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What is the true story of Genesis and why was Lilith conveniently left out???

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posted on Sep, 27 2009 @ 09:02 AM
Good post Shane thank you for taking the time to write it up, I will reply in full later.

posted on Sep, 27 2009 @ 09:05 AM
True story of Genesis....

Tree of Knowledge = First Fruit = First "God Child"

Tree of Life = Bloodline ancestral lineage of First "God Child" = Died with Death of "God Child"

Lilith = Adam's First Wife = Sister of Satan = Mother of "Canaanites" = Teacher of Black Arts/Sorcery

posted on Sep, 27 2009 @ 02:34 PM
To the OP:

Lilith was never left out of the Creation, although her name has been left out. She is the serpent in the tree, no less. She was the ex-wife of Adam, left for a spawn of his own flesh. Quite nasty when you look at it. The whole Eden tale is a demonstration of how Adam, together with Jahveh and Lilith lures Eve into the dualist mysteries of law, science and language. How making Eve do something she was told not to, and what consequences it brought about, was the plan all along that Eve should eat from the fruit of knowledge from the hand of Lilith. One charming detail not many realise: We know that Eve and Lilith were cursed by God for having eaten the forbidden fruit. But what about Adam? The Earth is actually cursed in his place. Adam actually runs free of God's punnishment.

posted on Sep, 27 2009 @ 06:10 PM
In other words. When God created humans in the first chapter of the book he made them to be male and female, or shemales if you like. However Adam didn't fancy his dress so he asked God to change hisgenetic makeup and do surgery on him, to take out a cell from him and close the shameful wound DOWN THERE, as the Hebrew text shows us. Well, the result was Eve, and the most subtile creature of Eden, who was Lilith, fooled Eve by the Tree of Awareness where Adam had already cut himself off, leaving the Earth with his curse. Until Adam denied himself and forced God to split him ion half, there wasa sense of calm in Eden. Ever since there has been greater and greater perversities contra the laws of life. Adam chose to be beast instead of angel, and to be honest it makes me sick. Seamingly, this world has no sense of sense.....

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 01:57 AM
None of that is written in the scriptures

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 10:52 AM

Originally posted by slymattb
None of that is written in the scriptures

It is not? It is written in plain sight in the Hebrew text. We were created in the likeness of God and his angels. These creatures have always been discribed as being hermaphrodites, having both male and female organs. Translate word for word from a Hebrew Tora the verse 1:27. It says that God created Adam in His own image and likeness, and that He created the same Adam to be male and female.

Further, in Genesis 2:21, God puts Adam under full narcosis, and while sleeping, God takes out one Heb. "Tsela", and that He close up the "sexual organ" (basar) "down there".

The word translated rib in our bibles, is the Heb. word Tsela, which has the exact same etymology as Lat. Cella or English Cell, meaning a smal room closed room in buildings like temple structures; like a monk's cell or a prison cell, and today's Hebrew speaking nuclear biologists call the cells they work with for Tsela's.

As for the different Lilith stories, you'll have to go to the different traditions of what is normally refered to as the oral Tora. And also Rabbinical and Talmudian litterature, together with the Kabalah. The most common acknowledgement is that Lilith was the serpent in Eden.

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 12:09 PM
Whilst it is true that a lot of information that neo christian states is contained within the Oral tradition of the Torah.

All the teaching I received (from jewish and chassidic sources) states that the serpent was Sa'tan not Lilith. I have never heard the serpent refereed to as Lilith before.

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 12:52 PM

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
Whilst it is true that a lot of information that neo christian states is contained within the Oral tradition of the Torah.

All the teaching I received (from jewish and chassidic sources) states that the serpent was Sa'tan not Lilith. I have never heard the serpent refereed to as Lilith before.

It's from Kabbalah, in the Zohar as far as I remember. Here Lilith is the cunning serpent (Nachash) in the Tree (Ets) of Knowledge (Dahath -- some trace the Eng. word Death to this word) of Good (Tob) and Evil (Ra).

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 01:06 PM
Lilith is not alone in being overlooked.
Before Adama there was Adapa.
Lilith has a closer relation to Adapa, and was probably the wife of Adapa.
Adapa was taken away by the Gods.
Adama was his replacement.
Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned!

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 01:18 PM
reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic

Can you quote the passage ? I have a copy here and cannot find anything at an easy glance which would suggest that Lilith was the serpent.

Indeed a reading would suggest that she was not even in Eden when the fruit was eaten.

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 01:19 PM

Originally posted by Cosmic4life
Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned!

Well said, Cosmic! Well said. Talking from experience, no male person has yet to express such wild fury as certain females in my life. No mystery then that the name Eve or Shevah with minor changes to the word, may mean beast in Hebrew and Destroyer and "God of Death" in Sanskrit among other things.....

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 01:21 PM

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic

Can you quote the passage ? I have a copy here and cannot find anything at an easy glance which would suggest that Lilith was the serpent.

Indeed a reading would suggest that she was not even in Eden when the fruit was eaten.

I'll take a look through my notes, I'm quite sure it was in the Zohar, and since my Hebrew is quite "slecht" I have to look to find a translation somewhere. I'm on it now....

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 02:11 PM
reply to post by gYvMessanger

First read the commentary for

2. Beresheet A : 25. Idolatry - bloodshed - incest
Verse 268.
[...]The nakedness OF THE SHECHINAH is Lilit, the Mother of the mixed multitude[...]

And further in

2. Beresheet A : 28. Hevel-Moshe
Verse 285.
[...] THE MEMBERS OF THE MIXED MULTITUDE are the children of the primordial Serpent that seduced Chavah BY THE TREE OF KNOWLEDGE, so the mixed multitude is indeed the impurity that the Serpent injected into Chavah [...]

As you can see Lilith is displayed as the Mother of the gentiles (mixed multitude), and in turn the gentiles (mixed multitude) are the children of the Serpent. Good enough?

For the complete verses, go to this online search in the Zohar

It is written between the lines in secretive language, the truth in plain sight that few notice....

[edit on 28/9/2009 by Neo Christian Mystic]

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 02:52 PM
Seems theirs some misconception about who lilith was..i saw a dcoumetnary on this, history channel, 2 or 3 years is siad, lileth was the first eve...they had argued over the missionary position for sex, and it booiled into a heated argument, between the 2. Lileth ran off, leaving adam, and curisng man, and vowed to impose a curse on al mankind. Hence forth this is how the succubus was created* at least this is what i remember from the history channel. After her abscence, god made anew woman for adam EVE.

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 02:55 PM
You have to realize though..theirs LOTS of missing info from th bible, jesus's childhood..those are found in 2 books, if i remember coorectly the apostols of peter and Nicodemus. Thier is no mention, of where able is it? his wife comes from, it is speculated to be incest* he married his sister. Thier is a differnece between the hebrew bible, which seems much more 'treuthful', the christian bible, catholic, protestant ect ect roman catholic it goes on and 2 are identical to eachother.

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 07:18 PM

Originally posted by jinx880101
reply to post by AshleyD

But if she appears over and over in the Torah, and the torah is older than the Bible...what makes the Bible the right version?

It's not the Torah she appears in, but the mishradic texts.

The presence of named angels in the story indicates that the midrashes mentioning Lillith were written after 100 BC, so they're a lot newer than the Torah (Pentateuch... first five books of the Bible.)

And yes, the Bible is a created and edited anthology book. The individual books, along with hundreds of religious texts, were considered for inclusion in a "book of the Christian faith" (Biblios, or Bible for short) in 380 AD or thereabouts:

A number of the books such as Genesis, are known to be edited from multiple sources. There are at least 4 authors (J, E, P, and D) whose works were put together by an editor (R, the redactor) to create the "original" book of Genesis.

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 07:32 PM
reply to post by Byrd

Allthough the texts refered to as Midrash or Kabbalah or Talmoud etc. are of relatively young age, they rest on ancient oral traditions and schools within the Hebrew culture as old or older than the books of the Bible. It wasn't until after the Babylonian exile that many of these, already then, ancient oral traditions were structured and collected into what we today know as Kabbalah and Talmoud etc.

Just like we learn in Sunday school today that Jesju drew a fish in the sand and likened it to the kingdom of heaven, Jews and other Hebrews still teach stories to explain the Torah etc. and these stories are often older (based on archaeology etc) than the written texts.

posted on Sep, 28 2009 @ 08:17 PM
reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic

I think that's a very tenuous connection to make. The Zohar is not meant to be read literally, the first verse quoted is a discussion on misplacing your faith, the second verse is a discussion of the rectification process of past wrongs.

A full reading of the second quote to me clearly indicates that the subject matter is describing the evil inclination, which is commonly referred to as Satan.

The only way you can make those two verses stick together is through an absolute literal take on the matter, and only if you were specifically looking to make that connection. I would again suggest that if your reading the text literally you know your getting it wrong.

The "secret language" is not so much a secret way to read between the lines as it is an understanding of scripture, a way of playing with keywords to link to phrases in the Torah, and manipulating words through Gematria. The reason why Orthodox Jews learning Kaballah have to study various other texts first is because the literal reading means absolutely nothing in context of the lesson your supposed to be learning, and you cant get the lesson from the text without understanding all the supporting framework.

I'm still trying to locate the passages in my hard copy, the online Kaballah Centre copy you linked is riddled with their own commentary, some of which is clearly wrong (the mixed multitude is not meant to represent the gentiles). Also for other people reading this conversation the Zohar (in any form) is not scripture, and its authenticity could be called into question (though not the validity of the majority of its teaching) if you felt so inclined.

Even though the books do rest on the oral tradition, that doesn't mean everything in them comes from the oral tradition, their are various Jewish sects which reject them saying they aren't authentic in that they are works created by rabbinical jews since the fall of the temple as opposed to direct information passed through the schools as was done before the fall of the temple.

If anything the Zohar in particular is suspect as it didn't turn up openly (even amongst the jewish community) until the 13th century and the form of Kaballism practised by the Jews who never left the area around Israel were not influenced by it, suggesting that whilst it did contain information the elders recognized as being correct, it in itself should not be considered a word for word oral tradition.

[edit on 28-9-2009 by gYvMessanger]

posted on Sep, 29 2009 @ 10:56 AM
reply to post by gYvMessanger

Bacharach, ’Emeq haMelekh 23c-d -

"And the Serpent, the Woman of Harlotry, incited and seduced Eve through the husks of Light which in itself is holiness. And the Serpent seduced Holy Eve, and enough said for him who understands. An all this ruination came about because Adam the first man coupled with Eve while she was in her menstrual impurity -- this is the filth and the impure seed of the Serpent who mounted Eve before Adam mounted her.

Zohar Sitrei Torah 1:147b-148b, Jacob’s Journey -

"The secret of secrets:
Out of the scorching noon of Isaac,
out of the dregs of wine,
a fungus emerged, a cluster,
male and female together,
red as a rose,
expanding in many directions and paths.
The male is called Sama’el,
his female is always included within him.
Just as it is on the side of holiness,
so it is on the other side:
male and female embracing one another.
The female of Sama’el is called Serpent,
Woman of Whoredom,
End of All Flesh, End of Days.
Two evil spirits joined together:
the spirit of the male is subtle;
the spirit of the female is diffused in many ways and paths
but joined to the spirit of the male."

Treatise on the Left Emanation

"I shall explain this relying on the esoteric meaning in the verse "In that day the Lord will punish with His great, cruel, mighty sword Leviathan the twisted serpent and Leviathan the tortuous serpent"--this is Lilith--"and He will slay the dragon of the sea" (Isaiah 27:1). As there is a pure Leviathan in the sea and it is called a serpent, so there is a great defiled serpent in the sea in the literal sense. The same holds true above in a hidden way."


In my mind there is no doubt that the feminine serpent counterpart of former Arch Angel Samael ("the blind archon (of God)" or "the poison of God", the angelic name of Satan before the fall), is Lilith ("the screech owl" or "the creature/demon of the night/desolation/miscarriage") and nobody else.

The story goes that God decided that Adam and Eve were ready to become enlightened, so he orders Arch Angel Raziel, guardian of the highest heaven and the protector of all knowledge, to write a book containing all true and divine knowledge and give the book to them. However, Satan (or Samael) thinks this idea is bogus, so he makes 1/3rd of the angels of God svwear allegiance to him and together they rebell against the other 2/3rds, and conspire against Man and God through stealing the Book of Raziel (the Spark of Heaven) and they seal it with chains and drops it down at the deepest deep of the oceans. Later. Much later, God understands what has happened, that the light he had intended Man to have had been taken away, so he judge Samael and delete his name from the book of life and renames him Sataniel, or "the enemy of God", and havs him thrown out of Heaven (a paralell to the curse of the serpent in Eden). God then orders Leviathan the old serpent of the Nile and as you can see above, the very Lilith, to retrieve the book and give it back to the human race, which she does.

posted on Sep, 29 2009 @ 12:00 PM
Good Post

I'll have to chase that up later.

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