Picture of US Soldiers Waterboarding Prisioner in Vietnam

Picture of US Soldiers Waterboarding Prisioner in Vietnam

www.npr.org

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/929597486194.jpg[/atsimg]

(visit the link for the full news article)

Well... I guess this was used for interrogating communists in Vietnam as it is used against terrorists in the War on Terror.

This is not as new as many are led to think.

As I was not alive for Vietnam, I wonder if this got into the press?

Would it have been as big of a deal as it is now and if not, why?

EDIT: Just noticed the interrogators are smiling...


www.npr.org
(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 23-5-2009 by breakingdradles]

I wonder why JFK never said anything about giving the North Vietnamese soldiers full U.S. Constitution rights and the privileges guaranteed with those rights? You would think he would've after seeing the indiscriminate torture inflicted by the U.S. in pictures like this. Funny how times change, don't they?

reply to post by breakingdradles



Ok, I totally disapprove of any sort of "enhanced interogation" techniques, but Vietnam was a different time. And well, we had crappy leadership, it was a disaster.

I am sure they got desperate in the end, which is exactly what is happening here right now. People get desperate, they start new and un-used tactics.

I don't think demonizing the troops from Vietnam has anything to do with it however. That was a very nasty war, much nastier than Iraq or Afghanistan, and back then, according to the stories that were coming out of both sides, that kind of conduct might have been seen as normal.

30 years is a long time...a very long time. I politics it's forever and in human rights it's even farther away than that.

~Keeper

Double Post

~Keeper

[edit on 5/23/2009 by tothetenthpower]

reply to post by Ferris.Bueller.II


That's exactly what I was getting at.

Do you think anyone cared, or even now cares that we probably waterboarded Nazis, Commies, or any of our other jokers to the US batman?

What makes terrorists different?

Also, isn't it funny how we have these groups of people that we are constantly against! We win WWII, beat the Nazis, but then get Commies. We just get over the Commies, and now we have Terrorists, what's next

Originally posted by Ferris.Bueller.II
I wonder why JFK never said anything about giving the North Vietnamese soldiers full U.S. Constitution rights and the privileges guaranteed with those rights? You would think he would've after seeing the indiscriminate torture inflicted by the U.S. in pictures like this. Funny how times change, don't they?

I doubt it as he was president for only 3 of the 16 years this war went on. It didn't really get ratcheted up until after he was dead.

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
reply to post by breakingdradles

 

Ok, I totally disapprove of any sort of "enhanced interogation" techniques, but Vietnam was a different time. And well, we had crappy leadership, it was a disaster.

I am sure they got desperate in the end, which is exactly what is happening here right now. People get desperate, they start new and un-used tactics.

I don't think demonizing the troops from Vietnam has anything to do with it however. That was a very nasty war, much nastier than Iraq or Afghanistan, and back then, according to the stories that were coming out of both sides, that kind of conduct might have been seen as normal.

30 years is a long time...a very long time. I politics it's forever and in human rights it's even farther away than that.

~Keeper

Please do not think I'm in any way demonizing troops from Vietnam.

I have done nothing of the sort and don't know why you'd start defending something that was never attacked.

Must be a sore spot so we'll leave it at that.

What do you think has changed in that 30 years?

"Terrorists" cut peoples heads off, kill babies with car bombs and kill their own to kill one of ours.

What has changed in the 30 years?

How can waterboarding be bad?

Just look at how much fun those soldiers are having!

Originally posted by breakingdradles
"Terrorists" cut peoples heads off, kill babies with car bombs and kill their own to kill one of ours.

And when was the last time that happened on American soil?

well think of how essentially simple it is

water boarding has probably gone on for centuries, if not longer

all you need is a cloth, water, and a victim

Originally posted by intrepid


I doubt it as he was president for only 3 of the 16 years this war went on. It didn't really get ratcheted up until after he was dead.

agreed i believe he was considering withdrawing the Advisors we had there prior to his death

JFK cannot be blamed for vietnam, in fact i would not blame any president

id focus more on those who profit directly from defense contracts

Please do not think I'm in any way demonizing troops from Vietnam.

I have done nothing of the sort and don't know why you'd start defending something that was never attacked.

Must be a sore spot so we'll leave it at that.

What do you think has changed in that 30 years?

"Terrorists" cut peoples heads off, kill babies with car bombs and kill their own to kill one of ours.

What has changed in the 30 years?

Ohh no, I didn't mean to say that you were doing so friend, I apologize. I meant to imply that this is what it will seem like if this were to be brought up in the MSM or something of that nature.

And alot has changed in 30 years my friends, for one, you have alot less rights as a citizen to protest and speak your mind, because of the massive anti-war movement seen during Vietnam.

I like how you put it. "Terrorists". Because we all know who the real ones are don't we? The industrialized nations of the world are the ones to blame. They created these so called "terrorists" because of their capitalist and greedy ideals.

I apologize if my comments seemed like an attack on you, it was the intent of my post .

~Keeper

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by breakingdradles
"Terrorists" cut peoples heads off, kill babies with car bombs and kill their own to kill one of ours.

And when was the last time that happened on American soil?

You must misunderstand me, I'm comparing them to Communists and Nazis, both of which also did not attack on our soil so I don't understand the question.

reply to post by breakingdradles


Ok. I'm not seeing the comparison. By that logic you could also compare them to the Mob or any drug gang.

While it is popular as of late to bash America for its "torture" of prisoners of war, we must take a step back and look at the world around us....

Did you know that on Iwo Jima and the Guadalcanal missions during WW2 that the Japanese (Because of the effective U.S Naval Bockade) would try to capture wounded Marines? What they did to them was beyond comprehension even by todays standards, they would eat them, not just kill and eat, they would keep them alive and cut meat from them when needed, this was done to keep the meat fresh.
North Korea and Vietnam were no picknick either, Captured POW's were routinely beaten to near death made to sit for hours on sharp rocks with arms extended if we take a look at history and what has been done to our troops (Not to mention beheadings) what we have done tends to pale in comparision.

I served in the Military for over 20 years but please do not get me wrong, I believe the U.S should always take the moral high ground and never stoop to the level of our enemies to do so blurrs the lines between right and wrong, we must always preserve our humanity. Just keep in mind what our troops "Over There" face and try to forgive our young Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen and Marines for thier failings because after all we are only human too.

Originally posted by intrepid
reply to post by breakingdradles

 

Ok. I'm not seeing the comparison. By that logic you could also compare them to the Mob or any drug gang.

WHAT!?

My question is, we did this to communists during Vietnam.

If it came out then, would there have been public outrage like there is today when we waterboard terrorists?

What makes terrorists better than commies?

Originally posted by breakingdradles
My question is, we did this to communists during Vietnam.

If it came out then, would there have been public outrage like there is today when we waterboard terrorists?

OK. I get it.

I think you would have seen more of an outcry. People had not lost their compassion for fear at that time.

reply to post by Sailor1


I certainly agree that our POW's went through hell during those wars and the ones who are captured today would probably face simliar fates. However It's not about the soldiers who actually took part, it's about the people who sanctioned that kind of activity.

I will never tell a soldier he was wrong for following orders, the reprocussions of not doing so would probably be worse.

It's the bureaucrats who have never seen war and the polticians who think of troops as just another number that are to blame for these kinds of things, they are the people who should be tried and removed.

~Keeper

Originally posted by Sailor1
I believe the U.S should always take the moral high ground and never stoop to the level of our enemies to do so blurrs the lines between right and wrong, we must always preserve our humanity.

This is what I've been talking about. Said much better I might add.