The Abundance Paradigm: By Amaterasu; Now Online!!!

reply to post by Amaterasu


well i just got back from work and i need some sleep so this'll be super short...

The NWO you speak of aren't exactly #proven# to be trying to kill 80% of us...I know, i know Alex said so..... Look the world is complex, very complex and it doesn't have easy answers -the nwo if they exist probably know that a mass cull wouldn't be a very good idea, for a start who would do all the work? But let's just assume that they don't kill 80% of us, after all anything #MIGHT# wipe us out any second - a star going super emits a beam of gamma radiation powerful enough to end ALL life on earth -the first we would know about it would be when we fell to the floor, the only future we'll see is one in which we live, so lets assume we don't die for a second...

Time will pass and society will develop, slowly we'll get better tech and spread it around, the stronger tech will displace the weaker tech -like how VHS was pushed aside to make room for DVDR or TiVo. This slow march of progress will go on after we leave the planet and start to fill up the solar system, it will go on as we journey to other starts and maybe even into other dimensions and times - The slow battle and tide of development will march on through our entire history, no matter what anyone tries to do in the mean time, they might delay progress or speed it up but all in all everything will maintain a slow march onward. Not just science, philosophy also and morals. politics, social systems, etc, etc, etc - This development has been going on since before our little rock was even slime covered and it will continue most likely even after it's burnt up into dust.

This is the process of nature, we aren't sitting here with perfect working hands, color vision, stereo audio and complex brains because someone thought it was a good idea -it just happened, the lung fish didn't think i know i'll invent a lung so one day i can spawn humans, better ideas beat poor ideas -thus the battle gets more complex and the bar is raised.

By the time humans were sitting around debating the finer points of 'cogito ergo sum' the bar was pretty high. Through countless ups and downs we have ended up where we are today, now consider what it was like when you left home and had to manage in the real world - pretty mind blowing hu? Well humanity is in that sort of place now, we're at a real point of becoming more than just a child like species, we have the power to destroy the whole world, not just through letting off bombs but our factories, farms and even over breeding could put the final nail in out coffin.

The forces of nature which got us here aren't kind, over 99% of all species ever to evolve got exterminated - if the world hadn't been so hard then we probably wouldn't be here. If we go on as we are blindly doing whatever we feel like then just like a billion other times she will wipe us out just like that.

Yes, we do need a new world order, a fair and stable system which is pragmatic and sensible - Yes, the current capitalist system is insane and it gives evil people an advantage - Yes, if we all worked together everyone could all be fed (i don't think anyone could eat cow more than once a month or something, i'm vegitarian so i wouldn't care but i know that the land area needed to grow food to feed an animal for slaughter is huge)

However, if we were going to do this then it would mean cutting the waste out of our society - cutting back some of the greed and stupidity which rules us. Driving 2 hours to work and back each day can't carry on happening, Throwing away an oz of formed plastic every time you buy ANYTHING can't carry on happening. Sending massive ships all the way to NZ to get butter because it's cheaper can't keep happening.

We live in a society convinced it can have whatever it wants whenever it wants it, people are so greedy and vain that they act like the whole world revolves around them.

Until we face up to the fact that we can't have it all and an extra scoop we are driving headlong into doooom. So, i say reconsider the moral to your book - Yes it is a great vision for the distant future, however we need to know that the ONLY way we will ever get close to a system like that is by working hard and being sensible.

You may have noticed my username is NatureBoy - it's because i respect nature, not just the cute animals but the awesome truth and justice of nature, we must respect and live in harmony with the true nature of the world - not deny it or hide from it, like it or not only the strong survive.


-----ok, you might notice i didn't respond to many of your points, i just went off on a wild tangent -thats mainly because i think the debate is getting clouded in mucky issues and i just wanted to explain my point clearly.

I'm sure i remember explaining that Tesla actually DID send projects he was working on out of america to the governments of hostile nations - this makes him a traitor and a spy as far as the law is concerned. Not only this but he also had made plans to have his project shipped out of the country after his death, thus the american government stepped in to stop it happening. Just because they wanted to check he didn't have anything worthwhile in his notebooks / designs doesn't mean he actually had something worth while - if the police want to search a car for drugs does it mean the boot is full of drugs? if the un want to look for WMD does that mean the nation has WMDs? of course not, the government was making sure they didn't give the secret of the bomb or lazers or force fields to the enemy -in fact as i said they did later use his work transmitting power through the atmosphere to create a wireless telegraph system called Radio.

I'm going to skip your other points, sorry but i just can't even get started about ol' Gary, i'll be here all night....

And please... Since you seem to know... How much is "more than they should?" Who gets to decide whether someone is taking "more than they should?" Do we include the Bill Gateses and the Rothschilds in that?

hehe, no i was thinking more of the great power of nature, that mighty force which ruined Gobeki Tepe, Babylon, Egypt, Greece, Rome and a million other empires who got too egotistical and thought they could have it all. Still, it doesn't really matter anymore, this debate is somewhat of a moot point -we're having it a little too late, i was reading some stratfor, blomberg and FT earlier and oh gosh this depression is going to bite hard from the look of it. So if it makes you feel better then pretend you can have it all, i doubt very much you'll be able to keep the dream alive as our society crumbles.

Originally posted by Amaterasu
The point has little to do with readability, really, and I make no apologies for my novicehood as a writer.

As Sam Goldwyn said: if you gotta message, use Western Union.

If you are writing to make a point, write an essay or a monograph or a pamphlet that makes it directly, instead of meddling about with literary forms that you clearly have no grasp of.

Besides, you're not fooling anyone. Why did you choose to present your case in fictionalized form? Because you thought it would be easier to read that way? More digestible? More persuasive? Do you think writing fiction is something any amateur can do? It is a hundred times harder than writing nonfiction. No, you obviously did it because you fancy yourself a writer. Nothing wrong with that, but then you must accept the verdict of your peers with a good grace, not try to refute their points and insult them when they express their opinions.

You wrote your silly screed as a novel because you believe yourself to possess auctorial talent. Well, I hate to burst your bubble, but...

I am not trying to sell this work.

Money is not the only coin in which things are bought and sold. You are most certainly publicizing the work and urging people to read it. That's selling. Your OP even (hilariously) makes a selling point of the approach you have chosen (fictionalize; embroider). Well, I am here to post my review, just as you requested. Stop arguing and swallow it. That's what real writers do.

But it's rude to come into this thread and make snide comments with no grasp of the full content.

Fiddlesticks. Are you seriously trying to advise others on literary etiquette? Then here is some from you. It is the height of bad manners to argue with anyone who criticizes your public work. It is permissible to correct them on matters of fact and that is all. A work of fiction is not a forum or blog post. Somewhat different courtesies apply.

I wouldn't even have bothered posting about your silly teenage fantasy of a book except that I saw how you were responding to NatureBoy. You, who have had the stupendous audacity to foist a heap of drivel on an innocent public and urge them to read it - were telling him to shut up! Amazing! That was when I decided to shove in my two cents' worth.

I, too, am trying to make a point: the point is that, if you hope to be an author, shut up and take the criticism. It's part of the job and if you can't handle it, don't apply. If you can't stand the heat, don't come in the kitchen.

Geddit?

[edit on 12-3-2009 by Astyanax]

Originally posted by NatureBoy
reply to post by Amaterasu

 

The NWO you speak of aren't exactly #proven# to be trying to kill 80% of us...I know, i know Alex said so.....

Alex, Icke, and many others...as well as the blatent signs: fluoride in the water, "medicines" that damage and kill, "vaccines" that injure and kill, the stripping of food value through petro-fertilizer and GMO in the fields (not to mention pesticides and herbacides), the battle against organics, HAARP, "accidents" with live flu virii, the Codex Alimentaruis (which at one time was touted as killing 3 billion if implemented fully...), and so much more.

But believe as you wish. [shrug]

Look the world is complex, very complex and it doesn't have easy answers -the nwo if they exist probably know that a mass cull wouldn't be a very good idea, for a start who would do all the work?

Lessee... There are not billions of THEM, so they don't need all of us slaves. They have underground facilities tended by Grays, and keep humans and experiments captive, and robotics. What do they need the bulk of us for? Work can easily be done by a few of us, Grays, and robots. Not so tough to figure out.

But let's just assume that they don't kill 80% of us, ... so lets assume we don't die for a second...

Time will pass and society will develop, slowly we'll get better tech and spread it around, the stronger tech will displace the weaker tech -like how VHS was pushed aside to make room for DVDR or TiVo.

Why are you so sure of "slowly" developing tech? If the tech curve, plotted in the '90's through our 5,000 year history, is correct and can be projected successfully, the tech level should max to infinite in 2012.

That curve is exponential in its progression:

www.androidtech.com...

altweb.jhsph.edu...

We can expect instead of "slowly" developing tech, a faster and faster developent. Infinite tech? I guess that's what we will have in 2012, if the curve is correct (and even if it is merely close - we STILL can expect this).

This development has been going on since before our little rock was even slime covered and it will continue most likely even after it's burnt up into dust.

And accelerating exponentially...

Until we face up to the fact that we can't have it all and an extra scoop we are driving headlong into doooom.

This (facing the "facts" you mentioned) is only a requirement if we:

Don't progress further technologically (VERY unlikely)

Don't manage what we have better (again... It all is VERY badly managed)

Don't extract the energy from the plenum (Dark Energy)

So, i say reconsider the moral to your book - Yes it is a great vision for the distant future, however we need to know that the ONLY way we will ever get close to a system like that is by working hard and being sensible.

Not so distant as you would persist in espousing. There is MUCH hidden and suppressed tech. And yes. In order for this to work, we have to mostly be on the same page, and each do whatever part is within their grasp to do.

But I contend that it is possible NOW - IF we can spread the word. I have given you a plethora of data (which by and large you have ignored) showing that your "we can do it in billions of years" approach is wrong.

We can extract the Dark Energy, we are progressing technologically in an exponential fashion, and we have the Internet (a vital piece).

I'm sure i remember explaining that Tesla actually DID send projects he was working on out of america to the governments of hostile nations - this makes him a traitor and a spy as far as the law is concerned. Not only this but he also had made plans to have his project shipped out of the country after his death, thus the american government stepped in to stop it happening. Just because they wanted to check he didn't have anything worthwhile in his notebooks / designs doesn't mean he actually had something worth while - if the police want to search a car for drugs does it mean the boot is full of drugs?

When a vehicle has been cleared of issues...it is returned. So where is all of Tesla's work if there was nothing there to hide? It has "disappeared." Many efforts have been made to retrieve it, but to no avail.

I guess it was filed with the Ark of the Covenent (Raiders of the Lost Ark...), eh?

I'm going to skip your other points, sorry but i just can't even get started about ol' Gary, i'll be here all night....

Interesting. One of my pivotal points...and you won't go into it. What could possibly take "all night" to discuss??? I might persume you just don't have anything to refute his discoveries.

Still, it doesn't really matter anymore, this debate is somewhat of a moot point -we're having it a little too late, i was reading some stratfor, blomberg and FT earlier and oh gosh this depression is going to bite hard from the look of it. So if it makes you feel better then pretend you can have it all, i doubt very much you'll be able to keep the dream alive as our society crumbles.

I keep saying... Time is short and this needs to blossom in the infosphere to the tipping point, and that is why I bring it up often here on ATS.

And I pretend nothing.

[edit on 3/12/2009 by Amaterasu]

Originally posted by Astyanax
No, you obviously did it because you fancy yourself a writer. Nothing wrong with that, but then you must accept the verdict of your peers with a good grace, not try to refute their points and insult them when they express their opinions.

I accept the verdict of anyone who reads it. I reject fully those that read one paragraph and then post a snide "review," insulting me. Don't you dare say *I* insulted *YOU,* buster. As for me and "writer..." Sure. Whatever.

You wrote your silly screed as a novel because you believe yourself to possess auctorial talent. Well, I hate to burst your bubble, but...

...but you, personally, make glorious evaluations of work based on an initial paragraph. And, no... I wrote it because I want to save the planet. I suspect you wrote (and write) your silly crap about my work because you enjoy being a...penile member.

I am not trying to sell this work.

Money is not the only coin in which things are bought and sold. You are most certainly publicizing the work and urging people to read it. That's selling. Your OP even (hilariously) makes a selling point of the approach you have chosen (fictionalize; embroider). Well, I am here to post my review, just as you requested. Stop arguing and swallow it. That's what real writers do.

Again, if you had read it fully, then you have every right to offer your critisism. But you are out to lay turds, not be constructive. And I will NOT accept THAT behavior.

But it's rude to come into this thread and make snide comments with no grasp of the full content.

Fiddlesticks. Are you seriously trying to advise others on literary etiquette?

Yes. Because it's common knowledge that if one has a review of a book to do, one does not read the first paragraph and then espouse an opinion. It makes the one doing so appear to be the rectal orifice.

Then here is some from you. It is the height of bad manners to argue with anyone who criticizes your public work. It is permissible to correct them on matters of fact and that is all. A work of fiction is not a forum or blog post. Somewhat different courtesies apply.

And hey. If you had READ the work, I would be more than happy to deal with you. It is the height of arrogance, rudeness and rectal-orificeness to "review" based on a single paragraph.

I wouldn't even have bothered posting about yada yada rudeness and bile...

I, too, am trying to make a point: the point is that, if you hope to be an author, shut up and take the criticism. It's part of the job and if you can't handle it, don't apply. If you can't stand the heat, don't come in the kitchen.

Geddit?

I get that you have not read my book and have no point therefore to stand on. That is the point I am taking from your drek.

[edit on 3/12/2009 by Amaterasu]

reply to post by Amaterasu

And hey. If you had READ the work, I would be more than happy to deal with you.

'The work'?



And your excuse for your treatment of NatureBoy, who actually did read it, is..?

It is the height of arrogance, rudeness and rectal-orificeness to "review" based on a single paragraph.

I'm sure you think that's true; most amateurs feel that way. Yet, I fear, that is exactly how both the publishing industry and experienced readers evaluate books. Art is not for hippy-dippy Pollyanna types, my dear; it's a hard, brutal, competitive world. Why? Because it is the real one, not some Princess Britney fantasy.

But my point is made, I think. No need to belabour it further. Toodle-oo, pip-pip and good luck with changing the world.

[edit on 12-3-2009 by Astyanax]

reply to post by Astyanax


Thank you for your exit from this thread.

reply to post by Amaterasu


ok thats it i can't take it anymore, sure the world is all about 'lizard hearted' people and david icke is right - Tesla managed to discover a way of making endless energy and the PTB just had all those wars over resources and energy which dominated the last century to keep us suppressed - 80% of us will be killed by the elite who will replace us with robots - the remaining people will have flying zen gardens.

Have your little excuse, write your (terrible) e-books and try and convince everyone to be as greedy as you - when the world is choking in methane and sulfa just remember with your last few breaths -if everyone had just been a bit more receptive to the very obvious and very clear problems society faces maybe we could have avoided this terrible end.

I don't think i even care anymore, goodbye humanity - so long violent ego and savage greed, so long blinkered narcissim and divergent strains of memetic tyranny. The universe won't miss mankinds vile hand, the earth won't miss our cancerous growth nor life our hungry destruction of everything we touch.

The globe may once again team with life or maybe it will die forever, it doesn't matter - sometime life will start again, sometime some being will awaken - someday out of the billion failed tries a species will understand, really understand their place in the world - they won't be the arbiter of their own destruction, they won't lie to themselves or look away from a tricky issue -their species will spread over the universe and see all the wonders of space...

.....then no doubt they too will die out, atrophy will chill the universe or the quantum bubble will burst - in the end nothing matters, we can only make the best of what we have.

So with this i leave you my star-eyed friend, be as greedy and egotistical as you like, pretend with all your heart that you can fly your zen garden in the grand canyon and teleport fountains made by people with nothing better to do than make you stuff and covert your (awful) ebooks. It doesn't matter, we are doomed whatever happens -we might as well fade away smiling.

As for me, I'm going to enjoy the chaos of a crumbling world - if anyone calls me immoral or pulls me up on my actions i'll just tell them that 'it's ok i know the truth and it's fine for me to do anything i want because this video i saw on youtube explained fairly convincingly that i don't need to worry about it, in fact I am trying to help everyone because i #just know# the world could be perfect as long as I do what it is that i just happen to like doing'

Originally posted by NatureBoy
reply to post by Amaterasu

 

ok thats it i can't take it anymore, sure the world is all about 'lizard hearted' people and david icke is right - Tesla managed to discover a way of making endless energy and the PTB just had all those wars over resources and energy which dominated the last century to keep us suppressed - 80% of us will be killed by the elite who will replace us with robots - the remaining people will have flying zen gardens.

I find this quite interesting. Rather than show me where I am wrong, you give up (which suggests that you have no refutation, in turn suggesting I am right). I am very disappointed in you.

Have your little excuse, write your (terrible)

In your opinion (you're good at stating your opinion as fact). I have received a couple dozen U2U's extolling its quality for every one of the detractors. So I begin to suspect that the fault is in your vision and not what I offer - especially when I give you data and rather than refute it, you "give up." [shrug]

In fact, at the beginning of this thread you may have noted a glowing review (and subsequent accusation that *I* posted that). In fact, that poster U2Ued me a message that showed that they fully grasped what I was saying, and also took The Terra Papers seriously (another set of data you never addressed).

I wrote back saying I wished I could copy and paste the U2U to the thread, but that ATS frowns on such behavior. I mentioned that they could do the posting themselves. And that led to what was written in that first post after the OP.

e-books and try and convince everyone to be as greedy as you -

This is ad hom, love. If you want to ensure it is not, own it. As in "In my opinion, you are greedy." In fact, I am not, but I am sure you need this term to assassinate my character.

when the world is choking in methane and sulfa

Whatever would create THAT!?! Oil? We don't need no stinking oil.

just remember with your last few breaths -if everyone had just been a bit more receptive to the very obvious and very clear problems society faces maybe we could have avoided this terrible end.

Yeah! Um, all the more reason to pursue a different path. Soon. Time is running out.

I don't think i even care anymore, goodbye humanity

Mmmmm. I am guessing they have indoctrinated you into the concept that we humans aren't worth caring about. They point to all the bad we do, claiming it is in our "nature." They WANT us to believe this. They don't point out that our poor choices are made out of the desperation created from a money economy.

And you seem hell bent on retaining the money system (in my opinion), as if we could not rid ourselves of it. Why is that?

So with this i leave you my star-eyed friend, be as greedy and egotistical as you like, pretend with all your heart that you can fly your zen garden in the grand canyon and teleport fountains made by people with nothing better to do than make you stuff and covert your (awful) ebooks. It doesn't matter, we are doomed whatever happens -we might as well fade away smiling.

Hahahahaha! The fountains will not be made by people "with nothing better to do" - in the derisive way you are using the phrase. They will be created by those who LOVE to do the creating. And in fact, we are a HIGHLY creative species, but that our time is filled with slaving for wages and falling to sleep too exhausted to handle anything creative.

And there is no pretense in believing such houses as I describe could be created. Since you refuse to address Gary McKinnon (and many others) who says that we have antigrav, preferring to ignore the data, you will try to paint my vision as pretense. [shrug]

Whatever, dude.

As for me, I'm going to enjoy the chaos of a crumbling world

Remember those words (should I not be successful in my efforts to bring freedom to us all) when you are nutritionally starved and have rickets or worse. I think you are hoping for this collapse. No wonder you fight my vision so.

- if anyone calls me immoral or pulls me up on my actions i'll just tell them that 'it's ok i know the truth and it's fine for me to do anything i want because this video i saw on youtube explained fairly convincingly that i don't need to worry about it, in fact I am trying to help everyone because i #just know# the world could be perfect as long as I do what it is that i just happen to like doing'

Silly person (in my opinion). You are trying to put the cart before the horse. There is a great deal of work and effort to be done before you can do (create) what you wish.

You can't just go out and create as you see fit until EVERYBODY can do so. Otherwise, it is greed, ego and selfcenteredness.

[edit on 3/15/2009 by Amaterasu]

Hi Amaterasu, I finally found time to read your book and I find it very inspiring.
I will spread your work in order to make the vision therein happen as I think this would enable us humans to live to our fullest potential.

Thank you for sharing your vision and I wish you all the best.

Originally posted by Swordbeast
Thank you for sharing your vision and I wish you all the best.

Thank you for taking the time to read what I offer. I am honored.

Also... Thanks mostly for offering it to others. The hardest part is spreading the concepts to the tipping point. Your help is very much appreciated. [smile]

[edit on 3/16/2009 by Amaterasu]

Reading through, this caught my eye:

That tech curve was projected to go infinite in 2012.

That date seem auspicious to anyone else here?

And now I remember... the Mayans predicted an age of enlightenment after the end of their calender. It might look something like a world of abundance, with an infinite tech level.

And... it broke. Bother. I never did read the first two chapters. And I only got up to page 46. It says the file is damaged and cannot be repaired. Oh. Dear.

reply to post by Rivyolie

That tech curve was projected to go infinite in 2012.

Indeed they did pick a famous date to make the 'tech curve...go infinite' - You don't think that maybe they did that because they were just making up nonsense off the top of their head by any chance?

By 'Tech Curve' they mean the rate of technological progress - The theory goes along the lines that when you invent one thing it helps you invent others faster, so while it might take a thousand years to create mathmatics it would only take 500 years to invent the computer because maths helped, the computer would then mean we could invent 'future tech1' in 250years, etc, etc....

If you're paying attention then you would notice that when you keep halving the time taken to discover something it will never reach zero (1 = 0.5 = 0.25, etc) so for a start maths wise it's never going to be truly infinite -- that's not the real problem i have with this statement though...

Being as how it was made by someone who claims to have read a lot of SF i'm sure she's more than aware of some of the awesome things we don't have yet - Force fields, teleportation, cyborgs, AI, time travel, anti-grav. etc. etc -- If the tech curve actually WAS going to 'go infinite' in a few years time then that would mean while obama is still in his first term ALL those things and more would be invented! haha how likely is that?

It does so happen that at the moment we're developing technological innovations much faster than before, no doubt the rate of progress is speeding up - certainly not the first time it's happened, society and science are much more complex than simple models of progress plotted against time though -maybe we just unlocked a door to a level of scientific understanding, we're able to then use that to quickly convert and upgrade all our older tech and make the stuff we've been dreaming about for ages so it seems like we're inventing a thing a second... Most likely this will continue until we are starting to fill out our solar system a bit, then like so many times before it'll relax while we refine and perfect what we have -then at some point a new break through (maybe hyperspace travel) will lead us into a new industrial revolution.

So while the trend of the rate of change may be going up, don't expect us to have finished doing science by 2012 lol, we still got plenty to keep the great grandkids busy (for all of their 500yr life span) - and that's before you even think about the massively complex things we can't even dream of yet.

edit to say oh and the mayans predicted no such thing!

[edit on 6-5-2009 by NatureBoy]

I look forward to reading your Book. A great big Thanks from me to you.

*Bump*

I read it twice, and am very impressed, and told the author so.

Anyone who has not seen it yet, I highly recommend it.

Let´s make this work of fiction become reality.

T4H

reply to post by NatureBoy


Ofcourse you are frustrated. I would be too if I were suppressed the last few centuries because of a few greedy, power hungry individuals.

Let´s be all we can be and reject the scarcity model shall we?

T4H

Originally posted by Astyanax

Originally posted by Amaterasu
Mind firmly closed, indeed.

To bad writing, always. I'm afraid it's been an lifelong prejudice with me.

Think on this, my dear: anyone who reads a book is paying the writer the great favour of their attention. To repay them in the coin of tedium and squirming embarrassment - on your behalf, incidentally - is not merely to waste their time; it is an insult.

What a bunch of balony.

How can you even begin to criticize a book which you haven´t even had the decency to read? It´s only 74 pages. "coin of tedium and squirming emarrassment"? Exactly how I feel after watching your arrogant remarks.

You are nothing more than a pompous a$$.

Maybe you should have just kept your mouth shut and moved on, the same goes for the rest of the so called "respected" critics in here.

You do not deserve new ideas because your small minds are unable to grasp the concepts. But please, do not let me keep you from your regularly scheduled dose of MSM and Jerry Springer. Have fun "watching the world crumbling" and doing nothing about it.

There is no scarcity but for what you are being told.

Originally posted by Rivyolie
Reading through, this caught my eye:

That tech curve was projected to go infinite in 2012.

That date seem auspicious to anyone else here?

And now I remember... the Mayans predicted an age of enlightenment after the end of their calender. It might look something like a world of abundance, with an infinite tech level.

And... it broke. Bother. I never did read the first two chapters. And I only got up to page 46. It says the file is damaged and cannot be repaired. Oh. Dear.

Another bright light on the horizon.

Makes you wonder if the world is worth saving. (I know the answer is YES but it requires sooooooooooooooooooo much patience)

reply to post by Truth4hire


? reject the scarcity model? ok.

its rejected.

where do i pick up my flying magic super zen garden?

We didn't get where we are in the world on blind hope and ignorance, it took real actual science combined with blood, sweat and tears. Life is hard, very hard but humanity has been working to progress steadily, some of us are helping that progression by working on actual real world problems on a practical level - others meanwhile are stretched out in the sun dreaming about a thousand years from now after everyone else has done the hard bit.

we ALL want to live in the world of plenty, its a common meme in literature spanning the world and history, every society has a utopia of some sort they're heading for. The real question is HOW DO WE GET THERE. That's what we're all working on now, thats why we build computers to help us and microscopes, rocket ships, etc, etc because we want to progress towards this magic free world...

For a bit oil seemed to be the answer, it changed the world but then we realized just how much it was changing the world! So far we don't have a viable solution to our limited resources and the complexity of survival (we need certain things to survive, to get those things we need a large slice of the population devoted to getting and working them, etc the higher the standard of life the more things we need, etc)

Robotics will be important, space mining also, molecular layering machines and high yield power generation - this technology developed in pretty much this order could have the world of 2100 or 2200 looking similar to a utopia but we have to work through each step before we get there.

reply to post by NatureBoy


Thanks for rejecting the scarcity model. Now to get from a to b please hold, a lot of people (including myself) are working on it.

(elevator music playing...)

Scarcity Model?

Oh, I see. You folks came up with fancy term for "nature." I was mistaken at first and I thought you had come up with some new concept.

The natural world, at least according to your funny little ideas, is a (bad) system that also depends on scarcity.

Do animals have all the food they can eat? No.

Do animals have all the mates they ever want? No.

Can animals live where they please? No.

And just look at how "poorly managed" nature is! That stupid starving lion could work together with the other stupid starving lions and have all the food they could ever want! What a putz!

The answer is that, ten starving lions working together is just ten lions working to starve together. You don't magically become more productive because you are working together.

Now imagine that one of those lions (the "lizard hearted" one, haha) found a way to use the other starving lions to get him food at their expense. He has just created an advantage for himself that nature will reward by granting him surviving offspring.

Why should life be any different for humans?

For the OP, this has become a personal religious issue. The OP has made it clear that he/she is right because of a lot of pseudo-scientific mumbo-jumbo and evidence to the contrary be damned because it is all the work of evil forces trying to suppress humanity.

Why should someone even read the "book" if they don't agree with the free energy nuts and don't believe that evil imaginary lizard people are suppressing all this remarkable technology?

This thread is akin to someone telling us that they figured out a way to cure all types of cancer. Then the first suggestion is, "First, you have to allow the Tooth-Bunny to enter into your life", and perhaps make a small donation.

Finally...

All of what I just said would just be pointing out annoyances but the danger I see is that you seem to believe in the unquestionable validity of many under-developed ideas:

Originally posted by Amaterasu
In my offered solution, everyone with internet access has the opportunity to work on the problem.
...
The efforts will be fully transparent (...) Not like agreements made in back rooms somewhere on the "behalf" of the people.

How is that any solution? How do you ensure transparency? How do you restrict people of a like mind from meeting in private and working together to ensure a competitive advantage for their set of genes?

You simply can't. Because neither you nor I, (nor the governments) have any control over peoples' thoughts and associations.

Since your perfect utopia is endangered by a handful of people simply organizing tightly to confer upon their offspring a breeding advantage, it will fail utterly and spectacularly in short order.

Despite what you may believe, you still haven't discovered a magical cure for the "human condition."

Jon