How China negotiates with kidnappers

The negotiation's are pretty much one sided and apparently dont usually come out in favor of the kidnapper
I believe this is a method that the US should begin using as I would bet that it could actually prevent kidnappings.
Now I dont know if the story behind these images is really the one that we are being told but I wouldnt doubt it, the Chinese dont mess around with criminals..

In this country, we would block off the street, take 12 hours to talk him out of it, spend $5 million to give him a fair trial; pay his food and lodging for life.

No wonder their products are cheaper than ours.
8-22-7

Chinese negotiations

that's the way it should be done, timely, efficient and effective...

Efficient, granted....

But a little bit inhuman, isn't it?

Without knowing the story behind this example, it's hard to say. He could have been a murderer or he could have been a father who wanted access to his kids...

Just to shoot him like that is somewhat, er, cold-hearted....

reply to post by stumason

But a little bit inhuman, isn't it?

Yes I know, we dont know the true story or the facts of this incident BUT assuming that he is a kidnapper and NOT an estranged parent wanting to see his son, then I have no sympathy for him..
Wait, even if he was a father to this child, wtf is he doing with him next to a window?
That right there removes all the doubt from my mind. All kidnappers of children should be treated the same way as this Trash.
Not doing it like this will not only risk death for the child, the kidnapper panicking and throwing him off the balcony and, like here in the US, the guy gets out in about 8 years with another 5 added on for probation.
Then, as happened before, he gets out and immediately proceeds to kidnap another child and possibly kill him.
Just shoot him and then bill his family for the bullet

Police in authoritarian nations are often much more effective at stopping and deterring crime before it occurs but here in the US and in other democratic nations the police are better at investigating them after they occur because in authoritarian nations there is often a lengthy process that can hinder investigations.

The Chinese People's Police are obviously a pretty damn good force, that movie is very impressive. We recently had a hostage situation in my town where the police tried to talk the guy out of it for about 2 days non stop ... he eventually shot himself even though a police sniper could have shot him within minutes after the ESU arrived. So for 2 days a major road on Long Island was shut down and entire neighborhoods locked down because the police were too soft to pull the trigger and end it. The guy had taken 2 little kids hostage and killed their grandmother that was babysitting them (he was hired by the ex husband of their mother to kill the family).




[edit on 24-8-2007 by ChrisF231]

wow, these two kidnapped kids were so lucky that they did not kill them too!! I mean he already killed their Grandma!!! If he even could kill a granny, sasn't the risk high enough that he will kill a kid too?

The captain who could have made the call was so lucky to have not these kids' blood on his hands!!!

America loves a bit of the old cowboy-style six-cylinder justice, don't we?

There's a reason we don't do that any more, you know.

reply to post by IchiNiSan


Exactly, and a lot of times it doesnt turn out the way that it did in his story.
Sometimes when faced with surrender or death, they choose death but they arent gonna go alone. Theyll take anyone they can with them, sort of a finaly vengeance type thing i guess.
In cases where the father kills his children, its usually because something happening in the marriage, like the wife filing for divorce, the man either kills the kids to get back at the woman or kills her and then claims that he was going to commit suicide and didnt want the kids to be "alone" with out one of their parents.
When the woman kills her kids, it has usually been because they met someone else, who she claims that didnt want kids and they are the only thing standing in the way of a future together (married)
Either way its a terrible act and if there is a HELL they will be first in line to get in, as will all kidnappers and child molesters.

With the stakes so high in that story, those cops should have taken him out with a sniper shot to the head.
Maybe they thought there were two kidnappers in the house and if one was shot, the other would retaliate.

The local agency in my area (Suffolk County Police) is notorious for inaction and lack of proactive approaches to stopping criminal actions. I personally feel we should do away with the county police and go back to the town/village police and county sheriff system but thats my opinion. They cover to large an area with too few officers, they cant even handle regular patrol much less have additional officers assigned to SWAT, K9, etc because the pay is so high ($100,000 base salary) the county cant afford to hire more officers.

The particular station that covers my area has less then 20 officers per shift plus supervisors for 325,000 people spread across 100 square miles. In total the department has about 2,300 officers for 500 square miles and about a million people (the county police only patrols half the county, the other half is patrolled by the sheriff's office and town/village police forces).

reply to post by ChrisF231


LoL, wow that is a way under staffed.
Hey did yall hear about some New York city that had all the cops going to a party or something, yes they were ALL there, which left the city un-protected for some time that night..
very funny

Originally posted by stumason
Efficient, granted....

But a little bit inhuman, isn't it?

Without knowing the story behind this example, it's hard to say. He could have been a murderer or he could have been a father who wanted access to his kids...

Just to shoot him like that is somewhat, er, cold-hearted....

Agreed... sorta.

IMO they should just use a tranquilizer or taser gun... or some other means of 'taking him out' without all the killing. After all, real guns don't always hit their intended targets, and the intended targets aren't always guilty even if it appears so at first glance.

i'm gonna say that a bean bag (non lethal ammunition fired from a shotgun) to the head might have been a better choice, the guy might ave lived. at least he would have had a better chance IMO,
another thing did anyone notice how weird his left armlooked as he was falling?

reply to post by Kruel


Well, you see the this that they wouldve had to have a VERY strong and extremely fast acting tranquilizer.
if they wouldve done that with a regular tranq dart, it would've taken a few minutes to work and in that time he couldve picked the child up and threw him out the window.
A taser wouldve possibly worked. At least knocked him sill long enough for the negotiator to get all over him.
Anyway, thats how things are done in China i suppose. Whoever made the ultimate decision to kill him obviously has the authority to be judge, jury and executioner.

I dont get all the worrying over killing this guy. He abucted a child and had he gotten away with it, there is no telling what the childs fate that this sick mofo had in mind for him.

Just think about this happening in the US, the guy wouldve served less than 10 years and wouldve gotten out, potentially abducting more children.
Its still to bad that we dont have the specifics of what happened, how it went down and what how they came to the decision to execute him on site.

So, in my opinion, this guy got exactly what he deserved

[edit on 8/24/2007 by Kr0n0s]

Ahhh China, how I love thee.

You may be an oppressive communofascist state, but DAMN are you guys efficient!!

I will continue to admire you from afar, as always.


Jasn

Originally posted by stumason
Efficient, granted....

But a little bit inhuman, isn't it?

Without knowing the story behind this example, it's hard to say. He could have been a murderer or he could have been a father who wanted access to his kids...

Just to shoot him like that is somewhat, er, cold-hearted....

Ruthlessness needs to be the key when dealing with criminals, the scum of society and in my personal opinion, non-human or at least below your average human.

I would advocate bringing back public executions, hang em high in the streets, and see if the child rapist, murderers, drug peddlers continue to act the way they do. Crime would go down. If not, the people that commit them will be "removed" and thus no more problems from them.

I have no sympathy for criminals, if that is not apparent. Cold hearted it may be, but personally I don't care.

Originally posted by Rockpuck

I would advocate bringing back public executions, hang em high in the streets, and see if the child rapist, murderers, drug peddlers continue to act the way they do. Crime would go down. If not, the people that commit them will be "removed" and thus no more problems from them.

I have no sympathy for criminals, if that is not apparent. Cold hearted it may be, but personally I don't care.

Indeed. Or perhaps we could let those that do have sympathy for the scum of the planet take them out of prison and bring them into their homes to try to "rehabilitate" them.

That would be good. An "Adopt a Criminal Scumbag" program.


Jasn

Kronos, pretty pathetic isent it. According to what I read in the article that department only operates with 2 officers per shift ...1 called in sick and the other refused to work alone because God knows how far away backup would be from the state troopers or the county sheriff's department.

Darkheart, unlike here in the US many foreign agencies do not have access to the amount of "less lethal" weapons that our police forces have ... also dont forget that the culture is also somewhat different in regards to dealing with crime as stated in other posts most police forces in authoritarian nations are very efficient in dealing with criminals shall we say.

Yeah, the DDR Volkspoliezi (nicknamed VoPos) or German Democratic Republic People's Police was one of the most effective police forces in human history ... they were also ruthless stormtroopers that make even the worst most corrupt US cops look like saints. Lets not forget that while authoritarian nation police are highly effective are deterring crime they stink at investigation them after they occur because much of the investigation branch is really there to spy on political dissenters rather then criminals.

the kidnaper was not killed, just be badly wounded
these days that guy is under trial,
www.daqi.com...

[edit on 25-8-2007 by gs001]

there are lots of kidnap crime in China,
most of them ended without casualty.
So, don't demonize China in this issue.

when the kidnaper( 张开林) was wounded, he was immediately sent to local hospital
after 6 days of treatment, his life was still in danger, then he was sent
to a better hospital for treatment, then cured.
finally the punishment he got was to stay in jail for 13 years.
Your "democratic" government and "free" media don't want your people
know what happened afterward so that they are able to demonize
China, what a terrible US of A.
If freedom and democracy are as evil as what USA is experienceing,
we Chinese would rather not to pursue them.


[edit on 25-8-2007 by gs001]