Well, I see two very good points in the last two posts that I'd like to address, and then I'll just make a brief comment on the content of the
You have claimed again and again that you are not in the CIA, what-not. And as Springer said no matter what you say/do people will still not
What's interesting about this is how utterly irrelevant it really is. You're so right about it. Questions have been asked regarding government
affiliations and they've been answered honestly. People have inquired if any of the Amigos are employed by the government. The three of them have
all stated that they do not. I've met all three in person, and I know what they do, but hey, no one has to believe me either. For that matter, none
of them really had to bother themselves in answering people's questions about their personal lives either. They chose to do that to try and cut off
people's misconceptions. If it doesn't help, well that's too bad isn't it.
Ask me what I do for work. My answer will be the same that it is to anyone who I've just met on the street. I make a living, thank you. To have
people who have never met you and have no idea who you are claim to "know" who you work for and what you do is an amusing concept at best. You ask,
they answer and that's all. The only ones who refuse to accept the answer are those with some bizarre agenda which usually becomes apparent very
That's all I really have to say about the whole do you work for the government issue.
I don't get how a site which relies on USER GENERATED MATERIAL can be CoIntelPro unless most or all of the members(or phantom members) are in
If one asserts that ATS is CoIntelPro, is that person speaking of the site itself or the thousands of people that make up the message?
This is perhaps one of the most spectacular points I have EVER seen posted. See, we (the staff) don't make the content. Our users do. If someone
believes that the content of ATS is intentionally producing disinfo or misleading people, or "hiding the truth" (a fantastic, dramatic and cinematic
concept that pops up whenever this conversation does) well then you're not talking about the staff, you're talking about the members. I think some
of our members might be insulted by that.
We don't direct the content, we make sure it adheres to our very clearly laid out Terms and Conditions of use. I've been a member here for 5 and a
half years now. I'm also currently one of the top tier of staff. I can see everything that has ever been trashed, moved, warned for, everything.
Never has a post been removed from view for ANY reason other than it not complying with the T&C.
We've made a lot of people mad. There's really nothing we can do about that. It is our opinion that it's important to keep ATS a family friendly
site, an educational resource, a place of learning. If someone had a thread junked because they lacked the skill to express their point without
swearing throughout, that's just too bad. If someone had a thread deleted because they mistakenly believed that ATS was the place to discuss their
latest experience with mind altering pharmaceutical products, that's too bad.
Unfortunately that has made a lot of people mad. Angry people say and do a lot of things. I know I've said about a million times that no community
is for EVERYone. A community that fits everyone does not exist. We do our best, but we're not a utopia either. Inevitably actions we have taken or
will take will cause disputes. That's part of life. When confronted with the fact that you are not a good fit with a community, you can either move
on with your life and focus on more important things or you can obsess over that community and put in hours and hours of relentless effort to make
them look bad. The choice belongs to the individual.
The supposed bad press that was mentioned by the author of this thread is simply that. People who might have disagreed with ATS's policy on certain
things, certain topics, certain actions, and instead of simply moving on have decided to make a concerted effort to invent absolutely fascinating
stories about us. Some of it is pretty baseless, some of it is written with some flair (kinda like what you find near the checkout line), but I
suppose it does attract an audience.
So the question then comes to the membership of ATS. You need to ask yourself about your own experience here. Comments from the staff are almost
worthless at this point. If someone decides to post an article on some site saying "That Djarums guy is a fed who tries to misdirect people's
thoughts and ideas, and he censors people who are coming near THE TRUTH"... well... what should I do about it? Better yet, what CAN I do about it?
Scan my drivers license in? Invite all of you for coffee and cake at my office so you can see where I actually work? Do you care? I know I don't
care. I don't care if you're a government agent, a doctor, a mechanic, a farmer, unemployed, a billionaire, a celebrity, or just an average person
in small town usa. Why? Because to me you're all the same. Every one of you are exactly the same in my eyes. You're each a person who somehow
found this website, signed up for it, and has decided that you enjoy the exchange of information and ideas. You're each a completely unique person
from your own walk of life with your own experiences, who's work and ideas I am now able to read and learn from, which is something that would
otherwise be impossible. I go into chat and talk to Australians... Australians... people a 24 hour flight away from me. ATS makes that possible. I
consider ATS a meeting point, a tool that allows people from anywhere on earth (or off it, for you UFO buffs) to simply type up their thoughts, click
post, and have it read by other people from anywhere on earth. One single thread might contain 100 replies from 20 different nations all "talking"
about a topic.
This is what we break our backs trying to present to the members here. A place where people can be heard. Where people can talk about what they're
thinking, what they're feeling, something they feel strongly about. A place where people in different countries can engage in the process of
critical thinking to get down to the bottom of something together.
In five and a half years being here I still get amazed on a daily basis by the things that people say and do on ATS. The sheer intelligence of this
group of members we have is unparallelled anywhere. Online or offline. That's ATS. ATS is more than just a couple of guys who's only difference
from you is that they have an extra forum to review complaints.
To address the topic of this thread in a brief manner, all I can say is "so?"
Are the Amigos a bunch of time card punching feds sitting in an office snickering about how they've pulled the wool over your eyes about something.
No they're not. Will that answer satisfy everyone? Nope. Will ANY answer satisfy everyone? Nope. So what can you do.
Has ATS been infiltrated by some government body? No we haven't. Will that answer satisfy everyone? Nope. So what can you do.
What the membership can do is enjoy ATS for what it is. The absolute best community anywhere for discussion of alternative topics, bar none. That's
what I see it as.
Can you choose to browse around online and peruse each and every story posted by someone who did not have a positive experience here? If you choose
to. I don't see why you'd bother really. If I didn't trust a community I was a part of and I felt they were all such terrible people, I'd sign
out and never come back.
There is absolutely nothing that we as staff can do to stop this from happening. As I said earlier, there does not exist a perfect community,
anywhere, in any shape or form. Inevitably there will always be someone who has had a crappy experience and will be mad about it. It's unfortunate.
To those who've moved on and found somewhere that suits them better, that's awesome! If they're happy, that's what matters. To those who
haven't moved on and have made it their lifes work to attempt to bring down this community by spreading utter stupidity about us, I have nothing but
pity for those people because to allow incidents on a web forum to consume you with such hatred is a true tragedy.
As an Administrator on ATS I am proud to say that I am part of this community, I absolutely could not care less if anyone thinks I work for [insert
evil name here], and I absolutely could not care less if anyone reads this post and considers it drivel. When I sign in here I am Djarums, a person
who has come to ATS nearly every day for more than 5 years, and considers himself exponentially smarter because of that. To me that is what's
important. I have learned so much from the brilliant members of this site, and I hope in a small way I have contributed to their ability to keep
enjoying it. That's all I really care about.
Djarums, Proud ATS Admin, Member and Fan of the ATS Community and Membership.
[edit on 5/11/2008 by Djarums]