Proof if there's GOD?

Well for me I think of us being created in his image and how complex things are. Humans and their advancements. I mean all other forms of life here seem to just cycle and recycle. We make strides and advancements. I mean first think of life and how cells "become" from plants to humans with more of a focus on us. You have a tiny egg that gets fertilized by a living moving/swimming cell both microscopic that grows and blossoms and turns into a living breathing person that looks like you or similar to you and your features. From microscopic upwards to whatever height 5,6,7+ ft tall. Think on the brain, our senses, how complex; although quite fragile, the human body is. Cars, planes, homes, technology period up to satellite, GPS, cell phones, solar energy, space travel. Do you think about how we came to play around with silicon, electric, and metal to make radios and send a live soundwave over the air and around (a) world? Not to mention bump that up to TV and live images, leading to HD and 120hz no/low blur tech? Internet? Yeah you have fish and sea "creatures" that have their own "lights" which makes them another awesome creation. But what about...

Sun, Moon, day, night, drive on the highway and look at the mountains, trees, lakes, streams, the ocean, clouds, stars in what seem to be perfectly aligned, or strategically postioned in picture formation as to tell a story of life itself. How many lifetimes will the "rest of the apes" take to "evolve" and speak, and leave behind what was inferior; like short necked giraffes to the long? I don't know about you but I tell you it's easier for me to believe we have a creator than to present a theory that we somehow were part of a cosmic explosion that swirled some dust together in a perfect, or at least habitable ecosystem, designed for us and that swirl made us. I have heard someone say that they believe a higher power started the Big Bang or what made our solar system, but don't believe he (being God) created us. Huh? What sense does that make. You say a creator started something so big but wouldn't be capable of creating us?...

Anyway; if you want some material that will "talk" to your spirit and mind check out explorationfilms.com A lot of interesting material. One to definitely check out from them is called "The Lazarus Phenomenon".

When somebody is happy they smile, when angry they yell, but some of the feeling is not released, they keep it inside and ball it up. This ball of emotion has no physical manifestation and no measurable properties so they don't know what or where it is.
It's thereby determined it must be god because there is no other explanation, but they can just feel it. They study this emotion and call it religion. They try to learn how to deal with the emotions and call it spiritual growth. They try to convince others of it's existance and call it faith.
Scientists do the exact same thing but they call it psychology.

reply to post by finnegan


Then a spiritualist or religious psychologist is a fraud huh?
Or a fool?
By your paramaters they are, based off the statement you just gave.
Too bad realities not nearly as simple as that.


[edit on 4-3-2008 by WraothAscendant]

I have no disagreement with your statement. "Misled" may be a better term though.

reply to post by finnegan


Rather judgemental stance you have there. Not to forget slightly tinged with egotism.
Especially considering the answers as to any sort of "higher power" being out there is far from being answered as of yet. Play semantics all you want.

Unless of course you can show me any sort of definitive proof that there is no possible way such a being can exist.


[edit on 4-3-2008 by WraothAscendant]

Originally posted by finnegan
When somebody is happy they smile, when angry they yell, but some of the feeling is not released, they keep it inside and ball it up. This ball of emotion has no physical manifestation and no measurable properties so they don't know what or where it is.
It's thereby determined it must be god because there is no other explanation, but they can just feel it. They study this emotion and call it religion. They try to learn how to deal with the emotions and call it spiritual growth. They try to convince others of it's existance and call it faith.
Scientists do the exact same thing but they call it psychology.

So you're saying that... unresolved emotions make people think they're experiencing God? I'm not quite understanding how you came to this conclusion. I don't quite see how unresolved anger could feel anything like God. And people that believe in God are often happy without thinking they're feeling God. I mean, they may attribute their happiness to a blessing from God, but I've never heard anyone think their happiness was God, rather than just happiness.

Also, many sects of the Christian faith depend on "feeling God," but just like I can't "feel" someone in the room constantly doesn't mean they're not there. Often you won't "feel" anything. You may *see* things, but feelings are often not much a part of it, apart from sudden comfort when you're in crisis or strength when you're weak.

The whole of Creation is absolute proof of God. The Creator. Modern materialistic science and all arguments against this fact. Is an attempt and a conspiracy to spread disinformation against that knowledge.

Originally posted by Howie47
The whole of Creation is absolute proof of God. The Creator. Modern materialistic science and all arguments against this fact. Is an attempt and a conspiracy to spread disinformation against that knowledge.

Howie....'The whole of Creation...'?

Absolute 'proof'? No, you do not understand what the word 'proof' means.

Seems you subscribe to the anthropomorphic principle. It requires a tremendous amount of hubris to conclude that the ENTIRE universe was 'created' just for us!!

Hundreds of millions of stars, in our Galaxy alone...and we can't get to them. Hundreds of millions of galaxies, each containing hundreds of millions of stars, and we obviously can't get to THEM!

NO, religions cannot explain it all to us because THEY DO NOT KNOW! It is a power trip, perpetrated for centuries, where those in power claim to know all of the answers, and pass down this alleged 'knowledge' to the masses...whilst keeping power and control in their hands.

The sheep are waking up!

reply to post by weedwhacker



Who says it was created just for us? That's all you! To believe it all happened by accident it the ultimate drivel.

God created it for himself first of all, then there are countless Angels and ArchAngels and Hosts of heaven the universe is swarming with gods creation. Your limited understanding of the scriptures just doesn't allow you to see the truth. The heavens scream of his glory. The evidence is all around you. You can not see the forest for the trees!!!

Originally posted by Howie47
The whole of Creation is absolute proof of God. The Creator. Modern materialistic science and all arguments against this fact. Is an attempt and a conspiracy to spread disinformation against that knowledge.

Actually modern science seems to be backing up Judaism...or its esoterical parts.
But then again, you find more life in any of the esoteric branches then you do of the mainstream of any religion. (Merton and Nouwen are the life for Christianity, so to speak, even if they are catholic)...(Kabbalah, depending on what form and how you view it...for Judaism), etc.

Leading scientist are Jews and see that science and religion actually are coming together.
Just not how an evangelical Christian 'thinks' it should. But they really would benefit from going beyond 'baby milk' and exploring (seeking with their whole hearts as Jesus said so they may find).

Peace

dAlen

"I can only show you the door...you have to walk through" - Morpheus

Originally posted by Bigwhammy
reply to post by weedwhacker

 

Who says it was created just for us? That's all you! To believe it all happened by accident it the ultimate drivel.

God created it for himself first of all, then there are countless Angels and ArchAngels and Hosts of heaven the universe is swarming with gods creation. Your limited understanding of the scriptures just doesn't allow you to see the truth. The heavens scream of his glory. The evidence is all around you. You can not see the forest for the trees!!!

this quote, beyond all else, shows the ignornce quite plainly.

ATS is about 'denying ignorance'. When we see nonsense, it should be exposed.

Circular logic is a form of 'ignorance'.

Having said that, I will NOT ever impinge on another's right to bellive as they wish. BUT, I, and others, MUST make our points clear, in order to discus the topic, right?

[edit on 5-3-2008 by WraothAscendant]

The heavens are telling of the glory of God and their expanse is declaring the work of His hands. Day to day pours forth speech, And night to night reveals knowledge.

There was an incident in the past when God heard and listened to those who feared Him as they spoke to another. This shows us that, even if the Bible was not available yet, there were already talk about God. Let us presume that we are living in those times. We have no Bible; we are not certain whether, or not, there is God; we do not acknowledge any God. We are not saying that there is no God, only, we are not sure if He exists, or not. We neither have any religion, too. This is our opening scenario. We are all neutral, and we are all just beginning to learn. And in the studies that we will make, we will not use any book first.

Let us begin with this question: Who created you? Do you agree that you were created by somebody? Nobody in his right senses would claim that he was not created by anybody. Take the case of a chair, for instance. A chair became a chair because somebody created it. Otherwise, it would not have become a chair, right? The question is: Who created you? One time, when one person is asked the same question, somebody answered that, he was created by his mother and his father. At first glance, we may consider his answer as valid because, had his mother and father not mated, he would not have come to existence. But the question is, if his mother and his father were his creators, why is it that other husbands and wives could not produce any child? If his mother and his father were able to create him, it should follow that all other husbands and wives should beget children. But how come, there are couples that are childless? In other words, we cannot consider it to be a general truth that our respective parents are our creators, or makers.

But granting that it was, indeed, our parents who created us. The question is, why didn’t they make you good-looking? Why did one mother give birth to a lame child? If that baby was, indeed, created by his parents, definitely, they should have created him without any deformity. If your parents were the ones who created you, they should not have given you the physique of a man and a heart of a woman. Why did they make you a homosexual? If they were your makers, then, they should also have to power to repair your deformities!

Isn’t it that a carpenter who made the table can also repair that table should it gets broken? You are limping when you walk, why didn’t your parents give you legs of equal length, if they were your creator? And because they didn’t have power to do that, we are now led to a great and irrefutable conclusion that man is not the creator of man! If man is the creator of man, then, all men should be able to create man. And if man is the creator of man, he should have made a perfect man. But should his creation be defective, he should be able to repair the defect. But the glaring truth is, man is not created by man. There is “Somebody” else who created man. Every object that we see around us is made by man. The chair and the microphone were made by man. But the user of that chair and that microphone was not made by man. There isn’t any available proof that man created man.

In fact, there was one laboratory in America, which took one cell from man. They studied it very well. They tried to find out what that cell contained, and they copied it. They took little water, little iron, little mineral, and they combined them all together. Until they succeeded in imitating a human cell. But there arose a problem – it was lifeless. So, they decided to stop. They had proven that, they can only imitate a human cell, but they cannot make a real one.

Even animals know god is real. Even the most uncivilized civilization on earth knows there IS a god. Why cant you?

And i've learned from life; that if most people believe in something, it's probably true.

reply to post by jedimiller


Most people these days believe food comes from the grocery store.
Does that make it true?

Originally posted by WraothAscendant
Most people these days believe food comes from the grocery store.

Does that make it true?

That's the minority. But essentially, food is purchased in the store.

but you made a good point. People believe that Jesus comes from some book and that he's all made up. Rejecting the history. Thinking that he was all part of the imagination because he's in some book. Could be fiction. right? well. No. There is enough evidence for jesus and for God. You have the smartest people in the world, knowing in their hearts that god is a real, existing entity. You have scientists who believe that as well.

I know star wars is not real, but I enjoy it. simply, god is real because some do know he's real, and that's all we need to know. it's not just faith.

I ask you this. If some scientist did research on God..and he found thru his findings, that God is real. published it on a national Journal. would you then believe in God?


I think you will.

reply to post by jedimiller


Ummmm Jedi...........
Nevermind. Your wrong. But nevermind. Your logic is waaayyyy flawed.
Have a good night.

Originally posted by WraothAscendant
Ummmm Jedi...........
Nevermind. Your wrong. But nevermind. Your logic is waaayyyy flawed.
Have a good night.

Ok, Good nite to you. Guess i'm tired. keep your faith. Later.

reply to post by weedwhacker


[/Seems you subscribe to the anthropomorphic principle. It requires a tremendous amount of hubris to conclude that the ENTIRE universe was 'created' just for us!! ]

Where did I say that? I said pretty much the opposite. even basic Christianity doesn't believe it was created for us. So you are extremely
misinformed. They believe it was created for God's pleasure!

Originally posted by weedwhacker

Originally posted by Bigwhammy
reply to post by weedwhacker

 

Who says it was created just for us? That's all you! To believe it all happened by accident it the ultimate drivel.

God created it for himself first of all, then there are countless Angels and ArchAngels and Hosts of heaven the universe is swarming with gods creation. Your limited understanding of the scriptures just doesn't allow you to see the truth. The heavens scream of his glory. The evidence is all around you. You can not see the forest for the trees!!!

this quote, beyond all else, shows the ignornce quite plainly.

ATS is about 'denying ignorance'. When we see nonsense, it should be exposed.

Circular logic is a form of 'ignorance'.

Having said that, I will NOT ever impinge on another's right to bellive as they wish. BUT, I, and others, MUST make our points clear, in order to discus the topic, right?

No I am denying your ignorance wacker!

You said:

It requires a tremendous amount of hubris to conclude that the ENTIRE universe was 'created' just for us!!

You accused Christians of being so arrogant that we believe God created it for us!!!!

That is an ignorant statement of the highest degree.

He created it for himself.

Consider you ignorance Denied
.


[edit on 3/5/2008 by Bigwhammy]