How do conspiracy theorists know the truth when we all have acccess to the same info?

Originally posted by justsomeboreddude
So what I have gathered from this thread, and correct me if you disagree, is that there is no truth, only individual perception. We really cant rely on any source of information, because it could all be intentionally false or merely someone elses misinterpretation. So therefore truth is dead, because there are no absolutes in a world of perception. Therefore we can only trust our judgements derived from our own limited faculties.

There is a truth for all things. Some are knowable, some are unknowable. For example, the person justsomeboreddude is unknowable. One may know facets of justsomeboreddude, such as that he likes trolling on this forum, but it is impossible to know all of the facets of justsomeboreddude.

But other things, such as 9/11 have a real truth, and is obvious that what the govt says about the event is not the truth, and thus we must reveal as many facets of the truth as we can, first by presenting evidence that does not correspond with the official theory, and then hopefully eventually getting a real investigation.

Originally posted by justsomeboreddude
How do conspiracy theorists know the "truth" when we all have acccess to the same info? I mean we all have TV, the internet, library cards, etc. So how is it that conspiracy theorists find the "truth", while the rest of us seem to miss it. Are conspiracy theorists smarter than the rest of us, or is it that the rest of us just cant handle the "truth"? Also, how does a conspiracy theorist know they are right?

They don't find any "truth". You have conspiracy theorists making assumptions based on evidence at hand, and you have career conspiracy theorists making wild assumptions based on evidence at hand. One group don't get much attention, the other group make millions of dollars working a perpetual con.

You make a beautiful point. I often find myself thinking that there is something up, something's not right, and somebody is behind it. However, as much as I enjoy this site, when I read what many post I am just like, "WOW!" There are some delusion, hate filled people out there.
And, just because some dude has looked at information for 60 years and come up with a theory does NOT make him right.
As Jack Johnson says, "Fact is only what you believe...fact and fiction work as a team."

Thanks for posting.

reply to post by prevenge


So couldnt this just be caused by class warfare and jealousy as opposed to being based on any facts.

reply to post by really


Very good post. A star for you. I see your point about fact and fiction working hand in hand, and that in very few cases do we see the whole truth.

the super dreaded nefarious double post.

[edit on 6/5/2009 by justsomeboreddude]

reply to post by justsomeboreddude


Thank you, Somboreddude. I appreciate it. I like your name and fully understand it.

Originally posted by justsomeboreddude
reply to post by prevenge

 

So couldnt this just be caused by class warfare and jealousy as opposed to being based on any facts.

Despite your right-wing extremism contrasted with my tree-hugging, left-wing socialism, I find you unusually in tune with my way of thinking. You asked the next proper question as I see it.

We are in a period where the apparent victim is being tempted to become the oppressor. This appies to socioeconomic status as well as racial issues. Just look at the "it's us against the elites" sentiment and "blue-eyed, blonde-hair white people are the cause of all our problems."

If we wish for another French Revolution or a "reverse" holocaust, sure I guess, go for it but really it's best not to become that which you despise.

Now, don't get me wrong. There are birds of a feather that congregate to help one another in their mutual interests. Those interests could be selfish or giving.

There is no doubt about it but those I accept, I accept because they are from direct knowledge of the situation, some bad, some good. Some things you see going on are not what they appear and nearly everyone talking about it is wrong because they lack certain critical facts which are not available through any channel that the general public can access.

When you are looking into conspiracies, there is a LOT of information that you have to go through. I'd hate to hazard a guess, but I would bet that 90% to 95% of what one reads/researches should be thrown out. The problem, however, with doing all that reading/research is those little bits of information are still floating around in your brain, and at some point, they probably begin to be believable as they have become part of your knowledge base (i.e. you just "know it" without understanding where you learned the information).

I think one has to be very careful in looking into "conspiracies" to avoid being hoodwinked.

However, I do believe there is something to 9/11 and I base that on one simple piece of evidence. Those buildings fell at near free fall speed, which means they had no resistance as they came down.

The only two places I go to for 9/11 research are www.ae911truth.org... and www.pilotsfor911truth.org... as I think they are the only ones with the experience and training to fully understand the situation. I took materials and engineering classes in college, but that by no means gives me the ability to correctly analysis the information as that training was never put to use in the real world.

[edit on 5-6-2009 by Finalized]

If all I watched was MSNBC, then I'd be saying what a wonderful job Obama is doing, people are working, the Middle East loves us, and the US is getting better every day that Bush is now out of office (that evil anti-christ)!
If I watched Fox News then I'd be saying how lousy Obama is doing, unemployment is increasing, the Middle East hates us, and the US is getting worse every day that the anti-christ (Obama) is in office.

Conspiracy Theorists look beyond the rhetoric. They don't base their information on opinion pieces. They actually look at the data that the MSM tries to warrp to whatever agenda that they may have.

00.02 . . . . . I'm just sayin'. . . . . .

reply to post by Finalized


I agree with you Bits of Conspiracy Theory on The Brain Theory. It's hard to get it all out once it gets in.
I'll tell you what always gets me about 9/11. It was a crime scene. You do not get rid of evidence from a crime scene before investigating it. One LARGE example of our government doing that in a 9/11 context was the selling of all the steel from the buildings to China without doing much investigating. I could not believe that.

reply to post by mikerussellus


I agree with that but they then get caught up in their own rhetoric. The more I look at what they have to say the more I believe many of them are just as bad as the MSM.

reply to post by really


Thats why we have to police ourselves. Hell, I was caught up in the rhetoric myself until Bush sprung Tarp on us, that was a wake-up call for me. Then I found this site and thought -sheesh- there are those that actually believe the same things I do.

One of the most common sayings on this site is 'Deny Ignorance"

I like to say, "Doubt Everything"

No one really "Knows" anything for sure. The scope of the subject of life is really multi-dimensional. It is karma in action. Everyone has certain affinities and intuitions and an inner guidance. Peoples personal "condition" has a lot to do with it. Education is vastly overrated. People with high degrees don't necessarily have "understanding" or affinity with a subject. Memorizing and training can be of value but are also hindrances. Most people do not care for truth. No one is benevolent beyond their own self interest. We all skew our understandings to fit out desperate needs what ever they may be. The more attachment a person has the less objective. Knowledge is a process of descent. One must rise about the subject and look down on it to sort out the details. This is very difficult if not impossible when the true causes are not initiated on this plane of existence.

Originally posted by Finalized
However, I do believe there is something to 9/11 and I base that on one simple piece of evidence. Those buildings fell at near free fall speed, which means they had no resistance as they came down.

I didn't think this was supposed to be in particular a 9/11 truth thread but since its here...

One thing I do observe is that collapses began in the area of the fire where the buildings were weakened by the impacts. Another thing is that the south tower collapsed first despite being the last to be hit because it was damaged at a lower point, thus there was more weight above the point of damage.

The towers were constructed such that removal of the floors to support the walls would leave it without any substantial stiffness.

Why would demolishing at the point the collapse began give a different freefall speed than the remaining support at the same level simply giving way? In either case, the portion above the damage acquired sufficient momentum when falling as a unit to start unzipping joints below it. Also, the outer skin being peeled open by the mass above can act like a lever arm against the floor-skin joints requiring very little force to snap them.

One thing to note is that much of the steel inner core did not collapse with the rest of the building. On videos with the proper point of view, it is still visibly standing for awhile after the walls and floors came down. To say it all came down at nearly freefall speed is not quite true.

Nothing above is some MSM or official line I am eating up. It's where my own thinking on the matter leads me, and before any explanations started becoming public. I've failed to see any good case to make me change it. I'm sure similar arguments have been made ad nauseum within the forums anyway-- probably better ones.


[edit on 6/5/2009 by EnlightenUp]

reply to post by justsomeboreddude


They actually don't know "the truth", only what they think is the truth. They are conspiracy theorists, not conspiracy truthers, there's a difference. All they have is theories that many can make a very convincing and strong case for, but doesn't mean that what they say is 100% truth. That is why there are so many theories out there.

It comes down to intelligence, perspective, and emotional/mental health being balanced with reason and logic.

Some people are not "bright" enough to see the truth within the information they have, some people simply do not care, some people read the information and come to different conclusions then others, some people are fearmongers and thrive on chaos fear and panic so they make nothing out of the little things, some people are mentally ill and read too deeply or too literally and misconstrue , some people do not understand the information that they have due to learning disabilities, some people who speak the "truth" have their own agenda and saw that there was a world of people who would fall/fight for anything then manipulate those people , some people choose to not view any information at all and live with a "blind" view on the topics leaving them ignorant.


There are so many variables and possibilities on why people believe they know things others don't some times it is validated some times it is not.
It's really impossible to come down to one definable answer on why people know/don't know the truth when it's right in their face.

Conspiracy theorists are like little kids. They see shapes and patterns in the shadows and most probably suffer from clinical pareidolia.

They see things they don't understand and apply deep meaning to them. They then take this false concept of a thing, and apply in in their reasoning process to arrive an some conclusion - one that is often predetermined because they hold a bias that such a conclusion must be real.

If you conclude that the world is ruled by reptilians, you can rationalize all types of evidence in order to support your conclusion. Let's not forgot the #1 logical fallacy which conspiracy theorists rely on, which goes something like this:

Normal:
Person 1: I have baseball!
Person 2: Ok, prove it!
Person 1: Here it is, see!
Person 2: Ok, I believe you.

Conspiracy:
Person 1: I have baseball!
Person 2: Ok, prove it!
Person 1: PROVE THAT I DON'T HAVE ONE!!!!!!

It's the whole "You can't prove that something or other isn't the case, therefore I am stupid and believe I am making a point."

Or... "Prove it's not a UFO!"

(Subsequently, the person who says that believes they now have proof of a UFO [or that the unavailable not-proof is evidence that it might exist and they adopt the notion that "1000 blurry pictures must = 1 UFO... this idea is illustrated in the "... but there are too many accounts of UFOs by pilots and others!"] based on the fact that it can't be proven to be one because the video is blurry and the object 50 miles away, in space, with no reference points!)

In the span of a lifetime, it is hardly possible to study the intricate operations and relationships between the federal government, international organizations, private business, etc... and get a grasp for how this planet and all of its institutions are interdependent on one level or another with each other. This makes it clear that the conclusion that an "NWO" exists is one that is a preconceived conclusion that there exists a "higher controlling power" and is easily seen at various stages and cultures in our civilization.

Of course, this site facilitates just a flawed attitude with it's brainwashing slogan "Deny Ignorance" as if ignorance could ever be denied. We are all born fools and will all die fools, surely ignorant of a plethora of things that we could have learned, yet even given all the time in the universe it is impossible to know everything.

People have historically applied nonsensical causes for various events, be it spirits who are responsible for the weather or a god/gods which are responsible for external events or even human endeavors. The idea of an NWO is the singular entity/description for the myriad of interdependent factors working individually toward a common goal that is innate in the human condition. From individuals we form families, from families tribes. From tribes we form nations. From nations, countries; from countries unions. It is our destiny as humans to form a world.

I find the conpiraciy theorists know less than anyone else, they will only read that which backs up thier claims and push aside that which counters any information they believe...like the ufo believers. I find them to be extremely paranoid and see things in just about everything...movies, tv, music, etc.... They do make for very interesting posts though...when your bored read them...it never makes sense, so read for entertainment purposes. The real answer is they think they know more than everyone else but are as clueless as everyone. People who disagree with them will be called "SHEEPLE" which I find to be rather lame..or disinfo agent. They do nothing but complain and do nothing to stop these so-called conspiracies.

[edit on 5-6-2009 by kerazeesicko]

Well I know there is a conspiracy by tptb to make my Mars Bars smaller. I know it, I saw it in the paper even.. and I...

Wait, the paper.. That's the MSM !! OMG, am I a fool!!

My Mars Bars MUST therefore be the same size they've always been 8[

Must me me getting bigger, I guess..