Boston Area Malls Implement No Swearing Policy

Spurred by complaints from shoppers, several Boston area malls owned by the Simon Property Group have implemented a "No Swearing" policy, aimed at foul-mouthed teenagers. Signs in the mall use popular text messaging techniques to get the message across. T-shirts with offensive messages are also targeted.




The argument will be put forward that this is a violation of the teen's First Amendment rights, but what about common decency? Some of these kids have no consideration for anyone else except themself.

Related News Links:
pqasb.pqarchiver.com

I think this is stupid for several reasons.

Their new policy includes "No offensive clothing". What is offensive clothing and who decides what is and isn't offensive? Are fat ladies in shorts going to be banned from entering the mall? How about lycra? No, just kids with their underwear showing because some old lady didn't like the way she feels when she lays eyes on a young boy's undies...

It's a classic case of My Rights vs Your Rights. The kids have to yield to the 'elderly' shoppers who were made "uncomfortable" by the kids' behavior. It's one thing to disrupt the peace with screaming and other disruptive behavior, but NO Swearing? I swear, and if I'm in a mall while I do it, I hope I don't get kicked out...

In my opinion, the small group of kids who are causing the real trouble should be dealt with instead of taking the cowardly action of making blanket policies that affect everyone shopping there...

A mall is a business...not an entitlement.

If you owned the property, like Simon Property Group, I think you would feel differently. In the end, if you don't like their policy, you could always take your business (and your spicy words ) elsewhere.

I see no problem here.

Good move by the shopping center, now if others would follow. I just hate it when walking into a mall where kids think they own the place
and think it is long overdue.

--------

BH just in case you are not aware of it when in a privately owned mall you have no first amendment rights. It is like entering a private home, when in Rome do as the Romans do if you don't like it do not let the door hit you in the butt on the way out, they have the right to refuse service to anyone.

[edit on 12/21/2006 by shots]

*stands in the middle of the food court; loudly declaims . . .*


I, Franz Konstantin Vom Strangecraft, do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey . . .

*all noise is drowned out by the swarms of jack-booted mall security, who surround SC and haul him away to a tiny, windowless interrogation room.*


I think it's fine, both legally and socially. Obscenity in public is usually meant to shock, embarras, or otherwise coerce the target of the outburst. I wish they'd enforce this everywhere in public venues. You can't take your kids to the park without some kids shouting profanity around you.

If cigarrette smoke is banned as a noxious nuisance, why is disturbing the peace OK?

Originally posted by shots
BH just in case you are not aware of it when in a privately owned mall you have no first amendment rights.

True. "Rights" wasn't the correct word to use. Sorry.

HOWEVER, realize that I said I think they should deal with the kids who are causing the trouble. I have no problem with them kicking out troublemakers. What I take issue with is the blanket policy, which is a pet peeve of mine.

Too many times I see people saying, "I'm offended" and so a policy is made to make sure no one is offended. I think that's stupid.

I'm NOT supporting disturbing the peace.

Yea, I would just say don't shop there anymore. If it were a public place, I would be against it. Its a business though, and it is their choice. Their profits will either rise, because customers will see it as a clean environment and shop their more, drop because people think they should be able to say whatever they want, or stay the same because people really just don't give a damn(ironic).

Honestly, I wouldn't shop there because I usually end up cursing during some point. But for others maybe they will because they like the idea of stopping people from saying whatever they want.

All in all, chances are it will stay the same though, since nobody really cares one way or the other. Chances are they will just fall in line with the new rules because thats what they have been brought up to do since day 1.

Indeed, it's private property so the 1st doesn't really apply. The business owners have the right to refuse service to disruptive elements.

A ban on swearing doesn't have any weight out on the street. There was a similar ordinance in Chicago for a while, maybe it's still around, I don't know.

Anyway, I tried very dilligently to get a ticket for swearing from at least half a dozen police around my place of business, my school, and my home. As soon as I heard they were giving out tickets for swearing, I knew I wanted one to frame and show my children.



It's hard to get ticketed for swearing. Most of the cops I approached didn't even have a clue there was such an ordinance, and even when I had convinced them I wasn't just full of crap, they still wouldn't write me a ticket.

I even asked politely.

But whatever, there's a huge difference between public and private property when it comes to the rights you have.

Send these kids home and let them read a book or do something useful with their time instead of wandering the mall. It's a place of business for cryin' out loud, not a playpen.

Originally posted by grimreaper797
All in all, chances are it will stay the same though, since nobody really cares one way or the other. Chances are they will just fall in line with the new rules because thats what they have been brought up to do since day 1.

You're right. Either you were brought up to express yourself without using profanity or you weren't.

I find it hard to think of an instance that would cause me to use profanity in a mall. Because they were out of my size of Birkenstocks?

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

HOWEVER, realize that I said I think they should deal with the kids who are causing the trouble.

. . . and face a lawsuit from their outraged "parents," alleging that their darling kids were the target of racial, gender, agist, or some other bigotry.

The only way to avoid such lawsuits is . . . to have a policy in place, and enforce it on everyone equally.

I have no problem with them kicking out troublemakers. What I take issue with is the blanket policy, which is a pet peeve of mine.

Unless you have a blanket policy that is uniformly enforced, even in your own business, you'll end up with lawsuits.

Blanket policies mean treating eveyone equally, yes? and equality should be the goal of our society, yes? Otherwise, you're setting up some rentacop in the role of judge, to decide that "we didn't want their sort hanging around our mall. You know the ones . . . those people.

Too many times I see people saying, "I'm offended" and so a policy is made to make sure no one is offended. I think that's stupid.

Right. And too many times, "civil rights" are the refuge of ciminals and their lawyers.

I'm NOT supporting disturbing the peace.

I know you're not, BH. But would you ever support doing anything to curtail it?

all the best.

I have images of Demolition Man now, where the little machines issue tickets to those using profanity.

Dystopian society aside, I don't know about the rest of you, but the malls in my area look like one huge massive game of Pimps n Ho's. I'm pretty far from being a prude, but it would be nice to see at least a minimum standard of decency in people's behavior and attire while in a public place. For instance, fat people should be banned from wearing spandex.

And, to answer someone's question, who determines the standards of decency?

Historically, it's been the local community. When the public decency issues first started to arise, people realized the standards of decency are different from state to state, and city to city.

Originally posted by jsobecky
Either you were brought up to express yourself without using profanity or you weren't.

I was, but I put all that behind me. I love profanity. I am a potty mouth. And I'm fine with it. I don't shout it from the rooftops or cause traffic to stop, but what people call profanity is a part of my everyday vocabulary.

I find it hard to think of an instance that would cause me to use profanity in a mall. Because they were out of my size of Birkenstocks?

You don't wear Birks! And people who wear sneakers swear, too!

Originally posted by WyrdeOne
Send these kids home and let them read a book or do something useful with their time instead of wandering the mall. It's a place of business for cryin' out loud, not a playpen.

This had me bustin' a gut!!!! Right on!

In any event, MALLS are not the public square. If we had not been talking about private property, I would of course have opposed such a ban.

In fact, I'd like to rip a few choice words on the White House lawn and on the steps of Capitol Hill, but sadly I hate the cold in Washington even more.

Perhaps in the Spring....

[edit on 21-12-2006 by loam]

I'm no prude, by any stretch of the imagination, but i say ENOUGH with the swearing in public, where people feel they can say anything they want, as filthy as they want. This society now, does not know proper from improper and i guess its up to the higher ups to monitor the situation.

Swear your heart out at home, but dont stand next to little kids, and mothers and grandmothers and spew the "F" word every two seconds.
Its not proper in any other country either. Its not just here.

We dont want rules imposed on us, but we act like animals, so therefore, someone has to take action.

I've got no problem with a no swearing policy at the malls. Ironically, the Simons' new HQ can be seen clearly from my office window. They're big-time here in Indy. The Simon brothers own the Pacers.

Of all the rules and regulations that may come up, I'm guessing the "no bad hairpieces" rule will not be implemented. Here's the speaker of the house in the Indiana state legislature-



Nice "do", Pat.

With all that money, , you'd think he could afford a better looking

rug.

If these kids cared, they wouldn't shop at the mall anymore. If their parents got it (which I'm sure they don't) they would stop shopping there. I'm sure the teenage crowd is a huge income for the stores, and what the stores don't like, the mall doesn't like.

But what about places like Hot Topic, who make a living off of rebellion (corperate Goth as I call it). I'm sure they will have to stop selling those shirts with "offensive" language on them. And, if these kids boycott the mall, HT may move thier business elsewhere.

Aside from that, I think a good question is "what is offensive" I know a lot of old people who would complain to the mall for me wearing my favorite anti-bush shirt.

IS this offensive?





or this?



or this?




This is a slippery slope.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

HOWEVER, realize that I said I think they should deal with the kids who are causing the trouble. I have no problem with them kicking out troublemakers. What I take issue with is the blanket policy, which is a pet peeve of mine.

I understand what you are saying, however one policy for all seems much better as I see it. This way no one can cry discrimination because it applies to all and I assume that would also include adults although that is not mentioned. No swearing means just that as the signs that state no shirts no shoes no service that also apply to all

I for one am all for the mall doing what it feels to promote a pleasant environment for the shopping public. Chances are the kids that make problems weren't spending near as much money there as those that were offended.

I personally don't want to hear loud cussing in the mall when I take my 6 year old son to get a new outfit or whatever. And if I walked in and heard him at 14-15 years old swearing, I'd probably beat his arse...

There are better ways to deal with teenagers then implimentig no swear policies. I coached sports for many years and heard the outrageous language from young adults. I learned over the years that attempting to correct them with some sort of punishment only made matters worse. I did find out through trial and error that embarrasement worked far better and had much more staying power. And not to stick up for the teenagers but I've heard farrrrrrrrr worse come from adults then I've ever heard come from the mouth of teenages. And exactly where do you think they are learning this language from?

Me??? I'm more offended by individuals who wear clothing that makes me want to vomit. Just because they make it in your size doesn't mean you should be sporting that midriff shirt and daisey duke shorts.