Originally posted by FlyersFan
Originally posted by SteveR
I think you are missing the point Libra is making. None of that really matters.
I fully understand the point Libra is making. I disagree. An empty resume DOES matter when someone wants to be POTUS.
Ah, but see, here's the rub. It matters to
you, and others with a similar mindset to you. I'm not saying that you're wrong, rather I'm
saying that you don't speak for everyone. To many people (at least 100,000 of them) it really doesn't matter.
Originally posted by FlyersFan
It matters VERY much. No financial platform DOES matter. Belonging to a 'church'
that espouses (paraphrase) 'Africa is our true homeland' and 'blacks first'
MATTERS. Replace those phrases with 'Germany is our true homeland'
and 'whites first' .... SCARY and unacceptable!! Same with that 'church'
Obama is a member of.
Man, you really gotta get past that whole church thing. It's a weak argument at best, and kinda makes you look racist at worst. I'm not saying you
are racist, mind you, I'm just saying that your repeated and vehement fixation on the whole black church thing could make you look like one to
some people.
The fact is, the church is in a poor black community dedicated towards trying to teach black people they don't have to be victims of some
preconceived notion that, in the words of Notorious B.I.G. "To get ahead, you got to either have that jump shot or sling that crack rock." It's a
community of people descended from people forcibly brought over from Africa, and whom have watched it degrade further and further into what is
arguably the worst place on Earth to live in.
Now most people are sheep, be they black, white, or whatever. Simply telling them "stop shooting each other, stop doing drugs, and stop robbing one
another," isn't going to work. There's laws and police officers that already say that all day long with little to no effect.
Instead, what this church tries to do is convey strong moral and ethical values, and associate them with black people, so that the two are not seen as
seperate, but rather one in the same. A child raised in such a church, through repetition of that Mission Statement you hate so much, learns to
associate the truth "black values" as being good moral and ethical choices, rather than the "bust caps, bust back" mentality of Biggie Smalls.
Now if you can't see this, and can't accept that black people would actually want to rise above the morass of drugs, theft, and murder they are
constantly associated and bombarded with in popular culture, or that they could have possibly found a way to change that mindset in a positive rather
than negative fashion, that's your choice. You can continue to assume (IMO wrongly) that the only possible message that could come out of such a
church is that of racism and hate. But don't impose that view upon the rest of the world, because some people are a little more open minded than
that.
At the very least, try to accept that not everyone feels the same way as you about the Church thing, and their acceptance of it is not neccessarily
blind ignorance or Black Pantheresque leanings.
Originally posted by FlyersFan
I think it would be nice to see the West care about Africa for once.
I think it would be nice to see America care about AMERICANS for once.
We just sent billions in aid to find a cure for AIDS in Africa.
We forgive debts - like to Egypt.
Plenty of $$$ is donated. Plenty of people volunteer.
It's not the job of middle class America to fully support all of Africa.
Africa has been caught in constant warfare, genocide, drought, and famine largely due to the exploitation and ignorance of white people, for so long,
that it has become ingrained now in the politic of the land.
But again, I see your point America needs to support Americans first, and worry about other nations second. And I wholeheartedly agree.
However, I'd like to present an additional perspective on this. Africa is one of the most resource-rich continents on the planet. Now, unfortunately,
most of the harvested resources are lost either through corruption, black markets, smuggling, or outright destruction. What few resources do get
through are typically exported either without the consent of the governments in charge, or the proceeds are used to line the pockets of the corrupt
governments.
Eventually, Africa won't be so eff'd up. Eventually, through self-enlightenment, outside intervention, and a lot of people trying to do the right
thing, African nations will be able to stand on their own, support themselves, and begin healthy and legal commerce in the world market, with massive
amounts of resources at their disposal.
Now, if America plays a major role in "fixing" Africa, or even just a few select nations like Nigeria, Egypt, South Africa, and whatever name "The
Congo" is going by at the time, this would provide a HUGE stabilizing force with some of the richest resources available, and a fantastic trade
partner. And whom do you think they will give favored trade status to, but the nation that has helped them the most.
Thus, completely ignoring the humanitarian effect (which personally is still a big motivator for me), I believe that aid to Africa is an investment in
the well-being of Americans down the road. However, I think we should be going about it a completely different and more efficient way. I don't agree
with just dumping money and resources in the hands of various African governments without accountability. I do believe, however that it is a seperate
investment budget from the one we use to help present-day Americans, in the same way that I consider my grocery budget seperate from the budget I use
to invest in stocks with.
It's still caring about Americans, it's just more in terms of investing in the future of future Americans.
[edit on 4/5/2007 by thelibra]
