Christianity, Satans Greatest Deception

reply to post by iamcamouflage


I like the premise. There were plenty of attempts to control people prior to the Biblical god with a huge selection of other gods. Maybe this story finally stuck. Look, if you throw enough stuff against the wall....

I've thought about the "Tree of Knowledge" concept in the garden and what possible sense does that make? If you look at it from a parental standpoint and we all have these instincts within us. If you're a parent, don't you want to pass all possible knowledge on to your children? Does a parent hold back such vital knowledge from a child? I for one want to see my children thrive and go further than I have. I am not jealous of their success. If we are all "God's children" and we were made in his image why wouldn't he have the same feeling toward us? To withhold such information seems like a petty and teasing thing to do. Who would do that a loving parent or a deceiver? If we were incapable of dealing with the knowledge why is that? He made us imperfect and incapable and wants us to live continually dealing with our imperfections? Again that sounds like jealousy.

Jealousy is what a tribal wise man not a loving creator would base his words to live by on. The Bible was written by men to control men. Not a god and not a satan. At some point in time early religion must have explained the unexplainable. A god of the wind, or earthquakes, or trees or water. But at some point people realized they could control others for either good or bad with these superstitious doctrines. Keep in mind that not everything contained within the Bible or most religious doctrines is entirely bad. In the Old Testament there are Kosher laws. People didn't know the whats and whys of food spoilage, microbiology. And so you tell your people not to eat the shellfish, it can kill you! That was a true and good thing at that time. It has much more impact on the simple minded when "GOD" says it and not Irv the wise man. This just was not a god laying down the law, it was a high priest or what have you. ONe guy or maybe a few guys just ahead of the curve. And they didn't know the whats and whys either because they didn't have modern laboratories. They just figured out the odds were good that you would get sick or die eating the shellfish. They were observers of the natural world and human behavior. Eventually these wise guys would be called scientists and they changed from their long smelly robes into lab coats. (That alone probably helped their dating probability.) And so the tribal wise guys were trying to protect the tribal members. It's pretty simple when you break it down.

Now we've reached a point where we know how to properly prepare food. We've largely moved on from that but what of the rest of the mumbo jumbo? Some of us remain confused because as I've explained it's not all bad. That's the most confusing and almost evil part of religion, it's not all bad. We cherry pick the good parts and explain away the bad. There are some of us that still think they need a book to tell them don't kill, don't steal and don't eat the shellfish! How evil is shrimp cocktail? Delightfully so!

reply to post by The time lord


When it comes down to it, Jesus was appointed and whole at the beginning just as the Father. I don't think that is what is commonly disputed amongst religions. I think the term "Son of God" is what is being disputed. It needs to be re-evaluted and redefined. Are we not all Sons of God? Do we not all call Him Father?

On another note, I do think Jesus is our Kinsman-Redeemer. In OT books such as Ruth and Leviticus it was common to have a next of kin(blood relation) who functioned as a "kinsman-redeemer" if a family member was imprisoned. Likewise, Jesus became flesh and blood with us here on Earth so that he could be our kinsman-redeemer and absolve us of our sins.

The Head of Days, or Ancient of Days, is not often spoke of in the Bible. It is spoken of 3 times in Daniel and several in the book of Epoch. In the book of Daniel "Ancient of Days" is applied to the Son of Man in the essence of being eternal. Also, in the book of Epoch, the Son of Man and the Head of Days have eternal qualities as well.

It's a very difficult concept to grasp really. Was Jesus the Son of God? To answer that question I suppose we must be more like Simon Peter...

And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

isn't islam the greatest deception of satan?then where does that place christianity?

reply to post by andrewsymonds


The greatest deception of the satans is your mind. You have the ability to manipulate anything at your own will. Although you may see it as "examing" or something of that sort, thoughts may arise that aren't your thoughts.

The greatest deception is in our mind but then there must be the Truth and the truth shall set you free. If I was to perform and Satanic ritual to get me to heaven will it work, or do you believe in Christ, there are no different paths, either it is one or the other.

Originally posted by dusty1
Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

actually it makes alot of sense if you think outside the box just a little bit. you dont have to be so harsh hes just bringing up a new idea.

Originally posted by dusty1
Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

That made me chuckle.

Billy Madison.......good times.

Edit to add:

reply to post by RoyalCanadian


It's a movie quote and was meant with sarcasm not malice.

[edit on 26-11-2009 by DevolutionEvolvd]

Originally posted by Daniem
Hmmm, Satan behind the bible? Consider:

The conflict in the Bible between God and the Serpent, God was trying to keep a certain type of knowledge away from Mankind and the Serpent was trying to teach Mankind that knowledge. God made it a sin to eat of the fruit.

Why should learning knowledge be a sin?


If satan is behind the real world:
You are lead to think that you are the most advanced human earth has ever seen when in fact, the reverse is true. You are dependant on what someone else knows, for all your basic needs. Everything is prepared for you.


Can you make clothes?
Or do you get it in department stores.

Can you build a house?
Or did someone design it for you? Someone else built it?

Can you even gather food for your own survival?
Or do you get it at grocery stores


It was the learning of certain types of knowledge that was made a sin. Someone didn't want Man to learn that knowledge.
Knowledge that when studied, leads to the realization that earth is a prison where you can get trapped, and that unless you study this knowledge you will be forever controlled and never be free.

You think you know anything different than me? Someone has designed an education system that produces individuals who all think the same way.

Satan? Only him or someone like him would want us to live like this, as ignorant slaves, totaly dependant on him\them.

totally dependent on who? a compassionate God without any limits? or the serpent that lead us away from God, brought us to the world of matter, & would want to keep us trapped as long as possible (i.e. as the working class, serfs, slaves, the injured, the sick, the deceived, the usurped, or maybe just food)?

well said.....

Me personally understood God a lot more when I had children of my own. I found myself saying things to them and it was like oh... that's what God's been saying to me all along.

Comparing this to the tree of knowledge, sure you want your children to explore and learn but there are things you tell them not to get their fingers into, like the eletrical socket or rat poison.

Also as a parent, I definitely can understand a Jealous God. Maybe men these days can't because their happy to hand over their responsibilities as fathers to other men or anybody but I wouldn't want my children calling any other man Dad but their own.

Originally posted by Dookzor
reply to post by TarzanBeta

 

LOL, gotta love fundamentalist Christians contradicting themselves and their religion constantly and then leaving, convinced that they still have the moral highground.

A failing religion and people wonder why.

Edit - Just thought I'd link a previous post by TB to further showcase his hypocrisy.

www.belowtopsecret.com...

Nice one mate.

[edit on 26-11-2009 by Dookzor]

The thread's title is "The Easily-Offended Make me Laugh".

I am not easily offended. And I said this thread is -borderline- offensive because of the amount of stupidity within it.

I fully stand by my previous thread. I am human and I get agitated, and sometimes it's a mistake as to how agitated I become and the actions that follow, however I am not someone who is easily offended. I am an abrasive personality by nature, which is WHY I LAUGH AT THE EASILY OFFENDED.

I admit to a little hypocrisy in the aspect that as a Christian maybe I should be more understanding of idiocy...but...Not really. Being a Christian is about forgiving idiocy, NOT understanding it.

Now, if you, by your earlier post, intended to claim that the reason people do not like Christianity is because of people like me who are abrasive, then how is it that you can use MY VERY OWN THREAD titled, "The Easily Offended Make me Laugh" when the very basis of that thread is the fact that I should be able to call a FOOL a FOOL when I see one - and beyond that, that people should look inwardly and not outwardly for a reason for such name calling.

I understand my abrasiveness and I am sorry if it does offend you. I will immediately do my part in not calling anyone a fool as soon as they stop being one. I do not call a fool a fool without cause.

Beyond that -- Realize this much : By the OPs posts in this thread, it would be safe to assume, based on the topic at hand, that the OP could very well be Satan and that is the most logical argument against his argument. IF we are to consider a culmination of dozens of authors letters and writings as a document written by Satan, we could just as easily claim that the very OP is Satan attempting to discredit Satan as the author of said book fully KNOWING that the book itself was written by Satan! A never-ending trend of foolishness and stupidity and "circular logic", which you pointed out earlier, doesn't make you happy.

No, we should not tolerate stupidity.

Oh wait, maybe I should be more polite.

"Deny Ignorance."

We altered at the altar
when we lied about divine
and hid it in the vine.
Forbidden over time
the truth became a rhyme.
A riddle.
Who lies behind the triangle
with the fire in the middle?

This thread keeps returning to the "Tree of knowledge" allegory. Before eating of the fruit from the tree of knowledge there was no duality between good and evil. Should the question really be, whether God or Satan created the duality? Maybe it was the enlightenment that came from learning the truth?

I suppose if we were to carry this allegory forward into the present day the innocent Adam and Eves might be the public being led blindly by the main stream media. So once the ATS snake has driven us to understand that the media deceives, now where does the responsibility lie?

Originally posted by TarzanBeta

Originally posted by Dookzor
reply to post by TarzanBeta

 

LOL, gotta love fundamentalist Christians contradicting themselves and their religion constantly and then leaving, convinced that they still have the moral highground.

A failing religion and people wonder why.

Edit - Just thought I'd link a previous post by TB to further showcase his hypocrisy.

www.belowtopsecret.com...

Nice one mate.

[edit on 26-11-2009 by Dookzor]

The thread's title is "The Easily-Offended Make me Laugh".

I am not easily offended. And I said this thread is -borderline- offensive because of the amount of stupidity within it.

I fully stand by my previous thread. I am human and I get agitated, and sometimes it's a mistake as to how agitated I become and the actions that follow, however I am not someone who is easily offended. I am an abrasive personality by nature, which is WHY I LAUGH AT THE EASILY OFFENDED.

I admit to a little hypocrisy in the aspect that as a Christian maybe I should be more understanding of idiocy...but...Not really. Being a Christian is about forgiving idiocy, NOT understanding it.

Now, if you, by your earlier post, intended to claim that the reason people do not like Christianity is because of people like me who are abrasive, then how is it that you can use MY VERY OWN THREAD titled, "The Easily Offended Make me Laugh" when the very basis of that thread is the fact that I should be able to call a FOOL a FOOL when I see one - and beyond that, that people should look inwardly and not outwardly for a reason for such name calling.

I understand my abrasiveness and I am sorry if it does offend you. I will immediately do my part in not calling anyone a fool as soon as they stop being one. I do not call a fool a fool without cause.

Beyond that -- Realize this much : By the OPs posts in this thread, it would be safe to assume, based on the topic at hand, that the OP could very well be Satan and that is the most logical argument against his argument. IF we are to consider a culmination of dozens of authors letters and writings as a document written by Satan, we could just as easily claim that the very OP is Satan attempting to discredit Satan as the author of said book fully KNOWING that the book itself was written by Satan! A never-ending trend of foolishness and stupidity and "circular logic", which you pointed out earlier, doesn't make you happy.

No, we should not tolerate stupidity.

Oh wait, maybe I should be more polite.

"Deny Ignorance."

ah... nothing like an angry ranting christian. jesus would be so proud.

Satan is a liar and a manslayer.

According to the story in Genesis he told Eve she would not die if she ate of the Tree. Have you ever lost someone you love and felt the sting of death? Satan is responsible for the death of every human that has ever lived.

As the story goes, God designed everything. He made a man, gave him a job naming all the animal creation. Then God gave him a beautiful (naked I might add) woman and said "Fill the earth, the whole thing is yours". All except one tree. The whole earth and every animal would be subject to humans that would never die. Just do not touch one, tree, in the middle of the garden. Is that so much to ask?

The only "knowledge" God wanted to keep from humans were things like death, suffering , sorrow, grief, murder, rape, disease, hunger, We could go on and on.

Welcome to the world that was created by Satan. Bask in the knowledge he gave us. Then blame God for all the problems in the world.

Satan is not necessarily a bad guy. If the ego encourages individuality and separation, then that is a good thing. I mean, who the hell would want to spend their eternity, serving some "God?"

Anyway, I posted about this stuff on a thread call Kymatica, but that thread is gone, don't want to repeat them, so I'll just copy and paste them here:

Pretty interesting video. I guess everything happens for a reason, and the reason I watched this one is so that I can explain a little more of just how everything "might" work(and this one is pretty critical, because it may have to do with your eternity. Now I don't know what happens to your "soul memory" or "information" after this dimension, but if there's one thing that you need to keep in mind, keep this in mind.)

It has to do with this little "channeled" lesson that I read awhile ago, and it went like this. After everyone makes their way back to the highest(11th?) dimension, they'll have a choice to: keep their individual identities and experiences, or "to become one with God or the Ultimate Creator." The channeler didn't say just what exactly happens when you "become one with God," but we can infer that we will lose our identities, and that clearly is not a good thing(you want to be your own God, don't you?)

So clearly, this idea of to become one with the universe is not quite as "enticing" as it seems. Remember, the point of existence is to experience as many things as possible(and after seeing this very beautiful girl, I can only be thankful that I took this "contract" and be able to learn of this "possibility.") According to Hidden_Hand, God became Space to give us the appearance of individual identities. To try to find our way back to God would seem to defeat the purpose!

This video made the analogy of the ego to Satan. If the ego is giving us the illusion of separation, then clearly, he is NOT such a bad guy after all(and perhaps the reason why he chooses to "help" us out here is really because he doesn't want to continue his journey back to God, such a sly "devil" that he is).

If we were to connect that video with what Hidden_Hand said, then the introduction of Free Will is merely the introduction of the ego, which gives the illusion of separate identities. We can conclude then that this "consciousness of (our) universe" could merely be the reprehensible Yahweh, who did not how to "create" or "sub-divide." To think, then, that we should "unite" with "that guy" makes me sick to my stomach.

Anyway, I've been pondering, if this is all a game, then what if someone from Africa wanted out of this game? According to Hidden_Hand, Yahweh trapped us here, so maybe they don't really have a choice.

reply to post by dusty1


But what if I wanted to live in a world filled with extremely beautiful women(with their permission of course. I don't think you can just create whatever world you can think of, without other souls agreeing to participate in it)? Could that have happened, without Satan's interference?

[edit on 26-11-2009 by np6888]

reply to post by np6888


The world would have been filled with beautiful people. The motive in your heart would be good, by the way. Hey man, the Bible said the first humans were created naked. They only realized they were naked after they ate from the tree.

reply to post by np6888


Perhaps the Garden of Eden is an ongoing dimension. When we read in the news about some member of the Clergy being charged with sexual predation what was really going through the Priests mind? Could he have been in some kind of Spartan fantasy where homosexual contact with underage boys is not a sin? Does the innocent child not feel the exploitation until later after he has eaten of the fruit from the tree of knowledge? Does the responsibility lie with God, the Priest or the young boy? Or maybe it is all Satan's fault the young boy feels victimized later?

reply to post by fromunclexcommunicate


The priest is responsible for his own actions and should be punished. If his superiors knew he was capable of that conduct, they should be punished as well. The priest serves Satan and his own twisted desires.

Originally posted by iamcamouflage
Is it unreasonable to believe that Christianity is the devils greatest deception?

Not if there are facts to back it up. You seem to be on to something.

Try not to use the Bible as a reference because, if the Bible was inspired by Satan then it could not be used as a source to prove that Satan did not inspire it.

Why fear the bible? If is was inspired as you say, it can and should be included as a source to prove or disprove it. Most humans seem to fear things they perceive may be capable of overpowering them.

How can you be sure that the Bible was not inspired by Satan?

The only way to find out is to make a judgment based on an impartial evaluation. Even the bible has a quote that says, Test all things, and hold firmly that which is good. (1 Thes 5:21)

If Satan is able to deceive, how can you know that you are not being deceived into believing and worshiping a religion that is actually inspired by Satan?

It sounds like you are saying jesus is a deception.
We won't argue with you on that.

11:14 ...Satan masquerades as an angel of light. It is no great thing therefore if his servants also masquerade as servants of righteousness, (2 Cor)

We are not sure why you would not want to utilize the bible. It seems like it supports portions of your concept.

Satan came to earth as Jesus

to convince humanity to worship a false prophet?

That is pretty close to what the bible says is going to happen. In fact it states in Matthew 24:5 For many will come in my name, saying, I am the Messiah. Interestingly enough there is a lot of information in the bible that supports much of your concept. Even the numbers that are supposed to be used to calculate a particular entity add up to the image that is worshiped and the name. jesus adds up to 616 in Hebrew. j=yod=10, e=niquud=n/a, s=shin=300, u=vav=6, s=shin=300. 666 calculates to be its image. It appears that this supports your concept quite well.

Reference

[edit on 26-11-2009 by The Riley Family]