The 12th house rules the unconscious, but I am sure there are qualities of each sign which has 'motivations' that are different and may be why we have developed so many different techniques to connect with it and what lies beyond our understanding.

Originally posted by TravelerintheDark
What the cat is doing is open to question

What a human thing to say.

simply enjoying that it's making sound or attempting communication on some level.

That's absolutely no different than human music. The only difference is what's on the cat's mind, which is also the most interesting thing to me. It's amazing listening to birds sing too. Of course there are a lot of people who make a hobby of listening to birds but most people don't realize how "psychic" birds really are and how much intelligent form is in their calls that even humans can relate to. Just like an foreign or especially oriental style of music, it just takes some getting used to, but animals can be natural musicians. They don't have the upper-layer processes to doubt or question the "correctness" of what they are doing, and don't need to. They are always totally absorbed in the moment.

Two Layers Within Us According to the theory of C.G. Jung, there is in our unconscious two layers, a personal, upper layer, and an impersonal, deeper one. The personal layer is coloured by our own life, our experiences and our surroundings, but has its roots in the impersonal layer. In this deeper layer, which all humans have in common, there is a "creative force", out of which emerges myths, symbols, images, dreams and fantasies. In Jung´s terms this is the depths from where "the archetypes" rise.

I suppose the creative force is first conceptualized in the subconscious, where then it is first interpreted as mythical or symbolic, where images and fantasies are interpreted as a possibility. Given meaning however one is "wired".
Impersonal is not a word I would use to describe that process. As I would think it is communication with the higher self.

Each one of us have his or her own reactions and attitudes to these "archetypal" situations in life. They are coloured by personal experiences, habits and circumstances. Mostly we go through these changes smoothly and life goes on as it should. But sometimes this "archetypal" force can manifest itself in strange ways, maybe as a strong reaction to someone we encounter, like a spiritual leader or a partner. We can become quite fascinated by this perosn, in certain cases it can make itself felt almost like a "magic" spell so that your thoughts are occupied with the matter constantly. Just think of the way we react when we fall "desperately" in love!

So what it is that makes one person want one thing above another? What compels us to choose? What determines the choice? It isn't the way the brain is wired, it isn't always what we are taught is the "right" choice. Sometimes we say we "can't help it". And if it is "bad" we can even blame it on demons.
Why does the apple fall far from the tree?

Originally posted by bsbray11
What a human thing to say.

Indeed. Being human I can't seem to help it
Actually, you wrote what I was thinking when I wrote that below.

Originally posted by bsbray11
The only difference is what's on the cat's mind, which is also the most interesting thing to me.

Interesting to me as well.

I agree with about the cat seeming to harmonize with its human counterpart. In fact there's a piece which may have been quite accidental where the cat changes to another key on the piano and gets a rather pleasant harmonic, at least to my ears. It then immediately returns to the keys it seems to enjoy pressing most.

Why it enjoys it is open to interpretation, but returning to the same keys implies to me that the cat is enjoying the sound on some level.

I believe near any mammal, all of which have a level of socializing instinct, will inevitably pick up behaviors and habits of the creatures around it. First and foremost I believe in an effort to communicate, which is where I believe humans first developed artistic ability. At some point it goes beyond communication and becomes an effort in and of itself to interpret the world around us.

[edit on 13/6/09 by TravelerintheDark]

Archetypal Astrology The image to the right shows a glowing being in the middle of a system which takes its nourishment from above as well as from below, from darkness as well as from light. In the middle is a watching eye. The energy seems to be circulating so that one side of the being gives out and the other can pick the fruits of its own efforts. Archetypal astrology is a way of looking at the horoscope with the theory of the archetypes from Jungian Psychology in mind. The archetypes can be described as psychical forces which generates "inner images", concepts and ideas which the whole of humanity have in common, regardless of cultural belonging.

same link

which says to me that the archetypes are universal within the astrological energies.
Two people from two different cultures with similar astrological configurations might do the same thing. One is accepted in their society, one is not. The energy is consistent, pure. The expression is judged. Therefore the consequences of the actions are different. One feels anger and or guilt, the other pride and acceptance.

[edit on 13-6-2009 by seagrass]

The Aries/Libra axis concerns the struggle to find the balance between autonomy and compromise, self-assertion and cooperation, respect for the self and respect for the other. Naturally associated with the 1st/7th houses, this is a cardinal, fire-air axis ruled by Mars and Venus, mythic lovers and antagonists in equal measure. It describes the inherent tension that exists in all relationships: the struggle to find a balance between personal freedom and autonomy on the one hand, and the support, approval and appreciation we all need from others on the other hand. The question is, how can we be independent and focused on the achievement of our own goals, and at the same time find completion and fulfilment in our relationships?

This axis sounds like what you were saying about me vs them. Selfishness vs Self love, Self expression. etc.

the word tolerance and acceptance come to mind.



[edit on 14-6-2009 by seagrass]

The needs circuit is represented in the Cancer/ Capricorn axis...

Cancer and Capricorn can describe the twin core fears of engulfment and abandonment, which seem to be universal themes deeply lodged in all of our psyches. The sphere of Cancer and the Moon concerns nourishment and nurturing, early experiences of safety and care, and our need for protection. The Moon is the child in all of us, and the child the part of us that doesn't grow up. The sphere of Saturn, on the other end of the spectrum, is the sphere of the parent, the carer and provider, the one who is responsible for establishing safe boundaries. The entire axis is concerned with issues of security, safety and protection.

Where we found security was in the family or group unit. Developing a home base. Nurturer and provider. Male and female gender roles. The problem is expecting everyone to fall into that role and to remain in that role regardless of desire. A strict attitude on this axis will lead to disappointment eventually, as one needs to find both those archetypes within oneself.

Naturally associated with the 2nd/8th house axis, the inherent conflict on this axis revolves around issues of resources and ownership, values and possessions, both personal and shared. Taurus is a gentle, peace-loving and practical sign, which prefers to stay within its own sphere of comfort. However, if this axis becomes particularly polarised on the Taurus end of the spectrum, then the simple, biological drive towards stability can become inert and stagnant. This inevitably evokes and stimulates the kind of intense crises that are associated with the sign of Scorpio, which breaks down fixed structures in the interests of growth and new life.

what circuit do you suppose this is? any ideas?