You People Are So Dumb

What's going to corrupt this country is a bunch of neocons who spend half the time praising the Constitution and the other half nullifying it whenever it becomes inconvenient.

This country is already wholly corrupt. I guess you missed the first post in this thread.

The constitution has already been nullified by the federal government. 99.999% of everything the federal government does is outside its constitutional limitations.

Oh, btw, in my first post I state that people will be subject to 5 years in prison and a 250K fine for failure to buy a private insurance package or pay taxes on a public plan.

Of course, the public plan isn't really public either, its to be administered by private insurance companies.

-for profit, of course.

I love how the democrats pushing this bill now act like this isn't what they really wanted all along.

The bill was written by insurance companies.

Indeed, the democrats in question didn't even bother to read the bill, let alone actually write it. The entire point of the healthcare bill, as with all bills the congress passes, is to restrict competition in the market to primary corporate sponsors and create a monopoly. The free market prohibits monopolies from forming, they only form when government intervenes.








[edit on 8-12-2009 by mnemeth1]

Well, the only real solution is a revolt, and there is one coming. Unfortunately, it will be one that will totally decimate the current system, even the "good" aspects of it. It is literally going to be a revolt that will throw the baby out with the bathwater.

reply to post by digitalBreakfast


lol ur a funny guy...i can see wot this guys tryin to say an he wants more people to stand up to these fat cats....but i preferre ur approach...sit back..do wot u enjoy doin...an let woteva happens happen

I understand some of what you are saying and also believe as you we are truly more beholden to corporations than most of us know. However the fact that this is more or less under our everyday radar is a huge, distinguishing factor in discussing that state of our government.

You throw the word "fascism" around pretty loosely my friend.

My father grew up in a single parent family in the Nazi occupied Sudetenland. After living with Nazis he was under the thumb of the Russians and Czechs.
He finally escaped to America in the late 40's.

With all due respect, you don't know a thing about what it is like to live in a fascist society. For all of its faults, we still live in a truly great country that, in the context of the rest of the world, offers its citizens a wonderful life. Sometimes its good to put things in perspective and realize how much you have.

Originally posted by mrsoul2009
I understand some of what you are saying and also believe as you we are truly more beholden to corporations than most of us know. However the fact that this is more or less under our everyday radar is a huge, distinguishing factor in discussing that state of our government.

You throw the word "fascism" around pretty loosely my friend.

My father grew up in a single parent family in the Nazi occupied Sudetenland. After living with Nazis he was under the thumb of the Russians and Czechs.
He finally escaped to America in the late 40's.

With all due respect, you don't know a thing about what it is like to live in a fascist society. For all of its faults, we still live in a truly great country that, in the context of the rest of the world, offers its citizens a wonderful life. Sometimes its good to put things in perspective and realize how much you have.

I don't throw the term around loosely, I throw it around because that's what it is.

Read up on it

volokh.com...

VC reader Steven Hamori thinks that Leiter (like many contemporary commentators and perhaps the editors of the American Heritage Dictionary as well) is confused about the definition of fascism, and misinterprets the oft-repeated Mussolini/Gentile quote that “Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power.” Hamori writes

[The quote] has circulated in the left wing blogshere for as long as I can recall… I believe it to be a real one too although some credit it to Giovanni Gentile (Mussolini allegedly took credit for it while not originally uttering it).[According to Wikipedia:]“Gentile, described both by himself and Mussolini as ‘the philosopher of Fascism’, was the ghostwriter of ‘A Doctrine of Fascism’ which, signed by Benito Mussolini, described Fascism in the Italian Encyclopedia (which was edited by Gentile).”

The problem is that a ‘corporate’ in Italian of the period is not a business organization. A corporate is a production planning board made up of workers, owners, and others involved in production advocated by the syndicalist school of socialism. Their beloved quote is actually Mussolini (or maybe Gentile) making a connection between fascism and socialism . . .

[Again, Wikipedia]“Historically, corporatism or corporative (Italian corporativismo) is a political system in which legislative power is given to corporations that represent economic, industrial and professional groups.”

“Under Fascism in Italy, business owners, employees, trades-people, professionals, and other economic classes were organized into 22 guilds, or associations, known as “corporations” according to their industries, and these groups were given representation in a legislative body known as the Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni.”

Hamori concludes:

I doubt Leiter knows anything about the history of fascism. Intellectually, the progressive left has a lot more in common with it than the ‘libertarian right’ (the real liberals). . . . If anyone advocates a merging of ‘business corporate’ and state it is the regulation happy / anti competition left. The average ‘right winger’ says let an uncompetitive business fail.

In fact, I would go so far as to say Mussolini's system of fascism is MORE FAIR AND JUST than our current system which only provides representation to the monied elite and mega-corporations that can afford to dump millions into political coffers.

It is a sad day indeed.

At least under Mussolini's system the little corporate thugs would get a say too hahaha.

The fascist political system we have now is an outrage and completely unconstitutional.

reply to post by mnemeth1


I don't have to read up on it - I know exactly what it is - and your "definition" is fine and dandy but I profoundly disagree with your premise.

Try not to hate America so much...

Originally posted by mrsoul2009
reply to post by mnemeth1

 

I don't have to read up on it - I know exactly what it is - and your "definition" is fine and dandy but I profoundly disagree with your premise.

Try not to hate America so much...

I love America.

If I hated it, I wouldn't care so much about it.

If you agree with the definition, then its Orwellian to disagree with the premise, since my premise IS the definition.

We live in a fascist country that has thrown the constitution in the trash.

Originally posted by mnemeth1
Fascist Soup [
Healthcare Bill = 250,000 Fine And 5 Years In Prison For Not Buying Private Insurance Coverage


G





[edit on 8-12-2009 by mnemeth1]

What utter unmitigated garbage. The quoted penalty is the max for tax evasion. not for failure to get heaalth insurance. It is like claiming that you go to jail for 5 years for working overtime. Next you'll post a link to a study reporting prison deaths and you will then claim the penalty for no health insurance is death. Admit it. A black man is president and you can't stand it. So in a blind racist rage you post sewage like this.

Originally posted by 4nsicphd

Originally posted by mnemeth1
Fascist Soup [
Healthcare Bill = 250,000 Fine And 5 Years In Prison For Not Buying Private Insurance Coverage


G





[edit on 8-12-2009 by mnemeth1]

What utter unmitigated garbage. The quoted penalty is the max for tax evasion. not for failure to get heaalth insurance. It is like claiming that you go to jail for 5 years for working overtime. Next you'll post a link to a study reporting prison deaths and you will then claim the penalty for no health insurance is death. Admit it. A black man is president and you can't stand it. So in a blind racist rage you post sewage like this.

You mean evading a fee for private insurance imposed on your paycheck by force of government.

If you do not purchase insurance, government will forcibly confiscate the money for a private insurance package from your paycheck.

I guess you missed the post that details the "public option", which is to be administered by Kaiser Permanente for profit.

Bottom line, if I refuse to pay for insurance, public or private, the government will throw me in prison.



[edit on 8-12-2009 by mnemeth1]

Damn, that rant was so good I had to lay back and smoke a cigarette when I was done reading.

reply to post by mnemeth1


Whatever you say dude.

If we were truly living in a fascist society you'd be getting a hard knock on your door soon....

What's truly great is that we can have these discussions.

Originally posted by mrsoul2009
reply to post by mnemeth1

 

Whatever you say dude.

If we were truly living in a fascist society you'd be getting a hard knock on your door soon....

What's truly great is that we can have these discussions.

I'm sure that will be coming to an end soon enough.

It always does in these kinds of situations.

The name for these people are ''New Age Mobsters". And many states are involved in the rackets.

Originally posted by mnemeth1
Fascist Soup reports:

Seriously.

I mean how much more damning evidence do you need?

Our entire government is run by a bunch of fascist pigs that do nothing but bend over backwards for international corporations and commercial banks.

Gore + Enron = Cap and Tax Creators

Goldman Craps = Carbon Derivatives Ponzi Regulator more here.

GE + Westinghouse Energy = Lobby For Cap and Tax (of course, they own the major TV networks which support the endless stream of anti-humanist agitprop)

Goldman Craps = Trillions In Fraud and an Oil Scam

Goldman Craps = Billions Looted In Bailouts

Goldman Craps = The Reason Obama Was Elected

Shell Oil = Strategic Partner For The CRU

JP Morgan and Goldman Craps = Authors Of Carbon Derivatives Legislation

Healthcare Bill = 250,000 Fine And 5 Years In Prison For Not Buying Private Insurance Coverage


God I love democrats and republicans, they really know how to ram a fascist police state down the public’s throat.

[edit on 8-12-2009 by mnemeth1]

Its people like you Mnemeth1 that instill hope in my life. I hope that people will find the courage and strength that you have to stand up and fight back against those enslaving our people. Someday, well be so sick of it that well take back whats ours.

Weve let this problem slide down for decades, smart individualistc minds once many years ago had the same conversation we are all having here. Has anything changed??? Absolutely not, were now moving to more desperate extremes when it comes to fixing this huge cancerous issue.

I applaud and salute your thoughts!!

If people do something about it now they will get crushed. These guys have the police backing them up, and American police are veery well equipped.

I believe the main reason why people won't revolt because the elite have mastered the ability to alter our thoughts. They have already bought out the media, the government and law officials. They keep us busy with entertainment, debt, and high hour-low income jobs.

You keep the person busy enough not to meddle around their business, and they get free play.

reply to post by Equinox99


Your very right,but when will these people in these agency's realize their being used as pawns?

I am so sick and tired of thread after thread:

The government is destroying America!

We need to revolt!

Overthrow the government!

Wait....how can we do that?

We can't do that!

Nobody will get off their arses to do anything!

Oops....there went our Bill of Rights.

Wow....I believe that's the Constitution burning on the White House's front lawn!

Wake up people!

Oh...you're awake?? Hmmm..now what?


I'm not criticizing ATS members anymore than I am criticizing myself. And no, I don't have any answers -- I just think that at this point we need to come up with some. Pronto.

The only thing that seems to matter to the government is money. The best way to curtail their latest endeavors designed to send us all to the poor house is to remove the only thing fueling the fire. Also known as MONEY.

How we are going to get enough people to withhold payment to the government though is the dilemma. Too many people are too scared and I don't really blame them -- the system is designed to make you fear the repercussions of not paying.

I no longer have our taxes taken directly out of our paychecks and instead have opted to pay "estimated taxes". That was the best idea I could come up with (that's legal) to get as much money into my hands as possible. My thinking is that if the system does eventually collapse, I will have put as much money into my mattress as possible.

Not sure if that was the right thing to do or not -- but I had to do something.

Like I said, there are many members of this site that can come up with some ideas that will actually have an impact. My hope is that they will surface soon and share their wisdom.

Otherwise, the threads about a possible collapse will be replaced with an actual one.

When situations get worse ,and they will, those that are affected with a short temper will fly off the handle,they will either get arrested or get support from those locally in similar situations , there ain,t enough prisons for detaining everyone, so when things start getting nasty those at the top will just get on a plane and dessert the country, leaving all to manage on your own.

If you have 10% unemployed this will rise but there will still be a large amount of people working, most will notice a deteriation of standards,goods ,services, rising prices, ? there will be far more crime ,attitudes will change towards negativity.as fear becomes more prevelant

The rest of the world is going to notice big changes, to stop the collapse of usa, and also to stay competetive ,world currencies will devalue , and so problems world wide will develop,
You were all given advice as to what should I DO on many occasions, and you was told, to store as much as you can in ALL things that you will need,
the more independant you are the better.
There is a good chance of damage reduction if good genuine people like RON PAUL take the lead,
whatever happens the people of usa will have to make drastic cuts in their standards and accept a lot less,other wise it could implode.
According to the bible ,in the last days difficult times far worse than the world has seen, maybe these times are NOW?
Try to help those a little who are worse off than yourself, keep as many virtues as you can , most important is love. If half the population help one person each, then we should all get through this.
we can do it, together.