Firstly, while making this post, can I apologise to another member whose research outside of this thread is crossing over with or complimenting
mine. They haven’t posted their findings here, and in my making the following post, I will probably spill the beans about their post. It’s not
intentional, but unavoidable. In doing so, I merely seek to keep this thread – which has turned into a good collection of intelligent, relevant
research – alive and (fairly) well.
OK…….so a few posts back we returned to the subject of the “Iron Door” legend, at Hallthurm. To recap, the legend goes that at various times,
but not constantly, an iron door appears, which offers an entrance into the Untersberg. It also has links to being a “Time Portal”.
Further research on this subject has led to the “discovery” of a cave entrance in the area mentioned in the legend (near to the old fortress),
from which warm air emanates, as if the mountain is “breathing”. Now undoubtedly, this is a natural phenomenon, with differing air pressures
inside and out, air circulating through the mammoth cave system in the mountain, etc, but I think this could be from where the legend of dragons
living in the mountain could stem from. People in days gone by, who could not explain such phenomena scientifically, may have attached the dragon
explanation to it to explain what they do not understand (I mentioned this previously with regard to then Pied Piper of Hamelin story). Interesting,
nonetheless – It is as if the mountain itself is breathing, and taking on a living form. No wonder, then, that in times gone by, and indeed now,
certain groups either worshipped or had a great deal of spiritual affinity with mountains.
A little more research, and the well timed mishap of two mountain walkers getting lost on the mountainside in bad weather on December 31st, has
revealed another cave, also near to Hallthurm, but higher up the mountain. This cave is a little bit more interesting, as the photo used for the
report of the rescue of the two mountain walkers clearly shows a red coloured flow from inside the cave. Red coloured water can often belie the
presence of Iron Ore deposits in the land that the water is draining from…
Yes. Iron. As in…..Iron Door?
Tenuous link, you are probably saying to yourself right now. And that’s what I would be thinking too.
However. Even more research (someone has been very busy), reveals that again, in legend, there is a cave on the Untersberg at the mouth of which,
“Wild Women” were sometimes seen, dancing naked amongst other things.
The name of the cave? “Die eisernen Thuer”. (The Iron Door).
So, when the legend speaks of the Iron Door at Hallthurm…..does it actually refer to the CAVE known as the Iron Door, as opposed to some mystical
iron door that appears from nowhere? I think YES. (I would add, I have no evidence whatsoever, this is just my hunch at the moment).
Taking this line of thinking a bit further, I revisited the legend of Lazarus Gitschner and the monk. This was covered way, way back in this
In a new description of the whole Lazarus and the Monk inside the mountain story, I found it described as follows (in German):
“Da kamen sie zu einer eisernen Thür. Diese machte der Mönch auf. “ (“There they came to an Iron Door, which the monk opened”)
( from: www.wfg-gk.de...
There were 12 doors in the story of Lazarus, each leading to one of the 12 “Untersberg Churches”.
This then, got me thinking even more.
What if the 12 doors are actually 12 caves?
I believe often in then storytelling from generation to generation, which is effectively how history, and specifically local history was
“recorded” before everyone could write, computers, TV, etc, things that were difficult to explain, as ignorance could offer no explanation, were
described in more poetic, or simplistic terms. Thus, is the true story of Lazarus, one where a monk, with secret knowledge of time portals in caves in
this mountain, took Lazarus to each cave, and made use of the portal to show Lazarus? And when recorded for posterity, in what was probably initially
a verbal passing of the story from person to person, the caves became magical doorways (after all, the word PORTAL means doorway….).
If you go with this theory, of caves and time portals, then I think we have 2 possible current locations. The “Eisernen Thur” cave near Hallthurm,
and the cave in the Mittagsscharte, which is also meant to exhibit time portal abilities, specifically on 15 August.
I am sure, with a lot more research, that records (in whatever form), will exists somewhere that will give pointers to further locations (i.e caves),
that could add to this list. These may be parish records (if they exist in the area), possibly in church records themselves, or maybe even word of
mouth stories that have made into the 20th or 21st Century among local people.
Again, I apologise if this post has either stolen someone’s thunder, or stepped on their toes. But the above is a mixture of my thoughts and
research and their hard work locally, and for my part, this is where I want the information to be considered and discussed, and hopefully, with input
and comment from others, expanded upon.
The above is also discussed in German at
The two forums are both one’s that I participated in recently on this subject, with White Eagle, the member whose hard work and further research has
led to this line of enquiry. And I don’t believe the research has reached a conclusion yet. I believe there may be much more to come in due course.