Hello to all, I am a newbie on the board and I look forward to exchanging posts with you.

I work as a DOD contractor in which I must have a security clearance, it has always confused me why myself and thousands of other people have to go through an in depth investigation just to get a job at what we do, while politicians don't even need one, yet they have access to just about anytype of classified materials.

I know they are elected officials and yes they were elected to office due to trust BUT why should others have to go through a security process and they don't? It sounds like a huge double standard to me. All they take is an oath and give their word.

There have been countless politicians busted over the years for corruption and some of them even sent to prison, so why should they be held to a lower standard.

Personally I think that if ANYONE has access to classified materials, which it even states in the security manuals concerning national security issues then they should fill out the paperwork and be cleared through an investigation just as others have.

My question has nothing to do with the current election either, I have always thought about this matter all the way back to the 70's and I am not here just to single out one political party, they all should be held to higher standards.

I have been told by some people that some politicians do actually have authentic clearances that were investigated such as mine and others, but when I ask who they are....no one knew and I asked how can you know for sure then that they were cleared?

I filled out a FOIA request form and sent it in only to be turned down citing privacy issues, I also called the senate security office and they said the same. So with that being said, I would like to ask anyone on this board.

Do you know by chance how I can find out who has a clearance? I have googled and just about everything I can think of doing an online search with no luck.

If I do eventually discover some politician that has actually filled out the paperwork , been investigated and cleared then I will be happy and let my inquiry go because that tells me that the statement about them not needing any type of clearance is not exactly true and there are exceptions to the rule.

If not I will continue to research things and hopefully with any luck, contact my elected officials and ask that the policy be changed. I know thats wishful thinking, but I just think it's wrong. Anyway...with that said I hope someone may have some answers I am seeking and I look forward to hearing from you. You can post me or email at melhardee@yahoo.com

Thanks.

Not only should they have to go through the proper channels for a security clearance, they should also have to be drug tested like everyone else.

Security clearances for elected officials depend on thier particular access to materials deemed secret or otherwise. Not all congressmen or senators are cleared to view classified documents because it doesn't directly pertain to thier roles or memberships of committees. I am not sure what level of clearance you obtained but as for me I had the lowest level (SSI clearance), so I would be unable to view anything that anyone say in the DoD could because of my job.Compartmentalization is what keeps the secrets my friend.

[edit on 21-12-2008 by djvexd]

Originally posted by rangersdad
Not only should they have to go through the proper channels for a security clearance, they should also have to be drug tested like everyone else.

A star for that! Yes, they should be subjected to all conditions that they impose on the working class. That would simply be fair.

Most couldn't get them..too much drug use, past crimes, psychological issues, can't pass poly, or have no references who will say anything good.

The thing that is paramount is that any clearances Secret and above require a non-disclosure agreement.......How many in Congress would be willing to sign a document that says that if you reveal info that is deemed currently or in the future as a threat to NATSEC (national security), you surrender most of your rights. Barney Frank????

Senators and congressmen/women are in fact state employees whcihc happen to work in a federal setting. They are elected and employed at the state level to work at the federal level. Which is another reason not all of them are required to have security clearances.

True, those are the regs for the Sen Committee on Intel......those members must be vetted and receive clearances.....

Yes it says they must have the proper clearance but does that mean the secret oath they take clearance or a authentic Gov't security clearance? The one where a sf or esq 86 form is filled out.

See, this is my point, people say they must have the proper clearance but no one really knows what type and level of clearance they have, thats what I am trying to find out.

If you look at those regs posted about, nothing in it says what specific type of clearance for congressman/women or senators is needed, it just basically says they must have a security clearance or the appropriate security clearance.It does not SPECIFY which type or what level, so for all I know they could be talking about only the secret oath they take.

I always have people tell me they don't need clearances as I refer to and then others say they do, BUT no one can really show me proof if they do need one and give specific information that actually states what level they have and did they fill out the paperwork.

Thats what I looking for.

I guess its all ATS huh?

Basically what your thinking about is that politicians ARE cleared. But the process is a little different. You or I when we recieved our clearances had to fill out mounds of paperwork which was then sent to the FBI who then investigated the information then provided the clearance. Public officials who require one are generally given only a non disclosure packet which is about 1/10 the size of the paperwork you or I filled out. This is because politicians are "vetted" or investigated through the media and public when on that large of a stage (i.e congressman or senator). The FBI relies on the opposing campaigns and the newsmedia to do the bulk of the investigation for them. Why do they do this? Geberally they are working on a extremely LARGE backlog of clearing individuals for differnt work ( my low-level clearance took 7 months to come through). As many here would ask "why would they trust the media or an opposing campaign to clear the politician?" That's becasue the media and opposition do have an uncanny knack for diggin up dirt on politicians. Then said person endures the storm and is elected by the people. 95% of it is done for them. Just becasue you been bad once or twice doesn't mean you can't get cleared, and the way the FBI looks at it is, the safest person to trust with state secrets is someone you can control with thiers. Hence the vetting and signing. Now thier staff and aids are a completely different story and must fill out the standard forms but generally do so very early ( as you can be applying for a position and still apply for a clearance without being hired) and are generally moved to the front of the line once elected.

I think you misunderstood what I was saying. While the FBI does the bulk of the actual legwork ( and this comes from the adminstrator for CBP), for politicians the OPM conducts something along the lines of what was stated here: Other Investigations
The Office of Personnel Management (OPM) conducts other types of investigations. Some are for
employment purposes only, and others are for a combination of employment and security clearance
purposes. These investigations are generally not conducted for the Department of Defense contractor
personnel.
This would encompass most elected offcials whom need access to confidential material and even up to TS docs. This was as of 5 years ago when I was employed. Unfortunatley the strigent requirements for you or I or anyone else do not apply to elected officials unless said official is going to be directly involved in a classified project and not just provide oversight. I was not inferring that they watch tv and say "OK Frank here ya go!" The FBI, CIA NSA have ALL used MSM and other outlets to obtain information on people especially politicians. Is that all they rely on? No. But it is looked upon.

assume you were replying to my post.....Good post......I agree, my point is that you and I undergo much more investigation than John Q Representative, UNLESS he needs access to TS levels of info (as you said)...So, we cannot assume that the Representative that goes to Iraq has a TS clearance or even a clearance at all. I was required to fly certain politicians in my aircraft, when I asked their level of clearance, I was often told, "none, but it was authorized by Gen. XXXXXX") These individuals had visual access to recon and weapons systems data that should have required a TS clearance. Some had had a previous clearance (> 10 yrs old), but some had none.....

Yeah, thats what always got me about being cleared by the top brass. but you were outranked and what are you going to say? F U general, I don't think so! Nope, your going to say YES SIR NO PROBLEM.


I was stationed at Fort Bragg when my unit was mobilized during the build up to Desert Shield before deploying and I remember like yesterday when we were all at Pope AFB waiting on the green ramp area to embark on an aircraft and the Air Force all of a sudden started shutting down that area of the strip down due to a weapons movement.


They had what is referred by the Air Force to as GODZILLA.....basicallly a huge aircraft moving tractor that looked like a cross between a tank and a monster truck, they are use to move the big aircraft like C130s and C5s etc...around. This time they were hauling trailers attached to them with those bombs on the back. There were 6 trailers attached per tractor with each trailer having 10 bombs on them and there were a total of 15 tractors.

The AF police just about shut down everything, I guess it was planned weeks in advance, but no one told us. Figures.

Usually that does not happen but I found out later through scuttlebut that a new special weapon was being loaded called the BLU 109 which at the time was a newly developed bunker busting deep penetrating bomb and had at the time the highest DX rating for the DOD.

Anyway what was strange was seeing a local state representative observing the whole thing and we had to turn around and leave and we all had secrets clearances at the time. I guess secret was not high enough huh?

After that happened thats when I became interested in if these elected officials had actual security clearances.....BUT like you said the general "AKA post Commander" had cleared him.

After that I just could not believe what I saw and was a skeptic from then on. I still think it's a double standard for us to have to go through our crazy paperwork and investigations and these people don't.

It took me 452 days to be cleared, mostly due to backlogs in the system as JPAS put it. I had to take 2 polygraphs, SSBI the whole works.
I was sweating bullets when I had to put down my ex wife on paper, that was a nasty divorce. But in the end, I passed go and collected the money.

Hopefully these new proposals being brought up about revisions in the security procedures in the senate and congress will change things, but I'm not holding my breath.