Obama: “America is no longer what it once was"

Originally posted by LLoyd45
I can't find one at the moment. I heard her tell it on a talk show about 3 years ago.

So you'll just take her, alleged, word for it, without any corroborating evidence (like what you've been knocking Obama supporters for doing)?

I'm not saying it isn't possible; however, I do find such a bold claim to be highly improbable. I would certainly want something backing it up before I went around touting "Brooke Shields has an IQ of 155" as fact.

Google finds nothing supporting such a claim, and that little tidbit seems like it would be something which fan sites would jump upon.

Originally posted by LLoyd45

Actually, IQ isn't "all about genetics".

I beg to differ with you on that point.

You can beg all you'd like; however, research supports that, in the nature vs. nurture debate, environmental factors do have a substantial effect on FSIQ and VIQ. So no, it's not "all about genetics".

Originally posted by LLoyd45
He's every bit as brilliant today, as he was when he was ten.

And there's the crux. If he's truly "every bit as 'brilliant'", then his MA, at the age of ten, would have been approximately 20. Carry that over to a CA of 18, and his I.Q. becomes roughly 111 as an adult.

I'm certainly not claiming that your son's MA had no further development, and I realize that there's probably quite a bit of parental bias involved; however, you're either showing a clear lack of understanding when it comes to I.Q., or you're flat out being intellectually dishonest when you say that "your son has an I.Q. of 200+" based off a test he took at the young age of ten.

I will say that your son isn't the real issue here, and I agree that we should all leave that avenue alone from here on in. My whole reason for mentioning it at all was in regards to your behavior (pattern of unsubstantiated hyperbole) in the thread.

I still fail to see any evidence that the girl in question was actually "frightened".

Originally posted by LLoyd45
Well I'm sorry . I'm not going to go track her down to prove I'm right. That would be ridiculous.

Especially since you could just as easily be proven wrong. Not worth it for a mere coinflip, huh?

You made the claim that he "frightened" her. Is there any evidence at all that she was, in fact, frightened, or is that just what you want to believe so that you can further demonize the man?

Belief is merely acceptance without proof. Actual knowledge requires more.

Originally posted by LLoyd45
Maybe not, but I'd say most children would be disturbed by such an answer.

While you do have every right to your own opinion, I don't see that you're qualified enough to give any meaningful substance to such a claim.

Originally posted by LLoyd45
No, I'm not a clinical psychologist or a psychiatrist

I congratulate you on your degrees in counseling; however, you still don't seem qualified enough to really give substance to your opinion regarding "most children"; especially since you've still failed to show any evidence that even this one child was truly "frightened".

Originally posted by LLoyd45
Just like all you Obama supporters, huh? I'm not wasting my time posting links to a dozen articles, so you can refute them. It's not that important to me what you believe.

This is the difference Lloyd, Im telling you that religion is a matter of choice and Obama chooses to be Christian, your telling everybody else his a muslim. Im providing evidence in which he says his muslim, I make references to the constitution, what have you done so far besides spreading rumors that his muslim? You have not provided any evidence as to where he says his muslim or whether he practices being muslim, you have not provided any evidence as to where it says one is forever a muslim.

Typical McCain supporter, smear the opposition, provide no evidence.

I guarantee you Fox News will be the final nail in his political coffin before election time.

Fox news is the neoconservatives talking machine, theyv lost all credibility, just like their viewers.

They're the only part of the MSM media that's not in the tank with the Machurian candidate that wants to be President.

So your telling me that fox news is a more truthful source of information, well then this further clarifies my statement above.

If he had a legitimate birth certificate, he'd have no need to posts obvious fakes on the web. Wake up..

Thats the thing Lloyd, you have yet to prove that these rumors you listen to hold evidence. All i see is talk coming yourside, no evidence.

Your getting your sources of information from the very same machine that mislead the US public over the last 8years you. You wake up.

Obama has posted an obvious fake online to deceive idiots like you. I can't wait till it goes mainstream.

Yes I am the one deceiving people yet im the only one here providing the evidence and facts against these little stories you spread. You are yet to provide the evidence to back up thse accusations.

If your going to spread little stories around the forum, have the evidence to back it up Lloyd.

As I said before, the Constitution applies to American citizens. Prove he is one, or shut up please.

Thats the thing, his gone through the proper authorities over the years and thats how he became a senator:
usgovinfo.about.com...
So your little accusation that his not a citizen has being debunked.

Now as for the question as to whether his a natural citizen:
www.politifact.com...
"It's a valid Hawaii state birth certificate," spokesman Janice Okubo

But now you see Lloyd if I was in your shoes, it be just as easy for me to say thats a "lie", or its some "coverup" then have no evidence to back it up.

Now either you provide evidence from an official impartial source where it says his birth certificate has been faked or you shut up.

If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably is a duck..

So in plain english, you dont have evidence as to whether his muslim or not, you can only judge the man by appearance.

Is there some reason why you repeat yourself over and over again? you sound like a broken record.

You dont seem to counter anything I provide with evidence, all I hear is talk from you. Dont you think people saying "his a closet muslim!! his a racist!!, his an african extemist!" without any evidence to back it up, broken records?

what's next.. something idiotic like "I'm rubber and you're glue" as a defense?

You have yet to provide evidence as to where Obama says his a muslim or whether he has ever practiced being a muslim.

Stop acting like one then. Nobody is telling Obama anything..

Your telling people obamas a muslim without backing it up with evidence, Obama is saying his a christian, we live in a country where one has the freedom of religion. If your going to call another man something he says his not, you better have the evidence to back it up.

That's your choice I guess, but don't expect me to reply. I'm tired of talking to a wall.

Im the only one providing the facts here, your only shaking you stubborn head, your the "wall".

Frankly you ramble, and it makes replying to your nonsense rather tedious.

This is the kind of nonsense your spreading around this forum:
"Obamas a Bildenberger, his part of the NWO, His the anti-christ, his a muslim, his a racist christian, his a pro-african terrorist, his not an american citizen, his an elitist, his too popular, he does not spoil his kids, well his just different, he blinks too much, he tells the truth and the rest of the world likes him. "

Yeah, it is quite impressive isn't it? That twice the average IQ of most people. As I said before, it's all about the genetics.

Yes thankyou for telling us your son has an IQ of 200, im sure this brings up the credibility of your posts.




[edit on 9-8-2008 by southern_Guardian]

He's right Lloyd. People only remember the spotted blue dress during the Clinton years. But this country prospered. Bush came in and people are losing their houses left and right.
America has been raped. And their is no police report. Just my .02

reply to post by jpm1602


America is no longer what it used to be.

it used to stand for the land of opportunity

now its the land of please come and save me



bailing out big banks but leaving the little guy to suffer?

Sounds awfully conservative to me...

Did you see Trump on Letterman friday night? He flipped a 10 mil prop in palm springs to a russian. 'The king of fertilizer in his country' lol.
He said most props are going to foreigners now.
Land of the hosered I'd say.

The feds bailing out banks every other day now. Isn't that a hoot n nanny!

Maybe printing dollars to pour into Iraq was not such a good idea. Trump also brought that up.
Thanks alot GW. You will be notoriously known as the most hated president in history. Well done.
Just like the oil company your daddy gave you and the baseball team. You couldn't shoot the broadside of a damn barn....moron.

[edit on 8/10/2008 by jpm1602]

[edit on 8/10/2008 by jpm1602]

[edit on 8/10/2008 by jpm1602]

reply to post by LLoyd45


There are very few people in this world I hate. As a hard core right winger I can even say that I respect Clinton. However the more that comes out about Obama the more I hate the scumbag. He is a disgusting human being and a left wing Marxist. There is not one thing I can find that makes me have even a shred of respect for Obama. Just about the time I think I have found something he lets slip with another load of crap. Man, this is the best guy the DNC could find?

reply to post by TXMACHINEGUNDLR


You allow the mccain propaganda to influence your own judgement

if you'd research it YOUR SELF and sotp listening to sean hannity

you'd see that they've been lying to you for the last 15 yeras

the same realization i came to.






This country ISNT what it used to be. because of the likes of Bush and his father. Out of respect for the dead, i wont mention WHY i dislike Regan, ill just say i didnt care for him as a president.



to jpm


i didnt see that episode

but i did see the colbert report where the major of some town where trump owns a golf course is trying to get Trump to take down his American flag on the golf course because the flag pole stands too high


THAT is unamerican bull scrap in its very essence.

I was initially very excited about Obama. His recent behaviour has shown character flaws. And don't even get me started on McCrazy. We are so frigging hosed.
We had a similar incident here in NE Ohio. A car dealership was flying a 50 foot flag and taking flak. After 2 yrs in court the dealership won. And we wonder why we have so many problems in this country.

[edit on 8/10/2008 by jpm1602]

reply to post by jpm1602


LOL even though i disagree with you

that made me laugh In a good way


Obama has character flaws. So do you. So do i.

is that a reason not to vote for him?

The TYPES of character flaws, IMO, are whats important.

What would you consider important for character?

if honesty is one of them - then all politicians are screwed by your definition

Lol it's ok Wiggins. Most people think I am just nuts. Rightfully so I'm sure. My problem with Obama is the flip flop thing. He promised to get us out of that hellhole Iraq them said he'd adjust the timetable. Bought and sold I tell ya.

reply to post by jpm1602


Well i guess thats all in how you're ready to look at it....


He made a spur of the moment decision. He became educated. instead of sticking to his guns (thats what got us into this mess in iraq in the first place)

he changed his course and revamped his strategy to accommodate new data and input.

he's still for a withdraw.

just not as "soon" as the first time he spoke about it in 2007




about the comment above "that got us into this mess in the first place
"

the first intial reports said iraq had WMD's

now we know they didnt


did the plan get adjusted to accomodate?

nope.

we hung a leader of a soverign country for crimes that we didnt use against him to invade

we invaded on the premise of WMD's as a threat to our country

we over threw and executed on the grounds of immoral genocide.


Im not supporting Sadamn

But i am condemning Bush.


He never modified the battle plan based on new information
he allowed his ego to cloud his judgement.

if he ever had any "judgement" to begin with.....but thats for another thread.






[edit on 8/10/2008 by Andrew E. Wiggin]

reply to post by LLoyd45


I dont have to prove you false you have to prove that what you are saying is true. And you still have not provided any proof except for what you say. Got a link or any legitimate evidence that what you state is true. I have yet to see any proof of these claims.

Lloyd and any one here who hates Obama is a Neocon. They would steal and burn math books to keep people from learning 2+2=4 if that is what Obama supported.

Sad. These are the same people who hate Ron Paul, an actual Conservative. Can't have a real Conservative run for President we need another Oil Man Neocon.

I am American, and I'd ask our founding fathers, but unfortunately they've been dead for quite some time now. Have you been using a Ouija board to communicate with them or what?

Shouldnt you be required to prove you are an American. I really should not take your word for it. Can I see a birth certificate?

Hey, everyone LLoyd45 is not an American citizen.


[edit on 9-8-2008 by LLoyd45]

Unfortunately America isn't what it once was. The American dollar is doing worse than it ever has. We are invading countries with no good or legal reason for invading said countries. Our economy as a whole is sliding into recession and moving steadily toward depression. Our military is reaching the point that if we are thrown into another conflict a draft larger than any draft in the past will be needed. We have completely isolated ourselves from the world, skirted international law, and forgotten the meaning of the term diplomacy. Once the industrial leader of the world, now we import just about everything we need. Our businesses or corporations were once to be loyal to us, but now they are abandoning us, selling out to other countries and moving their headquarters to other countries. Our wealthy and successful were once loyal to us but now they are switching the currency of their money to the Euro. With the passing of the patriot act, true freedom became a thing of the past in our country, but never fear the illusion of freedom is still being maintained to keep the masses in line. In the political spectrum, Barack is right to say that America has lost a step on the national stage and global stage.

[edit on 10-8-2008 by Intilus]

Classic example of how everyone knows there is a problem but when push comes to shove, And it comes time to openly admit it, Everyone stays silent and those who speak out are ridiculed because gasp the children!
and omg we can't destroy the dream world everyone is living in, Because after all even though we all know there's a problem, we can all pretend all is well and let the dream world continue... Yes brilliant! lets bring the children up in the status quo, so all they know is the status quo...

News flash these stupid kids and yes I say stupid kids because that's what they are by default seeing as we as society have allowed ourselves and our future to be dumbed down and never question authority...
will never know there is a problem unless we talk about it, no I'm not saying scare them but unless they know what we know by us teaching them what's wrong with this world and more importantly this former Republic, then they will never know, The schools won't teach them the truth, And most people are so blinded by a false sense of blind patriotism that it's nearly hopeless....

The only way to make real change is to destroy this fantasy...


It should be noted I'm not anything close to an Obama supporter, But fact is fact this country is not what it's supposed to be nor what it used to be, And though I'm against 99% of what this man stands for, I will never stand against words of truth regardless of who they come from...

[edit on 10-8-2008 by C0le]

Originally posted by jpm1602
He promised to get us out of that hellhole Iraq them said he'd adjust the timetable.

But he didn't adjust the timetable. It's been 16 months since the beginning.

Originally posted by iamcamouflage
I have yet to see any proof of these claims.

None of those claims are true. That's why you haven't seen proof. (I know you know that, I just wanted to reiterate it.) Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. And there is no evidence to support these claims but repeated drama on blog sites. So, they are opinions. Incorrect ones at that.

reply to post by C0le


Are you the same C0le I used to disagree with all the time? LOL Because you're making some good sense to me now. You're a little harsher in your delivery, but the message is the same.

Over protecting children, especially from the truth, produces adults that can't handle the truth.

Oh, I meant to say that it's obvious (to me) that Obama's entire answer wasn't geared toward the child. The part for the child was that he also had daughters and wanted a better future for them. The rest was geared toward the audience at large.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


Use to be 16 months to BRING THEM HOME. NOw its 16 months to send to Afghanistan, some stay in Iraq, some in surrounding area. You are correct timetable the same but it is a change.

Originally posted by LLoyd45
For a man who seeks the highest office in the land, Obama sure doesn't seem to think much of his country..

That has got to be one of the dumbest Obama attack reactions to one of his statements I've read here.

Thank God you aren't the sponsor of a an addict attempting to recover. Your solution being "shut up, and don't admit you ever did something wrong" would be more damaging than the drugs/alcohol. If you are this worked up over Obama's realistic approach to talking about America's current issues then do yourself a favor and don't listen to RON PAUL and what he says is coming.

Your head may explode.

America has changed and many more learned men and women than you or I have said this to be true. Those that have worked in an official capacity with the U.S. government, and those that hold high positions in financial institutions have said more than America isn't what it used to be...they have said America is going to CRASH. The recent documentary I.O.U.S.A. attempts to lay this out for the public to understand the financial aspects of our impending doom. I suspect you may want picket this film for its logical honesty.

You want to hear something really unpatriotic and slightly delusional?

MCCAIN SAYS WE'RE BETTER OFF NOW THAN EVER!

I'll let the American Chronicle tell you why he is dead wrong.

John McCain Says Americans are "Better Off"! Are we?
No! And it gets worse before it gets better.
Gary Ater
May 20, 2008

Financial Summary Report:


• Net worth: Median net worth of Americans rose only 1.5%, the weakest in more than a decade. The median is the point at which half of all households have a higher net worth and half have a lower net worth.
  
  
• Wages: A national decline in US wages also helped account for the slow growth in net worth. While the median income rose 1.6%, after adjusting for inflation, median wages fell 6.2%. Wages make up the largest part of family income.
  
  
• Debt: Despite lower interest rates in 2006-2007, families spent more of their incomes paying off their debt. Seven percent (7%) of working families said their spending outpaces their income; 16.1% said they spend about what they make; 36.1% said they save income left over at the end of the year; and 40.8% said they save regularly.
  
  
• The share of families with debt rose 1.3 percentage points to 76.4%. Among families with debt of any kind -- including mortgages, other loans and credit cards -- the median level rose 33.9%, far greater than the 9.5% increase seen between 1998 and 2001. The median level of mortgage debt increased 27.3%.
  
  
• Savings: The percent of families who said they'd saved in the preceding year fell to less that 50%. This means that for the first time since the Great Depression of the 1930's, less than 50% of working Americans put any money away into any type of savings account.
  
  
• Assets: The survey breaks down assets into two categories: financial assets such as stocks and bonds, and non-financial assets such as home ownership. The median value of financial assets fell 22.8%, while the median value of non-financial assets rose 22.2%.
  
  
• Stock Investments: The percentage of families investing in stocks, directly or indirectly through mutual funds, fell 3.3 percentage points, to 48.6 percent.
  

My Edits: Bolds and Brevity

It goes into gas prices and the effects on commodity and food price increases but I believe that anyone with common sense would have seen this by now. I suppose you haven't though.

Our rights are being rescinded one by one. High numbers of people are being laid off left and right. Home-owners are becoming Home-less. The middle class is under a heavy crunch and bearing the burden of a failing economy. We're in debt up to our eyeballs with other nations (the criticized China being one of them), to the point that should they decide to, they could crash our system.

Obama is absolutely correct. He is only "wrong" in the eyes of those privileged enough not to notice America's "changes" or blinded by their own partisan hatred.

You say Obama is being unpatriotic by addressing America's issues yet I would say Obama loves his country so much, that he addresses the issues in the hope of changing them. His answer was not only appropriate but promising. He is telling the 7-year old that he wishes to fix the problem unlike McCain who claims there isn't one.

Who really is harming the child already in debt when it arrives?

Had he said as you so eloquently put it "America is screwed up", meaning it's all over and he's is just running for President for kicks, then you may have had a point.

As it is, he didn't.
And you don't.

- Lee