Teacher tells 7 year-olds Santa's Fake.

reply to post by MemoryShock


I'm sorry, was my sarcasm a bit over the top?

I think thats the entire point.

That teacher doing the one thing she could really think of to hurt those children was to tell them 'There is no Santa Clause."
What kind of sicko could possibly not see that as over the top?
She said it to shock and hurt them. She said it to unravel their worlds a little bit more so she could take that opportunity to control them.
Who's being over the top and manipulative?

You spend so much time defending your right to slap kids with the truth that you don't even think about when or where you should.

How many folks here think Santa's going to bring them a pony?


Anyone?

See - we all grow out of it
but a kindergarten teacher who uses it as a weapon against children is just sick.

She's got the right to do that though..
its only fair.
It's the truth.
Yaay!

"Oh, the tangled webs we weave when we practice to deceive." - Sir Walter Scott

Nobody would've been upset or gotten fired if the parents had adhered to the truth. Such anger and outrage that never should've been on a holiday that was originally built upon love, giving and forgiveness.

reply to post by badgerprints


Copy that...the sarcasm seemed more aimed at the perpetuation of this particular ideology then a focus on how and why truth should be disseminated.

As stated before, I agree that the teacher was out of line and something of this nature should be left to the parents.

reply to post by saint4God


Once again.
What if that teacher had told your children that Jesus didn't exist?
I'm not talking about the size of a state.
I'm saying,"Does this teacher have the right to tell your children that their beliefs are false?"

[edit on 11-12-2008 by badgerprints]

There are enough awe inspiring things that are real in this world. Enough possibilities to let their imaginations run wild. Instead of telling them about a man that will give them free stuff for no reason (entitlement), tell them about "the time traveler", who knows, you might inspire them to be the next brilliant mind in science application.

There are pleanty of stories that can give children drives and goals, why make up a story about a man that gives reward without effort? Christmas should be a time to teach about giving instead of receiving, leave the magic for bedtime stories.

Tell a story of a man who figured out how to travel through time, or create a device to shirk himself, or a man who figured out how to travel the universe. Who knows, it might inspire them to actually pursue it, not to mention, it allows them to imagine their own worlds. Anyone can tell you a story, but the idea of traveling across the universe, you could create your own.

My point is, santa claus could be readily replaced with a much more productive and creative driver. it would be filled with just as much magic, if not more. Some might say santa claus gives hope and optimism to young kids.

The best producer of hope is that which can never be broken or disproven in our lifetimes. Why do you think god is so successful?

From your positions earlier the teacher should tell the truth where she sees it.
What if she is an atheist?
Should she tell your kids you are a liar?

Originally posted by badgerprints
Once again.
What if that teacher had told you that jesus didn't exist?
I'm not talking about the size of a state.
I'm saying,"Does this teacher have the right to tell your children that their beliefs are false?"

I think that context should be applied when reacting to the action of the teacher. She was frutrated and said it in heated frutration...which is not cool. A reactive mindset for the communication of anything is not the best course of action.

Now, should a teacher communicate the truth to their students?

Yes!! That's their job!! Though the presentation should be objective and with the parents in mind.

reply to post by badgerprints


I would have never told my kids that jesus did or didn't exist in the first place. I would have never told them santa existed to begin with. Cuts out the issue of them having to find out from some substitute teacher.

300 years ago you know what the people of that time would call our cellphones, airplanes, and computers? magic. Lets give our children some "magic" to believe it, but let it be something that will benefit them for a lifetime. A story of a man giving stuff out for no reason is not a productive story to be telling children.

Yes, there is a time for truth, but, do we need to set a date for it for everyone to tell? No, it`s up to each and every one of us to make that call. Like I said before, as we grow up, we soon learn the truth, we don`t always need someone to slap our faces with it, do we? If telling little kids the story about Santa makes the those children smile and be happy over the holiday, then what seems to be the problem? I agree with many on this. Why take away something that is about love and giving? Is that what you want, a world that is stone cold with little or no heart? It`s not the idea about Santa or Jesus, it`s the idea of loving one another, and the giving from one heart to another that is the point of the stories. The problem is, we need to keep it in our hearts the year round, not just over Christmas. This is my opinion.

It now looks as though we want to make this all about what we teach our children. The do`s and don`ts of what we must teach them. And it all boils down to..............not one of us has the right to tell each other how to go about it. Not one of us is an expert, we all use what is within us to do the job. so let`s get off of this, ok? It just makes all of us look like a bunch of silly fools. Teach your children in the best way you know how to, we don`t come with a book on parenting when were born.

[edit on 11-12-2008 by FiatLux]

In some way it is good! But for children it exites them and makes them feel happy, and personally without christmas in december i think it would be awefull!

The weather is terrible!

I believed in santa until i was 7 though!

I can't believe all you people hating on Santa and the Christmas tradition.
Christmas is a special magical time for children they will grow up soon enough and will know of the harsh realities of the world so why rush it?

I have so many happy memories of my childhood regarding Santa and Christmas. I can't remember the how old I was when I stopped believing in Santa but it was something I figured out myself and did not have to be told. I was not crushed or hurt. I continued to pretend I believed because I did not want to ruin it for my younger siblings.

I now have children of my own and it brings joy to my heart to see the look on my childs face when she talks about Santa and Christmas. Parents enjoy it as much as the children.

You people that talk about the supposed harm of telling children that Santa exists do not know what you are talking about. This has been done for generations and everyone seems to have turned out ok even after been told this terrible lie when they were children.

It is simply a fun tradition that children and parents both enjoy. I think you people need to lighten up and try to enjoy life.

reply to post by MemoryShock


Seems like we've tangled up a bit. I was actually addressing ole whats his face. He took off.
I support telling kids the truth but there is a time and place.
The teacher is a twit.
She shouldn't get into teaching if hurting kids feelings is her basis for telling the truth.
If she wanted to dispell the santa myth it could have been done with a pamplet or lesson plan. The best time might be in January. Then the kids can mull it over for a year, maybe look into the easter bunny and the tooth fairy. They could read up on congress while they are at it.
You know, maybe they will be the ones to teach us that democracy in the USA is a lie.
Adults have their fantasies too you know.

Originally posted by grimreaper797
reply to post by badgerprints

 

A story of a man giving stuff out for no reason is not a productive story to be telling children.

No real argument either way in most of what you said.
The last line was a little off.
There is an underlying moral for giving but it has nothing to do with red suits or reindeer.

Originally posted by FiatLux
Why take away something that is about love and giving?

Becuase its not. For the kids it is all about the love of GETTING. Getting pleanty of big gifts that is. You think kids would light up if instead of gifts it was community service. The joy of helping somebody else out? Doubt it.

For the parents its all about A. reliving their childhood. Some nostalgia type deal where they want to relive it through their children. or B. an emotional feeling they get from exciting and hyping their child up about christmas, without a single care as to what effects it may have on their children.

Perhaps psychology isn't a strong point for most, but things like this DO have effects, mostly on a subconscious level. These kids DO learn from experience, and what this experience tells them is that when they want something, all they have to do is ask for it, and eventually somebody will give it to them for no reason.

I mean christmas time, heres a bunch of free stuff from santa. Easter, heres free candy and presents from the easter bunny. Halloween, heres a whole lot of free candy from the community

It's intent may be harmless, and you may think you are doing the kid a good deed by showing them a memorable time. In reality though, what you are doing is giving them something for nothing, and thats not a good life lesson.

Is that what you want, a world that is stone cold with little or no heart?

Thats what we got because of things like this. Kids grow up thinking everything will be given to them, and its all about them. You spoil these kids with extravagant holidays, ultimately for your own personal enjoyment of seeing the kids faces light up.

reply to post by badgerprints


What the line meant was "teaching kids this man will give you stuff without any reason" is not a good moral. AKA the theme of entitlement. If the story of santa was "you will only get a gift if you give to others" it would be a little different.

As the tale goes though, its just wait for this guy to give you free stuff, even if you did nothing to deserve it. Lets face it, whens the last time a kid that deserved coal actually got coal for christmas?

Originally posted by Erasurehead
You people that talk about the supposed harm of telling children that Santa exists do not know what you are talking about. This has been done for generations and everyone seems to have turned out ok even after been told this terrible lie when they were children.

Yeah, every generation turned out ok. Thats why the world is the way it is. Because we raised a bunch of generous well balanced individuals who fully believe in the spirit of giving.

Maybe Im a pessimist, but from the looks of it, christmas failed pretty hard in the 'teaching people to be giving' department.

Also, how long as santa claus been around?

Originally posted by grimreaper797
reply to post by badgerprints

 

AKA the theme of entitlement. If the story of santa was "you will only get a gift if you give to others" it would be a little different.

Well,
I think I made the point that Santa wasn't the ultimate moral here.
Giving is a voluntary act of caring or kindness or even love on the part of the individual.

You will only get a gift if you give to others is simply a compulsory rule that dictates the necessity to give in order to recieve.

IT IS NOT ABOUT RECIEVING.

It is about giving with no expectations of reciprocity or even thanks. It is about the idea that we can do good things for others without needing anything back.

reply to post by badgerprints


I said "alittle" different, not completely different or right. At least with the giving requirement, it would teach them to do good, even if it is selfish in reason.

No kid goes "Oh santa, I see. You give to me, without expectations of me giving anything to you because you wish to prove to humanity that giving without expectation is the ultimate act of kindness." These kids aren't plato and socrates, they aren't philosophyu majors, they are 7 year olds. They think "awesome, free expensive gifts! I can't wait to play that xbox 360!"

I'd have been mad, just like those parents.
I mean, their kids were seven- They only had a few years left of those Christmas mornings where the children actually believed in the magic of it all.
Who cares that they're happy they're getting big gifts?
They're excited, it's childhood.
And it doesn't last long.
Every parent wants to see their child excited for "Santa's" big night.

It doesn't matter that it's a lie, that it isn't real, or that the children are simply excited to receive.

Some of you are ridiculous.

Originally posted by grimreaper797

Originally posted by Erasurehead

Maybe Im a pessimist, but from the looks of it, christmas failed pretty hard in the 'teaching people to be giving' department.

Yep.
Good point.
You're a pessimist.

I can't argue with you there.

You win!