A question to those who believe in the ark and flood story

reply to post by Gawdzilla

BTW, THREE men built that "ship" in six months? A ship larger than anything ever built before? Really? You believe that, right?

They built the Ark in 120 years. God saw that the earth was corrupt, he gave them 120 years before the flood, and he told Noah to build the Ark so that they could surrive at the end of the 120 years.

By giving the dimensions of the Ark, I was showing that there was enough room to fit the number of animals in it that would be required.

Originally posted by octotomThey built the Ark in 120 years. God saw that the earth was corrupt, he gave them 120 years before the flood, and he told Noah to build the Ark so that they could surrive at the end of the 120 years.

By giving the dimensions of the Ark, I was showing that there was enough room to fit the number of animals in it that would be required.

Chapter and verse on the 120 years, please? Unless it's a Hovindized answer, in which case don't bother.

reply to post by Gawdzilla

It's hard to believe because it's absurd. Leveling mountains with water in FORTY days? That's got a Hovind Factor of 9, minimum. Rationalizations don't equate to facts.

The water didn't level the mountains. The force of all the water on the Earth would've moved the tectonic plates around, creating the world as we know it today.

Originally posted by octotom
reply to post by Gawdzilla
The water didn't level the mountains. The force of all the water on the Earth would've moved the tectonic plates around, creating the world as we know it today.

It says that in the Bible? Or is that just a rationalization to try and make the story seem sensible.

I'm also interested in the energies required to move millions of square miles of rock between 5 and 25 miles thick around like dominoes, please.

reply to post by Gawdzilla


Genesis 6.3, 7 [ESV]:

Then the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not abide in man forever, for he is flesh: his days shall be 120 years...So the Lord said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, man and animals and creeping things and birds of the heavens, for I am sorry that I have made them.”

God gave mankind 120 years until he would blot them from the earth, which the method of blotting out being the flood. The reason that the decides to do this is because the Earth was corrupt [Genesis 6.5].

Genesis 6.11-12 reitterates that the Earth was corrupt [ESV]:

Now the earth was corrupt in God's sight, and the earth was filled with violence. And God saw the earth, and behold, it was corrupt, for all flesh had corrupted their way on the earth.

Then in the following verses, God tells Noah to build the Ark [Genesis 6.13-14 (ESV):

And God said to Noah, “I have determined to make an end of all flesh, for the earth is filled with violence through them. Behold, I will destroy them with the earth. Make yourself an ark of gopher wood. Make rooms in the ark, and cover it inside and out with pitch.

reply to post by octotom


So, 120 years? How did they keep the wood from rotting during that time?

Also, every man, woman and child were killed except those on the ark? Does that include children, new born babies and the fetuses still in the womb? Those folks were evil, yes?

reply to post by Gawdzilla

I'm also interested in the energies required to move millions of square miles of rock between 5 and 25 miles thick around like dominoes, please.

Go drop some water on the sand at the beach. With millions of gallons of water falling to the Earth and bubbling up from within, all the dirt and such on the surface would be moved around.

And, no, it doesn't say that in the Bible. The Bible isn't a science text book, so God doesn't have to tell us exactly the physics of how everything worked. Deducing how something could've happened based on evidence isn't a bad thing. That is what evolutionists try to do when they try to "prove" evolution.

reply to post by Gawdzilla

So, 120 years? How did they keep the wood from rotting during that time?

The wood was pitched. This would've preserved it more or less.

Also, every man, woman and child were killed except those on the ark? Does that include children, new born babies and the fetuses still in the womb? Those folks were evil, yes?

Yes, everything except those which were on the Ark were killed. The Bible says what it means and means what it says. Undoubtedly, Noah told people of the comming diaster and gave them a chance to repent, but they refused and didn't listen. God has a tendency, throughout the whole Bible, to give people a chance to repent of their ways before their destruction. This is called mercy and God even shows this attribute today.

Also, the people in Noah's day, for the most part, weren't human to start with. This gets into the Genesis 3.15 prophecy and the Nephilim and is outside the scope of this dicussion, but if you get the chance you should look into it.

Originally posted by octotomGo drop some water on the sand at the beach. With millions of gallons of water falling to the Earth and bubbling up from within, all the dirt and such on the surface would be moved around.

You know that there's a matter of scale to be considered here don't you? Or don't you? Moving sand around on the beach is, literally, child's play.

And, no, it doesn't say that in the Bible. The Bible isn't a science text book, so God doesn't have to tell us exactly the physics of how everything worked. Deducing how something could've happened based on evidence isn't a bad thing. That is what evolutionists try to do when they try to "prove" evolution.

So you just make your "facts" up as you go along? Very YEC of you. But reality would have to intrude at some point. There was no mass movement of the Earth such as you describe. Geological forces on a global scale take time. Europe and North America are moving apart at about the same rate as your fingernails grow.

reply to post by Gawdzilla

So you just make your "facts" up as you go along? Very YEC of you. But reality would have to intrude at some point. There was no mass movement of the Earth such as you describe. Geological forces on a global scale take time. Europe and North America are moving apart at about the same rate as your fingernails grow.

Nice try, but no, I don't make up my facts. Deduction isn't "making up facts". If it is, then that means that evolution is a made up fact.

I'm not a young Earth creationist either. Not all creationists are the same.

Take an eyedroper and squirt a little at the ground. Yes, I am aware of the proportions involved.

Originally posted by octotomNice try, but no, I don't make up my facts. Deduction isn't "making up facts". If it is, then that means that evolution is a made up fact.

I'm not a young Earth creationist either. Not all creationists are the same.

Take an eyedroper and squirt a little at the ground. Yes, I am aware of the proportions involved.

So, then, where DID you get that stuff about the water moving the tectonic plates around like dominoes? Ken Ham, perhaps? ICR? The Discovery Institute.

You make up things like YEC, it's an easy mistake to make.

Again, sand is no 25 miles of rock. Take an eyedropper and squirt it at Africa, and see how far it moves.

reply to post by Gawdzilla

Again, sand is no 25 miles of rock. Take an eyedropper and squirt it at Africa, and see how far it moves.

Let me clarify myself. The tectonic plates would move as the water bubbled up from and fell into the fault lines. That would cause the continents to move. The water hitting the plains would not do that.

Originally posted by octotomLet me clarify myself. The tectonic plates would move as the water bubbled up from and fell into the fault lines. That would cause the continents to move. The water hitting the plains would not do that.

So, the water was under the tectonic plates? On top of the molten core? Really? Is that a new kind of water we've not heard of before?

BTW, I think you missed my question about the newborns that died in the flood? How evil, exactly, were they? I'm surprised the right-to-life folks are picketing churches. God has done quite a few abortions if the Flood myth is to be believed.

reply to post by Gawdzilla

BTW, I think you missed my question about the newborns that died in the flood? How evil, exactly, were they? I'm surprised the right-to-life folks are picketing churches. God has done quite a few abortions if the Flood myth is to be believed.

No, I didn't miss it. I answered it if you read my post. In short, the whole answer isn't in the scope of this discussion, but there is an answer. But as for how wicked they are, in God's eyes, every human is wicked and evil due to the fall and our sin nature.

Though an infant or baby in the womb couldn't make a choice for itself to go onto the Ark, their parents could have. Since the parent didn't though, their child have to suffer the concequences of the parents sinful action--much like my child would have to if I got drunk, threw my son in the car, and drove off the edge of the grand canyon. Even in this situation though, God show's his grace and love. The baby doesn't suffer eternal damnation like its parent would.

The water wouldn't necessacarily have to be on the molten core. There are underground springs you know.

Originally posted by octotom
Let me clarify myself. The tectonic plates would move as the water bubbled up from and fell into the fault lines. That would cause the continents to move. The water hitting the plains would not do that.

But why then do we see evidence for 'em plates actually moving really, really slow. No signs of long rapid movement what so ever anywhere..

[edit on 2-5-2009 by rhinoceros]

reply to post by octotom


God is an SOB then, because human babies are about as wicked as kittens.

"The water wouldn't necessacarily have to be on the molten core. There are underground springs you know. "

They're not under the tectonic plates, however. Do you know anything at all about geology, or are you just making this up as you go along?

Originally posted by octotom

The water wouldn't necessacarily have to be on the molten core. There are underground springs you know.

Core or not, if a tectonic plate is moving, it is doing so on molten rock. Any water involved will be in gas form. Your hypothesis is on fairly molten ground.

reply to post by Gawdzilla

God is an SOB then, because human babies are about as wicked as kittens.

As I said before, wicked is synomamous with sinner. All humans are born sinners. You should look into the Nephilim more get the whole picture. those that died in the flood weren't 100% human.

Originally posted by octotomAs I said before, wicked is synomamous with sinner. All humans are born sinners. You should look into the Nephilim more get the whole picture. those that died in the flood weren't 100% human.

Killing babies is a no-no in most cultures. Evidently fundamentalist Christians don't have a problem with it.

reply to post by UrsusMajor


The water would come onto the surface and work it's way down through the cracks, spreading the plates apart.