[ Dune = long freemasonry commercial?? ]

Is it just me, or is the Dune movie a well crafted covert Freemasonry video? I must have counted atleast 10+ references to freemasonry in that film.

fremans...
Blue Spice eyes = blue lodge
"Base of the pillar"?
"The sleeper who must awaken"?
"by will alone I set my mind in motion"?

And many more....thats all I could remember at the moment....some may be vague, but hey just throwing it out there.

I do not see any conection what so ever, especially ''The sleeper who must awaken''. Maybe you are refering to my lodge's Tyler who has a habbit of nodding off occasionally. Perhaps you can expound further?

The sleeper would represent the initiate before he has been given the light.

The base of the pillar is a reference to the pillars of freemasonry.

"By will alone" would reference the initiates requirement that he excercise his free will to show interest in the light of freemasonry.

Drinking the spice somehow provides esoteric knowledge to the dune character, and is represented by blue eyes. The same could be said about the initiate who joins the blue lodge.

And the fremans, (not only have a similar name), but they represent a group of individuals who operate covertly, and who desire to free society by regaining control of the 'spice' and provide it to everyone.

The name of the bad-guys in Dune is the Bene Gesserits which sounds an awful lot like Bene-Jessuit. Who rule through religious tyranny.

[edit on 16-1-2008 by Choronzon]

Ah well....I'm sure most of you have seen it, but it is an older film, so it maybe hard to remember.

Although, it is a good movie to see more than once.

Dune is an excellent film - well done and broadly faithful to the book, which I had read before I saw it.

As to a connection to freemasonry, I think not. Even looking at the examples you cited, we are talking about a connection between Dune and what people think freemasonry is, not what it actually is.

Oh but wait... Muad'dib is an anagram of Dumb Aid - clearly a reference to the silent charity that freemasons undertake.

Perhaps there is something to it after all...

I think you've been reading too much Hal Siemer.

The Sleeper refers to the coming Messiah. A candidate in Freemasonry - no matter how bitchin' he thinks he is after joining - isn't ever going to be a Messiah. He may get to work in the kitchen, and thus be able to work with bread and fish, but that's about limit.

Technically, there are no 'pillars of Freemasonry.' There are pillars related to Solomon's Temple, and said temple plays heavily into Masonry ... but no, not really a connection.

"By will alone" ... again, not much of a connection. It's true the wannabe Mason has to ask, but that's kind of a stretch.

Drinking the spice ... nooooooo. Not really anything comparable there, either.

The rest also doesn't really work either.

You'd be better off trying to find connections in The Man Who Would Be King or National Treasure.

Your pal,
Meat.

Hmm, well back when I read Dune and saw the movie, I had never heard of a Mason at the time, but thinking back, I can't really think of anything that would have a direct Masonic influence. There was a thread awhile back where someone else compared Dune to the Iraq war and Islam. Some of his points were coincidental or nonsense, but a few did make sense, like that Muad'Dib = Mahdi.

reply to post by Choronzon

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First let me say that the "Dune" movie sucked. The book by Frank Herbert had always been one of my favorites, and I was really, really let down when I saw the film.

Herbert was not a Mason, nor is Agent Cooper from Twin Peaks, who played Paul Muad'dib.

reply to post by Choronzon

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Different movies are meant to convey different messages, you need to be aware of them.

Watch the movie 300 and pay particular attention to the scene when Leonidas meets with "God King" Xerxus for the first time, there are a couple of references there. Also pay attention to the Xerxus tent scene where the fialetes gives in and requests to become a member. There are a few Masonic references in there, not to mention "God King" Xerxes and his army were the Egyptians. (On a side note: Did you know that the Israelite slaves referred to the one true God as "L"?)

IMO there are plenty of spiritual messages in there as well, King Leonidas had a strong sense of faith and was willing to sacrafice because that's where God wanted him to be.

Another good one that gets out a good message is Lord of the Rings, the final one where the eye at the top of a mountain has to be destroyed, I applaud that.


[edit on 18-1-2008 by spirit7]

[edit on 18-1-2008 by spirit7]

What God wanted him to be there? Zues? Athena? Dionysus? I think the only person who wanted Leonidas at Thermopylae was Themistocles.



What exactly are you applauding when the eye is destroyed? Just curious.

[edit on 18-1-2008 by AugustusMasonicus]

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

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Augustus, I'm well aware of what the history books and myths say about many Greek gods but there is new evidence that reveals some of the Israelite slaves may have been Greeks upon them, plus Leonidas refers to one God in his lines. That's all I'm saying.

In regards to the eye, it was a source of control for evil power in the movie and that's all that I was sayin on that one too. I dig spiritual movies like those two.

Believe me, I'm way past trying to get everyone to believe in Jesus Christ the same way that I do. This is a free country and I just want to share it on an intellectual level with everyone else.

Meh. All messages are meant to convey the same message - with the possible exception of Mel Gibson's flicks:

"Butts in seats will make you rich."


None that I can see.


None that I can see.


Really? I'm sure the Persians would be interested to know that they were Egyptians.


Umm...Leonidas was Spartan. Spartans were polytheistic, not monotheistic.


Wow. And here I thought you were all into God and stuff. Why would you applaud a symbol that is clearly God being destroyed? Seems kind of like it would be against your religion to hope for the downfall of your diety.

Tolkien - like myself, a Roman Catholic - was born and raised in in the 19th century, at a time when people didn't just blindly accept what they were taught.

Hmm... Not sure why you're suddenly questioning your religion, but good on your for taking the blinders off!

Your pal,
Meat.

Interesting.

I found the Lord of the Rings to be more of a morality tale rather than a spiritual one.

Your pal,
Meat.

reply to post by mmmeat

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Didn't the Persians rule much of Egypt? This link is mostly for kids but check it out

www.historyforkids.org...

The scene when the messenger arrived and said earth and water, then Leonidas felt the wind and looked around at the sons, daughers, and women that's when he realized where God wanted him to be.

The eye in that movie represented evil. Perhaps you should watch it and reply back to me when you've seen it rather then perceive it on what you believe from Freemasonry.



[edit on 18-1-2008 by spirit7]

Kinda defeats your own argument when you call 'em Persians rather than Egyptians.


Maybe you should read one of the websites for kids that will inform you that Sparta was polytheistic, not monotheistic. Your use of a single "god" is wasted; Castor and Pollux, Apollo Larneios, Apollo Chalkioikos, Helen, Leucippide, Lykourgos were some of the gods/demigods that Spartans worshipped.


While it's true that I'm far more pro-Masonry than I am anti-Masonry, I have no idea what you mean by 'believe from Freemasonry.' Perhaps there's a kiddie website out there that you can go to to find out more about Freemasonry.

As far as the Eye of Sauron goes ... perhaps you should read the books, rather than just rely on a movie as your source. I'm sure that Tom Bombadil would appreciate it.

The eye thing has some interesting parallels to a certain religion:

• warriors carried the symbol into battle on shields, helms and armor - much like a certain cross symbol;
  
• devotees were not allowed to pronounce Sauron's name - much like a certain ineffable name of a diety of a monotheistic religion;
  
• The symbol of the eye is all-seeing - a symbol that was in use certainly during Tolkien's lifetime by certain religious sects as a representation of God;
  
• The Eye, described by Tolkien as being a glow in a Palantir (a crystal globe) - and Tolkien was certainly aware of the esoteric belief that God was the center of the universe, represented by artists as the glow in the center of a sphere ala Dante's description in Divine Comedy as 'God, The Light At The Center of the Cosmos.'
  

And, at the end of the day, you're happy that polytheism and witchcraft (man, dwarves, elves, and all the other magical creatures didn't worship one god) won out over the belief in a single god - monotheism (Sauron ... who, at one point even became flesh to walk among the people ... sort of like someone did in the Bible).

So ... yeah. You might want to check out a book or two, rather than just relying on movies and kiddie websites.

God bless.

Your pal,
Meat.

[edit on 18-1-2008 by mmmeat]

I was referring to Leonidas's role in the movie meat. Sorry that I insulted your intelligence but back on topic it was the Persians who ruled most of Egypt and as I said a moment ago I'm well aware of the history books and the greek myths but I was just pointing out the message that the movie was conveying to me. You choose to overlook that and detur down a different path for some reason.

Hmmm....I always hear the claim that masons own the media and such, if thats the case then why is it in most movies the masons are always the villain of the film.

Masonice references in cinema

There are no lines of any historical context that are attributable to King Leonidas. Spirit, you need to stop referencing cinematic features as a source for debate, it serves you no benefit and in fact detracts from any point you attempt to make. I am certain you can make a lucid arguement if you used legitimate sources. Just a friendly bit of advice.



300 was a stylized and losely adapted depiction of an historical event of great significance, any resemblance to the same is purely accidental.

The Lord of the Rings was a masterfully executed endeavor which remained remarkably faithful to the original fantasy fiction text. Neither to me was spiritual though opinion is of course subjective.


[edit on 18-1-2008 by AugustusMasonicus]

[edit on 18-1-2008 by AugustusMasonicus]

I never made that claim myself but good point. All I'm saying is that different movies somehow slip in and convey different messages, sometimes without us even knowing and that we all learn from our own and different experiences. You see things one way while I see them in another way. Neither way is necessarily right or wrong and is not what is real but rather illusion. Whoa, that was deep, lol.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

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I hear ya, thank you for taking the time to understand what I was trying to get at. I hope that you did not feel threatened. With the recent evidence that greeks were among the freed Israelite slaves in the exodus I get the feeling that there is an underlying message in the movie pertaining to the annomosity between the Persian rulers and the Greeks other then just the trade berriers of wheat.



[edit on 18-1-2008 by spirit7]