the rest of the species on the planet)

What is Humankind if not a VERY PECULIAR animal? We're freaky, from the naturalist perspective. Totally freaky. The MOST FREAKY animal EVER.

That's Human beings. We're the freaks that somehow exploded out upon the earth from a remote and isolated breeding ground. Which might have been in Australia, eh?

Plus, ROD TAYLOR lives there!

— Doc Velocity





[edit on 3/11/2010 by Doc Velocity]

Reply to post by SaturnFX

Hmmm, I guess I could ask you to clarify on what you mean by Jesus freaks. But I`m still just gonna let you know that not everyone who accepts Jesus as their savior believes in the 7 day creation or the 6,000 yr old universe. Yes, I will admit Christianity has had a lot of people giving it a bad name. I almost feel like I should call myself something else just so I won`t be grouped together with the, I`ll call them "literals" because they take everything in the Bible literally. when actually back then, poetry was more common than prose. but i must remember that they are the... the... interlopers, the imposters! i am also aware that the Bible was written by Humans and the books to be included in the Bible were choosen, you guessed it, by all humans. and i know that humans are capable of mistakes. yes, i know, sacreligous right? Or maybe there are a small percentage of us who can reason and use logic. Just like the Bible says, in the endtimes there will only be a small ratio of believers who actually "get it" and are practising their religion the way their supposed to. I dont go to church, not in a traditional way. we hold church whenever we feel the need and we have no pastor whos pockets we must line. So imagine that if most of the believers are doing it all wrong? that would be just about any believer you would ever run into on the internet. im not saying im special, far from it. i just know for a fact that people like me are few and far between.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

What makes the aboriginal 'dreamtime' stories any more real than Christianity? Doesn't seem logical to believe in one myth and not the other. Unless you are guided by faith.

Reply to post by EvolvedMinistry

Actually he is not a mere "anomoly". He is most likely a "true christian" like I consider myself. I believe there are a lot more like myself, but we would still admitedly a small % of those claiming to be Christians. read my other post. you`re not to be blamed making a judgement based on what your experience has been. what other choice would you have? good luck in your journey.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Reply to post by B.Morrison

I too apologize for any part my ancestors may have had in the..gulp rape, terrorism, murder, and general brutality towards any helpless innocent people. Am I the only one who ever feels guilty walking around on OPP (other peoples property)? well actually they didnt even see it as THEIRS. thats the crazy part... well all the natives i know are gettin rich from their new casinos. oh well i say payback time. cuz those places are packed with caucasian senior citizens.! every tribe member gets a fat check every so often. pretty cool.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by TheComte
What makes the aboriginal 'dreamtime' stories any more real than Christianity? Doesn't seem logical to believe in one myth and not the other. Unless you are guided by faith.

The Hindus observe: A path and a gate have no meaning once the destination is in sight.

This is an allusion to the fact that our various rituals and traditions and religions only exist to guide us us to the objective... Which I believe is the acquisition of FAITH.

I know some will say, NO! The Goal is SALVATION!

But I don't buy it. The goal of religion is "To Worship God" — everything the Church does, it does in order to magnify the name of God, That's the stated mission of the Church. Cheerleaders and Pep Squads for God, right.

Your salvation has already happened, if you have FAITH in what Christ said and did in His Life... and in His Death.


You have Faith in that, you're unstoppable.

—Doc Velocity



[edit on 3/11/2010 by Doc Velocity]

40,000 or 300,000, maybe Millions. Regardless, we find ourselves here an now. Most likely repeating history for the umpteenth time. Can you imagine how many civilizations could have accomplished the same things and disappeared in these time periods. How rapid does technology grow? Exponentially each year. Say modern man intellect over a small period, 20,000 years. What would be left of that civilization? How far would you need to dig, what would be left, why did so many die off? So many questions we can try to answer with guesses. Do we really know, no? All we have are stories passed down into different religious books and other literature. We need to piece the puzzle together. Gather the information that we have through text, archeoligical finds, and modern day behavior and even at that point Hypothesize over the way things MAY have been. The most important thing to realize is that we know very little. We are all just flashes in a pan.

Originally posted by infinite8
Can you imagine how many civilizations could have accomplished the same things and disappeared in these time periods.

Oh, man... The untold stories... The epic civilizations (to the moon, even). As a modern civilization, I think we have a problem of perspective. There have been many, many ages of Man all around this steamy old globe, and we're just the most recent residents. Our Anthropologically-inclined friends out there want you to think in terms of Mankind climbing up out of Africa and marching across Europe and Asia and down into Australia, and doing so pretty swiftly.

But MAYBE We Humans Came FROM Australia.

— Doc Velocity





[edit on 3/11/2010 by Doc Velocity]

Originally posted by SaturnFX
oh boy, the jesus freaks aren't going to like this news...

how can you have a 40k year old site in a 6k year old universe

Paton said luminescence readings -- measuring the age of the artefacts based on how much exposure they had received to sunlight

Really? Lots of assumptions using that method. First of all, without an actual control sample (that is, a known 40K year old object) you have no clue as to what measurements of the radioactive elements within the sample and its surroundings should be, much less if the radiatin dose rate from cosmic rays has been constant????

Again it baffles me how this site is dedicated to conspiracies, and yet the biggest one of all (earth is billions of years based on radiometric dating), is swallowed whole by most of you without question. Ignore the young dates and embrace the outliers. I guess this sort of practice is considered science now? We simply manipulate data to support our worldview, and not to actually gain understanding. Can you hear that? It's the sound of Newton, Boyle, and Kepler spinning in their graves...



[edit on 11-3-2010 by kingofmd]

reply to post by constantwonder


"It is amazing that everytime we think we have something figured out we find something like this."

That's because you buy the media bull# translating the scientific method's strict point of view of "we found something that may lead us to think that..." into "we know that..."
also, whenever you're told "this or that first appeared at this date" it merely means "we officially claim we have found evidence that seems to date back to this date".

Basic epistemology would solve these confusions. (Epistemology : the philosophy of science, the criteriae by which one comes to scientific "knowledge" and their change through time)

whenever i hear "writing was invented 6 thousand years ago" i scoff mentaly and reply "yeah, you think so... until you'll tell us you've found new older stuff, you tardface."

scientists are already irrational
journalists reporting scientific results are plain retarded

notice i have a hard time qualifying the production of scientific enquiry
it isnt really knowledge
the scientific method cannot produce any knowledge about what is and what isnt.

Originally posted by zazzafrazz

Originally posted by constantwonder
So after doing some more looking around i have found that there seems to not only be an active archaeological conspiracy in Egypt, Peru, and Mexico, we can now add New zealand, Australia, and Tasmania.

I know that this is not new news but when you look at the dates of several disputed sites you find a pattern of dates coinciding with what may or may not be cover ups.

LOL constantwander don't tell me you are falling for the archeological cover up nonsense? Not you too!!!!

Archaeologists have said that Indigenous people have been here for up to 60 000 years, no cover up!!! Quite the opposite.
This is great news, I will read up on it more, so thankyou for posting it, but this is not astounding new information from the archaeological record regarding how long they have been here, just supportive evidence backing this incredibly rich cultures' long long long stay here.

[edit on 11-3-2010 by zazzafrazz]

Actually here in Tasmania the cover up is far more localised and personal.

by that i mean i know people here who have told me of places where there is magnificent evidence of the original people, but you know what, they won't tell anybody because they don't want the Aboriginal Tasmanians laying claim to the land where these artifacts and/or carvings etc are.

that's right!

The Aboriginal Tasmanians that are still here. Many Aboriginal woman were stolen by the first white settlers here, taken to the islands to hunt seals off our North Coast and their offspring survive to this day. They have lost much, including most of their language and culture, but still have some and still keep the connection alive.

Some Tasmanians are scared that they will lay claim to areas that contain their heritage. Sad but true.

and so the little cover ups continue to occur throughout the island...

Originally posted by B.Morrison
my apology is for them, the descendants, who need the event to be acknowledged and apologised for in order for THEM to move on....

What on earth are you on about? There has been an official Apology, and nothing changed. Remember, Sorry day? You know they want to lift the status of that day to a public holiday akin to Anzac day.

So, what changed... Has the poverty in outback towns eased? Are they keeping their kids in school? Are they any better off now? Sadly, there was no epiphany to be had. Things have carried on just as they had before.

I'm just glad I know real Aborigines and not the ones who feel as if they deserve something in order to be able to 'move on'.

some of my fortunate existence is due directly to their ancestors slaughter, simply due to my race....I believe that gives me the right to apologise for it..... as some of their misfortune is directly linked to the same things....

anything that can help to bring peace & unity is worth doing in my eyes...
and with this one...at the end of the day..it is not about me.

-B.M

[edit on 11/3/10 by B.Morrison]

What peace? What unity? Are we all living in harmony now???

Originally posted by Ha`la`tha
I'm just glad I know real Aborigines and not the ones who feel as if they deserve something in order to be able to 'move on'.

maybe its harder for some of them, the ones you don't know personally...how could you possibly know?

What peace? What unity? Are we all living in harmony now???

i had thought it was possible that an australian aboriginal ats member may read my post and appreciate it and in turn it would add to the list of positive experiences he/she has had with the white australian people. which seemed pretty peaceful etc to me...

-B.M

Interesting article with more to come hopefully.

Just want to share some info with you all.....

A few years back I lived in Gympie, Qld and was honoured to meet a man by the name of Brett Green who's Grandfather and Great-Grandfather spent much time with the native peoples of the area. The oldest began keeping records of all that the Kubbi Kubbi tribe showed him, including the ancient stone ruins of a culture that the native people claimed existed BEFORE they arrived on this continent by boat as slaves to a white race of people!!

I've been allowed to see for myself the artifacts Brett has in his keeping from what we can call a Sacred Tor, much like the one in Glastonbury, England and which included a large circle of standing stones reached by a winding trail that began with an entrance of two upright stones with intricate carvings on them.

I also had the pleasure of interviewing an old man who was paid to dynomite and bulldoze the entrance on the side of this ritual mound back in the 30's. He showed me the photo he took before beginning his paid work. It shows what can only be described as a Temple entrance, complete with carved uprights and entrance platform of stone.

Brett has been able to place all the information and facsimilies of the orignial drawings of the ancient ruins in his book called "The Gympie Pyramid Story", although not without some massive opposition from the earliest churches in the area that were responsible for the demolition of much of those ruins, as well as having his house burned to the ground by men in black suits who arrived in large black sedans.. so the eye-witness reports stated.

Furthermore, I remember watching a Doco some time ago about the earliest people on this country. It showed how back in the late 1800's and early 1900's we believed that Native Australians had been here for 40,000 years.

New research then showed how this occupation had been for over 120,000 years and that the "aboriginal" people where only 1 of about 5 different races who lived here over that time. So native australians were the only survivors from those 5 races, which also included a race of 3 feet tall white skinned people near a lake in the north of South Australia.

With the artifacts Brett has.. one is a tall (about 3feet or so), carved "statue" of two intertwined snakes. One has uncut Garnet eyes while the other has moonstone for eyes. This artifact came down through his forebears and is known to be the Healing Post used by the tribe in their Ritual Healing within a very large series of concentric circles that exist near Kilkivan.. about 50 or 60 miles west of Gympie.

Of interest, is the other portion of this amazing "statue" a finely wrought Gold Disc that sat between the heads of the two snakes. This is inscribed with the same symbols as were on the two entrance stelae (sp) from the Ritual Mound.

Link to page showing original drawings of the ruins Here

Brett has links to his updated CD e-book here as well. But you can also find links to muchg of the story of the Tribe including photos, etc.

Enjoy

reply to post by B.Morrison


I think one could argue the point, that is just evolution. That is how things work. The strong survive. But I see your point.

Originally posted by Ouroborus2012
Excellent... But, rest assured that the mainstream scientific community will flash their PhD's and find a way to discredit those who dated the find and will give it a new time that better fits with the modern science version of human evolution.

This post, and the subsequent one about the fraud Cremo, are pure hogwash.

The dates given to this site (given, by the way, by scientists) fit almost perfectly with what was already known and/or theorized about the Aboriginal population.

Please make a slight attempt to educate yourselves on a subject before you embarrass yourself any further.

Harte

Has anyone here read the book, The Thiaoouba Prophecy by Michel Desmarquet ?

A really interesting book, and in summary it states that due detrimental climatic changes on their planet as a result of nuclear war.
The original Asian and Black people survivors of the war came to settle on Earth and Mars because their planet was cooling.

Upon reaching Mars, they discovered that it too was already cooling and then came to Earth.

They originally settled in modern day new guinea, I believe, Of which the Aboriginal people are descended.

here is an excerpt from the book:

‘Thus, the two spacecraft headed for Earth. The first landing took place where Australia is now found. At that time, it should be explained that Australia, New Guinea, Indonesia and Malaysia were all part of the one continent. A strait existed, about 300 kilometres wide, exactly where Thailand is now found. ‘In those times, Australia possessed a great inland sea fed by several large rivers, so that diverse and interesting flora and fauna flourished there. All things considered, the astronauts chose this country as their first immigration base. ‘I must say, to be more precise, that the black race chose Australia and the yellow people established themselves where Burma is now - here too, was a land rich in wildlife. Bases were quickly set up on the coast, on the Bay of Bengal, while the black people constructed their first base on the shores of the Inland Sea in Australia. Later, further bases were established where New Guinea is presently located.

Very interesting book again I might add , READ and expand your mind.

Originally posted by constantwonder
This woman was a credible geologist who's career was destroyed over her findings at Hueyatlaco. The U.S. Geological Survey confirmed her dating.

Sorry, but you are wrong on both counts.

Steen-McIntyre did not make this discovery. Her contribution was minimal.

Your own source can tell you who discovered this and also the fact that they made the decision themselves to publish it.

And the USGS never "confirmed" these dates.

See, as was said, dating can be skewed by various things. These artifacts were identical to other artifacts found elswhere that dated to no more than 1,000 YBP. So, you are arguing that these natives made no improvement on their stone technology despite using it for 249,000 years?

Please think before you post.

Oh. And Steen-McIntyre's career was not "ruined."

She was not even the one that published the dates - that was Cynthia Irwin-Williams. Dr. Williams continued to be well-respected in her field (archaeology-a field that holds the actual qualifications for such dating methods) long afterwards.

Just because people don't agree, that does not "ruin their careers."

But Steen-McIntyre is still working - in fact she was one of the presenters at a recent (2008 ) meeting of the Geological Society of America.
Here's the pdf of her presentation.

Still talking about Valsequillo, as you can see.

You can hardly call this a "supressed find" if geologists are still listening to her presentations on it.

And the USGS was never asked to date the artifacts. Just the geology of the site. The artifacts, found supposedly under the ash that the USGS actually dated, could easily have been buried there much much later, either purposefully or even, yes, naturally through erosion.

This is from a refutation of the Fraud Cremo's "Mysterious Origins of Man" television crockumentary:

According to the program, Dr. McIntyre was blacklisted because she dated some stone tools found in Hueyatlaco, Mexico at 250,000 years old, indicating that humans were living in the Americas far earlier than the time accepted by the scientific "establishment." In actual fact, Dr. McIntyre did continue to work in her chosen field, but not achieve a high degree of success and recognition. Subsequent to her involvement in the Hueyatlaco project in 1973, she published technical papers in 1975, 1977, and 1981.

The program stated only that the stone tools were "uncovered," and that a team of experts from the U. S. Geological Survey was called in to date "them," meaning the stone tools. The program implied that it was Dr. McIntyre's project. This was not the case. In fact, at that time she was a graduate student working on a temporary basis under Harold Malde, the head of the USGS team which was called in to date the site, not the artifacts.

The archaeologist in charge of the project was Dr. Cynthia Irwin-Williams. It was she who directed the project and published the results and conclusions of the investigation. The 250,000 year date for the age of the artifacts was included in her published data. Although her colleagues disagreed with her on the age of the artifacts, they never persecuted her; they merely claimed that there were errors in her dating procedures. She continued as a respected and influential member of the American Anthropological Association and the Society for American Archaeology. The 250,000 year date definitely did not ruin her career.

There's more at that source, if anyone here is truly interested in the facts, and not a lot of blather and innuendo manufactured by fringe con men.

Harte



[edit on 3/11/2010 by Harte]