Why its pointless trying to prove god

Existance of Gods/God...Hummm,...Gods are wishfull thinking at best...I have no problem with those who want to think otherwise,.....Those that are always asking if Gods are real...or prove it or something ,..they seem like the group that are unsure of themselves in this world......As long as there is money to be made and people to control...there will be plenty of Gods Words out there.....

reply to post by madnessinmysoul

God is universal. He is worshiped as different gods in various cultures but he only exists as one. The Bible, Koran, and the Tanakh are the strongest evidence we have that proves God's existence.

If he doesn't exist, how did life start on this planet?
Darwin's Evolution theory has a loophole. If animals evolve into other new species, there has to be the first animals that existed before any other species for them to evolve. Creationism seems to make sense and fills in the missing information that we have all been trying to figure out.

You tell me, if there was no God, how did we end up on the right planet at the right living conditions which is able to sustain life, other than 100s of billions of planets out there that couldn't sustain life?

Originally posted by mrmajestyk6309
Those that are always asking if Gods are real...or prove it or something ,..they seem like the group that are unsure of themselves in this world.

I'm not unsure of myself, atheism gives you a much better perspective on the world then religion. I'm never questioning whether my decisions are right or wrong in the views of someone else, (99% of the time) and that 1% is at school or at work. So I don't have to worry about punishment for being me.

God is universal. He is worshiped as different gods in various cultures but he only exists as one.

OH your THAT kind of theist, the lesser of alot of evils

The Bible, Koran, and the Tanakh are the strongest evidence we have that proves God's existence.

Not proof, the bible alone has more holes then a mobster after a shootout.

Darwin's Evolution theory has a loophole. If animals evolve into other new species, there has to be the first animals that existed before any other species for them to evolve.

There is a theory on that, but its not covered by evolution. Evolution covers everything AFTER that.

Creationism seems to make sense and fills in the missing information that we have all been trying to figure out.

So I can safely assume you don't KNOW creationism, cause if you did, you wouldn't be saying that (unless your delusional)

You tell me, if there was no God, how did we end up on the right planet at the right living conditions which is able to sustain life, other than 100s of billions of planets out there that couldn't sustain life?

LOL!! I love this statement. Its just one of those adorably naive statements. (I say that with the least amount of condesendence possible)
The easiest explanation is, LIFE CAN'T HAPPEN ON THOSE PLANETS. Thats why it didn't. How do you know life hasn't attempted existence of EVERY PLANET IN THE UNIVERSE. It just can't happen on those it can't happen on. But earth, hurray, it can. So it did. And prolly somewhere out there theres another planet with life on it, and another etc etc.

[edit on 8-11-2007 by Damien_Hell]

[edit on 8-11-2007 by Damien_Hell]

Originally posted by Damien_Hell
A.) There is NO hard scientific evidence of any form of god.
B.) I've heard all the dumb arguments "Its written in creation" "God made it so only those who are willing to believe can see" Blah blah blah. Yet NOWHERE in any of those arguments does it say that its THEIR god. I could easily say "Its written in creation that (whatever god they don't believe in) made it and only those willing to believe can see it" And there goes they're whole argument. The fact is you can't prove god because he/she/it/zork (gender you cant even imagine!) doesn't exist. AND even if he/she/it/zork did exist YOU COULDN'T PROVE ITS YOURS. I see theists try and fail just trying to prove A god, can't wait to see them try to prove their god.
PS: They can't

You are right, there is no hard scientific evidence that there is a God. However there is no hard evidence to the contrary, you can't argue aganist it if there is nothing to back up your side. I would argue that the Bible is a pretty good place to start when looking at how to explain God in a scientific fashion. Many passages such as the flood do a pretty good job at explaining why a lot of things are they found the way that they are. Such as fossils of aquatic shells being found thousands of feet up on mountians. To me these things show that creation does prove thier is a creator and that it happened the way it is described in the Christian Bible. There are just too many loop holes in the entire evolution theory or any other for them to even be considered. The physical evidence points to a creation and with a creation their has to be a God creator.

Albert Camus called the entire argument about the existence of God 'absurd', because he knew that we as human beings would never be able to find a definitive answer until the afterlife, if there is one.

I'm starting to see why.

You are right, there is no hard scientific evidence that there is a God. However there is no hard evidence to the contrary, you can't argue aganist it if there is nothing to back up your side. I would argue that the Bible is a pretty good place to start when looking at how to explain God in a scientific fashion. Many passages such as the flood do a pretty good job at explaining why a lot of things are they found the way that they are. Such as fossils of aquatic shells being found thousands of feet up on mountians. To me these things show that creation does prove thier is a creator and that it happened the way it is described in the Christian Bible. There are just too many loop holes in the entire evolution theory or any other for them to even be considered. The physical evidence points to a creation and with a creation their has to be a God creator.

Your right, thats why I don't bother trying to disprove god. I try to disprove the religions. It is ENTIRELY possible that god exists. Difference is he/she/it/zork is a 10th dimensional creature that prolly looks nothing like humans and most likely doesn't care about us. But its impossible for there to be the gods described by organized religions. Besides if I can disprove that religion, I disprove that god. Such as the bible saying "Honor thy mother and father" But Jesus says (I think somewhere in Leviticus I can't remember) you can't become one of Jesus's disciples, (prerequisite to getting into heaven) if you don't hate your parents. Also it says IN THE BIBLE. That heaven is over 500C (degrees Celsius) I haven't bothered looking at other religions.

Originally posted by Damien_Hell
But its impossible for there to be the gods described by organized religions.

for a rational person, i thought you would of understood the concept of impossible opposed to high unlikely. you can't disprove it.

Originally posted by Damien_Hell

Your right, thats why I don't bother trying to disprove god. I try to disprove the religions. It is ENTIRELY possible that god exists. Difference is he/she/it/zork is a 10th dimensional creature that prolly looks nothing like humans and most likely doesn't care about us. But its impossible for there to be the gods described by organized religions. Besides if I can disprove that religion, I disprove that god. Such as the bible saying "Honor thy mother and father" But Jesus says (I think somewhere in Leviticus I can't remember) you can't become one of Jesus's disciples, (prerequisite to getting into heaven) if you don't hate your parents. Also it says IN THE BIBLE. That heaven is over 500C (degrees Celsius) I haven't bothered looking at other religions.

The quote you are looking for is in Luke and yes it says "25Large crowds were traveling with Jesus, and turning to them he said: 26"If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters—yes, even his own life—he cannot be my disciple. 27And anyone who does not carry his cross and follow me cannot be my disciple." It is obvious that this is not a literal "hate" but a call to his disciples to change the way they are living. To follow Christ you must give up your idols and false beliefs. He calls them to rely on him instead of themselves for everything they are going to need.
Never heard of the 500C quote, I think you would have a tough time actually finding that in the Bible. However, that would not really matter anyway. The Bible teaches that after death a believer recieves a "new, glorified body." Pretty sure that the body given by God could handle a 500C heaven.

reply to post by jedimiller


NO please thank you for that avitar i have never laughed so hard in my life

[edit on 9-11-2007 by xHADEEZx]

i think if god exists, it would be an evil prick.....killing millions of people every day, making us sacrifice animals, and even ourselves....

What a bastered...

oh and Jesus actually is litrally a bastered if you think about it,

[edit on 063030p://am3007 by andre18]

for a rational person, i thought you would of understood the concept of impossible opposed to high unlikely. you can't disprove it.

Like I said, disprove the religion and disprove the god

It is obvious that this is not a literal "hate" but a call to his disciples to change the way they are living.

your changing what he said, he said HATE your parents, friends etc etc. What if someone already hated their parents then hating them isn't a change in lifestyle.

He calls them to rely on him instead of themselves for everything they are going to need.

You don't see how dangerous that is?

Never heard of the 500C quote, I think you would have a tough time actually finding that in the Bible. However, that would not really matter anyway. The Bible teaches that after death a believer recieves a "new, glorified body." Pretty sure that the body given by God could handle a 500C heaven.

Found it:
The temperature of heaven can be rather accurately computed. Our authority is the Bible, Isaiah 30:26 reads, Moreover, the light of the moon shall be as the light of the sun and the light of the sun shall be sevenfold as the light of seven days. Thus, heaven receives from the moon as much radiation as the earth does from the sun, and in addition seven times seven (forty nine) times as much as the earth does from the sun, or fifty times in all. The light we receive from the moon is one ten-thousandth of the light we receive from the sun, so we can ignore that. With these data we can compute the temperature of heaven: The radiation falling on heaven will heat it to the point where the heat lost by radiation is just equal to the heat received by radiation. In other words, heaven loses fifty times as much heat as the earth by radiation. Using the Stefan-Boltzmann fourth power law for radiation

(H/E)4 = 50

where E is the absolute temperature of the earth, 300°K (273+27). This gives H the absolute temperature of heaven, as 798° absolute (525°C).

The exact temperature of hell cannot be computed but it must be less than 444.6°C, the temperature at which brimstone or sulfur changes from a liquid to a gas. Revelations 21:8: But the fearful and unbelieving... shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone." A lake of molten brimstone [sulfur] means that its temperature must be at or below the boiling point, which is 444.6°C. (Above that point, it would be a vapor, not a lake.)

We have then, temperature of heaven, 525°C (977°F). Temperature of hell, less than 445°F). Therefore heaven is hotter than hell.

Originally posted by Damien_Hell

It is obvious that this is not a literal "hate" but a call to his disciples to change the way they are living.

your changing what he said, he said HATE your parents, friends etc etc. What if someone already hated their parents then hating them isn't a change in lifestyle.


Found it:

(H/E)4 = 50

where E is the absolute temperature of the earth, 300°K (273+27). This gives H the absolute temperature of heaven, as 798° absolute (525°C).

The exact temperature of hell cannot be computed but it must be less than 444.6°C, the temperature at which brimstone or sulfur changes from a liquid to a gas. Revelations 21:8: But the fearful and unbelieving... shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone." A lake of molten brimstone [sulfur] means that its temperature must be at or below the boiling point, which is 444.6°C. (Above that point, it would be a vapor, not a lake.)

We have then, temperature of heaven, 525°C (977°F). Temperature of hell, less than 445°F). Therefore heaven is hotter than hell.

I am not changing what Christ says in Luke about hating your parents. Read the context of the passage and you realize that he is using hyperbole to make his point. He wants his followers to be dependent on him and follow him not rely on themselves. Also you stated in your first post that being a disciple was required for entering heaven which is not true. Belief that Christ died as the attonment for our sins is the only requirement for enterance into heaven. Being a disciple comes out of that belief.

He calls them to rely on him instead of themselves for everything they are going to need.

You don't see how dangerous that is?

I do not see it as dangerous. He is not telling believers to just stop working, sit at home and wait for food and money to magically appear. He is telling them to trust God in good times and in bad and know that God has a will for thier life and will provide what is needed for them to follow him.

Wow, that is a pretty intense formula for finding out the tempature of heaven. But you are missing a few key facts. Mainly, I doubt that there will be radiation in heaven. Heaven is not a place that is in this phyiscal world. It is not hidden in another galaxy somewhere. Therefore, I am certain that a place perfectly crafted by God is not going to have radiation or heat problems.

[edit on 9-11-2007 by SliderXC]

Why it's pointless to be pointless. Doh! I forgot my pointless point.! Sure the mods will figure a way to depoint me though. He He just kidding. !Kidding!

[edit on 10-11-2007 by jpm1602]

[edit on 10-11-2007 by jpm1602]

Lol. My guardian mods. They protect me from myself on these 'pointless' issues. I just feel so silly tonight. Is it a full moon?

Originally posted by SliderXC
You are right, there is no hard scientific evidence that there is a God. However there is no hard evidence to the contrary, you can't argue aganist it if there is nothing to back up your side.

Seriouly why do people even use this statement? Non-believers aren't the ones buildings churches to worpship a unknown and trying to convert the whole damn world. Plus logic is already enough to see the flaws

Originally posted by SliderXC
I would argue that the Bible is a pretty good place to start when looking at how to explain God in a scientific fashion. Many passages such as the flood do a pretty good job at explaining why a lot of things are they found the way that they are. Such as fossils of aquatic shells being found thousands of feet up on mountians. To me these things show that creation does prove thier is a creator and that it happened the way it is described in the Christian Bible. There are just too many loop holes in the entire evolution theory or any other for them to even be considered. The physical evidence points to a creation and with a creation their has to be a God creator.

Yeh that's if you believe the Earth is around 6000 years old and everything in the universe orbits the Earth which is flat by the way. By loops holes in evolution you mean the fossils of other speices of humans from which we evolved from? You probaly never even search up about these 'loop holes' (you just might find the answer)

I do not see it as dangerous. He is not telling believers to just stop working, sit at home and wait for food and money to magically appear. He is telling them to trust God in good times and in bad and know that God has a will for thier life and will provide what is needed for them to follow him.

LOL you don't watch the news do you? Trusting in god during the bad situations is pointless. If a guys robbing my house I'm not gonna pray, I'm gonna get my baseball bat and DO SOMETHING. Or at least call the cops if they have guns.

Wow, that is a pretty intense formula for finding out the tempature of heaven. But you are missing a few key facts. Mainly, I doubt that there will be radiation in heaven. Heaven is not a place that is in this phyiscal world. It is not hidden in another galaxy somewhere. Therefore, I am certain that a place perfectly crafted by God is not going to have radiation or heat problems.

No radiation, no heat. And it says IN THE BIBLE, it gets extra light from the sun. Light = radiation. Radiation = heat. Besides we ALL have seen Gods craftsmanship and we ALL know its greatly sub par. Thats why intelligent design was dis proven decades ago

If the evil in this world is intended by god, god is not good. If only god can create, god must have created evil. If somebody else created evil, how can we know that god and not the devil created the universe?

My collective consciousness runneth over. And I use to be such a 'Good' little altar boy too. I'm kind of pizzed off at God now too. You don't create a species and allow them to self implode. At leat 'I' wouldn't. Could the angels in their golden chariots relieve us of murderous tribal demolition at the last moment? We can only hope so....sigh....
And he said unto Abraham, slay your only child with the sharpest knife as he lay on the altar. Ye, the angel stopped him moments before the killing.
Is this a loving God? So we must give our most treasured to be alotted His love??? Very troubling.

Originally posted by Damien_Hell
Why its pointless trying to prove god

Finding God and proof of God starts with faith and acts of faith....never the other way around.

Originally posted by kinglizard

Originally posted by Damien_Hell
Why its pointless trying to prove god

Finding God and proof of God starts with faith and acts of faith....never the other way around.

Faith isn't proof, I could have faith the suns gonna implode in 3 seconds. I haven't proved it yet