it doesn't matter how many he did, he did it for a reason. He was probably tired out. Yeah, and like the other guy said,"what more do you want from him." He's been through a lot.

Yes it is believed by most yet not by me personally he helped everyone with his extraterrestrial abilities. But he only helped the people in that area of the world. What about the rest of the world at that time? Did they have any inclination of what was going on there? I mean no disrepect of your beliefs as I just ask you a question. To me it seems that he is believed as a savior but to whom? and how long did it take to reach the rest of the globe?

[Edited on 3-4-2004 by I See You]

nlive--- "He was probably tired out"

i thought he was God???

i thought he was all powerful and etc.???

and adults hate conmen.. that s why he was killed. The "hero" of the bible never existed...He evolved thru the "telephone game"

true true...

i also believe that some of those "miracles" evolved through people telling eachother stories...

how do we know he never done anything when he was young. i personally beleive that the period we do not know about his life was the time when he was coming to terms with his tasks here on earth. if you think about what he went onto do.

and also one more thing, if he was as we believe God on earth(gods son), than he did as all he should of done. you have to remember that god really has to be a passive observer, all to do with free will and all that.

so if jesus did this and that for everyone, he really would not have done gods work. he would have been here today gone tomorrow, and probably never remered at all.

giving people the ability to believe is more important, greater is the faith of those that do not see first hand.

Ok a bit more than 7 miricles where did you count that?

Water Changed to wine
Jn 2:9

Noblemans Son
Jn 4:46

Catch of Fishes
Luke 5:6

Demonaic in the sinagogue
Mk 1:26 Lk 4:35

Peters mother in law healed
Mt8:14 Mk 1:31:4:38

Cleansing teh leper
Mt 8:3 Mk 1:41 Lke 5:13

Paralytic
Mt 9:2 Mk 2:3 Lk 5:18

Invalid healed
Jn 5:5

Shrivveled hand
Mt 12:10 Mk 3:1 Lk 6:6

Centurions Servent
Mt 8:5 Lk 7:2

Raising the widows son
Lk 7:11

Demonaic
Mt 12:22 Lk 11:14

Tempest stilled
Mt 8:26 Mk4:39 Lk 8:24

Demonaics in Gardara
Mt 8:28 Mk 5:1 Lk 8:26

Raising of Jairus's daughter
Mt 9:18 Mk5:42 Lk 8:41

Bleeding
Mt 9:20 Mk 5:25 Lk 8:43

Blind men Mt 9:27

Another demonaic
Mt 9:32

Feeding five thousand
Mt 14:15 Mk 6:41 Lk 9:12 Jn 6:5

Walking on the sea
Mt 14~:25 Mk 6:49 Jn 6:19

Daughter of a cannanite
Mt 15:22, Mk 7:25

Feeding four thousand
Mt 15:32 Mk8:8

Deaf and Dumb healed
Mk 7:33

Blind man
Mk 8:23

Afflicted child
Mt 17:14 mk 9:26 Lk9:37

Tribute money
Mt17:24

Ten Lepers
Lk17:12

another Blind man
Jn 9:1

Lazurus raised
Jn 11

Heals woman of something?
Lk 13:11

Man with dropsy
Lk14:2

Blind men
Mt 20:30 Mk 10:46

Cursing the fig tree
Mt 21:19

Malchus healed
Lk 22:51

Second catch of fishes
Jn 21:6

+ Resurrection
+ appearing to desciples

and the miricles the gospels refer to when they say that he moved to _______ and produced miricles there etc.

Where did you get this 7 from.

If you are claiming that over the 40-100 years after these gospels where written. Bearing in mind these are either eye witness accounts either by desciples or followers, or second hand.

You really dont seem to understand the creation of the bible or what it contains, So your judgement really cant be valid.

sorry--- i meant 7 MAIN miracles that the church focuses on...

HAHAHAHA, more of this "he did this, he did that" bull! amazing, you would think people woud get board of these, mindless, uneducated threads. Instead the sheep keep on feeding.

[Edited on 5-4-2004 by HumptyDumpty]

Jesus died for ME?!?!

What if I don't believe in Christ? I don't wanna be converted! Maybe all this Jesus stuff offends me. What then? Don't even tell me "Oh, you don't believe. You're going to hell!"

What about the people of Bali? They don't even believe in a "God". They believe in multiple gods.

Just my take....

Thats my very same view.
Iam not, not looking for a religion. I do not think that there is nothingness when we pass. In fact I've searched for a God. I haven't had him tell me he's there. I didn't see him. And I find it hard to belive 2000 year old scriptures, and not have some sort of reacurance of god or some thing to let the people of this age belive. So I ask you religious know-it-alls on here (and dont try and say you aren't selfproclaimed know-it-alls, just read your posts.) am I the one that has gone wrong for not finding God, Or is God gone wrong in not letting the people of these new ages find him. MAYBE HEAVEN IS FULL.

Originally posted by they see ALL
Jesus even as a child knew what he was (son of God)...
remember in the bible the story of when he was in the temple and mary was looking for him and she said: wear were you and he said: at my father's house...
he knew his destiny and he could have helped people even when he was a child...

jesus began his ministry once he was baptized by john in the jordan river, and the holy spirit came upon him.

everything that he did in his lifetime was done in accordance with the scriptures.

Originally posted by they see ALL
sorry--- i meant 7 MAIN miracles that the church focuses on...

Yeah your probably right there though!

These 7 probably are the ones that present Gods authority. For example walking on water/calming the sea .... authority over nature
healing the lame man .... authority over sickness
healing the demon people ... over evil spirits
raising the dead ... over death ..etc


[Edited on 8-4-2004 by Beanie_pianoforte]

Originally posted by mig12
Jesus died for ME?!?!

What if I don't believe in Christ? I don't wanna be converted! Maybe all this Jesus stuff offends me. What then? Don't even tell me "Oh, you don't believe. You're going to hell!"

What about the people of Bali? They don't even believe in a "God". They believe in multiple gods.

Just my take....

Yeah exactly you got it down to a tee

So next time you meet a christian who says that. Tell him that you already know. Say that you want to go to hell and spend eternity away from God ... If you dont like him best place to be.

As for people who dont no .... God will Judge justly

Originally posted by HumptyDumpty
Thats my very same view.
Iam not, not looking for a religion. I do not think that there is nothingness when we pass. In fact I've searched for a God. I haven't had him tell me he's there. I didn't see him. And I find it hard to belive 2000 year old scriptures, and not have some sort of reacurance of god or some thing to let the people of this age belive. So I ask you religious know-it-alls on here (and dont try and say you aren't selfproclaimed know-it-alls, just read your posts.) am I the one that has gone wrong for not finding God, Or is God gone wrong in not letting the people of these new ages find him. MAYBE HEAVEN IS FULL.

So an infinite God has only got a finite space to fit his followers into.

So you looked for him.
"Knock on the door and it shall be answered"

Did you say ... Do this ... give me a sign and ill believe
I did ... didnt work

Or did you just pray but didnt really believe he was there. Cos then you wouldnt be praying to him. I did ... didnt work either.

It was only when i actually believed he was there and felt sorry that i had crucified him that i ended up getting into a personal relationship with the guy (dont really think he has a sex)

Originally posted by Illmatic67


SHUT THE HELL UP!!!! CHRISTIANS ARE FOOLS!!!!!

According to Jesus and according to their faith, Jesus HAD to die. He HAD to die. It was PLANNED that he had to be killed. Now as yourself this:

Who gives a # about who killed Jesus? Really.

I dont care if there is a god, I dont believe there is a god. If there is then he knew I would feel this way, because of all the diffrent people tell you that theres is best.

I believe thay there was a jesus. I believe that he was murdered for what he taught, just like today, say you talked to god, CRAZY, maybe you did, know one is going to believe you. Unless you have some really good proof, and not like the mormon's founder.

Who cares? Well you do, or you might not have made a coment, And I sure if you didnt care you wouldnt have said what you said.

[Edited on 8-4-2004 by SpittinCobra]

[Edited on 9-4-2004 by SpittinCobra]

It's very likely the 'miracles' were exaggerated or even faked. Consider the facts; the gospels of Jesus were written at least 60 years before his death by those who heard of the stories from their fathers or friends. "Mark" was not written by Mark, "Matthew" was no written by Matthew, and so forth.

So considering the facts that these were relatively older descendant of those who were friends of Jesus, isn't it safe to assume that your not getting the true story? The answer is absolutely.

Originally posted by iceofspades
"Mark" was not written by Mark, "Matthew" was no written by Matthew, and so forth.

So considering the facts that these were relatively older descendant of those who were friends of Jesus, isn't it safe to assume that your not getting the true story? The answer is absolutely.

Matthew was written by matthew. A first hand witness to Jesus' miricles as he was a deciple. Surely if he didnt believe that jesus did these things and was fake he wouldnt be willing to be a martyr for it.

Mark was written by mark (or John Marcus was his real name). He wasnt a desciple but was a companion of peter (1 peter 5:13) and paul (acts 12:25). He definately witnessed miricles by peter for example his escape from prison. Again why would someone give his life to works that are clearly false to him.

Theologians and Historians do not disagree with each other over the gospels they were clearly written by the people who wrote them. They do however argue about the authors of ... 2 peter and hebrews

It is true that the gospels could of been written 60 years later but only in the lie span of they're authors. either written as first hand accounts or in lukes case collective witnesses aswell.

Plus if the bible is inspired by God the value would be still perfect - only to be lost in translation. And of course for paul who wrote half the new testiment he wrote only a few years after jesus' death. He didnt live that long after as he died in captivity why? cos he lived his life for jesus who he claims spoke to him. He should of died several times before he actually did because of the treat ment he recieved due to being a follower of what he called "the way"

Originally posted by Beanie_pianoforte


Theologians and Historians do not disagree with each other over the gospels they were clearly written by the people who wrote them. They do however argue about the authors of ... 2 peter and hebrews

Asolute bunk.
Scholars have argued on and on about the dates and authors of who wrote what in the Bible.
In fact, I have a Bible sitting in front of me right this second and it even states in the preface that the works are only "attributed" to certain authors and that the dates are "thought" to be the ones in which the works were written.

Jesus did enough to prove He was the Son of God.
As far as where He was during those missing 18 yrs, you have to go to secular history.
When Joseph (His adoptive father) died, He and Mary became wards of Mary's uncle Joseph of Aramathea. He was the minister of mines for the Roman Gov't, and traded tin in Cornwall (Britain). In their history they speak of Him coming there with His uncle Joseph and His mother mary when He was 14 yrs old and stayed for 2 years. He made a waddle hut, that was later encased in iron to preserve it. Joseph was very well loved by the Brits and they spoke well of Jesus, taking note of the Feast days He observed. Do a search on the net, I can't remember the sites I found this on, but just put in Joseph of Aramathea in Britain and you'll find it. My pastor did indepth teaching on this subject, check out my signature.

Jesus did many Miracles they just arnt all recorded in the bible

There are also a lot of other books (Afaik) about Jesus and God in Chrisitanity that were left out of the bible but were never put in due to god saying something along the lines of "He who takes or adds from this book shall be taken out of the book of life" or along those lines

Therefor no one added (Or took) Any books or words from the bible and changed them (Even tho some might have)