Important Issue Here, and it Involves All of US...MIND POWER.

reply to post by Xtrozero


I am psi, and have had experiences all my life over and over again, and really like living secluded. No theres no circular logic. Ingo Swann was someone who worked in studies. The major departments of Universisties, black op and militia studies as well, and many scientific people, are not using circular logic. This has been studied intently. The outcomes whether Ingo talks about them, or one looks through the imperical evidence all explains my own experiences, and many others, with straight forward common sense and logic.

Though I have to add, I write and process everything with a very right brained influence, so I'm very grateful for the level of left brained scientific imperial evidences because my primary push is to get people to start journals and prove it for themselves with practice.


[edit on 22-2-2010 by Unity_99]

I might know a little something why we are not able to bend spoons or even make things move with our mind any more. There are probably one or two humans left that can do this, and that's if they are even still alive. The main reason we can not do this any more and are only limited to what we can do, is because each and every one of us now has a damaged DNA. Which goes all the way back to Jesus Christ being born. The Virgin Mary his mother, was one of very few humans left on the world, that still had the perfect DNA, hence Virgin Mary, not what many people had come to thing about her. This is the reason that Jesus Christ could do the things he could. Also another little thing what a lot of people never picked up from the bible, is that Jesus Christ did not go around writing things down for people to read. He told people so they could hear. Which is where the mistake comes in for humans when they read the bible. You need to have the bible read to you so you can hear it. The reason behind this is because, when you read things your human mind filters it before it reaches your soul or spirit. When you hear things that are being read or spoke to you by people, your spirit or soul will hear and listen first, then your mind will go to work from there. This is something I myself have done all my life, and believe me it works really well. Your mind will start being programed the correct way, and you spirit and soul will not confuse your mind. You mind is the only thing that will confuse you all, just remember that next time you read some thing. Peace to you all and I hope this information has helped some of you

reply to post by jinx880101


Disclaimer: I'm not going to read through all posts.

If you think the double slit experiment has anything to do with humans, or consciousness I'd like to know why?

It is a "measuring" problem, the conscious human experimenter has no influence.

www.physorg.com...

Best,

N

Originally posted by Trappedinspace
He told people so they could hear. Which is where the mistake comes in for humans when they read the bible. You need to have the bible read to you so you can hear it. The reason behind this is because, when you read things your human mind filters it before it reaches your soul or spirit. When you hear things that are being read or spoke to you by people, your spirit or soul will hear and listen first, then your mind will go to work from there. This is something I myself have done all my life, and believe me it works really well. Your mind will start being programed the correct way, and you spirit and soul will not confuse your mind. You mind is the only thing that will confuse you all, just remember that next time you read some thing. Peace to you all and I hope this information has helped some of you

I cannot tell if your are kidding or you're being serious ...

reply to post by jinx880101

But the point remains, you cannot make that statement, unless you have conducted the experiment yourself and have found it to be false.

Ok, how can I say this politely

Sir or Madam, have you maybe considered the very remote possibility that the experiment is sound, but your interpretation is completely, utterly, 100% misguided? Just sayin' ...

Also, seeing that this thread has gotten 70 plus flags lets me believe that there are very few "homo sapiens" hanging out here.

[edit on 22-2-2010 by Nichiren]

[edit on 22-2-2010 by Nichiren]

reply to post by Nichiren


Scientific American article on consciousness within quantum mechanics by the 2009 Templeton Prize winner Bernard d'Espagnat.

www.templetonprize.org...

www.templetonprize.org...

Still, d’Espagnat warns, experiments often falsify theories and so there must exist, beyond mere appearances, something that resists us and lies beyond the phenomena, a “veiled reality” that science does not describe but only glimpses uncertainly. In turn, contrary to those who claim that matter is the only reality, the possibility that other means, including spirituality, may also provide a window on ultimate reality cannot be ruled out, d’Espagnat insists, by cogent scientific arguments.

I started a thread on a very similar subject a while back, but because my explanation (2 messages) was broken up by a poster in between, I think most people never read past the first message, which on it's own probably looked like incoherent rambling.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Room temperature quantum coherence:

Nature 463, 644-647 (4 February 2010)
Coherently wired light-harvesting in photosynthetic marine algae at ambient temperature
Elisabetta Collini, Cathy Y. Wong, Krystyna E. Wilk, Paul M. G. Curmi, Paul Brumer & Gregory D. Scholes


"... This contrasts with the long-held view that long-range quantum coherence between molecules cannot be sustained in complex biological systems, even at low temperatures...."

Why are we kept in the dark when it comes to mind power? Why? Someone, somewhere knows the power we have, and is hell bent on making sure that we don't have the time, (or the interest) in practicing this. Learning about it, etc. Which leads me to believe that the media, wars, constant doom and gloom being advertised, is all there to KEEP US OCCUPIED. And not to mention, UNINTERESTED.

because that's the way the elite have programmed us. and trust me, that's not the way to go....that will lead to more bad.

reply to post by drew hempel


The Templeton Foundation is not a, let's say, impartial foundation

Mankind has gone through the same process over and over, each dimension created within planet earth pertaining to mankind has sank into a fallen state, physical consumption, of thoughts created through an overwhelming power that is your mind. A mind that can be seen as the almighty giver of life and lust there of, or can be see as a tool that generates its ability to create physical life from a greater force, comprehendable by those that know they know not.

"The invisable man runs rampant till he discovers what he can not see."
-VibratoyAgent

reply to post by Nichiren


embodyingcyberspace.com...

www.telesio-galilei.com...

The Telesio - Galilei Academy of Science, was established in September 2007. The Academies primary aim is to promote science. There are no economic interests, or considerations to the Academy. Telesio - Galilei Academy of Science for the betterment of science. The raison d'etre for the Telesio-Galilei Academy of Science and its affiliated Academies is the free exchange of scientific ideas. To champion the true scientifc spirit, and encourage rational and scientific discourses for no reward other than the betterment of science ; Telesio-Galilei Prizes and medals honoratia are ancillary to provide recognition of and encouragement for scientific work. Indeed, there are many points of disagreement and contention amongst scientific technicalities and concepts; as it should indeed be. That we should regard ourselves responsible as an Academy for upholding the right of rational disagreement as the most important principle governing our assembly

Diego Lucio Rapoport His research work has focused on developing a unified geometrical theory of spacetime, electromagnetism, quantum mechanics, Brownian motion, non-equilibrium and equilibrium thermodynamics and fluid dynamics, in terms of geometries with Cartan torsion. His main achievement, for which this award is made, is his development of a theory that not only unifies exophysics through torsion fields, but also extends this by surmounting Cartesian dualism and incorporates the mind and subjectivity to physics, establishing a two-way relation between them. This unification of exophysics and the world of the subject is an holographic structure represented by the Klein bottle, which is already present in the visual representation carried by the neurocortex. This transdisciplinary unified conception is based in Steven Rosen's topological phenomenology as well in the phenomenology of Heidegger and Merleau Ponty, Hegel's dialectical philosophy, cognition, perception, second-order cybernetics, semiology, physics, and geometry, a most general tensorial multivalued logic which admits superposition states and which has quantum and fuzzy logics as special cases, is derived in an extremely simple way from paradox and the semiotic codification of torsion. This represents a complete reversion of the current understanding of logic that departed from Aristotle, which have tried to eliminate paradox which has thus been proved to the fundamental to the generation of the laws of thought as much as those of quantum mechanics. In this conception, time waves have a fundamental role.

www.novapublishers.com...

reply to post by drew hempel


What does that have to do with the Templeton Foundation that you have linked to

reply to post by drew hempel


Nice try to confuse the issue with more data LOL! Not gonna work, though

Did you really pay $130.50 for that book

All I'm addressing is the OP's claim that the double-slit experiment is a clear manifestation of "mind power". Not so. It's a measuring problem.

I acknowledge that people are easily confused and blinded by science. And that's when usually an even more ignorant person steps in and explains everything by god, mind power or any other mysterious "energy source".

reply to post by Nichiren


This is an interesting issue raised and thanks for the new reference "Quantum Theory: Concepts and Methods" (Kluwer Academic Publishers, 1998) but the author Asher Peres makes the same problem that underlines science as a whole.

Peres tries to separate math from physics while at the same time acknowledging that the math comes from music yet Peres does not have a proper understanding of the music.

To wit:

"A classical acoustic signal with intensity f(t) also cannot have both precise timing and precise pitch....This is a general property of Fourier transforms, quite independent of the underlying physics. Yet, approximate values for time and frequency are certainly compatible, as every musician knows (see page 214). Likewise, in quantum theory, we can have approximate values for both position and wavelength...."

Peres footnotes the above with:

"Do not attempt to quantize Eq. (10.98) into a time-energy uncertainty relation! Time is not an operator in quantum mechanics -- nor is it a dynamical variable in classical mechanics. It is a c-number, a mere numerical parameter. The measurement of time will be discussed in the last chapter of this book."

So clearly the POV quantum statistics used relies on the above "approximate values" yet the author has made some terribly wrong assumptions -- based on a misunderstanding of the roots of math.

Also since Peres refers this issue to the final chapter of the book I think it's safe to say that it's the most important issue for quantum mechanics.

So we go to the final chapter that Peres refers us to and find:

"Formally, the Poisson bracket (in classical mechanics) or commutator (in quantum theory) of t with any dynamical variable is always zero." (p. 406)

And so reveals Peres error -- the underlying SYMMETRY of the Brahmin phonetic-number ratio system.

I address this issue in chapter 4 of my blogbook -- Mothership Landing and math professor Joe Mazur stated it's "very valuable." Also the "time-frequency uncertainty principle" kicks off my book.

Nonwestern music relies on time as a dynamic of complimentary opposites -- in violation of the commutative principle (i.e. the conversion of uncertainty principle back into logarithmic-based mathematics).

Originally posted by Nichiren
All I'm addressing is the OP's claim that the double-slit experiment is a clear manifestation of "mind power". Not so. It's a measuring problem.

Experiments have shown it has nothing to do with measurement.

It is about potential knowledge for a conscious observer.

Originally posted by Jezus

Originally posted by Jezus
How do you explain this...

If two identical experiments take place.
Both measure the slit the particle uses.

AFTER the experiment
The data from one experiment is deleted.

Now, looking at the back wall reveals that if the data is deleted the pattern is a wave pattern (interference) but if the data is kept the pattern is a particle pattern.

Data available = particle must use one slit
Data deleted = particle can use both slits and interfere with itself

www.bottomlayer.com...

3. Record the measurements at the slits, but then erase it before analyzing the results at the back wall. Suppose we take our modified double slit set up -- with electron detectors at the slits -- and still leave everything intact. And we will still keep the electron detectors at the slits turned on, so that they will be doing whatever they do to detect electrons at the slits. And we will record the count at the slits, so that we will be able to obtain the results. But, we will erase the data obtained from the electron detectors at the slits before we analyze the data from the back wall.

The result upon analysis: an interference pattern at the back wall. Notice that, in this variation, the double slit experiment with detectors at the slits is completed in every respect by the time we choose to erase the recorded data. Up to that point, there is no difference in our procedure here and in our initial procedure ([pp. 15-17]), which yielded the puzzling clumping pattern. Yet, it seems that if we, in a sense, retroactively remove the electron detectors at the slits (not by going back in time to physically remove them, but only by removing the information they have gathered so that it is not available from the time of the erasure going forward into the future), we can "change" the results of what we presume is a mechanically complete experiment, so far as those results are determined by a later analysis, to produce an interference pattern instead of a clumping pattern. This is mind-boggling.

reply to post by Jezus


I have seen that discussion before on ATS. Look it up. You might be surprised ...

reply to post by Nichiren


tph.tuwien.ac.at...

Presently the question of a proper formalization of the informal notion of “algorithm” seems to remain wide open. With regards to discrete finite paper-and-pencil operations, Church-Turing computability seems to be appropriate. But if one takes into account physics, in particular continuum mechanics and quantum physics, the issues become less certain. And if one is willing to include the full capacities of the human mind with all its intuition and thoughtfulness, any formalization appears highly speculative and inappropriate; at least for the time being, but maybe forever.

reply to post by Nichiren


Well some people have trouble understanding this issue.

If deleting data can influence the experiment AFTER it is complete a conscious observer MUST be a factor.

This is because only a conscious observer gives meaning to raw data. Data is abstract; the data itself is not in any way physically related to what it describes, it only has meaning when it is interrupted.

So that fact that the existence of information can influence reality proves that the conscious observer is a factor.

reply to post by drew hempel


Music relates to art and cannot be discussed in physics terms. Well it can, but nobody thinks about "frequencies" when you hear Mahler's 5th

But you hit the nail on its head re this thread. I hope you know why ...