First Responder States CD Countdown before WTC 7 Collapsed

reply to post by ULTIMA1


I guess I'm just asking for an example of when this has ever happened before. You make it sound like it is quite common for fire depts or demo teams to go in and bring down buildings. I cannot find evidence of this ever happening.

Can you please show me one example of this ever happening before 9/11?

The quote you listed below from Chief Hayden seems to indicate he is pulling men back, not buildings down. Or perhaps i'm reading the quote wrong.

Originally posted by ULTIMA1
www.firehouse.com...

We were worried about additional collapse there of what was remaining standing of the towers and the Marriott, so we started pulling the people back after a couple of hours of surface removal and searches along the surface of the debris. We started to pull guys back because we were concerned for their safety.

We pulled everybody back probably by 3 or 3:30 in the afternoon. We said, this building is going to come down, get back. It came down about 5 o�clock or so, but we had everybody backed away by then.

I dont see anywhere where he states he sent teams in to demo the building.

Originally posted by gavron
The quote you listed below from Chief Hayden seems to indicate he is pulling men back, not buildings down. Or perhaps i'm reading the quote wrong.

Well maybe its becasue Chief Hayden was not in charge at the time and did not give the order to bring down the building.

The Fire Commander who was talking to Silverstein (after the firemen were out of the buidling) decided to bring the building down.

You really should try reading everyones statements before posting.

[edit on 18-7-2008 by ULTIMA1]

reply to post by ULTIMA1


I'm sorry, I'm just going by the information that you posted, and that is what it was saying.

Were you going to show me an example of the fire dept or a demo team bringing down a 20+ story building while it was still on fire? I still cannot find that it has ever been done before.

Originally posted by gavron
I still cannot find that it has ever been done before.

Kind of like no steel building in the US in the last 20 years has collapsed from fire.

reply to post by ULTIMA1


So there really have been no demolitions of standing 20+ story buildings that were on fire ever before? That is just your opinion?

Originally posted by gavron
[ So there really have been no demolitions of standing 20+ story buildings that were on fire ever before? That is just your opinion?

Well i am going by the statements of the Fire Chiefs.

What are you going by?

reply to post by ULTIMA1


Show us where the Fire Department states that they brought down WTC-7.

Thank you for your cooperation.

Originally posted by ULTIMA1
Well i am going by the statements of the Fire Chiefs.

What are you going by?

So you don't have proof that this has ever been done befoe then.

It is just your theory.

Thanks then. I just wanted to clarify that. I was wondering why that had never been done before, and now you just confirmed it hasnt.

Originally posted by ThroatYogurt
Show us where the Fire Department states that they brought down WTC-7.

Thank you for your cooperation.

Gee you really need to read the statments of people involved. Also study up on Emergency Incident Command protocol.

You would see that when the Fire Commander is talking to Silverstein, he decides to PULL the building.

The firemen were already out of the buidling so we know he was not talking about PULLING the firemen.

Originally posted by gavron
I was wondering why that had never been done before, and now you just confirmed it hasnt.

Please do not be so immature as to put words in my mouth. I never stated it has not been done before, in fact i have stated that the fire marshalls and fire chiefs do have the authority to demo a buidling in an emergency. Something that you cannot debate.

I noticed as a usual believer you failed to post what evidence you are using to support your claims. I am using the statemtns from the fire chiefs, too bad you cannot debate them.



[edit on 18-7-2008 by ULTIMA1]

reply to post by ULTIMA1


You so funny Ultima.

Shall we regurgitate this ridiculous topic again?

"I remember getting a call from the fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, 'We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it.' And they made that decision to pull and then we watched the building collapse."

–Larry Silverstein

Lets Look at Chief Nigro's statementsagain)

Release date: September 23, 2007

Regarding WTC 7: The long-awaited US Government NIST (National Institute of Standards and Technology) report on the collapse of WTC 7 is due to be published at the end of this year (although it has been delayed already a few times . That report should explain the cause and mechanics of the collapse in great detail. Early on the afternoon of September 11th 2001, following the collapse of WTC 1 & 2, I feared a collapse of WTC 7 (as did many on my staff).

The reasons are as follows:

1 - Although prior to that day high-rise structures had never collapsed, The collapse of WTC 1 & 2 showed that certain high-rise structures subjected to damage from impact and from fire will collapse.
2. The collapse of WTC 1 damaged portions of the lower floors of WTC 7.
3. WTC 7, we knew, was built on a small number of large columns providing an open Atrium on the lower levels.
4. numerous fires on many floors of WTC 7 burned without sufficient water supply to attack them.

For these reasons I made the decision (without consulting the owner, the mayor or anyone else - as ranking fire officer, that decision was my responsibility) to clear a collapse zone surrounding the building and to stop all activity within that zone. Approximately three hours after that order was given, WTC 7 collapsed.

Conspiracy theories abound and I believe firmly that all of them are without merit.

Regards, Dan Nigro
Chief of Department FDNY (retired)

"The biggest decision we had to make was to clear the area and create a collapse zone around the severely damaged [WTC 7] building. A number of fire officers and companies assessed the damage to the building. The appraisals indicated that the building's integrity was in serious doubt."

[Fire Engineering magazine, 10/2002]

"I am well aware of Mr. Silverstein's statement, but to the best of my recollection, I did not speak to him on that day and I do not recall anyone telling me that they did either. That doesn't mean he could not have spoken to someone from FDNY, it just means that I am not aware of it."

Ultima? where is the part about him blowing up the building??

Originally posted by ULTIMA1
Please do not be so immature as to put words in my mouth. I never stated it has not been done before, in fact i have stated that the fire marshalls and fire chiefs do have the authority to demo a buidling in an emergency. Something that you cannot debate.

But I am debating that. I have asked you no less than 2 times to please post an example of a fire dept or demo team going into a 20+ story building...and bringing it down with charges or thermite cutters. Seems like it has never been done before.

Show us just one example, please.

Originally posted by ThroatYogurt
Ultima? where is the part about him blowing up the building??

You should read you own post, you answered your own question.

And they made that decision to pull and then we watched the building collapse."

The "THEY" making the decision to PULL the building is the Fire commander.

For these reasons I made the decision (without consulting the owner, the mayor or anyone else - as ranking fire officer, that decision was my responsibility) to clear a collapse zone surrounding the building and to stop all activity within that zone. Approximately three hours after that order was given, WTC 7 collapsed.

This means that the firemen were evacuated BEFORE the call to Silverstein, so they could not have been talking about the firemen when Silverstein was talking to the fire commander on the phone.

Originally posted by gavron
But I am debating that.

If i show you the regualtion that allows them to demo a building will you be adult enough to admit it?

[edit on 18-7-2008 by ULTIMA1]

reply to post by ULTIMA1



All I want is just one example of where a 20+ story burning building has been brought down in a controlled manner, by the fire dept or a demo team, prior to 9/11.

Originally posted by gavron All I want is just one example of where a 20+ story burning building has been brought down in a controlled manner, by the fire dept or a demo team, prior to 9/11.

The same way i want an example of a 20+ story steel buidling collapsing from fire proir to 9/11.

reply to post by ULTIMA1


I believe you are the one stating that the building was "pulled down". I was hoping that you would be able to provide any previous examples of that happening. Apparently you are not serious about your claims, of have any evidence to back it up.

Does anyone other than ULTIMA1 have evidence of burning multi story buildings being demo'd or cut with thermite cutters, to force a controlled collapse? Otherwise it looks like that theory may be completely busted.

Originally posted by gavron
I believe you are the one stating that the building was "pulled down".

I believe you are the one that thinks the building collapsed from fire, yet we have no evidnce of steel buidlings collapsing from fire.

But we do have evidence from the fire chiefs.

Originally posted by ULTIMA1
But we do have evidence from the fire chiefs.

Well, actually you dont have any evidence. Otherwise you would have presented it. You can provide no evidence of ANY buildings being "pulled" prior to 9/11.

It is obvious you are very passionate about your position, ULTIMA1, and I'm by no means trying to change your feelings. I was just asking for you to show evidence to back your side.

I'm sorry if you feel threatened by my for some reason. I just wanted to see evidence of previously "pulled down" buildings.

Originally posted by gavron
Well, actually you dont have any evidence.

Well that is incorrect since i have posted the statments from the fire chiefs as evidence that you cannot debate.

Also i have asked if you would be adult enough to accept the regulation that allows fire marshalls and chiefs to demo a building.

You cannot post any steel buildings that collapsed from fire prior to 9/11.


[edit on 19-7-2008 by ULTIMA1]