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La Santa Muerte

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posted on Nov, 20 2009 @ 11:34 AM
This next linked article, written by Jared Taylor, appeared in The Monitor (namely, the one in McAllen Texas) of October 29, 2009.
Grenades sold to undercover authorities overshadow human bones found at San Juan property

Federal authorities arrested a 38-year-old man on felony weapons charges at a house where investigators said he manufactured scores of grenades and performed occult ceremonies with human bones.
Ruben Ambrosio Fonseca Jr. had his initial appearance in U.S. District Court on Thursday after undercover agents posing as drug cartel members purchased 183 grenades from him that he allegedly manufactured at a San Juan house, law enforcement officials said.
Federal agents and the San Juan police SWAT team raided the property Wednesday morning, finding weapons, firearms and a blood-stained altar alongside human and animal bones in the backyard.
The grenades were designed as improvised explosive devices, meaning there is no set time between when they are activated and when they would explode, authorities said.
The bones - presumably used in occult ceremonies - were legally purchased via a Web site. Pathologists continue to investigate the skeletal remains.
Meanwhile, police said that the bones found at the house were obtained from Skulls Unlimited International, an Oklahoma City-based retailer of skeletal remains.
San Juan Police Chief Juan Gonzalez said pathologists continue to investigate the human bones but do not anticipate filing criminal charges against anyone in connection with their discovery.
Police confirmed Thursday that a resident at the house had purchased a catalog and the bones from Skulls Unlimited and that they believe the human bones came from the company.
Jay Villemarette, owner and president of the bone retailer, said most of his company's business - about 90 percent or more - comes from the educational community. Still, his company sells bones to anyone who wants to purchase them.
"There's no rules or regulations that prohibit us from selling to the public," he said.
Investigators found the remains of several dogs Thursday morning buried in the house's backyard, as well.
They believe the residents at the house had been worshipping Santa Muerte, Spanish for the Death Saint, and were adherents of Palo Mayombe, a form of black magic that incorporates skeletal remains and animal sacrifice.
Anthropologist Tony Zavaleta, who currently serves as vice president for external affairs at the University of Texas-Bownsville/Texas Southmost College, has described Palo Mayombe as a "first cousin" of Santería and said it "requires a blood sacrifice, generally a chicken or goat." Both religions have Afro-Caribbean origins and their own sets of rituals and initiation rites.
Adolfo de Jesus Constanzo, the ringleader of a drug gang, infamously brought attention to Palo Mayombe two decades ago when Mexican authorities discovered mass graves at Rancho Santa Elena, west of Matamoros. Fifteen bodies were ultimately uncovered. Some of the victims had been killed in the conduct of the drug trade. Others, like that of Mark J. Kilroy - a 21-year-old student kidnapped and killed during a spring break excursion - were randomly selected and sacrificed in occult rituals.
"It's all mixed together," Police Chief Gonzalez said of the Santa Muerte and Palo Mayombe being practiced in the San Juan case.
A police badge found at the property belonged to a former Rio Grande City officer who has been located alive and well, Gonzalez said.
After finding the bones, police have treated their investigation as a homicide case, but with the revelation of the bones being purchased via the Web, it appears unlikely anyone was harmed, the chief said.
A U.S. Border Patrol cadaver dog helped locate the remains.
Skulls Unlimited sells a variety of skeletal remains - animal and human - and gets its inventory from "wherever we can get a legal supply," business owner Villemarette said ...
Despite the more than 7 billion humans that populate the world, "human remains are high in demand but not very plentiful," said Villemarette, who founded his company in 1986. Most human skeletons he sells come from educational collections, or Asia, depending on cultural traditions on honoring the dead.
"Every culture is different," Villemarette said, adding that in Western culture, "it would be taboo to sell grandma."

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

Several thoughts are aroused by this article. Number one is a little off, but, if I was a murderer and I was particularly attached to the trophy skull of my murder victim (whether because I thought it was charged with magical power due to the ritual killing that produced it, or just because it turned me on to own the victim like that, a la Jeffrey Dahmer) wouldn't it behoove me to order some dud, non-magical, non-sexual-turn-on skull(s) from some bone retailer, and just keep the receipt lying around, dump the dud skull(s), and keep my own groovy skull(s) around using the receipt for cover if there were questions asked?...just a thought...the interesting Skulls Unlimited website is here.
Number two, this is the first mention I've seen of sacrificing dogs (and was that police badge used for cop-stay-away magic, hmm).
Number three, the bit about bones/human-body-parts featuring in some (no doubt off-brand, sure) Santa Muerte worship does cross-reference something from that last video in the last post on the first page of this thread...since then I have found a run-down/transcript of that video, linked here, from which we can extract the written relevant quote that follows.

"People begin with incense, candles, to undescribeable things, like obtaining items from a cemetery, human remains to accomplish what you want," Murillo said.

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

(There's some old Roman law saying, to the effect that the testimony of one witness is the same as (=equally worthless as) the testimony of zero witnesses...I tend to take that too seriously, and like to accumulate excessive redundant individually dubious data points...hence the cross-reference thrill-seeking, forgive me, I am not thinking that a couple such data points are proof of anything at all, it's just a habit of mental organization I use proceeding through a mess/mass of material...).

[edit on 20-11-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Nov, 21 2009 @ 07:10 AM
reply to post by nine-eyed-eel

Here as promised (with more later) are a couple of newspaper articles dealing with the late lamented Comandante Pantera/Padrino Endoque. Both of these are from The Chicago Tribune.
This first one, written by Oscar Avila, appeared August 6th, 2008. Death of Mexican preacher a mystery

The enigmatic preacher caused a stir when he erected a 75-foot-high statue honoring the Santa Muerte (Saint Death), a hooded skeletal figure with a scythe.
Now his own slaying, under mysterious circumstances, has Mexico buzzing this week.
The man who called himself Godfather Endoque was shot Thursday in a barrage of at least 100 bullets that sprayed his Cadillac Escalade after a high-speed car chase outside Mexico City. Authorities said they are investigating possible connections to organized crime.
In May, the Tribune published a front-page story about Endoque after he allowed a reporter access to his temple. At the time, he acknowledged having followers linked to organized crime but said he always stayed on the right side of the law.
"The protection of Saint Death failed in the case of Godfather Endoque," the newspaper El Universal mused. "Or maybe she simply wanted him at her side."

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

And here is the antecedent article, also written by Oscar Avila, that was just mentioned in the death-of-Endoque piece. It appeared in The Tribune of May 27, 2008. In Mexico town, icon of death inspires worship and worry

SANTA MARIA CUAUTEPEC, Mexico - Practically overnight, this has gone from a forgotten small town to a religious mecca where pilgrims travel hundreds of miles to seek answers to their prayers.
Their fervor is freaking people out.
While a similar shrine to a Catholic saint would likely be a source of pride, many residents are appalled at a 75-foot-tall statue of a skeleton shrouded in black, Santa Muerte (Saint Death).

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

(I interrupt the article because that statement seems weird to me, "statue...shrouded in black"...because in the two videos of the statue I've already posted, you can see, the statue doesn't look black - and I've seen other pictures - the statue looks off-white, or at the most ash-grey, like it needed its linens washed. Okay, back to the article.)

Although the Santa Muerte icon has existed for decades in working-class Mexican neighborhoods, never has it towered so ominously.
Town officials say they want to respect freedom of religion but are facing pressure from constituents who say their new neighbor is literally giving them nightmares. The town has ordered the statue demolished for zoning violations but has taken no further action.
In a small chapel on the grounds, devotees place tequila, cigarettes and bowls of fruit at the feet of smaller Santa Muerte statues. Some burn special incense sticks that promise better health or a new job. Hundreds of worshippers come for Sunday prayers, many traveling long distances to this town about an hour north of Mexico City.
The temple's leader, a young man with a goatee and piercing eyes who is known as Godfather Endoque, has warned that worshippers might respond violently if the temple is shut down. Endoque says he wants peaceful coexistence, adding that town officials should realize that many of their own citizens are closeted Santa Muerte devotees.
"This isn't a figure or an image, it's a form of faith and love," Endoque said. "Let's respect each other. You can have your saints. We will have ours."
The statue is visible from blocks away on a gritty strip that features taquerias, auto repair shops and strip clubs.
The temple itself holds an air of mystery, the land donated by an anonymous follower who credits Santa Muerte with curing his pancreatic cancer. Before entering the compound, a reporter is asked whether he is bringing a hidden camera.
But by building the massive statue with her outstretched arms, the temple's followers have taken the faith aboveground and welcomed newcomers.
That prominence has drawn the curious, including bricklayer Fernando Flores. The 52-year-old Mexico City man had driven past the statue once, and on a friend's suggestion, had returned to seek guidance on boosting his slumping buainess.
"I'm not changing religions," Flores said as he studied smaller Santa Muerte shrines behind glass along the temple's outer walls. "But I think it is possible to have the Santa Muerte in your house and other saints as well."
Many here do not agree. Residents say they circulated petitions in church against the Santa Muerte statue. Parents say the children at the day-care center next door started crying when they first saw it.
Braulia Navarro, who has lived in the town all of her 58 years, said her grandchildren have had nightmares about the statue. In a sign of the panic that has spread in some quarters, she even reports that family dogs have started howling mysteriously at night.
"The Scripture says not to worship false idols. I tell my grandchildren to believe in God, the Blessed Virgin and that is enough," said Navarro, a homemaker. "Didn't God defeat death? How can death be a saint? To me, that is no saint."
Endoque, who speaks in hushed tones, said he does not mind the backlash from Catholic residents, although he seems to relish jabbing the church back. He says Santa Muerte's popularity is proof that the Catholic Church has failed its followers.
"There will be some people who beat their chests and say they don't agree. But imagine if we had to agree with the ideology of every person in this world," Endoque said.
"People are tired of looking for religion; people are tired of the priests who make off with the donations. What do they ask for now? Faith, which costs nothing more than love."
...Salvador Castaneda, the municipal director of urban devlopment ... acknowledges that the town is applying its regulations more strictly because Santa Muerte is unpopular in some quarters.
Town officials say the temple never completed an impact study nor applied for a building permit before building the statue. Santa Muerte followers also ignored requests to appear at administrative hearings. That led the town to file an order of demolition in February.
Endoque acknowledges flouting protocol and said that the temple probably would not file the paperwork until town officials showed more respect.
Castaneda said he thinks the statue would be acceptable if it were about half its current height so it did not alter the character of the surrounding neighborhood so dramatically. He also said the temple must provide parking to accommodate the crush of visitors.
Complicating his job, Castaneda said, many bureaucrats are spooked by the statue, and several co-workers refuse to deliver notices to the temple because they fear that Santa Muerte will smite them.
The standoff seems unlikely to be resolved soon, Castaneda said, because town officials fear a violent confrontation if they try to topple the statue. Santa Muerte has a reputation for attracting the criminal element among its followers. Indeed, one of the incense sticks for sale in the temple here provides "protection for drug traffickers."
Endoque says his core group is peaceful but warned that he could not guarantee that devotees from Mexico City's roughest neighborhoods would stand idly by if the town tried to take down the statue.
"It will be a response of an entire people. They will say, 'Never. Never. Never touch. Never interfere with our faith,'" he said. "There could be a very strong explosion."
..."Please, handle this with caution," he said. "Don't steal the only thing these people have in the world: their beliefs."

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

[edit on 21-11-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 07:08 PM

Originally posted by Republican08
Heard regrettedly alot about this.

Quite a few mexican drug smugglers shipping in drugs to our youth here in the US, have a statue along with a tattoo of this Deity, or just a tattoo of this deity.

It is a quite nicely put Satanic god.

It is despicable, it's vengeful hateful, preaches hurting those who hurt you, may you safely carry drugs to children in another country. May you rape those who have raped, or rape those you want.

May you get the gold you want.

People will believe anything, if they think it will accomplish this.

If you want money get a job, don't pray to some statue and devote your life to it.

C'mon, this is the worst thing i've ever seen in my life, a worse religion than satanism.

If I could, kill one person. It would of been whoever spread the idea of the god of the dead. And call it a saint at that.

Edit to add: Sorry I didn't read your thread at all, I saw the name of the thread and immediately posted if it's off topic let me know.

[edit on 14-8-2009 by Republican08]

Okay, I wish to refute your assessment of the Santa Muerte faith, first off the Santa Muerte is NOT Satanic, in fact it is quite the opposite as devotional prayers and practices incorporate the veneration of Jesus Christ.

Secondly, Santa Muerte is not a God/ess but rather a saint just like any other, though she is not in the cannon but then again neither is St. Christopher anymore and people still pray to and petition him.

Thirdly, to say that Santa Muerte is only venerated by criminals and the poor is very one-sided, though this is due to the media portrayal of the 'cult' and in my opinion is VERY bias and with good reason, this being a forum that touches on conspiracies, you can see the implication in what I'm saying.

When people see different manifestations of spirituality they tend to react with fear and bigotry, especially in a context of thought that believes their religion is the only 'right religion'. Then anything outside their set cultural and religious paradigm, especially when it has to do with a concept that has to do with something alot of people fear the most such as death and what happens afterward. I just wonder why people never bring up Kali, with her necklace of skulls and all, with the same controversy. It's ironic that Saint Death has proven to help cope with the unsettling feelings that accompany the notion of death and dying, at least for me.

As far as it being "hateful, vengeful, and preaching to hurt others", I must point out that Santa Muerte in and of herself is NOT any of those things you or anybody else try to brand it. It is a spiritual concept, a symbolism, and a symbol in and of itself is neither good nor bad, it's all in the person or group of people that uses it. This may be another reason it is viewed in a negative light, the fact that the only media play it has is when someone reports on a drug-dealer, a murderer, or poverty. These being subjects that the news covers because of the majority eating up due to the primal nature inside us that craves violence. I view the news in a very dim light as it only seems to focus and report on negative and fear inducing topics, save for the few local stations that report on touching stories like lost puppies being found and such.
Just because people of this stock use such a symbol for things such as this does not make the symbol or the faith surrounding it evil. If that were the case then Christianity and Islam should have turned out the same stigma with all the bloodshed that has been and is still to this day being shed in the name of it. I also love the fact that you state that you would 'go back and kill' someone, that is really the good thing to do, isn't it?!? I would never wish such a thing another individual or group of people, because life is way too precious, another tenant of Santa Muerte.

posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 07:50 PM
reply to post by GhedeNibbho


If it wasn't death on the arm of the murder, than it would be something else, the criminal act would still be the same, and probably linked to whatever it was, whether it was a pentagram or sponge bob. Criminal activity, murder, violence, ect. have been going on long before Santa Muerte, or anything else such as this for that matter, had ever existed. I think it's better to address the problem itself without having to attach something external to the problem in order to rationalize it.

As, you can gather by my post, I do venerate Santa Muerte or La Macabre, which another root image of Santa Muerte that stems from none other than the catholic faith which put it out originally as Catholic propaganda, and was venerated in Italy back in the day which led to the church discontinuing production of such an image and also led to naming St. Benedict the patron of the Holy Death to dissuade the manner in which La Macabre was used. Death has appeared in many cultures in many and many forms because death is something EVERYBODY on earth has in common. It's just that different people have different ways of viewing things in different cultures and even individual people within a said culture. This is why the world cannot ever be unified into one religion, because you can't expect everyone to think the same way as the next one and to try to convert everyone to be the same would make this place a very dull, and in my opinion, horrible world.
Now, as a devotee of Santa Muerte, I am not involved in any criminal activity, I do not condone the use of legal or illegal substances, I do not condone violence, rape, or murder, and I am certainly not from a destitute upbringing or environment.
I venerate Santa Muerte for many reasons and none of them have anything to do with anything that is being presented. Now I must state that I am not defending the criminal actions of people linked with this form of spirituality, I am defending the faith itself from being demonized as it is in the portrayal of it.
I also must commend the person who started the thread for posting from a viewpoint that does not seem to be as bias as the posts in which I am responding to. You can PM me if you want a personal account of what working with Santa Muerte is like, I wouldn't say I worship because I'm not that type of person. I also say to PM me as my spirituality is a very personal and private thing and I do not feel comfortable discussing the more intimate aspects of working with Santa Muerte via this public medium, especially with the kinds of remarks that are being made in between your posts.

Lastly, I'd also like to add that the bundle of seeds are meant to go inside the bag to 'feed the saint', it is a common practice in traditions such as Brujeria to 'feed' saints and spirits with offerings to activate them or 'heat them up' so to speak.

-Ghede Nibbho

posted on Dec, 11 2009 @ 07:32 AM
reply to post by GhedeNibbho

First of all, thanks to GhedeNibbho for responding. I had not thought of the seeds in connection with feeding the saint, like with the fruit offerings in front of a devotional statue...obviously, seeds are food that would keep, unlike something more perishable, like bread.
Also, I hope I don't present as derogatory towards the devotion, or its followers. I think this stuff is interesting, is all, who knows why, some people watch golf on TV, know what I mean, I like this stuff better.
Anyways, I have been busy offline, lots of further backlog I should have posted, so to do so...
Here's a recent piece from the LA Times of December 7, 2009, written by Jill Leovy. (Note that it mentions Sisyphus, who we saw in the USTREAM material on the first page of this thread.)
Santa Muerte in L.A.: A gentler vision of 'Holy Death'

The sect is linked to narcotics trafficking in Mexico. As it moves north, it takes on the benign glow of virtue.
The prayer in Spanish sounded like one from an ordinary Catholic Mass. But the man who led it wore a coyote-skin headdress and called himself the last of 13 generations of brujos - witch doctors - in his family.
The name the worshipers invoked was not that of the Virgin Mary but of Santa Muerte ...
About two dozen devotees recited a rosary and stood and sat on cue to offer praise to this unconventional icon one Sunday at a storefront shrine near MacArthur Park.
"Angel created by faith," they chanted, "allow the power in me to be released."
Her first adherents included Mexican prisoners, drug dealers and prostitutes, and those in legitimate but dangerous nighttime work, such as security guards and taxi drivers.
"It's sort of like the Virgin for people on the edge," said Patrick A. Polk, a folklorist and curator at UCLA's Fowler Museum.
But in and around Los Angeles, where Santa Muerte services are held in at least three storefront shrines, a dash of pop theology and Southern California sunshine seems to have given the movement a mild New Age flavor.
Followers, many of whom call themselves Catholics, talk less about death than about cleansing the spirit and developing inner strength.
"Everything depends on oneself," said Miguel Velasco, a former administrator and a "spiritual guide" at the 3-year-old Sanctuario Universal de la Santa Muerte on Alvarado Street. "You can believe in God, or a saint, or even a tree. But what really matters is the faith you have. Faith can move mountains."
Leaders here characterize the practice as benign, and devotees appear to draw from a broad cross section of people in immigrant neighborhoods - manual laborers, public employees, couples with children, laid-off factory workers.
Despite the startling imagery, these worshipers say, their cult is centered on love and virtue and is becoming accepted.
"Years ago, they used this for witchcraft, to get certain things: money, revenge," said Santiago Guadalupe, who dons piles of wooden beads in addition to the headdress to give the weekly sermon at Sanctuario Universal. "Now it is more religion. It is about health, prayer."
Guadalupe wears a ponytail and possesses classic Aztec features: beaked nose, prominent brow, a wisp of a beard. He is from Catemaco, a town in Veracruz state where a Mexican subculture of alternative religion thrives. He said he began his training in the shamanistic arts as a child.
He helps run the sect from a pink office in the back of a tiny botanica up the street from the shrine. The walls are decorated with a sentimental painting of an Indian shaman in wolf skin, a sunset calendar and shelves containing incense and a bottle of Tapatio hot sauce.
From here, Guadalupe, who cited spiritual reasons in declining to give his age, works three phones at once, taking calls from clients all over the region seeking blessings or help with love affairs - part of the all-inclusive spectrum of Santa Muerte devotion. There are also those requesting the more basic Shamanistic services: healing herbs, potions and readings of tarot cards and foreheads.
One recent afternoon, Guadalupe barked into one phone while reading the screen on a second, periodically cupping his hand over the mouthpiece to call out to customers in the botanica.
The customers wanted their fortunes told, and Guadalupe asked them to wait as he turned back to his phones, impatiently tapping a pen on the desk.
A large stack of tarot cards sat on the desk near him. Behind him, a large, glossy statue of the Virgin Mary caught the glare from the single lightbulb.
"People come for their jobs, for good luck at the casinos or for problems with a husband or wife," Guadalupe said.
"In Mexico, more came because they were having problems in their family. Here, they come because they feel alone."
Santa Muerte "accepts them no matter their age, creed or color. She is accepting of all religions," he said.
At the weekly Santa Muerte Mass, Guadalupe takes turns with several other spiritual guides to lead a long and somber service that resembles traditional Catholic Masses in Mexico and includes the recitation of a special rosary that incorporates the traditional Lord's Prayer and appeals to Santa Muerte in place of Mary.
Sneakers and cowboy boots thump on the laminate floor as the crowd stands for long stretches, then kneels for blessings. They inhale incense smoke, and raise their arms to the figure of Santa Muerte wearing a security guard's badge. Paper notes are safety-pinned to the skirt of her white satin gown - petitions from devotees seeking favors.
Offerings are piled at her feet: orange carnations, white chrysanthemums, pink roses, a goblet of Snickers bars and peanut butter cups, beer, tequila and baskets of bananas, grapes and loaves of bread. Signs in felt pen urge visitors to be quiet.
Guadalupe offers prayer for those in jail or in trouble with the law - a nod to Santa Muerte's origins among the marginal. But mainstream preoccupations rule. His sermon stresses the importance of family, the evils of envy and gossip.
A similar scene plays out three times a week at the Templo Santa Muerte on Melrose Avenue, where about 20 people gather for services. "Blessed and glorious mother, Angel of Death," they pray. "We ask you to protect us."
The services are run by a Mexican wrestler turned missionary who calls himself Sisyphus, who set up the shrine three years ago. Their tone is more improvised and folksy than at the shrine on Alvarado Street, and there are personal testaments and singing.
"We search for spiritual evolution," Sisyphus said. He said he sees himself more as a counselor than a priest.
At both locations, devotees talk of Santa Muerte's power to perform miracles. They share stories of unexpected blessings - an airline ticket procured, a baby's lung infection cleared. Santa Muerte is said to have particular powers over love.
But guides don't make guarantees. Their mission is to help people only with their faith, Guadalupe said, adding: "I don't like problems."
Rick Nahmais, a photographer who has documented immigrants' Santa Muerte worship, said the practice fills serious needs among the marginalized, citing a group of transgender prostitutes he photographed in San Francisco. They sought Santa Muerte's protection from AIDS and even conducted marriages in her name, he said.

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

[edit on 11-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Dec, 11 2009 @ 09:25 PM

Originally posted by nine-eyed-eel
And he quotes a saying I never heard before (but I like it) EL DIABLO Y LA MUERTE SON HERMANO Y HERMANA = the devil and death are brother and sister.

they are!

posted on Dec, 11 2009 @ 09:39 PM
have you seen this?

Death saint gets Mexican makeover

what about this?

Mexican Policeman Attacked By A Flying Humanoid Entity

the above article also explains what is being said in the following video (for those not fluent in Spanish) - plus there are subtitles:

posted on Dec, 13 2009 @ 12:31 AM
reply to post by queenannie38

Thanks for responding...I have a version of the video (and I think the rense stills are from the same initial tranche), but yours is more suitable because it has, thanks on that.
And the article on the Santa Muerte makeover that you linked is also good, I have seen versions and I figured to quote from it next time I get back on to David Romo...(I'm so backlogged...but then again, that's the fun of an expanding subject)...
I figured while I was on Santa Muerte in LA, I have a couple obvious cross-references to's an advert for the temple on Melrose...

Here's the link to the website he mentions...containing the classic line

Never forget that since you got born you started to die little by little and soon our meeting it must come true.

(Ain't there some Buddhist saying " I contained within me the seeds of my destruction at the time of my arising" ... or maybe that's just one of them assorted satanic proverbs floating around the subcultures, they all do kind of roll up in a ball eventually so I'm probably wrong as to the provenance...But that's what it reminds me of...)

[edit on 13-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Dec, 13 2009 @ 01:59 AM
reply to post by nine-eyed-eel

I guess I ought to hit some high points off of that Melrose Templo Santa Muerte website, having brought it up, especially for non-Spanish speakers.

In the "Who we are" section there are brief biographical bits about Sisyphus/Profesor Sisyphus, and also a colleague there, Profesor Sahara...translating + paraphrasing, Sisyphus's bit says he's from the state of Nayarit, where to begin with he was influenced by "the Shaman Juan" from whom he learned his basic spiritual education...later he got to know Don Genaro (no I don't think that's a Castaneda reference, sorry) who taught him to meditate, then later still Don Joaquin taught him to speak with the Most Holy Saint Death, who in turn named/appointed him as the messenger of the "Black Angel", which is his-name-for/the-name-under-which-he-knows Santa Muerte, and then he was immediately converted into an adopted-son/protege/affiliate of Santa Muerte.
Profesor Sahara's bio bit says he's from Oaxaca state, that he got to know Jesus at the age of 9, when Jesus told him that he would grant his prayers both always and (redundantly) when he was far from home...for 30 years his prayers have been granted...nevertheless he was in an accident and after having been in a coma, he again re-encountered Jesus...Jesus told him that the hour had arrived to begin his mission, and thus Sahara decided to devote himself to religion, but did not truly find his way until one day he got to know Santa Muerte when he was 37, and that was the beginning of his spiritual path...
Other things that strike me, for whatever reason, from various pages, are an announcement of a mass in New Jersey, the presence of feng shui on the list of classes offered, more than 150 people have been baptized "con la Santisima Muerte" and the first wedding ceremony has also been performed, the (local California) TV Channel 62 went with the group to the mountains and taped some baptisms being's a recipe/ritual in order to obtain money - you need 3 green candles, 3 yellow candles, 3 gold candles, 3 silver candles, 1 purple candle, 13 coins of different denominations, 13 white corn kernels, 13 black corn kernels, 13 yellow corn kernels, a 100% natural cigar, and some gold dust...set up the candles on a new white porcelain plate and disburse the coins, corn kernels, and gold dust, while invoking Santa Muerte and smoking the cigar ask for "Prosperity, abundant money"...

posted on Dec, 13 2009 @ 12:11 PM
aside from the "cult" aspect of this subject, there are actually very positive ideas connected with Santa Muerte during Dia de los Muertos.

posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 10:12 AM
These next people have a whole bunch of stuff (where to start?) that I'll eventually post + overview, like videos of baptisms, website etc...but I'm starting with this here little video, following the principle of grouping like-with-like because this, just like the last previous video, is an advertisement for a Santa Muerte temple in Los Angeles.
These folks El Instituto Arcano= The Arcane Institute this links to their website originally came to my attention because they were into the San La Muerte, the Argentine male-devotional-entity, similar-yet-different to Santa Muerte, when I first started researching that...indeed they have a (so-labelled) San La Muerte statue in this here Santa Muerte video...I don't know how that works, yet, likewise there is mention of the "Group of The Eighth Archangel", don't know about that, yet, either.
For some reason they were not mentioned, far as I can tell, in Jill Leovy's LA Times piece. They appear to be friendly/collegial with Sisyphus's group, there are reciprocal mentions + appearances in each other's materials...Anyways, to the video advert.

Okay, translating the onscreen text, different bits separated by ***, with the time it appears on screen (or starts, with the scrolling/crawler bits) given first...
(0:29) 1323 Fetterly, Los Angeles, between Olympic and Telegraph
(0:48) Gatherings and talks every Saturday at 6 p.m.
(2:20) The Temple's Teachers
(2:28) Esoteric talks where we inform you about how to prepare your altars and candles, prayers, invocations, cleansings, these talks are given by the teachers of the Instituto Arcano and by members of the group of the eighth archangel, participation is totally free/at-no-cost every Saturday at 6 p.m., we look forward to your visit.
The song is interesting too, it appears to be purpose-built as a Santa Muerte hymn (like at 1:50 "aunque seas la muerte" = even though you are death), though I ain't figured out all the words (like I say, Spanish singing is hard for my skill set) yet.
Other little shout-outs on the iconography+paraphernalia...
(0:10) the San La Muerte statue, down below
(0:11) another owl
(0:32) blue-dyed "novelty" daisies
(0:45) Death on horseback statue, I don't know if it's Santa Muerte or just some old-fashioned Death-in-general
(1:00) Skull+crossbones on the moon, in the wall mural
(1:23) Particularly striking Santa Muerte statue, well-dressed in money, smoking a cigar, interesting red gem hanging on its chest, with glowing red eyes and a bejewelled scythe...

[edit on 14-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Dec, 15 2009 @ 04:37 PM
Oh, so, here's Round Two on the shooting incident in Mission Texas with the off-duty Border Patrol agent that we already saw on the first page of this thread ... ongoing, opening, new developments a la breaking news, yupyup... This story is written by Sergio Chiapas, the link is to its December 14 2009 appearance on

A fortune teller aligned with the Santisima Muerte is expected to face a federal judge on Tuesday afternoon.
Claudia Elena Gomez and five others are facing a multitude of charges after a plan to steal drug money from one of her clients went horribly wrong.
The McAllen-based psychic and the others have been jailed since June for an ambush-style attack on an off-duty Border Patrol agent in Mission.
Court records obtained by Action 4 News show that Arizona Border Patrol agent and his 10-year-old daughter were visiting family in the Rio Grande Valley but were chased and attacked by mistake.
A criminal complaint filed in the case shows that the group's true target was one of Gomez's clients who drove the same type of Cadillac.
The complaint shows that Gomez was a card reader and worshiper of the Santisima Muerte, a Mexican religious icon followed by drug traffickers, criminals and others.
Gomez told investigators that the incident started when her client had come to her for protective prayers.
The client told Gomez that she was traveling to Michigan where she was going to pick up a large amount of drug money and bring it back to the Valley.
The McAllen fortune teller allegedly turned around and hatched a plot to steal the money from her own client.
The group was supposed to split the cash from the heist but ended up facing federal firearms and carjacking charges.
Gomez allegedly worked with Juan Vite Martinez, Jose Wenceslado Mejia, Nieves Rogelio Ramirez, Dagoberto Navarro-Pompa and Maria Teresa de la Rosa during the failed heist.
The six were quickly rounded up after the incident but court records show they had help from Jose Antonio "El Comandante" Armendariz and another suspect with blond spiky hair and a ponytail.
Those two men have not been arrested or charged in the case but a federal criminal complaint was formally filed against Gomez and the others last week.
Court records show that Gomez, Martinez, Navarro-Pompa and De la Rosa are from Mexico while Mejia and Ramirez are American citizens.

posted on Dec, 16 2009 @ 04:18 PM
reply to post by nine-eyed-eel

Here's another little Texas, while we're there...This is reported by Christina Rendon, the link is to Police Search Home of Grandma Caught with Cocaine

SAN BENITO - Maria De Los Angeles Magana, 40, is charged with possession of coc aine and child endangerment. Authorities say Magana was caring for three of her grandchildren when she was arrested.
Magana says she was just doing all she could to support and take care of her family.
Photos by police show what was inside her home; Santisima Muerte statues, a scale with coc aine residue and unsanitary living conditions. Authorities say Magana was living in the home with her family and several grandchildren.
Magana spoke to our cameras before seeing a judge. She says she'd only been involved with drugs for about two weeks, trying to get extra money to support her family, but police say that's not true. They'd been watching her since September and served a search warrant yesterday.
Neighbors say they've seen a lot of traffic at the home; people stopping and going and exchanging things.
Magana says she knows what she did was bad, but says she couldn't find a real job. But authorities say they aren't buying her story.
Magana is being held without bond tonight and will later be handed over to Border Patrol. We're told Child Protective Services is investigating.

posted on Dec, 16 2009 @ 06:08 PM
reply to post by nine-eyed-eel

Here is a piece from the (Wisconsin) Janesville Gazette of November 15, 2009, written by Pedro Oliveira Jr. The saints march in to drug wars

ELKHORN - Deputies with the Walworth County Drug Enforcement Unit expected to find coc aine when they searched a Darien home in late August.
They found nearly a pound.
They expected to find cash.
They found $31,000.
What they didn't expect was the small altar for a skeletal Mexican saint. It was Santa Muerte, the patron saint of drug dealers, prostitutes and other criminals.
The saint, from the Spanish meaning "saint death," is popular in Mexico, where researchers say the cult claims more than 2 million followers and goes back about 3,000 years.
Police say they found the altar while executing a search warrant at 25 Market St. while investigating Roberto and Jorge Quinonez, a father and son authorities believe were moving large amounts of coc aine into the community.
Santa Muerte often is associated with drugs, brutality and other crimes. Their followers pray for protection from law enforcement and safety during drug deals. Santa Muerte is believed to be as powerful as the highest Catholic saints, but she doesn't discriminate.
Offerings often are marijuana or alcohol. Blowing smoke in the saint's face is believed to awaken her powers.
Santa Muerte has slowly crept into Mexican communities in the United States, often in bigger cities such as Los Angeles or Chicago. She has also started to make her way into Walworth County.
Deputy District Attorney Joshua Grube said knowing about the underground culture is one piece of the puzzle when it comes to investigation. He likened it to police learning about gang signs and colors.
"We learned about some little statues or bags or charms that some people believe that if you put them in a threshold, it'll keep the contents of that room safe from law enforcement," Grube said. "So if law enforcement sees that on the threshold of a room or door, maybe that's the room that the drugs are in. You think, 'What are they trying to protect?'"
The Quinonez duo was not alone.
Walworth County authorities November 3 arrested 11 people on drug charges, and Lake Geneva officers found Santa Muerte in some of their houses, Grube said.
It wasn't the first time Walworth County authorities found evidence of the saint in the homes of suspects, he said.
Grube and other Walworth County authorities attended a class on the topic taught by Robert Almonte, retired El Paso, Texas, deputy police chief.
Almonte's interest in the religious culture underlying the Mexican drug war comes from working as a narcotics detective in the 1980s.
"We noticed that there was an increase that they had these altars set up for protection from law enforcement," Almonte said.
Almonte started researching the topic. He made several trips to Mexico, trying to understand the culture behind patron saints of the crime world.
Despite the association with criminal behavior, he said, it's important to note that not all Santa Muerte followers are criminals.
While in Mexico, Almonte went to shrines and participated in processions where more than 6,000 people gathered to worship Santa Muerte, kneeling and crawling after her statue.
Stricken with poverty and struggling in life, most of the followers seemed to be seeking help from whatever source they could find, he said.
But some other Santa Muerte followers have gone to greatly brutal lengths to please their saint.
Almonte recalls a case in Tijuana, Mexico, a few years ago when a member of a small crime association owed about $7,000 to the organization leaders.
"When he finally confessed he spent the money, they cut his legs and arms off and offered it to Santa Muerte," he said.
The man's head was never found. One of the group's members insisted Santa Muerte had taken it, Almonte said.
Almonte now goes around the country teaching a class on patron saints of the underground Mexican drug war.
"It seems like once we heard about this happening, if you just look around, they really are doing this," Grube said. "They really are having these amulets and statues and jam bags."

[edit on 16-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 05:10 AM
I should know better but I find it hard to resist going all high/low cultural here with this next post... Here is a sculpture (from, by Fernando Mastrangelo) of Santa Muerte, made from human ash...(Also, near as I can tell (unless the artist has titled them idiosyncratically) the captions are reversed, the Santa Muerte is the one on the left and Laugh Now Cry Later should be the one on the right...right?)

posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 12:06 PM
Here is a brief but interesting article from (the Mexican one) El Universal of November 6, 2009, that links-or-conflates (depending on one's working hypotheses, remembering that this is just one data point) Santa Muerte with the Zetas, the Gulf cartel, kidnapping, and taxi drivers, the Spanish text first, for accuracy's sake, then my translation, for the sake of ease ... Cae presunta banda de "zetas" secuestradores

Las autoridades mexicanas detuvieron a cuatro presuntos secuestradores ligados Los Zetas, brazo armado del cártel del Golfo, informó la Secretaría de Seguridad Pública federal (SSP).
Los cuatro delincuentes fueron detenidos en Ciudad Madero, Tamaulipas, "trabajaban para los principales líderes del cártel del Golfo" y forman parte de una banda junto a otros seis supuestos secuestradores, todos capturados por las autoridades, según la SSP.
Aseguraron que los detenidos son responsables de siete secuestros denunciados, aunque destaca que las fuerzas de seguridad tienen "conocimiento de 37 víctimas más".
La presunta banda operaba en Altamira, Ciudad Madero y Tampico y sus miembros "mediante amenazas, extorsionaban a los empleados de notarías públicas para que legalizaran los inmuebles que les eran entregados como pago a cambio de la liberación de sus víctimas".
También los acusan de vender "firmas y sellos de las notarías a los llamados coyotes con los cuales trabajaban realizando fraudes y compras ilícitas".
Los delincuentes, presuntamente, "formaron un grupo de taxistas a quienes obligaban a trabajar como informantes" sobre los operaciones que realizaban las autoridades en Ciudad Madero, Tamaulipas.
La detención de los 10 delincuentes fue posible gracias a labores de inteligencia de las autoridades y a los testimonios de las víctimas.
Durante los registros de varias propiedades, la Policía Federal halló "documentación de escrituras de inmuebles, facturas de vehículos, pagarés y diversos títulos de propiedad" de la presunta banda de plagiarios.
Adicionalmente, los agentes decomisaron 14 vehículos, algunos de ellos de lujo, un fusil AR-15, un revólver, cartuchos, 21 teléfonos celulares, documentos de identificación, tarjetas bancarias y diversas imágenes religiosas y de la Santa Muerte.
Los cuatro detenidos fueron identificados como Manuel Ulises Llanas Silva, Gerardo, un mecánico de 26 años, quien se encargaba de secuestrar a las víctimas, negociar y cobrar los rescates; Ángel Sierra Junco, El Negro, de oficio mecánico; y Brendo Skylab Ruíz García, Brandon, un empleado de Petróleos Mexicanos (Pemex), ambos de 36 años y acusados de brindar seguridad al momento de secuestrar a las víctimas.
También quedó a disposición de las autoridades Juan Antonio Olvera Gutiérrez, El Raro, de 28 años, quien tambien trabajaba para Pemex y presuntamente daba "apoyo en la logística de los secuestros", según la SSP.
Entre los otros seis miembros de la banda hay un contratista y consultor, el dueño de un negocio de renta de maquinaria pesada para la construcción, un propietario de una flotilla de taxis y un fotógrafo.

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

[Maybe I better put the translation in the separate/next post so as not to run afoul of the total character count.]

[edit on 21-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

[edit on 21-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 01:42 PM
reply to post by nine-eyed-eel

Which I would read as:

Arrest of an Alleged "Zeta" Group of Kidnappers -

Mexican authorities arrested four accused kidnappers tied to the Zetas (the armed branch of the Gulf cartel), the federal Secretary of Public Safety's office (SSP) reported.
The four, arrested in Ciudad Madero, in the state of Tamaulipas, "worked for the major leaders of the Gulf cartel," and together with six other alleged kidnappers comprised a kidnapping group, all of whose members have been captured by the authorities, according to the SSP.
The arrestees are affirmed to be those responsible for seven kidnapping cases in which they are accused, not to mention that the security forces claim knowledge of another 37 victims of the group.
The alleged gang of kidnappers operated in Altamira, in Ciudad Madero and in Tampico, and its members "by means of threats, extorted notary public office employees, in order to legalize title to real estate parcels which the gang had received as the payment for releasing persons whom they had kidnapped."
They are also accused of selling "signatures and stamps of the notaries, to the so-called coyotes who they worked with, thus perpetrating frauds and unlawful purchases."
The suspects also allegedly "created a group of taxi drivers who were forced to work as informants", apprising the gang of law enforcement activities being carried on by the authorities in Ciudad Madero.
This arrest of the 10 delinquents was made possible by official intelligence operations and by the testimonies of the victims.
During the search of various properties, the Federal Police found "documentation of real estate deeds, vehicle invoices, promissory notes and titles to various properties" of the supposed gang of fraudsters.
In addition, agents seized 14 vehicles, some of which were luxury models, an AR-15, cartridges, 21 cell phones, identification documents, bank cards and several religious images and images of Santa Muerte.
The four arrested were identified as Manuel Ulises Llanas Silva (aka "Gerardo"), a 26-year-old mechanic, who was in charge of the actual kidnapping of the victims, the negotiations, and collecting the ransoms; Ángel Sierra Junco (aka "El Negro" = the black one/the black man/the sad one), also in the mechanic trade; and Brendo Skylab Ruíz García (aka "Brandon"), an employee of Pemex (the government-owned Mexican oil company), both 36-year-olds and accused of providing security/back-up at the moment when the kidnappings took place.
Also remaining held by the authorities is Juan Antonio Olvera Gutiérrez (aka "El Raro" = the rare one/the unusual one/the strange one), 28 years old, who also worked for Pemex and allegedly gave "logistical support to the kidnappings," according to the SSP.
Among the other six members of the group are a contractor and consultant, the owner of a business that rents out heavy construction equipment, the owner of a fleet of taxis and a photographer.

[edit on 21-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Dec, 22 2009 @ 09:04 PM
reply to post by nine-eyed-eel

Here's something I haven't seen mentioned before, in the Catholic Church vs. Santa Muerte saga, namely, Catholic exorcisms to remove La Santa Muerte, or, better, because of La Santa Muerte...You should click + go to the link, because there is a video (which I don't know how to embed, this type, sorry) showing, evidently, some of the actual exorcisms, although no info is provided as to whether these shown are involving Santa Muerte as the possessing-entity-to-be-exorcised. (This is the last time I'll repeat this observation (just mentally visualize me saying it, the next dozen times) but, notice it's witchy old Veracruz again, yup). The byline on the piece is Steve Roldan, it's dated November 3, 2009, the link is to its appearance on
Priest Performs Exorcisms In Mexico

Exorcisms have long been a part of Catholicism, yet they are something most Catholics have never experienced. But a priest in Mexico gave a look at the demon-fighting ritual to KSAT in San Antonio.
The religious rite happens with great frequency in Mexico.
An exorcism starts off with prayer and reflection, then one by one, people are strapped and the transformation begins.
The Catholic ritual has been performed at a church in Veracruz, Mexico, where desperate families seek the help of an exorcist to free their loved ones of demonic possession.
Exorcisms can be traced back over 2,000 years. Weapons of holy water and prayer are used to invoke God.
"Exorcisms are something that is very real," said The Rev. Jesus Aguilar, an exorcist in Mexico City.
Aguilar is one of seven priests designated by the church to perform exorcisms in and around Mexico City.
He said there's no disputing what he has seen and what he has felt.
"It's true, in certain cases, you can feel the temperature start to change, and you feel a cold chill in the air," Aguilar said. "It's the same way when you walk into a place where there is witchcraft, or where someone was buried or where somebody may have died."
Exorcisms are typically performed on people 16 years old to 50 years old.
Aguilar said some of the causes include people turning to cults and the recent adoration of La Santa Muerte in Mexico.
"If a person dies in this situation, they could lose their chances of salvation," Aguilar said.

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

[edit on 22-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:55 PM
This next thing here is a huge resource, and I intend to keep on referring back to it, and dipping into it, every so often, cause it gives a perspective/viewpoint that I'm not getting elsewhere, pretty much...This is a forum discussion on Santa Muerte (filed under "occultism") hosted by Univision (you know, the Spanish-language TV corporation people, like Telemundo and Azteca America) under the umbrella of (obviously, Univision's hosting all diffferent subjects, not just Santa Muerte, but cooking, and soccer, et cetera, under other headings)...

This here Santa Muerte venue has been going on for just about six years exactly, with the first post being dated December, 2003, they are now up to about 190 pages or so...I have no intention of translating the whole chunk, but, this forum does have something very suitable in its material, namely, it gives us a chance to listen to the folk, the folks, the actual unmediated believers (plus some half-believers, fringey lurkers - still they participate in the subculture), speaking in their own words...whereas most all of these other references are filtered through what the reporters say, or what the priests say, or what the Santa-Muerte-priests+spiritual-leaders or the anthropologists say.
So I'm just going to reach in editorially and translate some of these posts, every so often, where I think we can hear the people, like a big old Communist would say... Also, a lot of these Univision forum posts have slangy or incorrect spelling, and where it seems on purpose and not a typo I plan on leaving that in verbatim - who am I to correct a native speaker? - I'll write it the way they wrote it and then I'll just read it the way I think it should read.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

posted on Dec, 25 2009 @ 12:52 PM
reply to post by nine-eyed-eel

Oh, yes, so much good stuff in the Univision Santa Muerte forum...Learning is fun.
Okay, this post is the 6th one down, on page 6 linked, the name given as the poster is David Tovar. These stories do relate to the theme that Santa Muerte is "jealous," so her devotee must show respect and keep his promise. I could easily see that in this Santa-Muerte-forum context, various stories might be told and received as being perhaps not so much literally true but rather as good teaching stories intended to show how a proper devotee acts. And they could also be true, I'm just thinking out loud.

Les contare dos experiencias con "LA SANTISIMA MUERTE", yo trabaje con ella durante algun tiempo, un dia vino una Sra. con un problema sobre su esposo, le recomende una Sta. Muerte de color blanca y las oraciones, pero yo siempre les hago las debidas aclaraciones sobre el uso de esta Santa..."Nadie debe de usarlas mas que tu, nadie debe tocarla mas que tu, hacerle sus oraciones siempre y cumplirle lo que le prometas"...para no hacerla larga, lo entendio y se comprometio hacer todo...todo iba bien, salio tal como esta Sra. deseaba, pero en una ocasion se le olvido hacerle su oracion un martes, cuando se acordo ya era tarde y se le hizo facil decir, "manana la hago"...esa noche no paso nada, y al dia siguiente no volvio a hacer la oracion...esa misma noche, oyo ruidos en la cocina...ella estaba sola con sus hijos, tuvo temor de que alguien se hubiese metido a la casa, se volvio a oir y se armo de valor y fue a revisar que pudiera ser...habia un enorme perro negro, ojos muy grande y rojos, solo le grunia como Sra. salio corriendo toda asustada, tomo a sus dos ninos y se fue a casa de un vecino, esta le conto todo y le recomendaron que quitara la imagen y la tirara, porque eso era diabolico, esta tomo la imagen la metio en una caja y la puso en el garage, todo se puso peor, empezo a tener muchos problemas con su esposo, con la familia, perdio el trabajo, bueno, un dia regreso a mi casa a decirme todo, tuvimos que hacer mucha oracion pidiendo perdon a la Santita, le prendimos velas, pasaron mas de dos meses para que todo se le arreglara, creo firmamente que haberle faltado el respeto a la Santisima Muerte le provoco esto, ahora le tiene su altar, le pone flores, agua y le prende su vela cada martes y viernes. Le va muy bien y es muy feliz con su esposo y hijos.
Esta otro caso si esta muy fuerte...
Una Sra. tenia problemas con su esposo tambien, pero a esta le di una santisima muerte roja y las misma instrucciones, cuando se hace todo con fe, se logra rapido, pero...como a los tres meses, el Sr. la encontro haciendo el ritual de rezos, con las velas prendidas, en este caso siete velas tamano: "Jumbo" (9"x2") color negras, agua, y una rosa roja...El hombre se enojo y tiro el agua y la flor, pateo a la Santisima y le pego a la Sra. Para no hacer mas larga la historia, esto paso hace mas de medio año, hoy el Sr. se esta muriendo de un cancer en el pulmon izquierdo, (el no fuma) y le ha ido muy mal en el trabajo...
La SANTISIMA MUERTE, es una Santa muy buena, pero muy delicada, nadie debe de faltarle en ninguna forma.

And while we're on the "jealousy" of Santa Muerte, this (page linked here, fifth post down from the top) extract is from a post attributed to one Yocubita, who posts frequently and eloquently in this Santa Muerte thread. Then I jump back to her two previous numbered paragraphs, where she speaks to other popular "illogical" ideas about Santa Muerte. (I think the ALL CAPS represents her DELIBERATE EMPHASIS SO WE NOTICE THESE POINTS.)






Here is another amateur "video honor a Santa Muerte."

I put this video in here just because it tends to undercut some of Yocubita's lines in that last paragraph, the two data-points when juxtaposed seem to have a dialectic, is all...

This last is from Lobo499's very first post, starting the Santa Muerte thread .

Vamos a empezar quien es nuestra Santisima Muerte; aquella imagen que se tiene de la Santisima Muerte, siniestra, dolorosa, cruel y fria.
Pues no es asi, a evolucionado como nuestra misma mentalidad hasta descubrir que la Santisima Muerte tiene el proposito de prepararnos para que el ultimo momento de nuestra existencia terrenal llegue a un nivel an el que nuestra conciencia, pensamiento y presentimiento se encuentren en paz para trascender a la region de sus dominios y luego a otra de superior caracter supremo.
Se dice que cuando la Santisima Muerte concede un favor se cobra con alguno de nuestros familiares, esto es totalmente falso ya que ella no trabaja asi, ella viene para ayudarnos y no para castigar a sus devotos.

[edit on 25-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

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