Perceptions, Reality, Imagination

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posted on May, 5 2009 @ 03:38 PM
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This is something that constantly occurs to me while cruising around on ATS.
I am totally aware that the mass of humanity views reality as what is tangible, what they can see, feel, touch and so on. I believe that reality is subjective; reality is what I perceive it to be, for me.

When we are asleep it is believed by some that our consciousness is on the Astral plane, it may or may not be fact, but our awareness is in another reality and no less valid, IMO.
I am alive while I am sleeping; I can die while sleeping, so that is a reality.
Therefore to me dreams are not just mere, they are experiences. I can awake and feel as if I climbed a hill and I would know, as in my waking physical life I do not get much exercise.



Moving on….God….does God/Creator/Source exists? Who knows, no one. We can believe but never know. I believe there is a Source that I and you and everything is part of, however I am open to the possibility that there is no Creator/Source. So I feel that I choose to believe whatever I want to, some of it really crazy, whacky out there stuff (as viewed by the general populace) but I don’t care. I do not wear a tin foil hat to work but I may have an invisible energy shield around me, of my perception.



I don’t care if you are an atheist, a skeptic a full on believer in aliens, ghost, Nibiru,
really whatever floats your boat. I think that being able to think outside of the box that society likes to keep a tight lid on, is good.

I find very relevant things in Fiction and in Fantasy. You may not, but I do and I am the mind that I have to be with everyday. I believe that I am a multi-dimensional being, that time is not linear, “The Matrix” might be real, the gods in all ancient text are aliens but I do not know and neither do you, it is speculative and perceptual. So believe whatever you want!



What is truth but perceptual? Is truth the same for all people, at all times? I think not.
What say you?


All opinions are and ideas are appreciated.

Your face is my face and my face is your face.
So I also am what you are and you are also what I am.



Peace!

Cindy




posted on May, 5 2009 @ 03:59 PM
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Some very thought provoking and wonderful points OP. I could not agree with you more about perceptions becoming people's reality.

Whether it is for the sake of creating a relatively stable social order, to enslave the masses for some form of economic, spiritual or political gain, or because it's vital to creating a stable and shared plain of existence...there is no doubt about it that we are all more or less force indoctrinated into widely shared belief systems upon birth that those who teach them to us, whether those sources be Governmental, Religious, Political, Familiar or Social truly believe they are sacrosanct and nothing outside of those binding shared rules should exist and if it should exist it is a falsehood or not normal in either an unseemly, blasphemous, anti-social or criminal way.

We aren't taught much, we aren't allowed to learn much, and those that dare to dream and share their dreams often find themselves stigmitized, outcast, sometimes imprisoned and sometimes murdered, whether it be by the Government, Church or some lone gunman looking to set the world right or keep it from going wrong.

They say that there is a fine line between genious and insanity, and that line is called success.

I hope this thread will be widely and wildly succesfull because it is those rigidly held beliefs of what reality is that holds humankind in a rutt it can't quite seem to get out of or beyond.

Great post CindyMars!



posted on May, 5 2009 @ 05:04 PM
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Originally posted by cindymars

When we are asleep it is believed by some that our consciousness is on the Astral plane, it may or may not be fact, but our awareness is in another reality and no less valid, IMO.
I am alive while I am sleeping; I can die while sleeping, so that is a reality.
Therefore to me dreams are not just mere, they are experiences. I can awake and feel as if I climbed a hill and I would know, as in my waking physical life I do not get much exercise.


Yes I believe our consciousness (non form, true self, soul) is able to travel astrally to all the many planes there are. Some say there are only 7 planes but others say 12. I think its probably both! We possibly cant reach the planes after 7 until we have ascended to these higher realms, its probably almost impossible to go to these while still connected via the silver cord...Im not sure.

To me dreams are real, I experience them in my altered state of consciousness but they are still very real and very relevant, especially lucid dreams, the dreams in which we are aware we are actually awake but dreaming.



Moving on….God….does God/Creator/Source exists? Who knows, no one. We can believe but never know. I believe there is a Source that I and you and everything is part of, however I am open to the possibility that there is no Creator/Source.


God has many names just as you have wrote, but for me I like the words being, creator and source. I believe there is a source because I have felt it and connected to it, so for me I just know. I believe the source manifested matter in order to experience the way love feels through form. The source created many vessels of matter (bodies, human and animal) and then filled these with its self. This is why I think we are all one. As each of us experiences our many lives it is our lifes loves and pains the source feels through us. When all returns to the source as one, hopefully the source will be so much more the richer for all our experiences it has felt through us. I believe our souls are just many many parts of the oNE soul, the one source. See the source as a massive light from which it split and became many lights of the one.



So I feel that I choose to believe whatever I want to, some of it really crazy, whacky out there stuff (as viewed by the general populace) but I don’t care. I do not wear a tin foil hat to work but I may have an invisible energy shield around me, of my perception.


I too believe much whackyness so to speak, well its wacky to others but for me its just my reality. So lets embrace our whacky beliefs Cindy and be happy we feel so strongly in a belief that we make it our daily mantra to follow it. I too use shields when neded and I know a lot of others do too.



I don’t care if you are an atheist, a skeptic a full on believer in aliens, ghost, Nibiru,
really whatever floats your boat. I think that being able to think outside of the box that society likes to keep a tight lid on, is good.


I agree and I have been guilty in the past of passing judgment on friends for their beliefs. I see now this was wrong and we should all be free to speak out without fear of attack. Thinking outside the box is good!


I believe that I am a multi-dimensional being, that time is not linear, “The Matrix” might be real, the gods in all ancient text are aliens but I do not know and neither do you, it is speculative and perceptual. So believe whatever you want!


I too believe we are multi dimensional and I also believe TOTALLY we can communicate with beings on other dimensions. Ive done it and I know it was not just in my head. I also believe we are not safe speaking with others from other dimensions unless we are excellent in the art of discernment and have good psychic shields (and swords!) of light preferably of the brightest white you can manifest.




I often think the matrix is a reality and we are all trapped with out true self shut down somewhere.

I believe in aliens good and bad. I believe in The Galactic federation of Light and I believe most Reptilians are not of the light. My reason for this is a personal one, it always seems to be reptilians that attack me astrally, so Im not just saying they are bad for effect. I think they seek our life energy and take it often.

So am I whacky
most probably but who cares! good thread Cinymars!

[edit on 5-5-2009 by Mr Green]



posted on May, 5 2009 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by cindymars

I find very relevant things in Fiction and in Fantasy. You may not, but I do and I am the mind that I have to be with everyday. I believe that I am a multi-dimensional being, that time is not linear, “The Matrix” might be real, the gods in all ancient text are aliens but I do not know and neither do you, it is speculative and perceptual. So believe whatever you want!


Very well spoken.

Perception is the only actualization of truth that I am aware of at this stage of the game.



What is truth but perceptual? Is truth the same for all people, at all times? I think not.


I think this is a beautiful thread both in word and imagery.

Who if any of us are to say what is the dream and what is the state of being awake? As you said, none of us KNOW, we are just full of thoughts that we at times allow to define us.

I like this kind of thread that provokes and invites new thought and gives us a chance to loosen ourselves from the anchors of our beliefs.

Starred and Flagged my friend!





posted on May, 5 2009 @ 05:27 PM
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I will keep this short but not so that the mods get mad at me so ill keep typing for a bit ! there we go



Look up at the sky.. that is your mind.. we are all one ALL one.. cats dogs trees you name it..

What is life? well its the universes "other function" we are the answer, it needs us to ask why to keep it going..

Your face is my face your mind is the universe

So pretty!

S A / Theresult



posted on May, 5 2009 @ 05:29 PM
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reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 


Exactly! I always wonder why people believe only what they were raised by their parents to believe. Not always ofcourse their are many exceptions, but most do. Say you were raised Christian or Jewish or Muslim do you just except that as reality as truth without questioning?

A good example, my Mother does not at all question, but feels afraid to believe anything other than what she has been taught as a Fundamental Christian. Thats ok that is her reality.

But sometimes here some people will quote Science as fact. Its not necessarily fact to me. Anything under observation becomes self aware.

Thanks for the S & F.



posted on May, 5 2009 @ 05:32 PM
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reply to post by Mr Green
 


Thanks MG! Well what can I say to that?
We pretty much agree.
I know you sometimes wear a tin foil hat though.
Joking!


Thanks for your insightful contribution and the S&F.

Your pal,
Cindy



posted on May, 5 2009 @ 05:45 PM
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reply to post by interestedalways
 


I read a book onnce long ago and I do not recall the title,it was 2550 or something like that. In the book when this guy who had become crippled by an accident, would go to sleep, he would go into this other reality, the same one, night after night. He was so happy there as he was no longer disabled. He knew this woman in his waking life and she felt that she was unattractive and he told her to change that thinking and change. It did. It was fiction but it had an impact on me.

Recently right before waking, I had, (what we would call a dream) but I think it more like a visual representation of the journey of my consciousness back into my body. I was sitting on the exterior of a space station and someone I cared about was in a space suit but they were untethered and I was freaking out that they were going to float away into space and die. They showed me that they were in control by making these to animal cookies dance. Weird I know. The most amazing thing to me is how cold I was,I was shaking and wanted to go back to the earth platform where my friend poured me a tropical drink and gave me an extra shot. (That is how I recognized who it was.) LOL In the physical it was very warm.

Thank you so much for the S & F.
I just thanked MG but since there are only 2 it must have been you.



posted on May, 5 2009 @ 05:47 PM
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reply to post by symmetricAvenger
 


Why would the mods get mad at you?
I thank you very much for your contribution.
I would really like to hear all opinions and ideas on the topic.

Edited to add:

I agree in the All Oneness!



[edit on 5-5-2009 by cindymars]



posted on May, 5 2009 @ 09:46 PM
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Well considered and beautifully written!

I reckon this is here for us to spout a bit about our beliefs, so here goes.

I believe that there IS an objective reality, but none of us may ever know it. I imagine it to be more of a framework for everyone's individual reality. We all plug into it somewhere, but most live in their own little realities.

Our individual realities are all that is 'real' to us, because that's all we have to act on, and interact with. With that said, just because someone else's reality is different from mine, that doesn't make it any less valid. It's all any of us have to base our perceptions on. So for each of us, individually, what we think is real is what's 'real'. It can't be any other way.

Now the 'objective' reality, as opposed to our 'subjective' realities, being the framework that connects all of our individual realities, is what makes us all 'one'. It's the connection point. But that's the place most of us will never know, being trapped inside our individual realities.

Yeah, I know I'm probably out in left field, but I like it here. It's comfortable, it's familiar. So much so, that I think I'll build my house out here in left field.

That's MY reality.

nenothtu out



posted on May, 5 2009 @ 11:38 PM
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Hey Neno, thanks!

I love the way you expressed that.
That is what I was trying to say.



"Now the 'objective' reality, as opposed to our 'subjective' realities, being the framework that connects all of our individual realities, is what makes us all 'one'. It's the connection point. But that's the place most of us will never know, being trapped inside our individual realities."

That is the place I strive to be. When at times, I am able to switch my perceptual filter, to one that is not a conditioned response, I feel triumphant.

I don't think we are allowed to speak of substances that alter reality but having some of those experiences at a young age, forever changed the way I looked at reality. I know it was perception, things only appeared to be solid.

I enjoy left field, there is always a party there.

Thank you for your eloquent expression and participation.

See you soon in space.


Shameless plug to follow.

Please come and visit Neno, myself and others at our Space Opera.
We are having a great time.

www.abovetopsecret.com...'



posted on May, 6 2009 @ 12:19 AM
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Originally posted by symmetricAvenger
I will keep this short but not so that the mods get mad at me so ill keep typing for a bit ! there we go


I never keep it short. I hope the mods don't get mad at me.



This is a most interesting thread. I have wondered about the relationship between perception and reality for a long time. I believe that there is an objective reality, however none of us will ever be sure we've got it right.
(In that sense similar to Neno's idea)



I have had the idea for a long time about visible spectrum colors.

My "Colors Theory" (as I call it)

The connection between what color you actually see and the color's name can only connected by showing an example. They cannot be described. Even if you describe the colors as warm or cold that does not actually describe the visible image but merely an associated concept with that color. This means that you can never really be sure someone sees the world in the same colors as you do.



Possible Example:

An object to me appears "my blue".

An object to you appears "your blue".

"My blue" is "your orange"

"Your blue" is "my red" etc...

You learned the colors as a child when people pointed to an object and said that is _____. They learned it the same way. We may see the colors differently but we call them the same. This is because the object does have a true color but the cognition of that color, in each of our minds, can be different.

So when you say the object is blue and I say the object is blue, we both believe we see the same thing. Though we are seeing the same object our perception of that object (the color we actually see) is different.


You may be thinking it is incompatible to believe that there is objective reality and also believe my "colors theory." However my theory does not contest the reality of the object it only contests the possibility that our perception of that real object may be different. It states that the same very real wavelength of light that is reflected off of the object and into your eye is processed differently in each of our minds thus producing different colors in our heads not changing the reality of the light itself. Therefore it is compatible with objective reality.




Originally posted by cindymars
But sometimes here some people will quote Science as fact. Its not necessarily fact to me. Anything under observation becomes self aware.


I agree some people put total faith in the current scientific explanation. This is foolish as our understanding of science is ever changing. We learn our previously undisputed theories were false, while crazed (tin-foil) theories are accepted only to be replaced years later by yet another theory. Our reality is not changing merely our understanding of reality.



posted on May, 6 2009 @ 12:40 AM
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reply to post by cindymars
 


Great OP!
Though I will have to disagree with the idea that because we are all different we are the same because we are different. But then again my perception leads me to believe we all came from the same source but became distinctly different things, rather like how siblings with the same mother were all once eggs in her overies.. If you catch my drift.



posted on May, 6 2009 @ 12:49 AM
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reply to post by Studious
 


Studious, totally cool color theory. I used to study method acting ( hey I live in LA)

anyway we had perceptual exercise, like:

Pretend you are on Mars, what does that atmosphere feel like.
Well having no idea, you try and use known experiences like humidity, gravity and whatever. You can only borrow from a known experience. So I get what you are saying about describing a color. Red is sort of red. LOL

I think of my body as a vehicle like a car. Last night whilst pondering, I was thinking about the brilliance of the fleshy biological vehicle that is the human body. Our eyes are lenses, that is just fascinating.

"Our reality is not changing merely our understanding of reality."
That is an outstanding concept. I love the theoretical physicist.
They really turn me on ,seriously. LOL


Thanks for your paticipation and insightful color theory,

Also see Studious at the Space Opera, very entertaining character.



posted on May, 6 2009 @ 12:54 AM
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reply to post by Studious
 


I like that! It fits in pretty well with my perceptions.
The 'objective' reality is the wavelength of the light, our 'subjective' realities are our perceptions of the colors. They're joined, in that we 'see' the same wavelength, but our own realities define what actual 'color' we perceive. 'Objective' reality gives a common name to the color, that we all understand and identify with our subjective perceptions, consistently.

That has possibilities! It's like an explanation of my thought that even I can understand!

nenothtu out


[edit on 2009/5/6 by nenothtu]



posted on May, 6 2009 @ 01:06 AM
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reply to post by Watcher-In-The-Shadows
 


Hey Watcher! I totally get your drift. I am not a kabbalist but I gained a working concept of creation from it and have expounded on it through other teachings. So your perception of coming from the same source but becoming distinctly different things, is in line with that, to my understanding. Source (if there is one) would be omnipotent , and omnificent yet completely unknown to itself, therefore you, me the cat and the dog and everyone.

Hey thanks for contributing. I think we are in agreement, not that we need to be.
I look forward to discussing these concepts further.



posted on May, 6 2009 @ 01:16 AM
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Oh when I say source I mean the reality in which we both exist. for now. My views work into what I can best put simply as the sexual reproduction of "realities". But that is minus ALOT of explaination.
And I, as well, look forward to further discourse.

[edit on 6-5-2009 by Watcher-In-The-Shadows]



posted on May, 6 2009 @ 01:47 AM
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"The importance of this self-respect as a prime motivator of human nature can hardly be overstated; it may enable an individual to defy civilization, even in the face of the hatred of the whole modern world. When an individual acquires fundamental self-respect, then s/he will be made a fool no longer, and all the blows of civilization are nothing but the battlescars of a proud warrior. Civilization is powerless against it, because a person who has re-claimed fundamental self-respect cares nothing about the laws and standards of civilization.

This self-respect leads to genuine self-love, the second and decisive step on the path to sanity, for self-love (and happiness in large measure) consists in becoming one’s own ideal again, as in childhood. This self-love eventually overflows and becomes love for others and for external nature."

www.primitivism.com...

Glenn Parton: “The Machine in Our Heads” (1997)
John Zerzan: "Against Civilization"


[edit on 6-5-2009 by pai mei]



posted on May, 6 2009 @ 02:37 AM
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In relation to preceptions someone made a good point be for about my blue and your blue and what it means!

What way is up? is kinda the same thing feel free to check out my 2 questions.. a lot of what we do in fact think about is missconseption or lack of understanding of what we in fact are in many ways "or at least understand"..



The is only one reality and that is your own but its linked by a bounded by something very special

WHY

no matter who we are this will never change as its the chaos that makes the order and gives rise to the very nature of the beast "the universe"

It requires us to be here in order for IT to be there.. its a very simple complex thing

We are a thought... just a moment but an infinite one all at the same time

once we stop asking it all falls apart

i hope that made some sense



posted on May, 6 2009 @ 03:33 AM
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Originally posted by cindymars
reply to post by Mr Green
 


Thanks MG! Well what can I say to that?
We pretty much agree.
I know you sometimes wear a tin foil hat though.
Joking!


Thanks for your insightful contribution and the S&F.

Your pal,
Cindy


Ssshhh dont tell everyone about the tin hat! (what are they even meant to do anyway? Block mind control waves or something?) Well I do believe there are some out there who can and do do this to many, but I doubt wearing a tin hat will help lol The key to mastering mind control from others is to be a master of your own mind.

You are welcome to my S & F my friend, you have created an excellent thread.

MG ( without the tin hat!)





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