Billy Meier What A Joke!

Johnlear,

David Icke and people who like to believe what he preaches as truth like to now use the term you stated above,even though he certainly did not imply as such in the numerous appearances and interviews he held around that time.

Originally posted by michaelhorn
...you're pretty mild, considering 19 assassination attempts on Meier's life, a lot of trouble for a mere hoaxer, no?

19 assassination attemps! and they all failed!
I guess it wouldn�t be that hard to kill "a poor one armed swiss farmer" (violins here).

...Who was trying to do it? The Three Stooges?...Willy Coyote maybe?




[edit on 24-7-2004 by Peronemlin]

Originally posted by acidhead
erm yes . we have seen the video of it , it was discussed about page 3

it shows a STATIONARY flying saucer infront of a tree , the camera zooms in and that is all.

if i made a 20ft rubber duck and had it sit still infront of a tree , took a video of it where i zoomed in - would that prove the duck was infact real ?

If you could mount even a 3.5-meter (~12 ft.) rubber duck (actually, metal would be more fair) toward the top of a tree, I'd be impressed, but moreso if you tied one arm behind your back. There are too many shots of this ship that display very obvious metallic construction. And sorry to keep harping on the one-arm factor, but I think most would agree it's an important one and absolutely must be considered. Meier always went to the contact locations alone, as all the researchers (remember, 6 years on-site) and witnesses to Meier's activities have testified, and even some spies who later wrote Meier and the investigators.

why do his ufo flying videos look like they are on bits of string and pendulum swinging ?

Sorry to use your own advice, but try actually reading things. I explained on pg 3 or 4 the plausible deniability concept of the ETs. Also read (again) the FIGU bulletin excerpt I linked to that explains their controversy induction methodology. Regarding analysis done by Meier-debunker, Bruce Maccabee, on the alleged "Meier pendulums," see Prof. Deardorff's dissection and rebuttal at www.tjresearch.info/BillyYes.htm.

I looked for info on comb filters on the web to get myself educated. Is there anything else I need to know about the model of comb filter that Meier would have used circa 1976? You mentioned you had an 8 / 16, but what do you suppose Meier would have used based on your knowledge? Another questions is, do you still have your sound posted anywhere? I'd like to have it reviewed and compared. Thx.

Aurelius,

One point you bring up is that Meier has only one arm which has been stated a few times to explain certain points in this thread.However after reading from the link you have just recently posted it states he has a 'close group of followers'

Then you say that as he has been spied upon and followed for 6 years on site with nobody ever noticing anyone helping him to take pictures as he went to these locations alone.

This leads me to ask did these people researching his claims follow him 24/7 ? If so, then are the people who tried to asassinate him 19 times all in custody and/or serving time in jail ? If they didn't follow him 24/7 then how can anyone say with certainty that he did not have help to take the pictures he claims as genuine ?

19 assassination attemps! and they all failed!

ill do it , give me a price

I'll buy you a coke in Cream

So, allowing to take pictures and films of their spaceships, taking people back in time to take pictures of dinosaurs, bringing vintage ray guns to burn holes in trees, etc etc; you say that is NOT interfering in any manner, shape or form with humans?

MH: That is correct, as Meier voluntarily particpated in all of the events, other people were prevented from doing so. I don't recall anyinformation indicating that it was against his will. Rather, he was, numerous times, afforded the opportunity to discontinue the contacts if he could no longer bear the difficulties they brought him.

One more little thing... they are not allowed to reveal themselves to terrestrials...so, where is Mr Meier from? Mars?

MH: See above.

Thanks for the advice, that�s what I�m doing: "Thinking, fellow, thinking!"

MH: Good, please ponder the above response, read the (FREE) articles at www.theyfly.com and then figure out how a one-armed guy did all this.

HE'S EITHER AN ABOVE-GENIUS LEVEL PHOTOGRAPHIC EXPERT, FILMMAKER, VIDEOGRAPHER, METALLURGIST, SOUND ENGINEER, SPECIAL EFFECTS WIZARD, MODEL MAKER, PHYSICIST, ASTRONOMER, HYPER-SPACE PROPULSION EXPERT, HISTORIAN, ARCHEOLOGIST, MATHEMATICIAN, LINGUIST, CLAIRVOYANT, MASS HYPNOTIST, ETC., ETC. OR...

A REAL CONTACTEE.

Now think real hard...which one is it?



really , a one-armed man being visited by aliens who contradicts himself in interviews , who takes photos of ufos and makes them look like models and who records audio of ufos that sound like feedback

hmmm , wonder who is living on a different world here ? ? ?

MH: What are the troubling contradictions...and is that what really troubles you about the case?

what does your last comment mean ? "whatever your'e on"
are you getting personal because i can create the same sound as your idol's ufo sound with basic equipment ?

MH: Funny that you don't enjoy a little ridicule when you have plenty of it for someone you don't know, haven't researched, etc. And if you wish to make the claim of duplicating the sounds please go ahead and back it up. FYYI, the Groton Naval undersea sound labs has (had at hte time) the largest collection of sound source material in the world. While they were able to identify the exact type of aircraft engines also recorded by Meier on the same tape as the UFO, they were unable to match it with any known sound source. PLEASE read the darn Sound Analysis Report (FREE) at my website and try to offer up something remotely resembling a real challenge. If you only knew how many other "heavy hitters" have come forward with this light-weight stuff!

show me links to these reports of proof , show me something links to things please

show me a pic of the yellow car in the pic in daylight with a person near it
show me a pic of this tree with a person standing next to it at the same angle as this photo is took from to show scale

MH: Gosh, and you want me to do everything fo ryou? I've spent 25 years researching the case, spend more than 25 minutees and you might be taken seriously. And, as far as the photo of the craft by the tree goes, go look at the video of it and you'll get all the scale you want.


show me some video of a ufo flying overhead and not some "on a string and wobbling" video as has been shown

MH: Somebody REALLY hasn't done their homework. Okay, I posted the excerpt from the Photo Analysis doc, go read the whole thing and stop behaving like an amatuer!!!

Originally posted by Sariel
One point you bring up is that Meier has only one arm which has been stated a few times to explain certain points in this thread.However after reading from the link you have just recently posted it states he has a 'close group of followers'

Over the years, people started seeing (and photographing) the same ships Meier photographed. Some saw the ETs conversing with Meier. Others found Meier to be just who he said he was: a human being like everyone else who had a unique "job" of relaying information to us Erdenmenschen (Earth human beings) from an off-world source. Some of these very people wanted to help Meier with the task of organizing and publishing his (now over 25,000) pages of information, as well as helping to translate it into other languages. And that's what they did. I think "followers" is more applicable to those who believe...rather blindly I might add. Billy Meier is all for knowledge and thinking and adamantly against belief. Belief is what got this world in the mess it's currently in, wouldn't you say?

Then you say that as he has been spied upon and followed for 6 years on site with nobody ever noticing anyone helping him to take pictures as he went to these locations alone.
This leads me to ask did these people researching his claims follow him 24/7 ? If so, then are the people who tried to asassinate him 19 times all in custody and/or serving time in jail ? If they didn't follow him 24/7 then how can anyone say with certainty that he did not have help to take the pictures he claims as genuine ?

I didn't say he was followed for six years, rather a comprehensive investigation into Meier on and around his property took place over six years by American and Japanese teams. Others like Lous Zinnstag, Gary Kinder ("Light Years"), and Randolph Winters were on separate fact-finding missions.

Meier not only took photos during this investigative period, but was able to bring forward several unique metal samples allegedly from the ET craft given to him by his contactors, all the while building up his ramshackle home, raising three kids and writing thousands of pages of profound material. He also dodged a rifle bullet while sitting with lead investigator, Stevens, on his front patio. So he was definitely being "watched", in all respects, by those who wanted to know the truth and those who wanted to stifle it. You would have to ask Wendelle Stevens re. the 24/7 schedule. I do know Stevens reported that there would be no way Meier could fabricate the evidences he brought forward during that period of time. The Meier Chronicles video and the movie Contact by Genesis III will give you more of an idea of what transpired.

As far as the 19 (now over 20) people who tried to off Meier: Some were self-confessed nut-jobs, others were sent on behalf of some "group" that couldn't have someone like Meier writing down and disseminating the truth about everything from UFOs coverups to how many popes actually believed in god. None of those assassin wannabe's are in custody as far as I know.

MichaelHorn,

Researching a case for 25 years does not mean everyone has to take your outlook and opinions of this claim by Meier as fact.If you are genuine in wanting to try and verify whether the claims made by Meier are indeed true,you would welcome questions by people that may or may not have been asked before.It simply does not matter whether they have viewed a picture for a few seconds or studied vast amounts of this case for years.As a researcher you would welcome any input which may help solve it once and for all.

Unfortunately you seem to have already made your mind up and ignore any questions asked by members of this forum.Instead you respond with posts like 'I've researched this for 25 years you should try the same' or with links to your website which of course is blatently biased.

The fact remains that there are discrepencies in what Meier has offered as evidence.These points have been brought up in previous posts and so far have not been answered sufficiently in some peoples opinions.

I,like many others,simply would like to have answers so we can form opinions like yourself.

Aurelius,

Thankyou for replying to my questions.I appreciate the time you have spent doing so.

Although i personally do not think that this is a geniuine encounter,i at least enjoy reading into the subject the same as most on these forums.Who knows,once i've read into it some more i might become a believer!

I haven't read it, but Kal K. Korff 's Spaceships of the Pleiades: The Billy Meier Story is apparantly a good debunker of this 1975-1978 episode.

Spaceships of the Pleiades: The Billy Meier Story

Now, if you want to read a debunking of that, check out Analysis of Korff's Spaceships of the Pleiades by Jeroen Jansen

A very good read.

I give up, you win...

See you around.

Sariel,

No one has to, nor should they believe me or Meier, of course. And you're absolutely right, the years per se mean nothing but the results of the research, I dare say, lead me to no other possible conslusions. I indeed welcome any input that can contribute to the understanding of the case. But I'm not interested in the rehashed, disproven or illogical claims of people who haven't taken the time to research, study and think but who only wish to foist off unsubstantiated claims as legitimate criticism. And that, and the comments that follow, are not directed specifically at you or anyone else here, I don't have enough experience with the members here to be that accusatory though I've encountered in my work a significant number of people to whom these comments apply, in my opinion.

As far as making up my mind, let me try to express what I've concluded and why. At the very least, the Meier case is authentic in as much as the objects are real, full-sized, of unknown origin and not hoaxed by any means. I base this on having examined all of the research material that I know of that was done not only by the original investigative team but by independent scientists and experts who evaluated Meier's physical evidence. And the testimony of numerous credible witnesses, many of whom passed PSE lie detection tests, some of whom took their own photos of the ships.

Regarding the links to my website, on what do you base your remarks that they're biased, have you read them all? You are certainly free to question and/or inform me of the bias you found. I have written about what I consider to be an even higher standard of proof than the physical evidence, i.e. the prophetically accurate information that Meier has been provided with for about 50 years - or more. I cite dozens of very specific examples, which are only a small fraction of the information of this kind that exists in the Meier material.

I challenged CFI-West to back up their claim that Meier's photographic evidence was an "easily duplicated hoax" - they failed after three years. James Randi retracted his claim that the case is a hoax.

I absoutetly don't know if everything in the Meier case is true and accurate but, as far as the physical evidence goes, how about ONE photo (out of 1,200), ONE film (out of eight), ONE sound recording (out of four), ONE video, ONE metal alloy sample (out of one-dozen)? And if just ONE is, what does that tell you?

The way anyone is going to determine the truthfulness of the Meier case is to review all available material, consider the man, his environment, handicap, lack of funds, resources, accomplices, etc. Consider the shear amount of time to produce this immense body of evidence and work in about three years, all while working to support his family, renovating a ramshackle farm house, etc. Are any of us up to that challenge, even in our relatively comfortable environments with all the technology available to us now?

The ease and glibness with which people dismiss or overlook the monumental nature of Meier's accomplishments only confirms their lack of critical thinking ability and fundamental intellectual honesty, the same kind of people who could not have withstood an iota of the oppression and opposition he's had in the course of fulfilling his life's work. And yes, he's just a man, he makes mistakes, gets angry, etc. The lurking, inderlying (and probably religiously induced) notion that he, or anyone else, must be a "master", guru, perfect person, saint, etc., etc. should indeed be questioned.

How should contact come about? Who should the contactee be, etc.? And why in hell do we believe any of these shoulds anyway?

After asking myself why he was given all of this prophetically accurate info for the past 50 years it finally dawned on me: So that maybe, just maybe humans would have the simple, good sense to perceive the unparalleled level of accuracy and, based on that credibility, would at the very least be willing to look at what was foretold for the very near future - and what we might do to avoid the worst of it and get back on the right course.

What I have certainly concluded is that the Meier contacts are far less about UFOs, ETs and even Meier himself than they literally are about our future survival. I am more than willing to do what I can to provide information, suggestions, etc. because my own personal goal is to make the prophecies wrong. I'd love to be pivotal in the kind of awakening that is necessary. And it doesn't take an ET or a Swiss farmer to see that our world is in real trouble. But it may take the opening of some minds to perceive the truth and meaning of the case.

Regards,

MH






Text

Originally posted by Peronemlin

I give up, you win...

See you around.

oh come on - of course he won - nothing like making him sweat tho is it

Michaelhorn,

Firstly i confess i haven't as of yet had the time to actually look on your website,although when i have some spare time (my two little girls don't think i deserve any while they are awake) i will indeed take a look.The reason i say it is biased is because you come across as someone who believes the claims made by Meier to be true.In the same way that most of the other sites linked by other posters are biased as they seem to have made their mind up that they are false.

No offence is intended by my quote,i simply always have trouble finding what i consider to be truly neutral sites with anything related to ufo's.

One of the things that i'm sure most people will agree on with regards to the ufo topic is that it is littered with disinformation,hoaxes and outright lies.After all,listening/reading to many people we are being visited by Plaedians,Greys,Nordics,Reptilians,Demons that fly around in ufo's,some that are camped on the moon,some say we never have been to the moon.We have a crashed ufo in Roswell,no they are weather ballons,chupacubras running around,underground bases throughout the world full of aliens having laser fights with special forces,a vast colony of aliens living in Yorkshire and playing for Preston football team (sorry for my own little input there ) and countless more sightings of strange and wonderful things.

When all this is flying/walking around the planet with thousands of people claiming that they have inside knowledge about it,you can understand why i tend to view it all with sceptisism until of such time i have managed to read into it and form my own opinion.

So goodluck with what i presume is an on going reasearch into the Meier case and all other interests you may have in the wacky world of ufo's.I'm off to watch the West Indies get stuffed at cricket

Sariel,

Ah, as they say, confession is good for the soul. To clarify, I base my conclusions on the truthfulness of the case on the thoroughness of the examination of the physical evidence and, more importantly, on the unique accuracy of what I call the prophetically accurate information. Add to that the overwhelming and complex, non-contradictory circumstances in the case and it's impossible for it to be ahoax. However, I don't know that everything is true in the case as any number of things have not yet occurred which have been foretold, at least not yet. And I haven't read the 20,000+ pages of information that are still in German. I would love to know of any other cases that have even a fraction of the quantity, quality and variety of evidence to establish their authenticity, I personally know of none.

I think that I have reported and researched as neutrally as possible. I obviously have concluded that the case is authentic and aspects of it coincide with my own point of view. So I am not neutral in championing the case and what I perceive to be its purposes, etc.

So I couldn't agree more with you regarding all of the claims, which if half true would leave barely any room for us normally dysfunctional, imperfect humans, what with all the purported ETS, etc. taking up breathing space. If there was as much as a scale of proof from the slithery hide of the supposed reptilians I'd be interested in seeing it. There are too many people, some on this forum I think, who accept as fact the whole reptilian nonsense, presuming that every one in power is some kind of shape-shifting, slithering, slimey monster who secretly sunbathes on rocks, open-mouthed, ready to diminsh the fly population when they're not ruining the lives of mere mortals.

Of course, while you appear to be a sensible guy, I have to admit that I'm a bit suspicious of anyone who's that interested in stuffed crickets...isn't that considered a reptilian delicacy?

Funny that you don't enjoy a little ridicule when you have plenty of it for someone you don't know

yeah , your a real hero arent u , hope meiers was happy in you defending him like that

HE'S EITHER AN ABOVE-GENIUS LEVEL PHOTOGRAPHIC EXPERT, FILMMAKER, VIDEOGRAPHER, METALLURGIST, SOUND ENGINEER, SPECIAL EFFECTS WIZARD, MODEL MAKER, PHYSICIST, ASTRONOMER, HYPER-SPACE PROPULSION EXPERT, HISTORIAN, ARCHEOLOGIST, MATHEMATICIAN, LINGUIST, CLAIRVOYANT, MASS HYPNOTIST, ETC., ETC. OR...

A REAL CONTACTEE.

Now think real hard...which one is it?

i think the above comment is going a bit far - i wouldnt say he a genius or expert at anything , its pure exageration on your part.

so the question really is :-
he's either a really bored one armed man with lots of time on his hands to learn alot of little hobbies like photography, sound recording etc

or in contact with aliens ?

What are the troubling contradictions...and is that what really troubles you about the case?

see post id 701254 on page 11 of this thread by Peronemlin

And if you wish to make the claim of duplicating the sounds please go ahead and back it up.

ok

www.futuretrance.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk...

i didnt record this the same as my other version because its 12:50 am and i dont think recording loud feedback will go down well with neighbours etc but it does show you how the basic sound is done. of course without the same filter type/mic/speakers/amp meiers used etc you are going to get slightly different results

this was recorded by putting the headphone output into a mic input of a novation supernova2 rack virtual analogue synth.
echo was added and low pass filter was used to tame some screaching.
the feedback was adjusted with its comb filter comb frequency setting - the stepping u hear in the sound is down to the fact its not an analogue comb filter , its a digital one and only has 128 step resolution

MH: Gosh, and you want me to do everything fo ryou? I've spent 25 years researching the case, spend more than 25 minutees and you might be taken seriously. And, as far as the photo of the craft by the tree goes, go look at the video of it and you'll get all the scale you want.

a picture of this car with a person near it would be nice - just to prove that it exists outside matchbox scale


this picture looks plain wrong , if that is a full size tree then the grass looks roughly 3ft tall at its base. are there any pics of this tree with a person standing near it ?

I looked for info on comb filters on the web to get myself educated. Is there anything else I need to know about the model of comb filter that Meier would have used circa 1976? You mentioned you had an 8 / 16, but what do you suppose Meier would have used based on your knowledge? Another questions is, do you still have your sound posted anywhere? I'd like to have it reviewed and compared. Thx.

sorry , i have no idea what type of filter he used - it could be anything from a home made synth filter to something altered from a tv receiver.i could be wrong about how he made the noise as i am only reverse engineering the sound so to speak and there are many ways to get a similar sound.

on an other note - i have just invented a shrinking ray and shrunk a tin of deoderant to roughly 2inches tall !!!


u get my point ?



[edit on 24-7-2004 by acidhead]

[edit on 24-7-2004 by acidhead]

Nice sounds, now why not have them analysed, i.e. spectrum analyser and oscilloscope and see what you get, i.e. patterns, hertz range, audible/inaudible, etc. And, BTW, where are the outdoor sounds and do you by any chance have 15 or so witnesses (including a plainclothes cop) who'll attest to your making the sounds outside in a field as opposed to with your sound equipment?

But I'd say let's see how your sounds, when anaylsed, compare to Meier's. You have some of the info in the Sound Analysis Report. If you're right there should be no technical difference between the sounds, with the exception of all the above info and the fact that they were recorded on portable cassette tape recorders. Hey, maybe you've at least solved part of the riddle. Oh yeah, a man with only one hand doesn't have a lot of time on his hands, perhaps only on one.

As far as the photos of the ship are concerned, as I suggested view the video carefully, then explian and duplicate it (you can use two hands).

Acidhead, I listened to your sound, you have skills, but it did not sound like the UFO sounds Meier provided. To me it sounded like military alarm was going off in the distance, and reminded me of a race track a little bit. Thanks for the file though!

Nice sounds, now why not have them analysed, i.e. spectrum analyser and oscilloscope and see what you get, i.e. patterns, hertz range, audible/inaudible, etc.

you are barking up the wrong tree , sorry. the fact that it was done on different equipment will throw up different waveforms , different patterns etc.

and, BTW, where are the outdoor sounds and do you by any chance have 15 or so witnesses (including a plainclothes cop) who'll attest to your making the sounds outside in a field as opposed to with your sound equipment?

i didnt make it in a field , i made it in my home studio - if u want me to take a speaker into the garden and play the sound and then record it again to mix in some animal noises just for you then ill try and do it tomorrow if i can be bothered.

what are you trying to say on the last bit ? that because 15 people bore witness to him having loud noises comming from outside ? if i open the windows i will get about 40 people witness to mad noises comming from this house - what difference does it make.

did these 15 people see a flying saucer and hear this noise come from it or did these 15 people just hear a loud noise ?
if these 15 people heared a noise then isnt it possible he just played it loud on a speaker ?

But I'd say let's see how your sounds, when anaylsed, compare to Meier's. You have some of the info in the Sound Analysis Report. If you're right there should be no technical difference between the sounds, with the exception of all the above info and the fact that they were recorded on portable cassette tape recorders.

this is false - if u get 2 guitarists playing the same song on 2 guitars in 2 different rooms, just because they hit the same notes doesnt mean they will have the same waveforms. there are things like room reverbs , mic frequency response and countless other variables to take into consideration.

As far as the photos of the ship are concerned, as I suggested view the video carefully, then explian and duplicate it (you can use two hands).

why ? someone else has posted up links for fake ufo pics , all this 1 handed stuff as well - who cares how many hands he has , people with a limb loss usually can compensate for it in other ways - ie people with no hands learn to write with their feet etc , so stop making out this bloke is a total invalid.

the video of the ufo near the tree - u get a fake ufo , you put a small metal rod holding the ship up on the side that the tree is in the background , you also put a support bar going to the tree , you take the focus out of the camera enough to blend the bar into the tree and then u shoot a video of it.

it isnt impossible (please dont fire back the "well do it with 1 hand" #)

just out of curriosity - can you prove that i never created a shrink ray gun ?