Reuters cameraman killed by Israeli tank (Graphic)

This is not a new story


And there is an existing thread on ATS about it.

i will find.

---


Well, it must have been a while ago, cause it is not in my last 250 posts... and a search isnt producing the resluts i want...

So i will restate my comment from when i originaly saw this...

Mabye Journalists shouldn't be sticking thier face/camera into a warzone.


Mabye the other thread was deleated, there is a lot of thread deleating going on, at ATS latly...

[edit on 6/18/2008 by TKainZero]

reply to post by ExquisitExamplE


this is not worth a thread. Journalists die on a daily basis in the world for what they have to do, and telling us what we already know is just a way to bump up your ATS points.

By the way, try to even the balance and start a thread about these Hamas militants who attack school buses with AK-47s

Originally posted by maria_stardust
There is no way that the Israeli army can justify its actions in this case.

They won't even try.

If they can run a bulldozer over a White American female, killing her with no repercussions whatsoever, I seriously doubt that anyone will be punished over the senseless death of a Palestinian male.

They'll claim one of two things:
Accident or Militants.

Then case closed.

Heh...we do the same thing in Iraq.
Gotta love the way the world works.

- Lee

reply to post by ShatteredSkies


Good point Shattered.

While this was no doubt a monumental tragedy, let's not forget the mindset of the average Israeli, and that of it's military. What must it be like to live in country which is surrounded by Muslim states that openly advocate your destruction? Where every Jew killed is a murder made in Allah's name? Where your enemy does not wear a uniform, or wave a flag, but blends in with the general population. What must that be like? What effect would that have on one's psyche?

I'm not trying to defend what the Israeli military has done, but I am saying it's a whole differnent ball game in that part of the country, and I'm surprised these sort of things aren't occuring with more frequency.

You may flame when ready.

Peace.

let me get this straight a man was setting up a tyripod a mile and a half from a group of tanks in a war zone gee you think maybe the soldier thought the tripod was maybe i don't know going to be used for mounting an anti tank missile and so he decided to shoot first then ask questions later. yes they were in a press car but you think hamas wouldn't put a press placard on there car if they thought they could destroy 4 tanks. its sad but bad things happen in an occupied war zone.

Originally posted by spines
reply to post by ExquisitExamplE

 

True, accidents happen, and friendly fire is an unfortunate product of confusion in danger. However, when one repeatedly fires an accident...over and over and over again. That stops becoming an accident.

Yes, it makes them an American soldier, doesn't it?

Yanks have no place to criticise other peoples war mistakes, IMO.

Israel is a country of evil.

They always say they investigate these aggressive acts, but in the end you hear nothing from it anymore.

Remember when they killed tens of kids and women in southern Lebanon?

Wow, those Israelis sure are cold heartless bastards! Thats a joke. I've read through this thread and see a whole lot of hateful remarks about the Israelis and lots of conjecture. Like someone else mentioned, I bet a lot of you have never served in the military and know nothing of the battlefield.

Lets make an excuse for the Israelis here:

For one thing, several hundred yards is a good distance to quickly determine if someone is pointing an RPG or a camera at you.

Secondly, the person making the case of "boo hoo hoo, how can the Israelis shoot at them even if it was an RPG instead of a camera? An RPG can't kill a Merkava tank at that distance!" Thats too bad. Just because I have a gun and I think someone is trying to kill me with a rubber band, I'm gonna shoot (simply for the fact that he is trying to kill me!)

Thirdly, the Palestinians and Lebanese have MANY times used women and children as human shields (if anything, for the NEGATIVE press this gets whenever the Israelis decide to fire anyway!) I think this is far colder and "heartless".

Finally, this was probably a case of misidentification of threat. As for the children, I feel for them. I feel less for the reporter/cameraman. He knew he was in a warzone. What saddens me is none of you even realize that the very fact this video is out there means someone released it ( I wonder who and with what agenda???) Sure enough, many of you are jumping right through the hoops they want you too (they can't beat the Israelis with their pea-shooters can they? The next logical step would be USE THE MEDIA!)

[edit on 18-6-2008 by CreeWolf]

[edit on 18-6-2008 by CreeWolf]

reply to post by C.C.Benjamin


My countries foreign policy and my countries soldiers have nothing to do with me. Because those that run my country are evil, greedy and not-at-all concerned with life, that negates my right to criticize?

No, that doesn't seem right.

Originally posted by Matt_Mulder
this is not worth a thread. Journalists die on a daily basis in the world for what they have to do, and telling us what we already know is just a way to bump up your ATS points.

This is a mindset which is all too common. "It's just some guy"...

...getting killed violently, when he did not have to.

Originally posted by Matt_Mulder
By the way, try to even the balance and start a thread about these Hamas militants who attack school buses with AK-47s

This is always an argument when anything critical of Israel's actions is brought up. This is the attempt at balance. Day after day of hearing nothing but the misdeeds and evils of Palestine, while ignoring those of Israel.

I am not excusing Palestine; if they had a tank they would use it. However, I don't understand how military budget makes one nation righteous and the other despicable.

reply to post by lee anoma


Exactly. Never show the other side...unless they are making themselves look bad.

Originally posted by ShatteredSkies
Well, I'm gonna give this a shot.

[...]

There's really no way to tell what was going on as non of us were there and no one knows what kind of communication and intel was being relayed to the tank commanders. We might never know.

This is legitimate argument...for awhile. As I, and others, have been saying: It stops being an unfortunate lack of communication, an accident or a misidentification, when it becomes an almost daily event.

How do people keep ignoring this? Does the media have you so blind to such obvious murder. Both sides are guilty. Stop justifying one because they use their tanks, and criticizing the others because they do the same (using what they have available to them).

Why does fancy military tech allow one the benefit of the doubt?

Originally posted by DavidsNite
While this was no doubt a monumental tragedy, let's not forget the mindset of the average Israeli, and that of it's military. What must it be like to live in country which is surrounded by Muslim states that openly advocate your destruction?

What must it be like to be a people who were forced out of their home at gun point, watched their property occupied and destroyed, lost innocents to 'retaliation attacks' and must deal with the oppresive apartheid government on a daily basis?

More justification for Israel, without the slightest thought for the other side of the conflict.

Originally posted by DavidsNite
Where every Jew killed is a murder made in Allah's name?

...Where every Palestinian killed is a murder made in a nations own self-assertion that it deserves to exist more than another.

Originally posted by DavidsNite
Where your enemy does not wear a uniform, or wave a flag, but blends in with the general population. What must that be like? What effect would that have on one's psyche?

Where your enemy advertises himself with uniforms and technologically advanced weaponry; tells you by way of action that their right to live is greater than your own. What must that be like?

Originally posted by DavidsNite
I'm not trying to defend what the Israeli military has done, but I am saying it's a whole differnent ball game in that part of the country, and I'm surprised these sort of things aren't occuring with more frequency.

By ignoring the other side of the conflict and rebroadcasting what the media throws your way, you are defending the Israeli military. Their actions are compartmentalized and justified as they come, while the whole of the Palestinian people are portrayed as 'the bad guy'.

And this sort of thing does happen very often in that area. We just don't get to hear about it by ways of the major media.

Once again: Why do we allow for and justify ones murder but demonize anothers? There are two sides of the story...as much as people don't want their to be.

I rant because it angers me. It is disgusting!

reply to post by snowen20

"Response....shoot through the children to maintain integrety of your force and security of your detail. shooting kids is a REAL BAD THING! but unfortunatly bad things happen in combat, thats why combat is a BAD THING."

exactly, and yes, if you did it once, you get used to it and the next day, you do it again, for you already damned yourself for doiing it the first time. you are guility for one murder, what stops you from doing it again?
i hope you know what i mean. i do not mean you, but speaking for all those, who have done it and have fallen very deep into the dark. that is why trained forces are getting better with every day out in the field. there isno place left for them anymore but the battlefield :-(

Originally posted by CreeWolf
Thirdly, the Palestinians and Lebanese have MANY times used women and children as human shields (if anything, for the NEGATIVE press this gets whenever the Israelis decide to fire anyway!) I think this is far colder and "heartless".

More double standard. Because you don't readily hear about it on the news which is, clearly at this point, one sided in its reporting, it must not be happening?




Video







Choosing to ignore it doesn't make it go away.

Originally posted by spines
Day after day of hearing nothing but the misdeeds and evils of Palestine, while ignoring those of Israel.

You're kidding right? This thread alone, how many have come to criticize or highlight the "misdeeds and evils" of Palestine compared to how many that criticize the Israelis? I see far more Anti-Israeli sentiment. Hell, its almost a sin to criticize Palestinians or Lebanese in the MSM let alone this forum!

reply to post by CreeWolf


I don't know what to tell you. You must have access to the MSM that the rest of us aren't privvy to. Perhaps you aren't in the same country as myself (the U.S.).

...Really, I am genuinly interested from where you developed this view.

Edit to add: I am not anti-Israel. I am against those who murder, destroy and opress...

Whatever, at this point, I am screaming into the wind.

[edit on 6/18/0808 by spines]

[edit on 6/18/0808 by spines]

First things first Israel shouldn't exist... there is no reason for the Israeli's to be there... They did not have any right to be on that land.

Secondly when they have American's to back them up, (and we all know what they're like in the warzone too), it comes as nor surprise that the Israeli's think they are above everyone...

Especially when the Israeli's believe they are gods children...

Reminds me of a story I heard a few years ago about Israeli snipers shooting an eleven year old palestinian girl.

Damn the zionist agenda.

Just a thought, but maybe the soldiers in the tank thought they had mistaken the camera for an RPG?


I know, I know, really far fetched. This incident should never have happened. It's absolutely disgraceful the way these INNOCENTS are treated by wreckless, inhumane people.

reply to post by spines


Spend a few weeks in that area and come back and tell us accidents don't happen.

I know for a fact you were not in that tank listening in on the intel being discussed, end of story really. Not a single person here knows what was being said or why that tank engaged. There is no "it works for a while". It's going to work each and every time because the truth of the matter is, that we weren't there to even being to criticize. Which is why I don't.

I acknowledge that they're in a war fighting multiple sides, surrounded by enemies. I acknowledge that they're out for blood and they're ruthless. But do they have any other option not to be?


(Not aimed towards spines)

Israel as far as I'm concerned, as far as historical text goes back, has every right to be in existence in that area as much as Iraq does in its current state.

Nearly everything in the middle-east is molded by Western Civilization's interventions in the area for far longer than any of us have lived. We have to deal with it now.

Hell, it's not like Israel was just said "ok, here's your land, take it". They fought for it, they fought an entire war for what they have, with sticks and stones no less! And they WON! They have EVERY right to be there because they paid for that land in their own blood.

Shattered OUT...

[edit on 18-6-2008 by ShatteredSkies]

accidents happen ?? FFS some pople are so effin ignorant ...You make me sick ...HOOOHAAAA we are US jews and we rule ..

There would be No ´accidents´if the zionists pigs would not be there in the 1st place
Israel is a ILLEGAL state ...FACT ...Always has been always will be ..

Look it up ..its not a joke it is illegal and we put them there therefore we all are guilty ..
leave the area to the poeple that are the long inhabitans of the place and the problems would stop tomorrow
The JEWS stole the country from the people therefore they will ahve to kill them all ...otherwise it will never stop ..its logical

Plain and simple ...
If I was a palestine i would fight to the last to get rid of the occupiers ...
So would you

Originally posted by ShatteredSkies
Spend a few weeks in that area and come back and tell us accidents don't happen.

I know for a fact you were not in that tank listening in on the intel being discussed, end of story really. Not a single person here knows what was being said or why that tank engaged. There is no "it works for a while". It's going to work each and every time because the truth of the matter is, that we weren't there to even being to criticize. Which is why I don't.

My point was not that this, or any other killing, could not be an accident. My point was that when a nation has done everything to not deserve the bennefit of the doubt anymore, it is sickening that we still hand it to them for every 'accident'.

They are not killing a few civilians that were unfortunate enough to be near known militants; they are, on a fairly regular basis, killing many, many civilians. The number of innocent Palestinians murdered is far greater than those of Israel; yet we blindly lend them the bennefit of the doubt as they continue to commit countless crimes.

What makes Israel less guilty than Palestine? Is it because they attack with expensive rounds from an expensive tank?

When Palestine attacks, it is portrayed as a disgusting, horrible act, commited by terrible, evil men. When Israel attacks, it is presented in a light of, "They are defending themselves from those who attack them". For a nation that values freedom so much (mine), we sure turn a blind eye to some pretty terrible things.

Originally posted by ShatteredSkies
I acknowledge that they're in a war fighting multiple sides, surrounded by enemies. I acknowledge that they're out for blood and they're ruthless. But do they have any other option not to be?

And why is this same mindset not given to the Palestinians. That isn't even meant for ShatteredSkies. Why does my nations media refuse to report both sides of the story? Why are the Palestinians portrayed as radical terrorists when they are doing exactly what you would in the same situation?

All you hear is that freedom is essential. Democracy for all people! Yet we show nothing but hostility towards those fighting for that very freedom.

If I haven't beaten this horse quite enough yet: The one-sidedness media coverage is pathetic, spineless and more malleable than play-doh.

Originally posted by ShatteredSkies
Israel as far as I'm concerned, as far as historical text goes back, has every right to be in existence in that area as much as Iraq does in its current state.

[...]

Hell, it's not like Israel was just said "ok, here's your land, take it". They fought for it, they fought an entire war for what they have, with sticks and stones no less! And they WON! They have EVERY right to be there because they paid for that land in their own blood.

That's funny...when I read the history of the modern state of Israel, I see a much different picture.

Sticks and stones? More like illegally obtained arms from Soviet-controlled Czechoslovakia; breaking an arms embargo on the area. They also commited acts of terrorism against, not only the Arabs in the area, but the British as well....those are just some of the highlights.

Everyone following this thread should the Source.

I am not saying that their states creation is unique from any emerging nation which is unfortunate enough to be born by violence. I am simply asking that you don't give the history some makeup and give it a pretty face.

[edit on 6/18/0808 by spines]

[edit on 6/18/0808 by spines]

I dont think they can excuse this by saying that they thought it was an rpg. The crew had been shooting a panorama for several minutes. Not to mention that they've been around the area to shoot other stuff and if the tank crew didn't see the TV on the car then they must be blind.