What have we learnt from the Russian weaponary in the brief Russia / Georgia war

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posted on Sep, 4 2008 @ 05:12 PM
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It was interesting to view the video link supplied by 'Fromabove'. on the "directed energy lazer weapon", however it seemd rather programmed, what with the countdown etc, also would it be capable of dealing with this? multiple launches. Some of the Russian text says that it is "video archive" footage.
Turn the rubbish music off on the video.

www.youtube.com...




posted on Sep, 4 2008 @ 05:22 PM
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reply to post by jerico65
 


helicopters ARE aircraft - rotary wing aircraft


and the figures are from the US government , so if anything is reported under what actually occured

75 total aircraft losses (all types) of which 63 were USA (apologise put the wrong number as its from memory) - 40 fixed wing and 23 rotary wing in the period august 1990>feb 1991.



posted on Sep, 4 2008 @ 05:35 PM
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Originally posted by Harlequin
helicopters ARE aircraft - rotary wing aircraft


Nah, really?


If you actually read my post, I said that the number seemed high and that it can't just be fixed wing, and must also include rotory wing aircraft, too.



posted on Sep, 4 2008 @ 07:09 PM
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The Russians were taken off guard by the Georgian attack and had only a span of hours/days to begin their attack on Georgia so that the west would be taken off guard and any interference could be stopped early. They had rushed preparations

The US in the gulf war had MONTHS of planning and gathered mountains of intelligence reports before they launched their attack. Not a very comparable situation since both armies were in different positions.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 01:29 AM
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Originally posted by James R. Hawkwood

15.000 dead Russians in Afghanistan in ~10 years.


That is if you wish to believe the soviet claims, which I think are highly suspect to further scrutiny. In all honesty, the soviets probably lost as many, if not more than the US did in Vietnam.





Iff i remember correctly, Afghanistan is warming up badly and the US just passed the 500 Deathtoll mark. That War is FAR from over and will take DECADES off more fighting untill the Taliban are defeated. Unless Pakistan is invaded, wich wont happen (nukes anyone?)


500 deaths in how many years worth of fighting? That is a rather miraculous number considering everything.

All in all, your arguments are highly flawed, and are the same old rehashed lines of a non thinker.


[edit on 5-9-2008 by West Coast]



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 03:56 AM
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Originally posted by West Coast
That is if you wish to believe the soviet claims, which I think are highly suspect to further scrutiny. In all honesty, the soviets probably lost as many, if not more than the US did in Vietnam.


It would not make much sense since Afghanistan has far fewer citizens; if their casualties were that much higher their peak strength in that country would not have been 100 000 but 500 000 like the American peak strength in Vietnam. In terms of geography and population sizes the casualties and peak volume of soldiers deployed are roughly comparable.


500 deaths in how many years worth of fighting? That is a rather miraculous number considering everything.


Well it's nearing 600 after the last few months and since the Russians are not arming the opposition we may perhaps gain some idea of why things are going as 'well' as they are. You can also compare how much of the country is controlled with how much the USSR did to see that there are ways to limit casualties while loudly proclaiming that the war has been won. One must also take into account that Afghanistan has now been at war for nearly three decades and that that sort of thing does affect the capacity to resist in many more ways than one.


All in all, your arguments are highly flawed, and are the same old rehashed lines of a non thinker.


I have heard you say this before and i i find your 'facts' as questionable as your opinion of others.

Stellar



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 05:19 AM
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Originally posted by jerico65

Originally posted by Harlequin
helicopters ARE aircraft - rotary wing aircraft


Nah, really?


If you actually read my post, I said that the number seemed high and that it can't just be fixed wing, and must also include rotory wing aircraft, too.


righto... so lets stop beating around the bush..
As per your original stance does 40 fixed wing aircraft constitute a 'high' loss?


EDIT:

Notably, Georgian Air defenses were quite good:

"Other analysts say the Georgians are probably operating the SA-11 Buk-M1 (low-to-high altitude) and the (low-to-medium altitude) Tor-1M mobile air defense missile systems."

As compared to Iraqi Air defences in 1990: SA-2, SA-3 or SA-6 with a lot of AAA.

Moreover note that the Russians used legacy aerial assets (Su-24, Su-25, Tu-22) that may even technologically predate the aerial assets used (and lost to ground fire) by the Americans in the 1990 Gulf War.

But then again, its all about who flies how, and who mans the SAM post how on the days of question. A lot depends on the intel given to pilots too..
So there's no real way for any of us to make a god-to-honest comparision here.. ever..

[edit on 5-9-2008 by Daedalus3]



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 07:29 AM
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Originally posted by jerico65

Originally posted by Harlequin
helicopters ARE aircraft - rotary wing aircraft


Nah, really?


If you actually read my post, I said that the number seemed high and that it can't just be fixed wing, and must also include rotory wing aircraft, too.


lets play this game you said:


Huh? Where did you read that? Maybe if you count helicopters, but not fixed wing only. Sounds a bit inflated.


so given your wise ass attitude i replied in kind - that and where did i ever say fixed wing? i didn`t - so stop assuming as it makes you look like a stupid red neck.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:23 AM
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Originally posted by Fromabove
First.. let me put this puppy to bed this way. Russia had it's war with Islamics like Iraq. It was called Afghanistan, remember. After a many year struggle they lost, were humiliated, and left with their tails between their legs. We (the USA) invaded both Afghanistan and Iraq and won both wars. The only reason Iraq took so long is because unlike the Russians we didn't just roll in and gun down all the civillians and leave taking spoil home with us like the barbarians they are.

As for weaponry, they have no new weaponry except some new missles. It took five days to take two ity bity pieces of Georgia, and only after the Georgians retreated because the Russians were destoying non military infrastructure. They are weak. We are building up our military presence in Georgian ports and what are they doing...? Uhh... nothing because they won't take us on.

As for new weaponry, yes, we have it all. It would take time to say it here so I'll make the below posts from outside sources and you be the judge. And these are just the declassified stuff. I'll leave it to the imagination what the classified stuff might be. Needless to say, when we fight Russia, it will be but a short war.


From outside sources:

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...


When you will fight Russia, you will probably find yourselves alone and surrounded.
EU governments support US, EU populace does not support US. EU governments get a lot of money from the US. EU populace get no money from the US, instead they have to pay increasing prices of fuel and see their money losing value thanks to the US.
They see job cuts and are supposed to abide by a multicultural philosophy forced by the US which means fewer wages and lower living standart.
When the time will be right for you to fight Russia, it will be because you will have no choice, not because you chose to. A time like that would mean a time of general uprising and instability, anarchy and chaos. You last desperate move will be to counter you last strongest foe, Russia. Don't count on NATO when # will hit the fan.
Don't count on the EU populace when your # will hit the fan.
We wont help you out. There is a good chance many people will be already turning aqainst you.

Good luck with your ventures, you chose the easy way. Somewhere down the line, you will eventually have to pay the piper from your own pockets. It will be your bad luck if it happens you will be out of change at that exact instant. You will have no one to blame when that time comes but yourselves.

My post was in the terms of denying ingorance. If you think that everything is wine and roses in the EU considering endorsements of the US global politics, especially by EU public opinion then maybe there is good deal for you since I might be able to sell you a bridge..



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 11:08 AM
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Should give the Georgian soldiers anti-tank capability like Javelins to take on the armored tanks and apcs. As well as Stinger missiles to take down helos and fixed wing aircraft.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 11:41 AM
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Soo, the Russian military defeated an army with 25k troops and an Airforce with about 8 old "Soviet Era" planes and that qualifies them to take on a better equipped military like the USA?
Russians as the worlds peace keepers huh?
I bet Czechoslovakia and Hungary would have something to say about that, since both of them were invaded during the cold war and had communism forced on them.
Not to mention the many European countries that counted on the US to be the buffer between them and 1000's of Soviet Tanks rolling across the German plains.
Why dont some of you hotshot 20 year olds who cant even point to Berlin on a map try typing "Berlin Airlift" into google and see what you come up with?

Some of you people are so transparent! Its very clear that this has less to do with being Pro Russian and more to do with being Anti-USA



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 02:43 PM
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Originally posted by deltaboy
Should give the Georgian soldiers anti-tank capability like Javelins to take on the armored tanks and apcs. As well as Stinger missiles to take down helos and fixed wing aircraft.


the georgians already had advanced Israeli Spike ER missiles ...

by the way , if USA decides to do something stupid , then expect the russians to arm the iraqi freedom fighters and resistance with advanced weapons to fight the imperialist genocidal american occupation forces

or maybe deploy nukes in Cuba and Venezuala ...

or sell advanced weapons to Iran

[edit on 5-9-2008 by manson_322]



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 02:57 PM
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Just want to make a small point, that just because an army has superior weapons and personel does not always mean victory.
Please research the war in Vukovar.
I am a little surprised that the Georgian army gave up so easily.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 02:58 PM
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Originally posted by manson_322

the georgians already had advanced Israeli Spike ER missiles ...


Any evidence of the Spike missile in Georgia?


by the way , if USA decides to do something stupid , then expect the russians to arm the iraqi freedom fighters and resistance with advanced weapons to fight the imperialist genocidal american occupation forces


Wouldn't surprise me that Russia is doing it already.


or maybe deploy nukes in Cuba and Venezuala ...


Already been done before in the 60s.


or sell advanced weapons to Iran



Already done that as well.

Perhaps we should do more to meet Russia's tit for tat just to balance things out.


Give Georgia Abrams tanks, F-16s, Javelins. As well as giving nukes to the Chechens. Imagine using a nuke at the Beslan school. Think the Russians would withdraw from Chechnya? Or perhaps a nuke at that opera in Moscow.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 03:11 PM
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reply to post by deltaboy
 





Any evidence of the Spike missile in Georgia?


www.popularmechanics.com...




Wouldn't surprise me that Russia is doing it already.

bs...
wheres the proof???
if russia was doing something like this death toll of US forces would havwe been 10000-20000+




Already been done before in the 60s.


Cuba yes, Venezuala no...




Already done that as well.


no... the only thing that irianians have are Tor m1 , Kornet missiles ,
the iranians are interested in S-300PMU-2 system




Perhaps we should do more to meet Russia's tit for tat just to balance things out.

Give Georgia Abrams tanks, F-16s, Javelins. As well as giving nukes to the Chechens. Imagine using a nuke at the Beslan school. Think the Russians would withdraw from Chechnya? Or perhaps a nuke at that opera in Moscow.


now you are talking , such a thing (giving nukes to chechens) will give Russia reason to evacuate major cities and disperse the populace and then Russia nukes the West in a preemptive first strike , 5-20 million russians will die and the 1 billion in the west and USA ... a complete victory for Russia
check out StellarX posts on russian civil defences




ive Georgia Abrams tanks, F-16s, Javelins


so that russians will blow them in a week ....????

[edit on 5-9-2008 by manson_322]



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 03:22 PM
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Originally posted by manson_322


www.popularmechanics.com...




Georgia: Unidentified antitank missile, possibly an Israeli-made Spike


Your link says unidentified and just says possibly. Not exactly the same thing.



bs...
wheres the proof???
if russia was doing something like this death toll of US forces would havwe been 10000-20000+


Mere speculation on death toll. They already have many Russian made weaponry already. Even advance ones like RPG 29s. So far mostly Iraqi civilians are being killed than American troops. Perhaps because they are easier to be killed than American troops are.


Cuba yes, Venezuala no...


Wasn't specific on which nation, just said already been done.




no... the only thing that irianians have are Tor m1 , Kornet missiles ,
the iranians are interested in S-300PMU-2 system




Thats still Russian made weaponry.




now you are talking , such a thing (giving nukes to chechens) will give Russia reason to evacuate major cities and disperse the populace and then Russia nukes the West in a preemptive first strike , 5-20 million russians will die and the 1 billion in the west and USA ... a complete victory for Russia
check out StellarX posts on russian civil defences


LOL, there are enough nukes to blow all of Russia 10 times over even if they disperse them because they are still in Russian territory.




so that russians will blow them in a week ....????



Doubt they blow them in a week. They already blow Georgia in a week without them. Imagine if they had those.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 03:41 PM
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Mere speculation on death toll. They already have many Russian made weaponry already. Even advance ones like RPG 29s. So far mostly Iraqi civilians are being killed than American troops. Perhaps because they are easier to be killed than American troops are.

???
proof of RPG-29 , I want a confirmation from russian sources that this happened (that there is Rpg-29 in iraq)




They already have many Russian made weaponry already

only crappy RPG and ak-47




LOL, there are enough nukes to blow all of Russia 10 times over even if they disperse them because they are still in Russian territory.


which will be much more difficult to kill after population evacuation and dispersal will happen.....
again as i said before check stellars post on civil defences



Doubt they blow them in a week. They already blow Georgia in a week without them. Imagine if they had those.

and i doubt that those weapons would even last a week against Russia ...



Your link says unidentified and just says possibly. Not exactly the same thing.

unconfirmed by western sources , according to russian mod , it was spike ER missile that was used to damage 3 t-80's and 5 t-72B

check lenta.ru



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 04:29 PM
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Originally posted by Daedalus3
righto... so lets stop beating around the bush..
As per your original stance does 40 fixed wing aircraft constitute a 'high' loss?


Depends. If the coalition only had 41 planes in theater, it is.


One thing I didn't check yet was how many aircrew were recovered from the losses by Air Rescue.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 04:32 PM
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Originally posted by Harlequin

so given your wise ass attitude i replied in kind - that and where did i ever say fixed wing? i didn`t - so stop assuming as it makes you look like a stupid red neck.


At ease, Gus. And you may want to wind your neck in a bit. And thicken your skin.

Now, back to the thread!!



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 04:49 PM
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app2.capitalreach.com...

Watch and learn all you need to know on this subject from experts. This is the truth.

More proof from unbiased sources.

michaeltotten.com...

[edit on 5-9-2008 by Sky watcher]





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