Norway Spiral created by Eiscat (New Evidence)

reply to post by Wolfenz


No, you have misread the calculations. The missile could very easily last that long in space. We are talking about an ICBM, not a cruise missile gone awry. It didn't form a "near perfect circle", but a "near perfect spiral", which is exactly what one would expect if they have any idea of Newton's laws of motion (namely the first).

It's not in the air.

Nostradamus? Now you've completely lost any credibility you might have had. Again, this is the "Science & Technology" forum, not the "Old French Insane Crackpot Discussion" forum.

Spirals are common in nature. All they take is a rotation and a lateral movement, or even a linear construction with slight regular lateral adjustments. They're not special in any way.

But please don't let facts get in the way of your games. It looks like you're having a lot of fun ignoring them.

Originally posted by Donny 4 million
reply to post by tauristercus

 

This post was for you T. Dave jumped on it instead.
I am not interested in his blahaaa chuckles.
I guess he thinks a rocket can fly around up in the ionosphere with out it's engine on. Or maybe his ICBM's have cold fusion propelent.

Your theory about the heaters and all that bunk is just stuff you made up .
I have been talking to your deaf ears here all through the thread and you ignore it. To your discredit I think.
The rocket could be the heater.
1.6 MEGA WATTS could also do it.
Beamed from a VHF directional radar.
No if ands or buts.
Until you can prove what the results of the Tequila Sunrise experiment are, then the case is no where near Closed.

reply to post by Donny 4 million


I jumped on it because it was full of half-baked nonsense.

The rocket was above the ionosphere. By quite a lot. Why you think it didn't have its engine running is beyond me. Cold fusion? What are you talking about?

The rest of my post stands, that your post is full of conjecture, devoid of any substantiating evidence, and requires massive leaps in known science to even comprehend.

This is getting ridiculous.

reply to post by davesidious


Riduculous is you jumping on it agan.
There is an ignor thingy the mods told me about.
Look and see if you have one.

i did taur remember i said instead of the heater arrays it could of been uhf or vhf or esr something steerable go ask godzilla if humans like directing beems on him frying him with microwave energy opps he doesn't exist
sorry had a godzilla moment en.wikipedia.org...

interesting view

en.wikipedia.org...

video oof differnt views of the spiral and obams sercurity in norway? ok

this video at 3.20 the camera person is scanning and show illuminated flares 3 of them im sure it not street lights it look like to me is this closer to the start of the spiral ohh by the way it look like the camera person is scanning over to when it is claimed the launch site ?

www.youtube.com...



www.youtube.com...


i apologize as i accidentally put the wrong video earlier the one above is the right one ! remember 3.20

sorry

[edit on 28-2-2010 by Wolfenz]

reply to post by Donny 4 million


We're here to deny ignorance. Your post was claiming I said things which I didn't. That is misrepresenting me. I put an end to that. The rest of your post I accurately called out for being baseless conjecture, which is supposed to be why we are here: to learn.

reply to post by Wolfenz


That has absolutely nothing to do with ionospheric heating. That requires a massive array of electronically-steerable antennae (which can only be steered up to 30 degrees). Those steerable radar dishes are exactly that - radar.

Those flares clearly have lamp-posts coming out of them and into the ground.

What exactly are you saying, now? That the EISCAT radar sites are capable of causing highly-visible phenomena in the sky (far, far more visible than anything the much-more-powerful ionospheric heater can create)?

Wireless energy transfer exists, but you've not yet shown any reason to think it has anything to do with what we saw in the sky. You keep finding unrelated technologies, and insisting they might have something to do with it, without demonstrating how it's even possible, then you get all upset when people call you out on your lack of evidence. The fact wireless energy exists, and the fact EISCAT have steerable radar dishes, and the fact that we saw something in the Norwegian sky doesn't mean, even slightly, that EISCAT are using their steerable radar dishes to wirelessly transmit energy to the sky. You have to find evidence. Otherwise you will never, ever, ever win any objective supporters for your hypotheses. And, to top it all, you'll never actually know anything about the spiral for sure, other than baseless conjecture.

Originally posted by Wolfenz

i did taur remember i said instead of the heater arrays it could of been uhf or vhf or esr something steerable go ask godzilla if humans like directing beems on him frying him with microwave energy opps he doesn't exist
sorry had a godzilla moment en.wikipedia.org...

interesting view

en.wikipedia.org...

video oof differnt views of the spiral and obams sercurity in norway? ok

this video at 3.20 the camera person is scanning and show illuminated flares 3 of them im sure it not street lights it look like to me is this closer to the start of the spiral ohh by the way it look like the camera person is scanning over to when it is claimed the launch site ?

www.youtube.com...

What's up Wolf?
Cool post and link.
A few new tricks for the bag.
Seems like we must be like candy to Davey.
He won't let T get a word in edgewise. This must be a tactic not science or courtesy
It's like a hungry little wolf pup or a jogger just needing a lot of attention.

reply to post by Donny 4 million


It'd be even better if Wolfenz could be bothered of showing us how they fit into his ever-changing explanation.

I keep posting because a) I was misrepresented, and wanted to correct it, and b) Taur isn't up yet, and I'm pretty sure he'd want attention brought to the ridiculous, baseless assertions muddying up this discussion.

I wouldn't have to reply so frequently if you guy's would stick to science and technology, instead of wishful thinking and flights of irreverent fancy.

Originally posted by davesidious
reply to post by Donny 4 million

 

It'd be even better if Wolfenz could be bothered of showing us how they fit into his ever-changing explanation.

I keep posting because a) I was misrepresented, and wanted to correct it, and b) Taur isn't up yet, and I'm pretty sure he'd want attention brought to the ridiculous, baseless assertions muddying up this discussion.

I wouldn't have to reply so frequently if you guy's would stick to science and technology, instead of wishful thinking and flights of irreverent fancy.

The slick deal is to bushwack a poster so the ONE WHO IS NOT UP YET
doesen't have to answer. BTW how the heck do you know T is not up yet?
Can you see him asleep in his bed.
Fact is you do not have to reply to anyone.
I had a top secret clearance in RADIO close to a half century ago.
I was trained in Electronic Warfare.
Here hold my candle sonny.

Originally posted by Donny 4 million

Originally posted by Wolfenz

i did taur remember i said instead of the heater arrays it could of been uhf or vhf or esr something steerable go ask godzilla if humans like directing beems on him frying him with microwave energy opps he doesn't exist
sorry had a godzilla moment en.wikipedia.org...

interesting view

en.wikipedia.org...

video oof differnt views of the spiral and obams sercurity in norway? ok

this video at 3.20 the camera person is scanning and show illuminated flares 3 of them im sure it not street lights it look like to me is this closer to the start of the spiral ohh by the way it look like the camera person is scanning over to when it is claimed the launch site ?

www.youtube.com...

What's up Wolf?
Cool post and link.
A few new tricks for the bag.
Seems like we must be like candy to Davey.
He won't let T get a word in edgewise. This must be a tactic not science or courtesy
It's like a hungry little wolf pup or a jogger just needing a lot of attention.

thank you donny sorry for all the misspelled words i had to leave in a hurry and shut down the system and i did not review the grammar and spelling

i was watching the eiscat videos and then it hit me one of the videos was talking how uhf act like a microwave oven with the door left open and a demonstration of plasma liquid put into a microwave! as it shows in(doucumantary) Holes In Heaven HAARP to show a visual effect even if its a rocket and eiscat facilty in either 3 locations norway sweden or finland closer to white sea

one thing i would like to do some research is what location was the tequila sunrise was going to be aimed at same path of that russian missile ?

oh god where is that straw i just cant get it ok the fire is cooling down where is that log!

ok it was a rocket that failed

ok eiscat was scheduled a experiment called tequila sunrise ( meteor dust studies with uhf and heater ) at the same time as the norway spiral
from 7.00am to 10 am where was the location of the aim !?

at 7.50am the famous norway spiral ( were the location is where the gates are) a photographer is when he notice the spiral

i like to know interesting doc i found look below

www.eiscat.rl.ac.uk...(rev4)%20-%20in%20progress.doc


was that rocket acting like a meteor spewing dust partials i want that straw !

Onen < goodbye




[edit on 27-2-2010 by Wolfenz]

thanks donny 4 million for noticing that im trying



sometimes i feel like im defending myself like jim garrison in the jfk conspiracy



[edit on 27-2-2010 by Wolfenz]

With these obvious blue spiral problems evident ... imagine now trying to explain the exhaust plume (that I temporarily ignored), from the EISCAT heater array point of view. Beats me how Team EISCAT would try to explain the creation of the exhaust plume



Maybe..a missile was fired? Like I said before the one doesn't rule out the other.


Yes, it does ... why do I feel that, in my previous post, I have just wasted my time showing and proving that most of the blue spiral & exhaust plume are simply NOT visible from the EISCAT heater location ... there's a HUGE mountain blocking EISCATS view of the exhaust/blue spiral area !

taur did you think about Finland's facility ? Sodankylä or Kiruna or Sweden or Longyearbyen instead of tromso ? did you to any calculation from these points ?

here is the cords for ya of these locations

e7.eiscat.se...

here is a cheat sheet of all of eiscat facility's glory

for the ones that did not know as i didn't know myself at first

e7.eiscat.se...


a brochure of interest

TransNational Access 3-fold brochure
Document Actions

*
*

A small brochure to download detailing the TNA program at EISCAT

e7.eiscat.se...

[edit on 28-2-2010 by Wolfenz]

reply to post by davesidious


Davesidious ... I really have reached my limit with these narrow minded people who have such extreme tunnel vision when it comes to being presented with evidence that goes strongly against their beliefs.

I'm sure that you're in agreement with me that the amount of evidence, and the quality of the evidence, that we have presented is such that any rational and intelligent person would have no choice but to accept it's validity.

So here we have these EISCAT zealots who are completely unable to put together even a tenth the amount of required evidence to substantiate and support their claim ... and yet here we have a group with the complete and unmitigated gall to completely fob off and totally disregard solid and legitimate evidence that I have gone out of my way to produce to show the many, many holes, illogicality and inconsistencies in their lame hypothesis.
And the worst part is that NOT ONE OF THEM has done a single iota of actual analysis of the data that was produced that morning ... instead, they've chosen to ignore COMPLETELY said data and instead, have reached their ridiculous conclusions based on literally nothing more than a document or two (produced many years ago) and some sporadic hit and miss searching on the internet looking desperately for any reference that associates the word EISCAT and any kind of artificially generated atmospheric effect.

The saddest part of all this is that whenever evidence is presented that clearly contradicts parts of their cherished EISCAT hypothesis, such as when I just PROVED, ... yes, PROVED ... that the EISCAT heater could NOT possibly see the part of the sky where the beginning of the spiral event originated, you lot immediately tried to sneak past this damning evidence by switching the heating to a bunch of radar units scattered around the northern part of Europe ... an example of clutching at straws that's almost mind boggling in it's stupidity !

Ask yourselves this .... have any of you managed to come up with ANY evidence whatsoever that explains even the simplest of the observed events that when put together, made up the spiral event ?
Any solid explanations for how the EISCAT heater could push an energy beam thru mega-tonnes of solid mountain to create the blue spiral ? how the 'fixed and unmovable' EISCAT heater beam could be moved away from it's +/- 30 degree north-south meridian to create an obvious trajectory ? why the trajectory that EISCAT allegedly created was entirely over Russian territory ? why that trajectory led directly to the Kamchatka Peninsula ?

Don't you guys even take ANY of this hard-core counter evidence on board and ask yourselves EXACTLY WHERE IS the supporting EISCAT evidence that you desperately need to back your claims up with.

Honestly, take a good, hard and serious look at all the research I have done and the rock-solid conclusions that I have arrived at ... then ask yourselves what have YOU done in your defense that even comes close to a similar amount of effort.

If you're absolutely honest with yourselves, your answer can only be that No, we haven't done ANYTHING by way of research that compares.

In fact, if I was in your position and finding my pet theory being ripped to shreds by the shear volume of mounting counter evidence, I'd be really embarrassed to be seen trying to cling so desperately to an obviously badly failed hypothesis.

Time to face reality and move on ...

reply to post by tauristercus


You are absolutely right. It doesn't matter what evidence is shown to the zealots, their pet (ever-changing) hypothesis will never be put to bed, as it is clearly not based on evidence, but "gut feelings", misunderstood scientific terms, and blatant guesswork. No one has managed to tie all these EISCAT ideas together into a coherent, testable theory.

And now we have a person with an involvement in electronic warfare (and not ionospheric science) from 50 years ago saying that has anything to do with it!

It's getting more and more pathetic every day. It seems Team EISCAT don't want to learn the truth, they only want their hypothesis to be true.

Originally posted by Donny 4 million

Originally posted by Donny 4 million
reply to post by tauristercus

 

This post was for you T. Dave jumped on it instead.
I am not interested in his blahaaa chuckles.
I guess he thinks a rocket can fly around up in the ionosphere with out it's engine on. Or maybe his ICBM's have cold fusion propelent.

Your theory about the heaters and all that bunk is just stuff you made up .
I have been talking to your deaf ears here all through the thread and you ignore it. To your discredit I think.
The rocket could be the heater.
1.6 MEGA WATTS could also do it.
Beamed from a VHF directional radar.
No if ands or buts.
Until you can prove what the results of the Tequila Sunrise experiment are, then the case is no where near Closed.

Originally posted by davesidious
reply to post by tauristercus

 

And now we have a person with an involvement in electronic warfare (and not ionospheric science) from 50 years ago saying that has anything to do with it!

It's getting more and more pathetic every day. It seems Team EISCAT don't want to learn the truth, they only want their hypothesis to be true.

It is sure damn sure you wouldn't tell what your qualifications are.
Look up the meaning of Sheeple. It may say in there that it is "one who believes anything Russia puts in print." and then merely repeats it without thought or qualification.
Other wise you would know that frequency and the ionosphere have changed very little to NONE in the last fifty years.
You always conviently miss the important points in your addictive need to belittle other members.

reply to post by Donny 4 million


If you think 50-year-old EW knowledge somehow imbues you with the ability to discern secret knowledge about EISCAT just from a few photos and ages-old, inaccurate patents, then you are really showing your lack of objectivity! Hahahaha!

Sheeple? No. It's called "objectivity". I'm not believing what Russia says simply because they said it, but because it agrees entirely with all the observed phenomena.

Yes, the frequencies and the ionosphere have not changed much in 50 years, but when your EW education has nothing to do with what we're talking about (or, at least you have completely failed to show how it's relevant), it's a moot point. Why don't you realise that? Oh yeah, because then you'd be wrong, and in Donny 4 million world, that's a big no-no.

The burden of evidence is on you, not I. You make these claims about EW, but can't even show how it's related to what we saw.

Get a grip!

Originally posted by PhotonEffect

Originally posted by Wolfenz
reply to post by PhotonEffect

 

www.eiscat3d.se...

wow did you see in the video that uhf 32 m steerable parabolic dish
www.ssf.npolar.no...

in how fast it can move

LOL its is double speed showing the view in what way it can move

Yes I believe it takes several minutes to adjust the dish's orientation-- it's not that quick actually

i got my finger and i can swirl swirl look people i can draw i can draw ! 360 all around up and down ! 2 mill watts in the sky microwaving the sky

well if you talking about eiscat 3d it can move like this not just single beams but multiple as the video say so

Huh?

Did you catch the range of coverage? Wolf maybe you can comment on the coverage areas being shown here? It doesn't seem to extend to the White Sea...

yes i did catch the cover range but put that green dot in Finland eiscat facility for the direction for the range

here is something about that Finland facility and ( experimental rocket launch releasing water at high altitudes and all (3) facility s are working together to test examine the experiment

if it was done in march of 2009 ( it had some problems in the experiment) why not something of a different experiment releasing err say plasma liquid on 12 09 09 www.space.fmi.fi...

Most important facts about NISSE during this experiment

* The NISSE experiment weights 28 kg of which 11 kg are tap water inside the NISSE watertank. The total rocket REXUS 6 has a weight of 511 kg!
* The boost phase of the improved Orion rocket lasts 5 seconds
* NISSE is accelerated for 26 seconds where the maximum accceleration is 21 g (in a NASA space shuttle rocket launch there are g's of about 3 g present)
* The rocket will reach after 150 seconds the apogee at around 95 km over ground
* The velocity after 25 seconds will be 4500 km/h (56 x the average car velocity)
* The rocket's diameter is 35.6 cm and its length 5.6 m. The NISSE experiment makes 60 cm of the rocket length
(((( * The rocket will spin in its longitudinal direction with about 3.2 Hz and vibrate with a frequency of 20-2000 Hz ))))
* The temperature on the outside structure will be about 130 degrees Celsius during the flight back towards Earth
* The preferred rocket launch window is between 11:06 local time (LT) and 13:45 LT
* Because of low temperatures in Kiruna during this time of the year, the valves of the NISSE experiments are kept warm by heaters before launch
* The NISSE water release is timed and ignited by the onboard main computer
* Before and during the launch the pressure and temperature in the tank are continuously measured

www.space.fmi.fi...

eiscat radar in action
www.space.fmi.fi...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/7553aa7ab976.png[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/83494f34220e.png[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0d11f0cd5049.png[/atsimg]

and i did see this video i posted this exact video in a previous post

EISCAT 3d what can it also actually do ?

Really? And you still think its used to shoot down missiles?

all i can say a phenomenon happen and someone took the advantage
to keep it going for 12 minutes

Originally posted by davesidious
reply to post by Donny 4 million

 

If you think 50-year-old EW knowledge somehow imbues you with the ability to discern secret knowledge about EISCAT just from a few photos and ages-old, inaccurate patents, then you are really showing your lack of objectivity! Hahahaha!

Sheeple? No. It's called "objectivity". I'm not believing what Russia says simply because they said it, but because it agrees entirely with all the observed phenomena.

Yes, the frequencies and the ionosphere have not changed much in 50 years, but when your EW education has nothing to do with what we're talking about (or, at least you have completely failed to show how it's relevant), it's a moot point. Why don't you realise that? Oh yeah, because then you'd be wrong, and in Donny 4 million world, that's a big no-no.

The burden of evidence is on you, not I. You make these claims about EW, but can't even show how it's related to what we saw.

Get a grip!

You see sedious you cleverly forgot the TOP SECRET RADIO clearence.
And how you know T is snoozin LOL LOL ha ha ha
Such childish tactics. ha ha ha

So here is what you forgot hee he

The slick deal is to bushwack a poster so the ONE WHO IS NOT UP YET
doesen't have to answer. BTW how the heck do you know T is not up yet?
Can you see him asleep in his bed.
Fact is you do not have to reply to anyone.
I had a top secret clearance in RADIO close to a half century ago.
I was trained in Electronic Warfare.
Here hold my candle sonny.

And here you are again. he he
Got your number mr. butt-inski
Now please let Tar answer for himself.

If it was Esciat, what does this imply? What is the significance of it not being a missle?

reply to post by Donny 4 million

You see sedious you cleverly forgot the TOP SECRET RADIO clearence.
And how you know T is snoozin LOL LOL ha ha ha
Such childish tactics. ha ha ha

So here is what you forgot hee he

The slick deal is to bushwack a poster so the ONE WHO IS NOT UP YET
doesen't have to answer. BTW how the heck do you know T is not up yet?
Can you see him asleep in his bed.
Fact is you do not have to reply to anyone.
I had a top secret clearance in RADIO close to a half century ago.
I was trained in Electronic Warfare.
Here hold my candle sonny.

And here you are again. he he
Got your number mr. butt-inski
Now please let Tar answer for himself.

Now please let Tar answer for himself.

Ok, here I am ... 'Tar' is now answering for himself ... as requested.


Donny ... what the heck ???? How old are you ??? 7 years old ??
The following can all be found in the above response from you to davesidious:

LOL LOL ha ha ha
ha ha ha
hee he
mr. butt-inski
hold my candle sonny

Having been shown an overwhelming and consistently solid PROOF and EVIDENCE that has literally shredded your EISCAT hypothesis, are you now unable to continue in an adult fashion and have instead begun to resort to childish behaviour ? Frankly, I'm really disappointed ... is this now going to be the standard of your responses ?



As for the following:

I had a top secret clearance in RADIO close to a half century ago.
I was trained in Electronic Warfare.

What possible value or importance could 50 year old RADIO knowledge have in today's hi-tech world ? Very little truthfully as what you learned then, and by today's technological standards, is essentially archaic, primitive and rudimentary.
Unless you're telling us that EISCAT is using hardware based upon 60's valve (tube) and transistor technology ?

If you tried to get a similar position today and that's all you had on your CV/resume ... guess what ? you'd certainly get hired by such an organization but only in a custodial position ... as a janitor.

As for Top Secret clearance half a century ago ... from todays perspective ... so what ? who cares ? How is that TS clearance and your 1960's radio knowledge even REMOTELY relevant to the Norway Spiral event.

In fact, for someone making such claims and coming from an 'alleged' technical background, you've been demonstrating an extremely limited understanding or grasp in even the most basic electromagnetic theory or applied knowledge.


[edit on 28/2/10 by tauristercus]