Thanks for the extended insights. Most Iranians in and out of the country shre the same feeling. When the Shah was ousted as a response to his corruption there was hope for something better replacing him. The mullahs and their Islamic Revolution have undone virtually all advancements Iran saw in the 20th Century, and have arranged the politival mechanism so there's no way to legitmately get rid of the present administration.

I genuinely doubt the Shah's son has much if any influence on the US policy towards the county, more the Saudis who are the real target of the mullah's wrath.

With the oil infrastructure in serious disrepair, and no one prepared to invest heavily in upgrading, Iran is facing a grim economic collapse, the first signs of which we are already seeing.

he type of imposed regime changes the US has maneouvred in the past
may be objectionable, but who is offering a better alternative? The current situation with the present government running the show at a budget of $90 a barrel for oil, when the international price is half that, is a collision course with grim reality.


Mike F

Mr. huckfinn,
Far be it for me to question your well thought out (and verifiable) statements, but I beseech you sir, for my own humble elucidation, are you actually presuming to state, devoid of jest, that Iran has a secret embassy in either Panther Burn or Hollandale MS???

Perhaps they are preparing to unleash a monster mutant strain of vicious Mujahadeen boll weevils hellbent on wreaking righteous jihad upon the unsuspecting naive cotton plants of the area???

EGADS!!! I feel compelled now to spring forth into action and initiate a "Paul Revere" style ride about the MS Delta countryside for the purpose of alerting the local unwary rural simpletons as to the impending doom laden scourge which lurks in their very midst!!!!

THE IRANIANS ARE COMING, THE IRANIANS ARE COMING



[edit on 14-1-2009 by Snisha]

FAIL

RESOURCES & the control of them are the center of everything. All the rest like religion are merely interesting cover stories. On my part it is no theory but instead is an indisputable fact. People wage wars in the name of many things but when the fighting subsides the spoils go to the victor 100% of the time.

Oil in the Mideast is in depletion and has been for years. The estimates have all been fudged. The truth is shown in actual production figures and after years of tracking various wells Saudi Arabia is in permanent decline.

4 People trying to overthrow Iran's govt? Oh yes that sounds legit! HAhaha. I believe Iran discovered 4 undercover U.S. operatives however they are most likely trying to play the issue up to be bigger than it is. I'm sure the U.S. has undercover intelligence operatives in nearly every country. At least I would hope we do.

Why is that? Do you believe that the US government is entitled to break laws abroad, steal, cheat and lie about it? Do you believe that since none of the other countries or people of the world are respectable that there is no reason that the US government should exclude YOU?

reply to post by Alpha_Magnum

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If you feel as if this is nothing more than trying to gain rights of natural resources, "I don't buy it." getting the rights of the natural resources will be the "Spoils of War" analogy, but the big picture is that the USA and other cronies from around the world want the "Control Of The Planet" as a singular sect with little to no different ethnicity's to maintain or deal with.
I do understand how your views are "Accurate" for the truths, but there is much more laying under the skin of these events.
I personally think that with this "Velvet Touch" operation, the US has poised itself, with the help of Israel, to invade Iran and dismantle their government and nuclear facilities before they do become a "Great threat" to their (US) initiatives and laid out plans of ousting every one of power that disagrees with them (USA).



www.presstv.ir...

Isn't funny that all the considered terrorist groups are spread away from each other , living amongst the population of the innocent? It is their excuse to use the projected statements of "Collateral Damages" to do as they will.

SO, "FAIL" I have not, but all I can say is, "It's coming, and it's going to be "Really Big" when it does.IMHO

reply to post by Allred5923

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I'm not going to bother quoting your reply:

RESOURCES are

LAND
WATER
ENERGY
FOOD

So if you want to get say oil you need to get what first?? Tic Tock Tic Tock...

LAND

If you want to capture WATER (wells, aquifers, rivers,etc) then what do you need to get first......

LAND

Once you pump all of the oil and pollute all the water what is left??

LAND

Where do you grow food??

LAND

In this case we want the OIL and after we deplete the majority of it how will we fuel our F-18s and Abrams tanks?

reply to post by Snisha

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Yeah, Panther Burn, MS. What's so hard to believe about that? The Iranians have a particular need for the very unique skills possessed by the occupants of the Mississippi Delta. I believe they specifically require their knowledge and expertise in areas of HooDoo.

Ever seen the movie Skeleton Key? I suppose you'll end up like Kate Hudson's character, as you seem to think you know about things that you do not know about. You'll be screaming in a dark place where noone will hear.

Mississippi Delta and surrounding area happens to be the origin of just about EVERY leader of an African American street gang in the United States. I think gangbanging was invented there or something. King Kong is a weapons system, apparently a component part of Gog/Magog, and it was designed in the American South during the civil war and is currently managed from Mississippi. Sa'eed is the Shah's cook and enjoys sleeping with his wife when he's away.

You should be kissing someone's butt for putting King Kong's head to bed (Tookie Williams was excecuted 12/13/2005). King Kong came out in the theater 12/14/2005), the Iranians were about to turn 'em loose.

Some really big things are composed of many small parts. Most people can only see the small parts and are obviously unable to see that they are working together to form a whole. Sort of like Galvatron. It's subtle, don't feel too bad.

[edit on 14-1-2009 by huckfinn]

It's been pointed out by more than one person here, whatever the rhetoric for war may be, peace, justice, religion, revenge - they're all cover stories. Countries go to war over issues of land and resources. Otherwise disputes just remain unresolved conflicts - but not worth dying for.

I'm highly critical of Iran, but not the culture nor it's people.

The Islamic Revolution in Iran that started 30 years ago, much like the Communist Revolution, has not produced any tangible benefits for the millions swept along with it. Education, health, personal freedom, quality of life for Iranians is significantly worse than before.

The mullahs running the country behind to facade of a democracy are worrisome. One could almost accept them if they had the usual greed and power motives - but their unwavering agenda to convert the entire world to their rigid interpretations of the Koran is scary. How far are they prepared to go? Would the death of tens of millions of innocent Iranians be considered an acceptable sacrifice to achieve their goals? No one can say.

At least when money lust is the driving force, you know the players will not try to do something completely self-destructive. But when religious beliefs are determinig the fate of 70 million people, and there are already signals that atomic mass destruction are a part of the endgame, it's something to be scared by.


Mike F

reply to post by mmiichael

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Hi Mike,
I see you're the other "RESOURCE" guy, nice seeing you. Regarding Iran it is important to realize what was happening those 30 years or more ago to realize just why the Iranians reject or till recently rejected "Western Ways."







There are several other examples but it is my opinion that the majority of the Mideastern nations (even our friends) hate us down to the last fiber because we threw their world into chaos for oil when they were content to ride a camel. The British Empire made slaves of the indigenous population of India (think of Gandhi), there was no Iraq. War by proxy is our game and if that fails or is too slow we invade.

Iran has no reason to trust us and if not for the oil we would not even bother with them. Saudi Arabia used to be all we ever talked about but their oil production has been on a decline so we need to talk about something evil like Iran. The truth is a tuff pill to swallow for the USA but we held a 100+ year empire!

When they talk about using German WW2 technology to make oil from coal in the USA you know the party is over. We can't go back so now we are forced to take what we want through force. Securing Afghanistan for a pipeline to the Caspian Sea (+ poppy and hash), putting Iraq back on the BUCK by force and there is no end in site.

We can't admit that all we care about is the oil and are willing to kill for it. Instead we create villains of people that at one point or another were our friends. When the RESOURCES decline we enter denial and turn on everyone. We lie to ourselves like imagining that carbon taxation is not simply strict ENERGY rationing.

Well I can understand how Persia rejects the high paced Western race to oblivion.

PAX A_M

All this Pro-Iranian propaganda. Give me a break. The game is about World Domination. And the Shah and his Mullahs are playing it. You don't have to involve yourself in an endless fight for resources when you are the only power. Your theories suggest that noone on this rock has the vision necessary to conquer the entire planet and rule it with an Iron Scepter.

The so-called Islamic Republic of Iran, while the initial revolution was real, was subverted in 1988 by its former rulers with the help from the Soviets (Ottomans and Mamelukes), Pakistan and Iraq. Since then its been a care taker government waiting for the Shah to return. Somebody really wants to be ShahanShah. They've been working Washington, Asia and the capitals of Europe for the last 20 years, to try and finish us off. As they know their is only one person who protects this place.

The only reason Iran came out with this story is because a rouge group of intelligence operatives has failed yet again to succeed at achieving either Pahlavi's or Qajar's goals. I guess they figure if they can't get what they want lets ruin the American's reputation even more.

In May 2006, when the Shah's crew thought their subversion plot would be successful, and they had reason to believe it would be as they poured EVERYTHING they had into it but it was still brushed aside by a strong Hand, the Iranian President was prepared to halt their nuclear research. The Iranians are only doing the nuclear research to attract the attention of the West. If they get nukes, we can nuke them. If they don't have nukes, we can't nuke them. It makes no sense for them to want something they know they'll get hit in the mouth about.

The Shah's Mullahs don't want nukes, they want America. If they can't have America, they'll spread lies about her. It sort of like when a woman calls a guy gay because he doesn't want her. America's got nukes and a whole bunch of other fun stuff. We send our toys to Mars on research expeditions...Our reality is their wildest fantasy and a slap in the face to their entire culture and history. Didn't they send a Christian Bible to Mars with the Rover?

They are not happy riding Camels. They want a space program, robotic/nano manufacturing facilities and fusion reactors. The Iranians that come here and raise their families like it here. They see our hospitals and shelves full of milk for their babies and noone tries to change them from their culture. And you actually think we need their Oil, Dirt? In twenty years we'll be getting all of our energy from Fusion and Hydrogen. All clean stuff.

Don't even trip, the Mullahs are too far gone and without hope. As is anyone rooting for them. Your never ending Americans want OIL theories are just about played out.





[edit on 14-1-2009 by huckfinn]

Hi and thanks for the reinforcement. I'd love to go into greater details here but don't want to push the attention span of those not versed on Western shenanigans the other side of the world.

When oil prices went through the ceiling in the mid-70s, the resource blessed Middle East was positioned economically to develop and flourish. Somehow it never happened.
The wealth and increased opportunities were squandered.

Iran and many other countries in the region remain painfully insecure in a rapidly changing world. The fear of loss of identity and of self-respect often overrides judgements politically and economically.

Someone once remarked the broad foreign policy of the US in the Middle East was to keep it in perpetual disarray. A Western fed 8 year war between Iran and Iraq, where nobody won anything, just meant depressed oil prices as the countries scrambled to fund their hostilities. In many ways the intense focus on the Israeli-Palestinian ongoing conflict is a successful deflection from the pressing domestic issues troubling the region. With a rapidly growing population, there is an increasing need for improved agriculture and manufacturing for self-reliance. In a fast paced world they are falling behind in modern education and improved technology. Knowledge is power, the lack of it ...

Always a sucker for idealists, I was sympathetic initially to the Ayatollah Khomeini who thumbed his nose at Western progress and the new set of psychoses and addictions that come with it.

But the revolutionary spirit is largely spent now, replaced by a doggedness and dogma that has diminished appeal to tens of millions of youg Iranians. Hollywood is sexier than a return to the long gone Caliphate.


Mike F

reply to post by Alpha_Magnum

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Yes, yes, I know the history of Iran and American involvement. I don't think anyone will be claiming that the U.S. was pure in their deeds. Comparing the 50's to Today is not productive. The world was different then, or at least the way we viewed it was.


Supporting opposition forces is not the same as actively overthowing a Govt. We can support Pro U.S. forces within Iran without going about killing the current Govt. Giving the side we support enough money and materials has worked in other countries. No need to resort to violence when other means will work.

Are we actively supporting some people in Iran, most assuredly. Are we arming and backing a guerilla force? I don't see widespread evidence of that.

reply to post by huckfinn

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Respectfully:

I'm glad you feel that way and hope you are able to get ITER working on time or invent a process for the separation of water molecules that has a positive EROEI. Keep in mind that all we are looking for is a process that outputs more energy than it requires in total to function. I think the issue falls into the Laws of Thermodynamics and those are a big let down. ITER might work out when the thing is completed in 2018 but in a global financial crisis the $9.3BILLION cost may be a factor.

I will keep my fingers crossed for you and good luck on your missions!!

reply to post by Alpha_Magnum

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Global financial crisis? 2018? Don't get too caught up with numbers and budgets and fictional events. Dude, respectfully, this is all a play/contrived. Limitations that don't exist.

I don't want to try and convince you from breaking character, if you are playing one, but very little of what you probably believe to be true about the how's and why's of the world is true.

These things we all know for a fact are going on will evaporate just as quickly as they appeared.

Once the enemy accepts its defeat, which it shortly will because it has lost, you'll see what the world can truly accomplish.

I heard a song when I was younger...don't believe the hype. But this thread surely does.

??

reply to post by huckfinn

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The thing is that your almost completely correct except your about 180º off target.

reply to post by Alpha_Magnum

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So, I guess you intend to stay in character.

Doesn't surprise me one bit that the CIA would try this against Iran, you'd be amazed at how many times the CIA has tried to secretely force a regime change in other countries.

reply to post by huckfinn

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Oh Enlightened Potentate of Sublime Verifiable Knowledge huckfinn...

You may presume to lay that chrome tongued junior hustler rap of yours on feeble minds that easily succumb to type-a personality blustering, the likes of which you so boldly offer, but it will take more than that to silence me when you purport to imply Iran's "need" for things in the Mississippi Delta.

My family is 4 generations deep in the MS delta. I am intimately knowledgeable of it's history, the history of Panther Burn as well as Hollandale. Your tossing around terms such as "HOO DOO" as if it is a unique commodity in the MS Delta is failing in a most pathetic fashion to bolster your incoherent argument(or lack thereof).

Personally I witnessed/tasted much more impressive VooDoo phenomina during the 9 years I lived in Jamaica so desist without haste in drawing comparisons to me and some female Hollywood puppet(in Skeleton Key???) along with the implications that I speak of more than what I actually know.

~Mayhap the obea man shall creep to your door to collect a toll one dark night so tread softly hedge wizard~

Laughable is your implication that I know nothing of Mississippi being a origin of powerful figures of thuggish gang tyranny. Perhaps the co-founder of the "Crips" Stanley "Tookie" Williams did not deserve to die in San Quentin. His 6.5 years on death row bemoaning his innocence as he nobly implored impressionable youth to refrain from gang activity surely made up for whatever atrocities he must have committed as co-founder of the "Crips" RIGHT??? HAHAHA

In your Gog/Magog reference I assume you are implying the Ezekiel: 38-39 passages from the bible but you say nothing else to substantiate it's relevance to your argument other than incessantly repeat "Reza Pahlavi, Reza Pahlavi" I beseech you to please provide credible verifiable FACTS!

But just for the record I shant be kissing your arse, or any one else's. It's just not a component of my particular essence of ~METTLE~ there guy.

I, have not yet discerned a grain of verifiable substance to your meandering diatribe in which you somehow try to superglue/ductape the C.I.A./Iran debacle into WHAT??? I can't begin to determine.

I suppose, as you said earlier, that I just can't put all of the small parts of your argument together to comprehend the "Grand Picture" as you have. Perhaps I would have better spent the moments of my life watching "Transformers" so I could grasp the subtleties of "Galvatron" as you referenced earlier.

How small minded of me!!! I from a young age, chose instead to read extensively and travel around this world to learn about and form opinions of ideas, cultures and history from actual people and not T.V.