Is Russia Posturing For War With The US?

Originally posted by Zosynspiracy
reply to post by Dermo

 

You thinking is typical. Arrogant, one sided, etc.

Arrogant, one sided?

Just because I don't see a war coming between Russian and NATO because both sides would be destroyed economically and militarily.. setting the world back 50 years?

How about the fact that it won't happen because noone wants a nuclear holocaust? Natural resources don't make one bit of a difference in one of those.

I hope you are from the US.. if so, then you have an excuse for thinking this because of Government paranoia that bleeds out through the media.
If you are not a US citizen, stop watching their TV!!

When Russia attacks, you can send me a PM saying "I told you so" .. I will find the closest hat to me and eat it.



[edit on 27/8/09 by Dermo]

Originally posted by MoothyKnight
HA! Russia can't attack us or they'll have our primary investors/partial owners to answer to, CHINA....

I don't think they are a threat regardless.

[edit on 8/27/09 by MoothyKnight]

You might want to rethink that...

Look, I live in the US..but I have to say..other countries are SICK TO DEATH of us...I talk to many many people from other countries, and they ALL hate us...we are like the stuck up brat kid that brags about how "my dad can beat up your dad"...

I have to say, I dont even like saying im from the US anymore..its nothing to be proud of , not in these days..our government is a laughing stock..

Kim Jung Ill is a loony. Russia knows this. Very possible that he may wake up and decide to attack Russia.

Russia does have valuable resources. Everything isn't about alliances.

HMMM......

Russia is deplying a missile defence system to defend against N.K.
(:lol

It kinda makes their temper tantrum over the US missile defense system seem kinda silly.

Or is it the Russia version of do as we say, "NOT" as we do????

Originally posted by neformore
reply to post by sanchoearlyjones

 

Was the US posturing for war with Russia when it decided to deploy its ABM system in Western Europe?

The Russians are as entitled to defend their territory as anyone else is, aren't they? Why would this be a precursor to anything?

I have to agree with the above poster in a sense. There's nothing wrong with protecting yourself or placing a deterrent.

If the US did fall Russia would be glad to have those in place not to mention Kim and all his threats I would do the same to be on the safe side.

Because if the US did fall chances are first thing Kim would do is go after South Korea and hope China backs him on it. Chances are China would stay a neutral party but chance is just that a chance nothing more.

It just looks like a defensive maneuver at this point we will just have to wait and see if anything else starts to go on the move.

Originally posted by sanchoearlyjones
Russia has deployed their highly advanced, and widely reported upon missle defense system as stated in the article; "The Far East".

How is this "posturing for war"????
Cause the U.S deployed their Missile Defense in Poland to protect against Iran?

LOL.

Tic for Tac

Originally posted by Zosynspiracy
reply to post by Dermo

 

You thinking is typical. Arrogant, one sided, etc. Russia has more oil, more natural gas, more timber, more minerals than all NATO countries COMBINED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Why for a second would you think Russia would be hurt economically if a world war ensued? In fact I think just the opposite. I think a war would spur economic growth and industrial output. It would be like what happened in in America during WWII. We became an economic powerhouse because all of our energy, manpower, innovation, money etc. went into military industry and the war machine. Russia is a vast country. War with NATO, US, Western Europe would be akin to throwing fire on gasoline especially since the US and Europe are in financial ruin right now. You act like the world relies on Europe and the US for everything. The US and Europe rely on the world for its natural resources. America is far from the country it was in the 1940s and 1950s.

You know how many countries would lend support to Russia if a war ensued as well? China for one would love to see American beat down.

Just to correct you a little bit. Russia does not have more oil than NATO countries. Canada has the second largest oil reserves in the world, the only non ME country in the top 5, Russia is number 8 on the list.

Originally posted by CanadianDream420

Originally posted by sanchoearlyjones
Russia has deployed their highly advanced, and widely reported upon missle defense system as stated in the article; "The Far East".

How is this "posturing for war"????
Cause the U.S deployed their Missile Defense in Poland to protect against Iran?

LOL.

Tic for Tac

The U.S plan to scrap Poland, Czech missile systems (PRESStv)

reply to post by heineken


You know looking at this video just made so much sense, why do countries keep so much money tied up in the military, and the answer is simple....... THEY DO NOT TRUST EACH OTHER!!

so ask yourself if the politicians don't trust each other why do we the people trust them?

because we are COMPLETE MORONS (no insult to the morons)

Hi All,

Okay so I found this the article in the OP. I left my description, or thoughts open. I did this because it is merely something to be VIGILANT of. Usually I am very opinionated, but because there isn't much here, it stayed open.

If anyone here is the aggressor it is the US; they have war postured for years now, and very openly.

I did read all the posts, and apologize for not responding to everyone of them, but no room in this posted reply.
*********************************************************

reply to post by neformore


go read my history of threads. I am definitely on the side of Russia. All I am being is VIGILANT.

General People have a right to know this is going on.


reply to post by Yummy Freelunch


Hi yummy, and Repub08,

See above comment for my feelings on this topic. It's similar to North/South Korea.......how they have soldiers mirroring each other.

reply to post by Dermo


Uh, I don't think Russia is any worse off than any other country right now. In fact since they had the Georgian War last year, they've faired better on selling gas to all of Europe.

reply to post by Peruvianmonk


Agreed!

reply to post by deessell


Sure, but they are allied up; along with Iran.


reply to post by System


Agreed

reply to post by mental modulator


sounds worthy of its own thread. Thanks for the sharing.

reply to post by Darthorious


I agreed too.

Originally posted by sanchoearlyjones

reply to post by Dermo

 

Uh, I don't think Russia is any worse off than any other country right now. In fact since they had the Georgian War last year, they've faired better on selling gas to all of Europe.

Yea, apart from the simple fact that they are still a developing economy/country..

That makes them an awful lot worse off than the worst western economies.. An awful lot worse even per capita than say.. Iceland who has completely melted down.

Russia has a GDP and military spending that is a good bit less than the United Kingdom..

WHAT MAKES THEM SO SCARY??

Simple.. US paranoia.

Hi all,
Seems to me Russia's upset about two important things, amongst other reasons:

US Defence Shield:: this allows WMD Missiles to go one way -- Russia, but not the other -- USA.

Offensive Technology:: At the time of of Russia's economical collapse, many years of R&D was handed to the USA.

Putin & Co know this and know their weapon and delivery systems technology is so far behind since, while their spy network has since seriously eroded to the point of no longer having the ability to steal US weapons technology so easily now.

I speculate the US' primary advancement is in it's delivery system vehicles
eg being able to reach all threats in a matter of minutes under the radar using superscret Mach 18 vehicles.

Decoy

Originally posted by sanchoearlyjones
Hi All,

The title states it all. Russia has deployed their highly advanced, and widely reported upon missle defense system as stated in the article; "The Far East". They reportedly did this to shield themselves from North Korea, but I don't think North Korea has ever been much of a threat to Russia. Especially considering they are on the opposite side of Russia of most Russian infrastructure, culture, and government.

However, what is over on their "Far East" is US friendly Japan, South Korea, and not to much further the Continental USA.

The amount of missiles deployed doesn't seem like that much, but the overall transfer of there seems odd. Something to definitely keep an eye on. Here's the full article below with a link.

en.rian.ru...

Russia has deployed advanced S-400 Triumf air defense systems in the Far East to counter the potential threat posed by N. Korea's missile tests, the chief of General Staff said on Wednesday. "We have already deployed a battalion of the S-400 systems in Russia's Far East in order to guarantee protection from failed launches of [N. Korean] missiles and to ensure that the fragments of these missiles never fall on Russian territory," Gen. Nikolai Makarov told a news conference in the capital of Mongolia. North Korea has test launched several ballistic missiles from its eastern coast since January. The missiles are believed to be Scud-type and traveled up to 500 kilometers (300 miles) before falling into the Sea of Japan. Makarov said Moscow was concerned over the proximity of North Korea's missile launch sites to Russia's borders, and would continue to take preventive measures, including the use of sophisticated air defense systems, to protect the country from failed launches. The S-400 Triumf (SA-21 Growler) is designed to intercept and destroy airborne targets at distances of up to 400 kilometers (250 miles), twice the range of the U.S. MIM-104 Patriot, and two-and-a-half times that of Russia's S-300PMU-2. The system is also believed to be able to destroy stealth aircraft, cruise missiles and ballistic missiles, and is effective at ranges of up to 3,500 kilometers (2,200 miles) and speeds of up to 4.8 kilometers (3 miles) per second. A regular S-400 battalion comprises at least eight launchers with 32 missiles and a mobile command post, according to various sources. The new state arms procurement program until 2015 stipulates the purchase of enough S-400 air defense systems to arm 18 battalions during this period. Russia has previously deployed two S-400 regiments to protect the airspace around Moscow and industrial regions in the central part of the country.

Wake Up, Stand Up,

Sancho

You're forgetting that China are in the mix as well..... hope the Chinkies are on our side!!

[edit on 30-8-2009 by john124]

Originally posted by neformore
reply to post by sanchoearlyjones

 

Was the US posturing for war with Russia when it decided to deploy its ABM system in Western Europe?

Damn right.
I say we pull every dime of us aid and military out of Europe, the med, the middle east and the far east.
Hell, let's just pull all of it and save a trillion or so a year.
We don't want to be seen as posturing.

Originally posted by Dermo
reply to post by heineken

 

Just because the music in that video gives a menacing impression while it shows images of tanks and soldiers doesn't mean Russia are looking for war. I could make a video like that for the Irish "Army" and guarantee it would scare people.. no matter how unfounded.

Fair enough, previous to WW2, war was a viable answer to bad economic conditions.. Not anymore though.

Do you think Russia would give up its newfound capitalism, wealth and progression (which has come in leaps and bounds since the fall of the USSR) for a war against NATO which it would undoubtedly lose and a collapse in trade with the EU which would completely decimate its economy?

eh? No!

you don't know the history of russia do you... even in world war 1, when the russians were in disarray and eventually bowed out because of revolution, nobody invaded them... they'venever been takin over in thier history. they defeated naplean, they defeated hitler, even the collapse of the USSR didnt lead the western countries of the world to try to invade russia.. i think war is more likely to break out between the ukraine and russia... perhaps that being the spark...

Originally posted by TheCoffinman
you don't know the history of russia do you... even in world war 1, when the russians were in disarray and eventually bowed out because of revolution, nobody invaded them... they'venever been takin over in thier history. they defeated naplean, they defeated hitler, even the collapse of the USSR didnt lead the western countries of the world to try to invade russia.. i think war is more likely to break out between the ukraine and russia... perhaps that being the spark...

I know plenty of History.. including that. But what difference does that make? People here are saying that Russia is a threat and posturing for war.

But what you are forgetting is that back then there was no NATO, no EU superpower, no US superpower, no China superpower.. No anti terror coalition... no global trade agreements, no United nations etc.. Just eugenics, far right and left politics and dictators itching for war.

The world is a different place now, Russia is a threat to no one in the west and if they do attack the Ukraine, which is highly highly unlikely.. unless the Ukraine stop paying their gas bill again.

The US is the biggest threat to world peace.. you should worry about what the pentagon or CIA have up there sleeves for the future. The views from Americans about war are insane, its not that easy for a massive war to break out these days... unless you have been told it is for your whole life.

Its especially not easy when two sovereignties hold half the worlds wealth and an alliance of rich countries has 15/16ths of the worlds military spending.

Originally posted by Yummy Freelunch
Well, now that we are "divided" , so to speak. Russia knows America is falling, we are broken..good time to take over...

It has been said by economists and strategists for over three years that America's reign is coming to an end, and that either Russia or China are in line to take over global leadership.

There are a couple of things to consider here...

1. Would America allow such a thing to happen naturally, or would the U.S. government try to prevent such?

2. Would China even try to compete against Russia, or would they form an alliance to strengthen their positions before a further battle between them?

I am very dubious about Russia, simply because their actions over the last few years have been escalating.

1. The murder of a dissident in the UK by Polonium 210 poisoning. This wasn't just a hit, this was an open threat to the UK. You don't kill opponents in this way unless you want to send a clear message to authorities.

2. Open war with Osettia (sp) and UN, NATO, US siding against them, at least verbally.

3. Russian Bomber incursion into UK airspace. Something that had been previously agreed but not acted on for several years.

4. Russian Sub found to have been damaged off of the UK coast.

5. Russian Subs off of the U.S. coast.

6. Russian crew "kidnapped" while shipping wood, and then reportedly held by Russian authorities. Not to mention their remarkable search and rescue efforts, for something not worth the cost?

There is more, such as the shutting off of Gas pipelines over contractual disagreements, opposition to defence and exercise measures by the U.S. and NATO, cyber attacks that were too blatantly blamed on Iran to be true, Russia and China (who else?) in talks to replace the $ with something else as trading currency.

There is definitely a lot more going on here than we are being told. IMO, Russia is awake and kicking. They know the time is coming to seize leadership globally.
And it wouldn't surprise me if the first wave was financial, with China assisting.

And no, I don't think it will be nuclear. All sides know that this will not get anyone anywhere. Sure, there'll be threats made, but there was an incident in the 80's where Russia *should* have responded with nukes believing the U.S. had fired, and they didn't. They waited, investigated, and quickly found that it was a system glitch.

Originally posted by Dermo


I know plenty of History.. including that. But what difference does that make? People here are saying that Russia is a threat and posturing for war.

But what you are forgetting is that back then there was no NATO, no EU superpower, no US superpower, no China superpower.. No anti terror coalition... no global trade agreements, no United nations etc.. Just eugenics, far right and left politics and dictators itching for war.

I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but you're wrong.

Hitler and the UK made agreements. Germany and Italy made agreements. France and Germany made agreements. The U.S. had business interests in Germany.

There were countless organisations, forums, consortium's, agreements and concessions made between all parties before Hitler went nuts, and it wasn't as simple as you are making out.

Yes, NATO might pose a threat to a Russian offensive. but where is this "EU superpower" in physical means? How is a weakened "US superpower" any different to the Anglo/French coalition in the 1940's? We were friendly with mainland Europe then too you know, Italy, France, Germany even.
When stating a nation is a superpower, that is only in comparison to their rivals. If you are talking about military might, yes the USA has some impressive fire-power COMPARED TO 1940's America. But how does it match up against a combined Russia/China force now?

The China Superpower is being addressed, and they are also in line to take leadership, so I don't know why you include them as a potential ally or an obstacle to Russia.
The anti-terror "coalition" is already fractured and is already based on each nations power, it's not a stand-alone military force.
There were global trade agreements, as there have been since global trade began. This would not affect a decision to go to war. If anything, such agreements would be utilised as another method of attack (see Russia shutting off gas pipelines, see nations blocking trade routes in times of war, see WW2 and the limited resources the UK had due to trade restrictions and the general chaos of war).
As for the UN, what do they do now? They have meetings and then issue statements slapping the wrists of governments they think have been naughty.

Yeah, the UN is a real threat to any ideas of taking power through force

When you suggest that a lot has changed since WW2, yes, indeed it has. But we haven't leapt forward in time and left the rest behind.
The lead up to WW2 was just as complex and relied on and involved thousands of agreements and allegiances around the world. Agreements were torn up, lies were told, deflection and coercion were rife.

Me personally I think Russia are on the good guys team heres why, lack of debt. They aren't owned by banksters and elitists as is shown by their national debt. www.visualeconomics.com... or lack of in this case

At least the Russians are able to push their own agendas unlike my country and the US.

The only reason everyone is so afraid of Russia is because we are led to believe that they are the bad guys, just because you hear it on the news doesn't mean its true.

reply to post by detachedindividual


Yea, yea, yea.. I know my WW2 history ffs.. How am I wrong?

As I said, No NATO, no world trade agreements, no UN, no EU etc etc.. I never mentioned any of the European pacts.

What is the EU superpower? 30% of the worlds economy. Softpower i know but it still holds serious sway over Russia. Therefore.. yes, it is a superpower albeit not in a military sense yet and hopefully never will be.

Anyway, basically, you are just arguing with me for the sake of arguing a point that has little to do with the initial thread.

Why do people quote things that happened generations ago and use them as prophecies for the future?

Take a look in the papers today about Russia and see what they have just done.. Putin visited Poland in order to mend burned bridges and apologize for his countries actions in WW2 and work towards making sure nothing like that ever happens again.. Does that sound like a country that is going to start attacking all around it?

As I said, the US is the volatile global power.. not Russia. Just because the world is balancing out power wise doesn't mean everyone wants a war.

[edit on 31/8/09 by Dermo]