Ninjutsu

Originally posted by onequestion
reply to post by yourmaker

 

Seriously though, TKD, BJJ, Judo, they will get you no where fast against someone who treats them as basic.

I am a professional mixed martial artists and boxer, i can tell you that judo and bjj are not just some basic art. You clearly have no idea what your talking about. I have never encountered a ninjutsu person in 10 years that can do anything against a serious boxer with some wrestling and bjjj skills.

Relative, they are basic. They can be contained in less time because of how obvious they function.
I'm not saying be a boxer, or be a ninja, or be anything but what you are, with what you have, when you need to.
Please continue to tell me I don't know what i'm saying, you fuel my desire to proceed.

Originally posted by yourmaker

Originally posted by EyesWideShut

Originally posted by yourmaker

You can't hit me because the moment you try I counter .000005 microseconds before.
Your fist could be mid-motion at my face but it doesn't make any difference.

Spoken like someone who's never been in a streetfight

I'm sure my real world experience pales in comparison to the numerous fights you've had in your head... I hope you get into a fight early in life and get punched in the face, not so you get injured but so you will be forced to face reality and humble your ego. Then I hope you understand that what you watch in the movies isn't real, Professional boxers get hit in the face, MMA fighters get hit in the face...these are people that are the best at what they do in the world and THEY get hit.

I used to think like you when I was 12, I had taken TKD for a few years and sparred alot, won a few tournaments...my martial arts skills were unparalleled...I was a certified badass (Never been in a real fist fight) Long story short in 8th grade my ego and I met a wrestler, some unkind words were exchanged, I take a fighting stance , he shoots in for a double and promptly folded me up

later on that year I started taking Judo & boxing...lol

At the end of the day, you're not invincible man...try boxing, feel what it's like to get hit HARD, go roll with some high level BJJ Guys, I can't reccomend Judo highly enough.... you have to train with people better than you in order to become better yourself.

Why do you feel the need to talk down to people that you don't know?
This is like going to any of the combat veterans around here and saying you don't know anything about shooting a gun.
I study Martial Arts and practice extensively. I train to fight anyone from a common criminal to 5 star General.
I didn't learn any of this on the first go, and I wouldn't expect anyone else to either.
I'm simply saying, beyond movies, beyond what other culture crap you people have latched onto, pure fighting is a science. I made no reference to any movies beyond JKD, which isn't some bogus movie style.
Why would you spend your time learning one art when JKD encompasses the best of them all?
There is really no technique you could use that doesn't have a counter ready for it...

Why would I roll with the BJJ guys when I can bypass their greatest techniques before I ever come close to the ground? Sure it's good to have that as a contingency but it's not a primary focus.
Or let the Judo guys get close enough to toss me? I can keep them within range, and if they enter it, the timing is set for me to use their best technique against them.

You don't seem to realize that I never have to make an offensive move to attack you.
You come to me when I want you to.

I'm not just some kid on the internet dammit.

I have been hit hard. Plenty of times, everything from a fist to a car.

Seriously though, TKD, BJJ, Judo, they will get you no where fast against someone who treats them as basic.

Originally posted by yourmaker
My defence is offence. My offence is defence. You can't hit me because the moment you try I counter .000005 microseconds before. Your fist could be mid-motion at my face but it doesn't make any difference.

I'm sorry, I should have known better than to debate with someone who has the ability to move in microseconds, far be it from me to believe that you were bound by the same laws of physics as the rest of us.

reply to post by EyesWideShut


it was a figure of speech,
sarcasm, nice...

If I decided to take some sort of martial art training, I think I'd start with wrestling.Most fights end up on teh ground, you may as well be the one to decide when and how it goes there,and what to do when it does. A solid wrestling backgrlund will also be beneficial in learning BJJ, which is another one I's like to study.
After that, boxing or kickboxing would be on the list. I actually did train in kickboxing years ago, but not long enough to become really proficient unfortunately

Lots of things sound good in theory or look good on tv, but don't necessecarily translate well to the real world.I've been a fan of the UFC and other mixed martial arts for a long time,and it's been interesting to see how things have progressed and styles have changed. Some things have not changed much though,and one of those is that a strong wrestling background or BJJ background is one of the keys to success.

Top level MMA fighters train every day, it's how they make their living. If there is an effective fighting technique available to them,there's no reason they wouldn't train in it. Sure,they have some basic rules in the cage, but overall the type of training and fighting they do translates pretty well into real world scenario's.

Anybody can get hit,and anyon cah get taken down. Watch the best fighters in MMA, they will stuill often get taken down by a top level wrestler.Sure,they may survive or even submit their opponent if they have the proper skills, but how many people possess those skills?

I think you have to look at martial arts training the same way you look at your equipment and tools. You use what has been proven to work. I buy things that I know have a proven track record if I plan to trust my life to them. Gimmicks and gadets are fun to play with, but when the rubber meets the road I want something that I know will work.

You can buy all manner or courses and training that promise to teach you how to never lose a fight,how to take away someones gun or knife every time, how to never get taken down etc. It's pretty much a guarantee that it will be rubbish. Like someone else already said, the best fighters in the worlsd get hit,taken down, submitted or KO'd. That's life,we are all subjectt to the laws of physics and human limitations. Train in what works and get as proficient as possible, then try to avoid ever having to use it,that would be my plan.

In a survival/SHTF situation, i'll pretty much rely on avoiding conflict if at all possible. If that fails, I will count on my firearms to settle the matter. Hopefully(and most likely)it'll never come to that.

Look at wild animals-even apex predators will try to avoid physical fighting if possible.They do this because they know that even the victor may well die of injuries sustained in the fight in a real survival situation. Same goes for us-you get in a fight and your awesome ninjitsu skills win th fight for you,but you get a stab wound in the process. Without proper medical teatment, it may well kill you. Or maybe you get taken down and break a bone or get a concussion in the process. No big deal right now maybe, but in a real survival situation, it could spell death.

reply to post by yourmaker


It sounds like you have been hanging around watching to many Kill Bill movies. Yeah you can add a creative element to the way you apply your technique and fundamentals. You can't contain someones creative ability once they learn how to use the proper technique. Once you know your technique you can start game planning and getting creative with the way you use it.

Originally posted by onequestion
It sounds like you have been hanging around watching to many Kill Bill movies.

Another jab, I can handle it.
Why does my learning fighting as a science bring out the "oh you must watch movies har har, bruce lee haw haw" in people?

Yeah you can add a creative element to the way you apply your technique and fundamentals. You can't contain someones creative ability once they learn how to use the proper technique.

Containing technique is my speciality.
The only special' technique in containing is knowledge of your opponent, and that's done through studying all styles, their benefits, their weaknesses.
Anything they do from that point is neutralized with an easy counter.. then you run.

Why do you say I can add a creative element, yet I can't contain someone else's creative abilities?
That's exactly what I study for.... there is no style or creative element I cannot dissect with a few timed counters...

reply to post by proteus33


yes i to have studied the art for several years me and five friends used to go to large woods and practice moving silently. i have even used some techniques to get a few feet away from a grazing rabbit

Ninjutsu is mythologized in the west.

Go online and buy a 'ninja suit complete with tabi boots', become the 'shadow warrior', Chuck Norris in 'The Octagon', throwing stars, smoke bombs, straight swords with a square tsuba and a blowgun saya on ebay for 60 bucks.

Back in the day in Japan spying, espionage, assassination, kidnapping etc were all viable methods for besting your rivals. Some clans had a good reputation for these kind of things, and as with all things Japanese, philosophical, cognitive and spiritual practices evolved. Was there guys running around like in the movies? no, was there secret death-cult groups of invincible uber ninjas? probably not. Is modern 'Ninjutsu' an actual martial art form representing true Budo like Iaido or Kyudo? Definitely not. When I hear of somebody who says they studied Ninjutsu it usually means they practiced a mix of different styles of hand to hand with some dodgy swordplay thrown in, but if anybody on here cares to enlighten me, please do.

It is difficult for the western mind to understand the Japanese way, especially when dealing with subject matter that has it's roots in ancient times. What we see today, when non Japanese try to embrace a culturally obscure subject like Ninjutsu, it is sometimes sad and laughable, at other times ridiculous.

reply to post by seabhac-rua


Well said sir.
I was brought up with karate, my dad taught Wado ryu, i learnt some Judo as a kid and since then have tried a handfull of arts including boxing, allso i was brought up on a s**thole roughneck estate where even the police would'nt go without a van load and for the last 21 years have been practicing Wing chun which for me is the one. The key is to find a good teacher, i have been to many wc schools which were awful and it seemed the teacher did not know the complete system or how to make it work.

At the end of the day, you can put the man in the fight but you can't put the fight into the man.

reply to post by yourmaker


How are you going to survive a barrage of wrestling and boxing skills if you don't have to the time to work and get used to the timing of my punches and shots? You have to gauge everyone's timing and style individually. When you are in a real life scenario you are operating on instincts and reverting back to your most basic forms of training.

Whens the last time you have used any of this against a trained fighter?