Mexican's sneeking back into Mexico - Wow, I love it ~!

reply to post by jfj123


for your information jfj123 I was speaking about breaking a law. A law is a Law regardless of its class of law. Its still a Law. And Truth if you havent notice was so fixed on not breaking them.
So for you aswell please re read the post before you jump the gun. thanks


Peace!

Originally posted by Ponyboy_86
i hate no certain race, i hate no certain religion or country.

Based on your posts, you hate the US and it's people.

i just hate ignorance.

And thus the self loathing?

like when u feel something is not right, because its just not humane, but everyone else sais its the right way just because the govt said so.

You're not getting it.
No sane person wants to see another person suffer but the US can't save the world and that's what you're asking us to do.
As example.
You're asking me to help hose down my neighbors house that is on fire while I watch mine burn to the ground.
That's what's known as an analogy.

yea weed is no good, the govt said tis illegal. but alcohol is good.

Please show me where the US endorses the use of alcohol. By the way, there are some benefits to moderate consumption of SOME alcoholic beverages.
Also, marijuana policies are being rewritten as we speak. You really need to keep up with whats going on around you.

we can go on debating this stuff all day long but all i see left on this thread is a few hard core believers in the american govt and a couple of us, normal common sense ppl that are "awake" to the bs thats going on trying to inform these ignoramuses. but why? why are we trying to help those who dont wanna be helped. i wish all "illegals" in usa would disappear for one day just to let the ignoramuses clean they own s for a day.

So now you're saying that the only thing illegals are able to do is clean somebodies house? Wow, now who is demeaning "those hard working people" ???

Originally posted by Ponyboy_86
i hate no certain race, i hate no certain religion or country. i just hate ignorance. like when u feel something is not right, because its just not humane, but everyone else sais its the right way just because the govt said so.

Do you go into a person's house and ignore their rules?
What does that make you?

A good idea would be to talk about the rules, and why they should be changed.
But I have seen no good reason why it should be.

Originally posted by Ponyboy_86
yea weed is no good, the govt said tis illegal. but alcohol is good. altho way more dangerous. yea, lets just use plastic that causes cancer when we could use hemp for everything we use plastic for and will cost way less. govt makes tons of smart decisions how could u ever question govt?

No, I've already said I don't agree with many things in our country.
But I still respect the laws because I live here.

Originally posted by Ponyboy_86
we can go on debating this stuff all day long but all i see left on this thread is a few hard core believers in the american govt and a couple of us, normal common sense ppl that are "awake" to the bs thats going on trying to inform these ignoramuses.

Awake?
Ok, why would it be in the interest of the United States of America to let illegals in?
We don't even have enough jobs for American citizens, which should by all accounts be first on the list.
Many illegals do not pay taxes.
Many illegals are in gangs which account for much of the crime in our country.
Many illegals are drug dealers.
Many illegals take jobs which should be given to people who abide by the rules.

To ensure the integrity (something you may not be familiar with) of our country, we must know what sort of people are coming in.
We can't do that with your 'plan'.


If you have a boat that's on the verge of sinking because it has too many people in it, you may think it's humane to pick up another hundred people, but I think it's stupid. It's stupid because you're helping some people at the expense of others, if not all.


Many illegals aren't making ends-meat.
Ok, but many American's aren't as well.
What you're really saying is that you'd rather have an American job go to an illegal and shift the burden onto an American citizen.

One job.
Two people.
Who should get it?
Seems like a pretty obvious choice to me - the one who isn't a felon.

Originally posted by Ponyboy_86
but why? why are we trying to help those who dont wanna be helped. i wish all "illegals" in usa would disappear for one day just to let the ignoramuses clean they own s for a day.

Lol! I wish they'd disappear for one day too!
Crime rate - down.
Unemployment - down.
Illegal drugs - down.
Economy - up.

Here are just some of the negative side affects of illegal immigration.
Before we start crying, "they're just trying to make a living".....blah...blah...blah...let's keep in mind:
-It's not just god fearing, humanitarians that cross the border.
-It's not just well meaning people who only want to make a better life for themselves and their families.
-It's not just an innocent person trying to get out of a bad situation.

three of the four terrorist pilots in the 9/11 attack were in the country illegally.

in 2005 at least 850 people from countries of "special interest" were apprehended crossing the southern border.

the Border Patrol arrested 39,215 so-called "OTMs," other-than-Mexicans, along the Southwest border. In 2004, the number jumped to 65,814.

T.J. Bonner, president of the National Border Patrol Council, says the Border Patrol has "reliable intelligence that there are terrorists living in South America, assimilating the culture and learning the language" in order to blend in with Mexicans crossing the border.

www.usillegalaliens.com...

reply to post by jfj123


Yes, but you fail to mention that those hijackers got in with US visas and overstayed them. 50% of illegals get in this way, yet I don't hear you harping about closing down the visa program.

You also fail to mention that overwhelming majority of those otm's are coming from Latin America. Once they get in the US they claim they are Mexicans.

countries of special interests mean nothing. Some of our allies like Turkey and Iraq on the list.

Reliable intelligence- Since when have US intelligence become reliable again? Missed 9/11, WMD, UBL and many other events. Why would they be right about this one?

Do a search on Canada and Mexico and see for yourself which place terrorists like the best. Remember all the attention is on the Southern Border.

Originally posted by jam321
reply to post by jfj123

 

Yes, but you fail to mention that those hijackers got in with US visas and overstayed them. 50% of illegals get in this way, yet I don't hear you harping about closing down the visa program.

You also fail to mention that overwhelming majority of those otm's are coming from Latin America. Once they get in the US they claim they are Mexicans.

countries of special interests mean nothing. Some of our allies like Turkey and Iraq on the list.

Reliable intelligence- Since when have US intelligence become reliable again? Missed 9/11, WMD, UBL and many other events. Why would they be right about this one?

Do a search on Canada and Mexico and see for yourself which place terrorists like the best. Remember all the attention is on the Southern Border.

I just posted the information from the source. If you have a problem with the information, contact the source.

Originally posted by TruthParadox

Originally posted by svpwizard
this actually makes me mad now that I took the time to figure it out ..... I worked illegally for 27 years in the us.

Never once did I take anything from the system, wanna see what taxes I paid into a system I never used??

You worked here illegally for 27 years and you never once took anything from the system?

How about integrity?
It sure as Hell doesn't make America look good when people like you are so unconcerned with our laws...

You certainly didn't respect the laws that were in place, so why should anyone respect you?

You shouldn't be angry because you were illegal for 27 years, you should be grateful that you weren't thrown in jail for breaking the law...

Originally posted by svpwizard
I happen to have all my pay stubs by the way, (I'm a pack rat with that and my tax returns- yep I filed taxes EVERY YEAR.....) I paid on average.

Fed - $8662.00 per year = $233,874.00
Fica - $3240.00 per year = $87,480.00

Awesome.
Some illegals pay taxes and some do not.
Doesn't change the fact that you were breaking the law every single day you lived here for 27 years...

That's nothing that should just be swept under the rug, in my opinion...

Maybe laws don't mean much down in Mexico, but they mean a Hell of a lot here. And I frown on anyone that breaks them as if they were twigs...

Ohhhh come on dude, "Laws mean something here", here where, in the US ....? Are you kidding me. Laws dont mean &%#* here in this country, they only mean something when it takes away from somebody else. Laws are broken all the time by Americans like you and I. Have you been listening to the news, AGI ring any bells? amoung many other stories that clearly show you that law are broken and there are plenty of Americans, even politicians arent paying taxes.
I know of many illegals that pay taxes, and many do reap benefits, why the hell not they are paying taxes. And hell if I didnt have to pay taxes I wouldnt, especially after seeing how our own government tosses the cash around as if nothing. Dont you see the US hasnt really made efforts to keep illegals out, they even let them file taxes knowing they have no social security number, so what does that tell you?

We have some pretty smart Americans reaping from these "illegals".

And many other countries have a problem with illegals, The US is not the only country having problems but we do keep the jobs available so people keep coming, thats obvious. If there was no jobs then there would be no more poeple entering. Then we in the US will see what it will be like to have no immigrants in this country.

Here is a source for ya.

www.disastercenter.com...

Just a little story for everyone.

There is a large building company. I won't name it but everyone would know who it is.
When they were building en masse, they were hiring illegals for their workforce-CRIME
They would allow the illegals to live in the houses that were being built-CRIME.
They would charge the illegals "rent" for living in those houses-CRIME.
They would in many cases, pay the illegals cash under the table - CRIME.

The results were that the costs of their houses were on par with all other houses per square foot, regardless of whether or not illegals were used during construction.

Many of the legals were not trained to do the jobs they were hired to do so the workmanship was shoddy at best.

Codes were ignored by the foreman and of course the illegals didn't know the codes.

The result:
Poorly built houses.
Loss of work for an American worker.
Incredible profits for the owners.
Cost of houses did not drop.
etc...

2 things need to happen
1. Anyone hiring illegals should be fined, lose their business license, jail, etc.. depending on the extent of the transgression.
2. Illegals should be fined, imprisoned and/or removed from this country and sent back to their country of origin again depending on the situation.

I'm so tired of hearing sympathizers defending the ILLEGALS and not defending their own countrymen who deserve those jobs and want those jobs.

I work in the construction industry and see this happen all too often.
I've been underbid by illegals who require cash payments, have no license, no liability insurance, no workers comp insurance, etc...

funny how some people assume im talking to them when im just making a statement if im talking to anyone in particular it would say "in reply to". and then oh no u gotta tell me all this stuff u been saying since page 1 yea i heard you laws. blah blah. im not arguing anymore im just here. i understand everyone's point of view what we need to do is put all these together and get the whole picture and then judge. and there's more to the picture then laws. and then u go to corruption.. so laws aint sh like someone just said... its just small part of the picture.

[edit on 26-3-2009 by Ponyboy_86]

[edit on 26-3-2009 by Ponyboy_86]

Originally posted by bitersweet
Ohhhh come on dude, "Laws mean something here", here where, in the US ....? Are you kidding me. Laws dont mean &%#* here in this country

To you, no.
To me, yes.

Originally posted by bitersweet
they only mean something when it takes away from somebody else. Laws are broken all the time by Americans like you and I.

Americans like you.

Originally posted by bitersweet
Have you been listening to the news, AGI ring any bells?

No.
"AIG" does.

Originally posted by bitersweet
amoung many other stories that clearly show you that law are broken and there are plenty of Americans, even politicians arent paying taxes.

No laws were broken with AIG.

Originally posted by bitersweet
I know of many illegals that pay taxes, and many do reap benefits, why the hell not they are paying taxes.

Good, but many don't pay taxes.

Originally posted by bitersweet
And hell if I didnt have to pay taxes I wouldnt, especially after seeing how our own government tosses the cash around as if nothing. Dont you see the US hasnt really made efforts to keep illegals out, they even let them file taxes knowing they have no social security number, so what does that tell you?

It tells me that if illegals are here, they'd rather them pay taxes than not.

Originally posted by bitersweet
We have some pretty smart Americans reaping from these "illegals".

We have some Americans not able to find a job because of these illegals.

Originally posted by bitersweet
If there was no jobs then there would be no more poeple entering. Then we in the US will see what it will be like to have no immigrants in this country.

It would help the economy as I've already said.
You have offered no rebuttal.
I'm still waiting for it.

As a topic reply,
The more people that leave the country right now, the better as there will be less strain on the system for those who remain.

Historically most illegals don't pay taxes.
1. They want to keep what little money they get.
2. Paying taxes increases the chances of getting them caught.
This relieves the burden on the actual taxpayers.

Most states won't give illegals drivers licenses so they also won't have insurance.
1. They probably don't know the rules of the road and are at an increase risk of causing accidents.
2. They have no insurance so they won't be able to contribute to the accident they caused.

Visits to hospitals will decrease which means the instances of individuals who default on their medical bills will decrease, which in turn will decrease the strain on the hospital system and as a byproduct allow for better care for those who do pay into the system.

The more that leave the better for the rest
Don't let the border gate hit you in the @ss on the way out !

Finally,
Since they're sneaking back across the border, it can't be too bad over there or they'd stay here

[edit on 27-3-2009 by jfj123]

Many people (the actual ones that come in, the laborers, farmers) in Mexico make about 50 pesos a week, that is about $4.00 US a week, so these people are used to making little money and still manage to live each day by a simple life (buying only the necessary food) and not the way we know it in the US.
If we had to live that way, oh my God we would run to the government to get assistance in a minute, food stamps, money for rent, medical for the family. Like so many do today and they have all limbs in working order and the mind is so so condition, why don’t they go out and seek a job that they may be able to handle, like flipping burgers or sweeping up floors or washing down public restrooms, why? Because most Americans (“ “ “hint hint” “ “ ) are lazy, they are used to the good life, the easy life. We really don’t know what hard ship is, these people from a 3rd world do. If we were to get those jobs, we would work them for a while until something better comes along and then what ? These jobs need to be filled and the illegal or immigrant will do them with not one single hiss but only grateful for the chance. But in any case they come to the US offered pay of even just $5.00 an hour or to be fair minimum wage, if that. So of course they will take a chance and cross the border to make some extra cash to provide for themselves and their families, even if for a meer 1 day.

You ask, “How they pay taxes with no Social Security number ?” Are you really that naïve…. The US government gives away numbers, they have a huge book of numbers to be used by those with no ss number but for the main purpose of paying unclaimed taxes. You will need to search that for yourself, but I know for a fact that these numbers exist. I can go online right now and request multiple numbers for that use if I need to.

The illegal’s don’t even have to cross the open borders (yes open, no walls just fence), in the desserts, dying of thirst, they can cross right at checkpoint, in front of a federal agents if they know what to do and do it right.
Money Talks, it always has, it opens the heavens for all that want it , as long as you have it and flap it in front of someone’s desperate or greedy face it will do all the talking.

And maybe it is not our responsibility to help or worry about a non-American (as you say), I say a foreigners because each one of us born on soil of the Americas is an “American”, North America, Central America and South America. But then why does the US go about helping countries in need, even Mexico. Maybe its because we are such a “Good Country” (whatever that mean) or maybe its because in the end the US will get something in turn for all the generosity that they have given or they will steal what they need (as with Iraq, all that oil means something).
Its everyone’s responsibility to watch over each other’s neighbor and see if they need help or can help. And hopefully that negativity wont seep into our own country but it always falters.

From my perspective, I don’t think its right that people are entering illegally (especially if it is rapists, murders, drug dealers, etc) or that people with visas stay after it expires or that people don’t pay taxes (illegal’s, residents or citizens not paying), but if the US really didn’t want no more illegal’s to enter they would make it happen. We are a powerful nation, the most powerful of all but the fact still remains the same. The US doesn’t want to completely close its doors, why would they. Free money from the tax payers and more money is generated by having them here, business are flourishing, the CEO are making money up the wazu and money is spilling into the economy all by these illegals.

Originally posted by BornPatriot
A delegation of nine state legislators from Sonora arrived in Tucson on Tuesday to say that Arizona 's new employer sanctions law will have
a devastating effect on the Mexican state.

Well maybe you should read this article and see what is now happening in the state of Arizona due to emplyment loss.

ebr.eller.arizona.edu...

As you can see the mass majority of people (illegals or immigrants with visa) working these jobs, construction, farming, etc, are now leaving because of these "laws" the effect is being felt much more worse then having the people working and helping restore the economy of Arizona and the US.

I can't understand why people don't get it!!! Illegals are NOT the problem, the damn government is problem....


"If you were to stop on a street corner anywhere in America and knowingly hire an illegal immigrant to do your laundry or clean your basement, you would be breaking the law.

But for years, the federal government has been paying immigration detainees $1 a day to perform menial work in the nation’s public and private detention centers.

Immigration and Customs Enforcement officials insist there is no double standard, saying the Voluntary Work Program offers detainees a break from the monotony of incarceration and a chance to earn money while they are locked up.

Rutgers University criminal justice professor Michael Welch called the program a “paradox.” Source

[edit on 27-3-2009 by svpwizard]

Originally posted by bitersweet

why don’t they go out and seek a job that they may be able to handle, like flipping burgers or sweeping up floors or washing down public restrooms, why? Because most Americans (“ “ “hint hint” “ “ ) are lazy,

Maybe from where you come from but where I come from, people work very hard for their money.

they are used to the good life, the easy life.

You must be referring to the richest 1% because most people don't have "the good life" unless of course you compare it to a 3rd world country. But wait, the US isn't a 3rd world country because Americans worked hard to make it more then just a 3rd world country.
You're implying that most people have more then they deserve when in reality, only a minority have more then they deserve.

We really don’t know what hard ship is, these people from a 3rd world do.

You may not but many American's do. Are you familiar with the tent cities in Cali or Florida?

If we were to get those jobs, we would work them for a while until something better comes along and then what ?

Then someone else replaces you in that job, they have that job for awhile then they get a better job then they're replaced. That's how it works.

These jobs need to be filled and the illegal or immigrant will do them with not one single hiss but only grateful for the chance.

And Americans would do those jobs as well for a fair wage.

But in any case they come to the US offered pay of even just $5.00 an hour or to be fair minimum wage, if that. So of course they will take a chance and cross the border to make some extra cash to provide for themselves and their families, even if for a meer 1 day.

That doesn't make it right.
They're still doing something ILLEGAL which makes them CRIMINALS.
I work hard for what I have and I'm sorry they don't have more but it's not my fault they don't.

You ask, “How they pay taxes with no Social Security number ?” Are you really that naïve…. The US government gives away numbers, they have a huge book of numbers to be used by those with no ss number but for the main purpose of paying unclaimed taxes.

Many illegals that do pay taxes use false SS#'s or T.I.N.'s to pay taxes.

Its everyone’s responsibility to watch over each other’s neighbor and see if they need help or can help. And hopefully that negativity wont seep into our own country but it always falters.

Yes but do you watch over every one of your neighbors all day and night so your neighbors are doing ok but you're in a bad position?

From my perspective, I don’t think its right that people are entering illegally (especially if it is rapists, murders, drug dealers, etc) or that people with visas stay after it expires or that people don’t pay taxes (illegal’s, residents or citizens not paying), but if the US really didn’t want no more illegal’s to enter they would make it happen.

The US is working on it but with the thousands of miles of borders, recession, wars, etc... it's hard to allocate BILLIONS and BILLIONS of dollars to make completely secure borders.

We are a powerful nation, the most powerful of all but the fact still remains the same. The US doesn’t want to completely close its doors, why would they. Free money from the tax payers and more money is generated by having them here, business are flourishing, the CEO are making money up the wazu and money is spilling into the economy all by these illegals.

Sorry but not true.
Most illegals don't pay taxes.
Many send money back to mexico.
Many use our health care system without paying for it.
Businesses that do use illegals don't give us price breaks, they just have a bigger profit margin.

Originally posted by svpwizard
I can't understand why people don't get it!!! Illegals are NOT the problem, the damn government is problem....


"If you were to stop on a street corner anywhere in America and knowingly hire an illegal immigrant to do your laundry or clean your basement, you would be breaking the law.

But for years, the federal government has been paying immigration detainees $1 a day to perform menial work in the nation’s public and private detention centers.

Immigration and Customs Enforcement officials insist there is no double standard, saying the Voluntary Work Program offers detainees a break from the monotony of incarceration and a chance to earn money while they are locked up.

Rutgers University criminal justice professor Michael Welch called the program a “paradox.” Source

[edit on 27-3-2009 by svpwizard]

The problem is really 2 fold
1. If there were no illegals to hire, nobody would be paying them.
2. There are people willing to pay illegals which makes them want to come here.

Ultimately, the government must increase the risk vs reward for both to the point that neither are interested.

Originally posted by sizzle
reply to post by haika

 

I've got a newsflash for you.
While visiting friends in Fl, some yrs ago. I thought that I would take a job picking oranges, to supplement my income. I actually thought it would be a great outdoor job. Ha!

I was met with extreme hostility. My face was the wrong color and I was unwelcome.
Maybe that's why more LEGAL citizens are not in the groves. You think??

[edit on 25-3-2009 by sizzle]

Few friends of mine had the same problem. It seems that that is seen as taking a job away from the ones that usually take those jobs. Now THAT's irony.

Originally posted by DrumJunkie

Originally posted by sizzle
reply to post by haika

 

I've got a newsflash for you.
While visiting friends in Fl, some yrs ago. I thought that I would take a job picking oranges, to supplement my income. I actually thought it would be a great outdoor job. Ha!

I was met with extreme hostility. My face was the wrong color and I was unwelcome.
Maybe that's why more LEGAL citizens are not in the groves. You think??

[edit on 25-3-2009 by sizzle]

Few friends of mine had the same problem. It seems that that is seen as taking a job away from the ones that usually take those jobs. Now THAT's irony.

So the illegals don't want us to take their jobs away from them but it's ok for them to take our jobs away from us.
HUH, makes you care about them just a little less huh?

...That was kind of my point..Pretty weird aint it? There are illegals that will give Americans a hard time for taking a job away from other illegals.

Originally posted by DrumJunkie

Originally posted by sizzle
reply to post by haika

 

I've got a newsflash for you.
While visiting friends in Fl, some yrs ago. I thought that I would take a job picking oranges, to supplement my income. I actually thought it would be a great outdoor job. Ha!

I was met with extreme hostility. My face was the wrong color and I was unwelcome.
Maybe that's why more LEGAL citizens are not in the groves. You think??

[edit on 25-3-2009 by sizzle]

Few friends of mine had the same problem. It seems that that is seen as taking a job away from the ones that usually take those jobs. Now THAT's irony.

You know what?
just for posting the irony of it,
I need to give you a star !